How can I get him to stop pushing me to the edge? Update in post 27 - Page 2

[JMJ]

Originally Posted by hakeber

Sometimes, I also feel like I have to say no because when I say yes to one thing, he immediately wants something else and something else and something else. It's so hard to not get angry when he doesn't take even a second to appreciate the yeses and can dos and haves and just focuses on what else he wants. Appreciation is in short supply, and his father and I both grew up in a world of heavy handed NO, reinforced with belts and wooden spoons, so both of us marvel at his...gluttony? I know that's not the right word, but it does feel that way when you feel taken for granted. Which I KNOW is ridiculous...I do know that. I just want to be able to teach him to be grateful for what he has before he covets what he doesn't...his whole motivation in life seems to be consumed with what's next and DH and I don't live our lives like that, so it's fascinating...where did this come from?

I've heard that children tend to believe that they deserve whatever they get. If they get hit, they're likely to believe that hitting them is OK. If they're given the world, they think they deserve that too. Eventually, some of us grow up and realize that it's wrong to hit children or realize how lucky we were. I would imagine that modeling and talking about thankfulness would show him that it's something you value and something that has a positive impact on the world.

[Katie T]

One thing I noticed with DD1 was that if she sensed me getting irritated she would take it and run with it so to speak. So I tried to put on a front that she wasn't getting to me and the annoying behavior would end much quicker.

I agree with giving a reason behind the answer of "no".

Another thing that I learned was invaluable was that no means no and to think before saying it to see if you really mean it.

I would be caught up in something and one of the kids would ask for something and I would say no or not today then think to myself that really there was no reason to not let them do/have what they were asking for.

Good luck it is a trying age but you are able to teach them so much during this time.

[meemee]

Rebekah,

this is something i learnt from IRL friends of teenagers.

around 5 - 6 year old children hit this peak of emotions. its what i call child angst - their first teens. i have a 7 1/2 year old and she went thru it at the same time.

my dd would tell me 'mom i dont know what is in me that is doing it but i cant help it.' those were bad, bad, days because she felt the whole world was out to get her, nothing worked right. my friends children - those who remember said it was worse than teenage hood.

i am not sure what i would call it. going to another level of maturity.

the only way i could describe dd was hormonal, PMSing. she would go thru such unpredictable mood swings and wear her out so emotionally. it last a few months.

that's also the last time her hitting came out. her hitting which came out of nowhere really triggered me. so one day i sat and seriously talked to her about it. not when she was in teh middle of it, but later. and explained what triggered it and the deep anger i felt towards anyone hitting me - whether it was her or anyone else. little by little she gathered her self control over time and that it. she never hit me anymore.

when i understood how terrible the time is for them, how hard they try to control but it seems like split personality and they cant, it really took away all the anger and frustration i was feeling.

plus i am a single mom who coparents. and at that time dd was deeply questioning her dad. and she would cry piteously over why he doesnt understand her. so i was able to see the depth of her pain. just seeing how deeply she was feeling all of this - took all my frustrations away.

you have got a lot of great replies along the lines of what i wanted to say. about looking at yourself and what is going on rather than your child. but its all been said.

another thing. that you specifically asked about. i have always been brutally honest with dd about my needs and feelings. for instance she loves hearing stories of when she was younger. i share both kinds - the fun stories as well how incredibly hard it was as an emotionally intense high needs child. i even tell her sometimes that i am in a bad mood. that she better not push me to the edge because i might turn into something she may not like.

i make observations and use specific examples instead of you frustrate me. i say something like when you throw food away it deeply angers me because its a waste of food that we cant afford, because it felt like my hard earned money thrown away and it saddens me deeply because of all the children who will go hungry tonight. when i say so much it really helps her to understand it isnt her i dont like - its her action.

you know something i quite enjoy this side of dd. we are now hitting a similar stage where i notice i need to give dd more independence, more responsibility and some space. she is maturing and wants to have a say in our life. time to brush up on how to talk book.

gluttony - isnt that our birthright. the camel in the tent story. it isnt that he doesnt appreciate. he probably doesnt have the words to express his emotions. its on and on and on. but it is also v. age appropriate. because they are learning they were all this time brougth to believe teh world revolves around them, till they had a rude awakening at 5 that it DOESNT. they understand that life is bittersweet. everytime you make a choice you lose something. it is painful and hard to make a choice. and therefore the gluttony.

mama i would try and look at life through his eyes. if you can do that it will so help you rather than thru your past experiences. really look at him and see what HE is saying, rather than what you think you are hearing. its v. v. v. hard to listen, truly listen without wanting to fix things or offer an opinion.

your sweet child is lost amongst this angst. when it clears it you will get him even more sweeter than ever.

