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Anyone a vegan and have healthy teeth? - Page 2

post #21 of 35
Thread Starter 
Just bumping for more replies. I have cut out ghee recently, so I am not getting the k2 fro that source anymore. I need reassurance that I am doing good. I hang out in the TF forum and feel like a failure that we are allergic to dairy, eggs, cultured foods, and eat very little meat. I thought yo needed all these things to be healthy, but I have to try to be healthy without it all.
Maybe I should start a thread about becoming vegan after eating heavy meat, dairy, egg diet (based on WAPF) if I don't get any responses here.
post #22 of 35
You sound to be experiencing my dilemma a while back. What are your convictions? Are you truley believing animal products are wrong on an ethical basis? because if you don't feel this way, i don't think the veg*n board is best for you.

Being the veg board I don't want to go in to much detail about my thoughts, but I would post it on the nutrition or TF board. Basically, I know my family is not going to be vegan, nor do I really want them to be. I strive to have as little impact on the animal farming industry as possible. I am VERY happy and healthy on a plant based diet, and consume a little wild fish and things I feel appropriate on occassion, but my family is happy and i'm happy with what they eat. It sure makes it more affordable to get the best, most ethical choices for them when I don't need a portion.

I'm not allergic/sensitive to soy at all, and actulaly feel tofu is good source of protein for me. I don't eat loads of it, but some. My kids actulaly love it diced, breaded and pan fried or baked and skewered with toothpicks.

I wouldn't feel like a "TF" failure. It's kind of a narrow minded feel to me, and I don't like the heavy emphasis on dairy products. DD also is very sensitive to lacto/naturally fermented things.

I like to stick to how I believe, and then follow with my menu based on that. You start with things your body CANNOT have for allergy reasons or whatever. Then cut out things you think are not ethical choices for you, and what is left is how you will feed your family. Don't worry about what he/she said you should or shouldn't eat if you are ok with it. Sometimes you have stop burying yourself with so much dietary information and just eat healthy and enjoy doing the best you can for your family.
post #23 of 35
Thread Starter 
Quote:
Originally Posted by 425lisamarie View Post
You sound to be experiencing my dilemma a while back. What are your convictions? Are you truley believing animal products are wrong on an ethical basis? because if you don't feel this way, i don't think the veg*n board is best for you.
Alot of it is religious reasons, as we are encouraged to eat very little meat. I have posted my concerns on the TF forum and I basically was told that there is no hope for us health wise if I eat vegan, and I never thought of posting in the nutritional section since I was hoping for thoughts from vegans.
Being the veg board I don't want to go in to much detail about my thoughts, but I would post it on the nutrition or TF board. Basically, I know my family is not going to be vegan, nor do I really want them to be. I strive to have as little impact on the animal farming industry as possible. I am VERY happy and healthy on a plant based diet, and consume a little wild fish and things I feel appropriate on occassion, but my family is happy and i'm happy with what they eat. It sure makes it more affordable to get the best, most ethical choices for them when I don't need a portion.

I'm not allergic/sensitive to soy at all, and actulaly feel tofu is good source of protein for me. I don't eat loads of it, but some. My kids actulaly love it diced, breaded and pan fried or baked and skewered with toothpicks.

I wouldn't feel like a "TF" failure. It's kind of a narrow minded feel to me, and I don't like the heavy emphasis on dairy products. DD also is very sensitive to lacto/naturally fermented things.

I like to stick to how I believe, and then follow with my menu based on that. You start with things your body CANNOT have for allergy reasons or whatever. Then cut out things you think are not ethical choices for you, and what is left is how you will feed your family. Don't worry about what he/she said you should or shouldn't eat if you are ok with it. Sometimes you have stop burying yourself with so much dietary information and just eat healthy and enjoy doing the best you can for your family.
Thank you for saying this. I need to stop reading what is "right" and just go with what I feel. Still I am a mess worrying about our health.
post #24 of 35
Are you finding yourself or your family to be feeling poorly or having any health problems since you reduced or eliminated animal products?

I think that telling someone that s/he is inevitably going to have health problems if s/he eats a certain way is a bit narrow. Certainly you can stack the odds in your favor or against it depending on what you do, but different bodies have different nutritional needs. Just b/c some people feel that they don't do well without a lot of meat and dairy doesn't mean that your body needs a lot of meat and dairy. And, if you cannot eat a lot of animal products for health or ethical reasons, you are going to have to figure out a way to make those dietary choices that you do have open to you work for your nutritional needs.

