Neonatal Cortisol Response to Circumcision with Anesthesia

[Fyrestorm]

This is an interesting study...scary that they actually thought it was a good idea to cut babies without anesthesia though.

Does anyone know if the full article is available on line for less that $32.00?
http://cpj.sagepub.com/cgi/content/abstract/25/8/412

The adrenal cortisol response to surgery was not significantly reduced by the administration of lidocaine. Blood sampling and anesthetic injection of venipuncture alone did not evoke the adrenal response in uncircumcised control infants. Cortical input or secondary epinephrine elevation may be producing the cortisol elevation in infants despite regional blockage of the afferent nerve pathways.

[serendipity22]

Unethical experiment...

Is any able to translate the quote into plain English?

[Fyrestorm]

They are basically saying that the stress hormone response was the same in babies whether they had pain relief or not.

Past studies have shown that cortisol can permanently change the brain.

[So-Called]

Originally Posted by Fyrestorm

They are basically saying that the stress hormone response was the same in babies whether they had pain relief or not.

Yes. In addition (not able to find the quote right now, but pretty sure about what I read), they did not observe this response with injections or blood tests. It was strictly a feature of circumcision.

n/m, there it is in the OP. It wasn't showing up for some reason:

Blood sampling and anesthetic injection of venipuncture alone did not evoke the adrenal response in uncircumcised control infants.

[katiesmom]

Heartbreaking...I'm bookmarking for next friend/family to have a boy.

[serendipity22]

So they found lidocaine was not especially helpful.

One thing I have never seen mentioned, is the possibility that an infant being circed could be in fear for his life.

Surely an older child or adult who was restrained and underwent a similar experience (without being told what was happening) would be terrified.

Infants feel way more than adults, as far as I'm concerned.

[Claire and Boys]

Yes. An adult going through something like this would be aware of what was going on and that the pain would stop when it the surgery was finished.

An infant has no way of knowing that.

[PuppyFluffer]

Originally Posted by serendipity22

So they found lidocaine was not especially helpful.

One thing I have never seen mentioned, is the possibility that an infant being circed could be in fear for his life.

Surely an older child or adult who was restrained and underwent a similar experience (without being told what was happening) would be terrified.

Infants feel way more than adults, as far as I'm concerned.

Yes, I believe so.
I can share my own personal experience as a hospitalized very sick 4-5 year old child. This was in an era where parents were not encouraged (or possibly allowed) to be with kids for procedures. I had an IV placed in my arm. I do not remember anyone explaining what was happening or why. What I know is that I was truly terrified and that I fought with all my might because I truly DID believe they were trying to kill me. It took an adult at each limb to hold me down to put it in my arm. I weighed about 35 lbs.
It's an experience that has effected me for my whole life. I didn't lay my arm out for a blood draw for 28 years!
In 2000, I got sick and had a CT scan with IV contrast. While I was an adult and able to rationally know that I was consenting willingly ....emotionally, I was completely hysterical. The emotional reaction totally overwhelmed me physically. I was cold, clammy, sweating, feeling panicked, I had tears coming out of my eyes and I had absolutely no control over any of the physical reactions. I've since learned about post traumatic stress and that is exactly what I was experiencing. I had to have a lot of bloodwork during this time and I had a wonderful lab technician who got me through it. I can now give blood without the extreme reaction.

I am curious to know if men in intact cultures have the aversion to doctors that men have in the USA.

I believe that circumcision (and other painful traumas to children) leave lifelong scars, some of them certainly consciously understood. I also believe that one can overcome those traumas in some ways but I don't think they can completely be undone.

[claddaghmom]

Originally Posted by PuppyFluffer

Yes, I believe so.
I can share my own personal experience as a hospitalized very sick 4-5 year old child. This was in an era where parents were not encouraged (or possibly allowed) to be with kids for procedures. I had an IV placed in my arm. I do not remember anyone explaining what was happening or why. What I know is that I was truly terrified and that I fought with all my might because I truly DID believe they were trying to kill me. It took an adult at each limb to hold me down to put it in my arm. I weighed about 35 lbs.
It's an experience that has effected me for my whole life. I didn't lay my arm out for a blood draw for 28 years!
In 2000, I got sick and had a CT scan with IV contrast. While I was an adult and able to rationally know that I was consenting willingly ....emotionally, I was completely hysterical. The emotional reaction totally overwhelmed me physically. I was cold, clammy, sweating, feeling panicked, I had tears coming out of my eyes and I had absolutely no control over any of the physical reactions. I've since learned about post traumatic stress and that is exactly what I was experiencing. I had to have a lot of bloodwork during this time and I had a wonderful lab technician who got me through it. I can now give blood without the extreme reaction.

I am curious to know if men in intact cultures have the aversion to doctors that men have in the USA.

I believe that circumcision (and other painful traumas to children) leave lifelong scars, some of them certainly consciously understood. I also believe that one can overcome those traumas in some ways but I don't think they can completely be undone.

Wow. DH has said similar things. He had open heart surgery at 4yrs and then around 7yrs encephalitis from his vaccines. He's mentioned things like how he thought they were draining his blood so that he would die....

I think his experiences were part of the reason he basically shrugged when I mentioned things like unassisted birth lol.