[hakeber]

Thanks Katie. That's a good point.

Meemee,

That was wonderful. Thank you so much for putting it into that perspective. I would really like to share piece this with dh, if you don't mind.

This is, to date, the most helpful thread I have ever started on this website. Thank you all so much!

[mamazee]

As far as delayed reaction to the new baby goes, my dd was fine with the new baby for maybe a couple of months or so, and then she realized that it was FOREVER and her life was changed and she didn't get 100% of my attention anymore and wouldn't ever again. So it was delayed for her. It is such a hard transition for them.

[angelandmisha]

[QUOTE=hakeber;15291250]That is so true. I'm ashamed to admit it, but you're right. Occassionally, I am limiting choices it's because the consequence of the choice is a nuissance to me. It is easier to say no.

Sometimes, I also feel like I have to say no because when I say yes to one thing, he immediately wants something else and something else and something else. It's so hard to not get angry when he doesn't take even a second to appreciate the yeses and can dos and haves and just focuses on what else he wants. Appreciation is in short supply, and his father and I both grew up in a world of heavy handed NO, reinforced with belts and wooden spoons, so both of us marvel at his...gluttony? I know that's not the right word, but it does feel that way when you feel taken for granted. Which I KNOW is ridiculous...I do know that. I just want to be able to teach him to be grateful for what he has before he covets what he doesn't...his whole motivation in life seems to be consumed with what's next and DH and I don't live our lives like that, so it's fascinating...where did this come from?


Hakeber, this post really struck me in relation to the suggestion of reading Naomi Aldort's book. I think the idea you expressed about the "gluttony" your son displays indicates that there are some long held ideas in your head that act as a first filter for whatever is going on, if that makes any sense. You have ideas about how you were expected to behave and what would have happened to you if you behaved the way your child does, but those are your ideas only- they're not his, ykwim? I highly suggest reading the book- it is very excellent and helpful. I do think that in raising our children well, we are forced ourselves to finish growing up.

I also agree with Just1More- we really have to explicitly tell/instruct/model for our children what appropriate behavior is and why it's useful/helpful, etc. It's
so hard to remember how much they don't know yet.

[hakeber]

So I have been taking a lot of what you guys have said to heart, and I wanted to share a really great moment I had today.

Yesterday I picked Benjamin up from school and everything was fine, he was happy, smilely, chatty then quite suddenly he snapped "arrrrrrg Stop talking to me!" And I thought; ooooh there is that teenager 'tude Meemee was talking about! And so I thought WWjustonemoreD? And I said calmly "Mommy, I need a little bit of quiet time now, if that's okay." And he repeated calmly and sincerely. I nodded. And a few steps later he growled; "I just wish I could walk to school and home by myself!"

My instinct was to guffaw at the absurdity of the request and say "no way! Not safe!" but I thought about the no, and thought of a compromise that I could live with...and I said "Can I talk?" And he laughed and said with a tsk; "Yes, mommy!" So I said, "How about tomorrow you get a head a start and I'll walk with Emily about ten steps behind you? That way you can feel alone, but if you need me, I'm not that far."

He liked it. Then he asked, quite nicely, for some more quiet time.

So today he started walking and I let him go ahead of me and we got about three blocks and he started slowing down, so I walked to him and put out my hand and hew grabbed it and he said "It's just I started feeling lonely." So I gave his hand a squeeze and said "I'm glad I wasn't far away." and he leaned his cheek on my hand and said, "me too."

Then I said, "How about when we get to the edge of the school building you can walk to the door alone?" (it's about six meters) and he lit up "That's a great idea, Mommy!"

And he gave me a big hug and kiss and kissed his sister, and off he went as I stood at the corner.

It was really great!

So thanks...from the bottom of my heart...days like today make me feel like a good mom.