As I said when you first posted this thread, I have been vegan for a very long time (22 years by the end of this year). I remain healthy, energetic, and I still have good teeth. Dd11 was the one just at the dentist time time around and she, too, has no cavities. On dh's side of the family, they really do seem to do better health wise with fewer animal products, but it is something that dh isn't willing to reduce. On my side, I might get by either way. My family members tend to be pretty healthy regardless of what they are eating or not.
post #25 of 35
I have been vegetarian for ~15 years and vegan for ~6 and I've never once had a cavity or anything. Dentist always gets excited about my 'perfect' teeth. DS is 16mos & vegan since birth and has no dental issues. DH was meat-eater all his life and always had lots of cavities. He eats vegan at home (so eats meat maybe 1-3x a month) for the last 4 years and has had I think 1 or 2 small cavities in that time.
post #26 of 35
Thread Starter 
Quote:
Originally Posted by ChristaN View Post
Are you finding yourself or your family to be feeling poorly or having any health problems since you reduced or eliminated animal products?

I think that telling someone that s/he is inevitably going to have health problems if s/he eats a certain way is a bit narrow. Certainly you can stack the odds in your favor or against it depending on what you do, but different bodies have different nutritional needs. Just b/c some people feel that they don't do well without a lot of meat and dairy doesn't mean that your body needs a lot of meat and dairy. And, if you cannot eat a lot of animal products for health or ethical reasons, you are going to have to figure out a way to make those dietary choices that you do have open to you work for your nutritional needs.

As I said when you first posted this thread, I have been vegan for a very long time (22 years by the end of this year). I remain healthy, energetic, and I still have good teeth. Dd11 was the one just at the dentist time time around and she, too, has no cavities. On dh's side of the family, they really do seem to do better health wise with fewer animal products, but it is something that dh isn't willing to reduce. On my side, I might get by either way. My family members tend to be pretty healthy regardless of what they are eating or not.
Quote:
Originally Posted by crunchy_mommy View Post
I have been vegetarian for ~15 years and vegan for ~6 and I've never once had a cavity or anything. Dentist always gets excited about my 'perfect' teeth. DS is 16mos & vegan since birth and has no dental issues. DH was meat-eater all his life and always had lots of cavities. He eats vegan at home (so eats meat maybe 1-3x a month) for the last 4 years and has had I think 1 or 2 small cavities in that time.
Yes, our health has gotten worse after eating high meat, dairy, and eggs, and my dd even developed cavities drinking cups of bone broth everyday.

I just don't know how to be a good vegan. What are you guys eating? Are you taking supplements to ensure you get enough nutrients?
post #27 of 35
Quote:
Originally Posted by bluebirdmama1 View Post
I just don't know how to be a good vegan. What are you guys eating? Are you taking supplements to ensure you get enough nutrients?
The book Becoming Vegan is one of the best resources for vegan nutrition. Maybe you can find it at your local library.

B12 is usually the biggest challenge, you can find it in nutritional yeast, fortified non-dairy milks, or fortified breakfast cereals. Some vegans do take supplements for it. A well-balanced vegan diet will take care of most of the nutrients you need.
post #28 of 35
Here are some sample vegan meal plans:

http://living-vegan.blogspot.com/200...eal-plans.html

And here's the "what's cooking" thread here for June:

http://www.mothering.com/discussions....php?t=1229839

I cook the vegan stuff from this cookbook most days:

http://www.amazon.com/gp/product/157...MVXXZ2F3VZXBFP

I'll try to come back and share more when I'm not NAK.
post #29 of 35
A typical day at our house:

Breakfast:
DH: Oatmeal with molasses, wheat germ, sunflower seeds, raisins and flax meal, coffee
DD: Toast with almond butter and agave drizzle, fresh fruit, soy yogurt, herbal tea
Me: Tofu sauteed in olive oil with nutritional yeast, salt and pepper, on toast, with sauteed spinach. Fresh seasonal fruit, coffee

Lunch:
DH: 2 PBJ sandwiches (we make all our own jams), 4 pieces of some sort of fruit.
DD: 1 PBJ, a piece of fruit, and carrot sticks
Me: Big salad with chickpeas, avocado, and berries.

Dinner:
DH and I: Black bean Sweet potato enchilada casserole with spicy mole sauce
DD: Black beans, steamed sweet potatoes, and greens saved out from the casserole with extra bean broth because she loves soup and doesn't like spicy food. She also usually gets a corn tortilla quesadilla made with a little bit of Daiya.
post #30 of 35
Wow catnip I don't know how you cook 3 separate meals!!

I don't think it's hard getting proper nutrients eating vegan... We eat lots of beans, nuts, whole grains, and tons of fruits & veggies. Also lots of fats from things like coconut milk, olive oil, avocados, etc. We often add nutritional yeast to our food for flavor but not as a daily supplement; we don't take additional supplements (although I think I said before that I am taking some now for an unrelated medical condition). Are there certain nutrients that you're particularly worried about missing?
post #31 of 35
Quote:
Originally Posted by crunchy_mommy View Post
Are there certain nutrients that you're particularly worried about missing?
I think that's the question. What are you concerned about, exactly?

It sounds to me like you've got yourself convinced that a vegan diet cannot possibly be healthy - but your families allergies restrict you to eating pretty much a vegan diet. That's a paradox and a conundrum. But, you've got all these people here, and families/stories/medical data/photographs all over the internet, demonstrating healthy, thriving vegans of all ages. You also say you all feel better eating this way. It sounds to me like what needs to change is your attitude toward veganism!
post #32 of 35
Quote:
Originally Posted by Sayward View Post
I think that's the question. What are you concerned about, exactly?

It sounds to me like you've got yourself convinced that a vegan diet cannot possibly be healthy - but your families allergies restrict you to eating pretty much a vegan diet. That's a paradox and a conundrum. But, you've got all these people here, and families/stories/medical data/photographs all over the internet, demonstrating healthy, thriving vegans of all ages. You also say you all feel better eating this way. It sounds to me like what needs to change is your attitude toward veganism!
Yes, I think a lot of people have misconceptions & a negative attitude toward veganism, I'm not sure why that is. Once when I told a waitress I was vegan, she looked shocked, said, "Wow you look really really healthy, I always thought vegans were all gaunt and unhealthy looking." Do some more research, look at pictures, read stories... I would never say that a vegan diet is perfect for everyone (nothing is 100%) but there are many many people who are incredibly healthy & live very long lives on vegan diets, and lots of research mainstream & otherwise to support it.
post #33 of 35
I have had "bad teeth" due to genes, but excellent oral health due to great diet and mouth care. I have had one cavity my whole life. Granted, I am now vegetarian but could definitely have said the same for the period that we were vegan (about two years). In a lot of ways, I felt like vegan was healthier 'coz I was much more conscientious about what we ate and making sure that we were getting enough of "everything" and now that I'm vegetarian I'm a little lazier, like oh just sprinkle some cheese on it and call it good.

But I definitely think that you can have a fully vegan diet with no detrimental effects to your family's oral health.

If you are noticing a lot of cavities and such, have you considered that there might be a gluten issue? I have heard of a lot of people with gluten problems ending up with cavities or loss of tooth enamel.
post #34 of 35
Thread Starter 
Thanks Somegirl99 and ToFu for the links!

Quote:
Originally Posted by catnip View Post
A typical day at our house:

Breakfast:
DH: Oatmeal with molasses, wheat germ, sunflower seeds, raisins and flax meal, coffee
DD: Toast with almond butter and agave drizzle, fresh fruit, soy yogurt, herbal tea
Me: Tofu sauteed in olive oil with nutritional yeast, salt and pepper, on toast, with sauteed spinach. Fresh seasonal fruit, coffee

Lunch:
DH: 2 PBJ sandwiches (we make all our own jams), 4 pieces of some sort of fruit.
DD: 1 PBJ, a piece of fruit, and carrot sticks
Me: Big salad with chickpeas, avocado, and berries.

Dinner:
DH and I: Black bean Sweet potato enchilada casserole with spicy mole sauce
DD: Black beans, steamed sweet potatoes, and greens saved out from the casserole with extra bean broth because she loves soup and doesn't like spicy food. She also usually gets a corn tortilla quesadilla made with a little bit of Daiya.
I need to hang out in the June daily diet thread as this is very helpful.
Quote:
Originally Posted by crunchy_mommy View Post
Are there certain nutrients that you're particularly worried about missing?
Minerals, especially calcium, fats, DHA + other fish fats, vitamin k2, b12, iron, vitamin A. All these things I have been taught that they have to come from animal sources as they are hard to get or poorly absorbed.
Quote:
Originally Posted by Sayward View Post
I think that's the question. What are you concerned about, exactly?

It sounds to me like you've got yourself convinced that a vegan diet cannot possibly be healthy - but your families allergies restrict you to eating pretty much a vegan diet. That's a paradox and a conundrum. But, you've got all these people here, and families/stories/medical data/photographs all over the internet, demonstrating healthy, thriving vegans of all ages. You also say you all feel better eating this way. It sounds to me like what needs to change is your attitude toward veganism!
Exactly! I have a really bad attitude towards veganism. Diet to me is like religion and I have been taught that animal products are necessary for so long that it is like learning all over again. That is why I am seeking stories and advice from those that have healthy teeth here. The feeling I felt when I was brushing my toddler dd's teeth one day and saw cavities made my heart drop. I was the most diligent person on the planet following the dental "cure cavities with nutrition thread" person and we developed them- and many other health issues, and kids with the worst allergies to all animal products basically. Like everything I have been taught is wrong. That diet I was on was a part of me. Now that I am faced with veganism, I feel like I am going against everything, but deep inside I know that it is the right thing.