[heartmama]

memee that was such a wonderful post, thank you! I feel like I gained validation from it too.

[muttmom92]

Originally Posted by hakeber

So I have been taking a lot of what you guys have said to heart, and I wanted to share a really great moment I had today.

Yesterday I picked Benjamin up from school and everything was fine, he was happy, smilely, chatty then quite suddenly he snapped "arrrrrrg Stop talking to me!" And I thought; ooooh there is that teenager 'tude Meemee was talking about! And so I thought WWjustonemoreD? And I said calmly "Mommy, I need a little bit of quiet time now, if that's okay." And he repeated calmly and sincerely. I nodded. And a few steps later he growled; "I just wish I could walk to school and home by myself!"

My instinct was to guffaw at the absurdity of the request and say "no way! Not safe!" but I thought about the no, and thought of a compromise that I could live with...and I said "Can I talk?" And he laughed and said with a tsk; "Yes, mommy!" So I said, "How about tomorrow you get a head a start and I'll walk with Emily about ten steps behind you? That way you can feel alone, but if you need me, I'm not that far."

He liked it. Then he asked, quite nicely, for some more quiet time.

So today he started walking and I let him go ahead of me and we got about three blocks and he started slowing down, so I walked to him and put out my hand and hew grabbed it and he said "It's just I started feeling lonely." So I gave his hand a squeeze and said "I'm glad I wasn't far away." and he leaned his cheek on my hand and said, "me too."

Then I said, "How about when we get to the edge of the school building you can walk to the door alone?" (it's about six meters) and he lit up "That's a great idea, Mommy!"

And he gave me a big hug and kiss and kissed his sister, and off he went as I stood at the corner.

It was really great!

So thanks...from the bottom of my heart...days like today make me feel like a good mom.

Oh that's so sweet. It made me tear up. I'm reading this thread with a lot of interest. My 5.5 yr old DD is acting the same way.

It does seem hormonal sometimes. She just becomes a totally out of control, unreasonable little person. But I can see how hard it is on her to feel that way. She's torn between still being little and wanting to grow up.

You all are inspiring me to handle these situations better than I have been.

[Just1More]

Yeah for good days!

[Funny Face]

What a great thread! I feel the same things many times. your update!

[hakeber]

That makes two relatively fight free nights in a ROW!

I'm just like this:

and a little bit like this:

Let's hope I can actually learn from my mistakes, and get DH on board who after witnessing my quick diffusing of two incidents that days ago would have been major meltdowns this evening, and hearing my story about this morning, is skeptically optimistic but still laments "I must be the most patient father ever! When did I lose control of you people?!"

As if he was ever in control.

I am also very proud of ds today...he was playing with the play-doh in school with a few friends and they mixed up all the colors which apparently they are not allowed to do, so when it was time to clean up ds chucked it all away (that's not the proud moment) and the teacher was looking for it and getting (according to him) VERY frustrated and angry and even though he was really scared, he raised his hand and admitted to throwing it away, and he didn't rat out his friends for mixing the play-doh up.

These are moments I am going to hold on to for when I feel like throwing him to the wolves.

[swd12422]

I'm subbing to this thread and saving it, b/c I know I'll need it in a few years. Thank you for updating and that sweet, sweet story about walking to school!

[DevaMajka]

What a great and timely thread! My 5yo has been getting on dp's and my last nerves recently. The rudeness, and the "I want I want" and "that's not fair".... I've noticed that dp and I are speaking to him with very irritated tones, even over really minor things. (that's really uncharacteristic of dp- he's usually so respectful and gentle). I'm also guilty of saying no to something because it's more convenient for me.
It clicked last night that I NEED to change myself. I need to be more respectful and considerate of him (including finding more mutually agreeable ways to say yes!). I told ds that I was going to try to be more respectful to him, and I wanted him to be more respectful to me. And I know that he'll try. That's just the kind of person he is. It hadn't really occurred to me before reading Just1more's posts that I need to be *very* specific about what I want from him. I'm so good about giving acceptable alternatives for smaller kids, but I forgot that a 5yo doesn't just know everything I want him to know.

So thanks for starting this thread, and to Just1more for sharing her ideas!

[Surfacing]