I am a little against veganism for the reason that I was one for years as a teen, but I admit I ate really bad, vegan junk all the time. Now I am determined to get it right.
Sorry for the novel; I take diet very seriously and really appreciate all the responses.
Quote:
Originally Posted by crunchy_mommy View Post
Yes, I think a lot of people have misconceptions & a negative attitude toward veganism, I'm not sure why that is. Once when I told a waitress I was vegan, she looked shocked, said, "Wow you look really really healthy, I always thought vegans were all gaunt and unhealthy looking."
post #35 of 35
Quote:
Originally Posted by bluebirdmama1 View Post
Minerals, especially calcium, fats, DHA + other fish fats, vitamin k2, b12, iron, vitamin A. All these things I have been taught that they have to come from animal sources as they are hard to get or poorly absorbed.
Calcium: Leafy greens including broccoli, collard greens and kale; fortified non-dairy milks; black beans, navy beans, soybeans, calcium-set tofu; almonds and sesame tahini; fortified breakfast cereals; fortified orange juice; blackstrap molasses. Animal protein actually causes loss of calcium from your bones, and interestingly the countries with the highest dairy consumption have the highest rates of osteoporosis. note that vitamin D helps with calcium absorption.

Fats: I think most people agree that monounsaturated fats such as those from olive oil, avocados, and nuts are much healthier than the saturated fats found in animal products.

DHA and other essential fatty acids: LNA omega-3 (which your body can convert to DHA) in flaxseed, hemp seed, walnuts, soybeans, canola oil, seaweed, dark leafy greens. For most vegans this is sufficient. I am currently supplementing DHA since I am currently pregnant and my needs are higher, am planning to continue while nursing. There are vegan sources of DHA from algae which is actually where the fish get it from.

Vitamin K: From Wikipedia: "Vitamin K2 (menaquinone, menatetrenone) is normally produced by bacteria in the large intestine,[2] and dietary deficiency is extremely rare unless the intestines are heavily damaged, are unable to absorb the molecule, or are subject to decreased production by normal flora, as seen in broad spectrum antibiotic use[3]." If you don't believe that, note that natto (a fermented soy product) is probably the best dietary source of K2. Apparently sauerkraut is also a good source.
Vitamin K1 sources: leafy green vegetables, broccoli, cabbage, asparagus, pumpkin, lentils, peas, soybean oil, nori, hijiki and other seaweeds.

Vitamin B12:
Nutritional yeast, fortified non-dairy milks, fortified breakfast cereals, fortified veggie "meats". Supplements use a bacterial source which is the natural source of this vitamin. Note that the vast majority (>95%) of B12 deficiency cases are not due to inadequate intake of B12 but rather either decreased ability to absorb the protein-bound form found in animal foods (these people do fine with the vegan sources) or due to pernicious anemia which is the failure to synthesize intrinsic factor; this is treated with B12 injections.

Iron: Leafy greens including broccoli and kale; mushrooms; romaine lettuce; lentils, navy beans, pinto beans, kidney beans, soybeans; tofu; quinoa; veggie "meats"; blackstrap molasses; flaxseed and pumpkin seeds; dried fruits such as apricots or raisins. Vitamin C helps with iron absorption; dairy foods and coffee and tea inhibit iron absorption. As a note, I have not taken any prenatal vitamins or iron supplements during this pregnancy and my iron levels are fine, there seem to be a fair number of pregnant omnivores taking prenatals who are still anemic.

Vitamin A: Plenty of veggie sources of pro-vitamin A (beta-carotene) which the body can easily convert to vitamin A. Note that high doses of vitamin A from animal origin can be toxic. There is no danger of toxicity with beta-carotene. Sources include carrots, peppers, pumpkin, squash, sweet potatoes, turnips, tomatoes, broccoli, dark leafy greens, nori, apricots, cantaloupe, mango, nectarine, papaya, persimmon, plantain, prunes.

This is not directed at you, but I find it interesting that most omnivores that quiz me about my diet and health seem more concerned that I am missing nutrients than they are. Omnivore diets are frequently deficient in: soluble fiber, insoluble fiber, folate, boron, magnesium, potassium, phytochemicals. While it is certainly possible to eat an unbalanced, unhealthy vegan diet, most vegans I know do a much better job of eating healthy and balanced than most omnivores that I know.
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