I don't feel anything! - Page 2

[Shami]

Bluebirdiemama, yes, this is what I am talking about. Whether you are a new christian or an old christian, this is such a healthy way to go on with the Lord and with the other believers. We can become spiritually sick because of unforgiven offenses.
Every week at the Lord's supper, before I take the bread and the cup, I ask the Lord to wash me and I confess any offense that I have with another member of the body, usually it's an offense with my dh. I declare by faith the I am one with the Lord and one with the body. I also declare that I love all of the members even if I don't feel it. I especially tell the Lord that I am one with my husband, even if I don't feel it.

In John, just before the Lord went to the cross, He prayed that all of the believers would be one, even as He and the Father are one. The oneness among us is way more significant than we realize.
Sometimes I wonder if I belong on some of these threads because when I have a disagreement with another believer I feel it is spiritually unhealthy and it does not build up or encourage the other person, or me, for that matter.

[Purple*Lotus]

I am still getting through the first page But before I forgot, I wanted to comment on one thing:

I think the reason I think I *should* feel something, is because I *used* to feel something. So that is why it is strange for me. But if I look at it from the angle that I am not supposed to feel something, then yes, it makes sense. I just used to feel such powerful love for God. I can't put it in to words. But it was like this rush of emotion and happiness and sobbing with joy at the same time. I suppose maybe I think it should always feel that way? Well, not always, but you know, once in a while, at least.

[Purple*Lotus]

Originally Posted by Shami

I wanted to say a little more in response to some pp that said it is not about feelings or how you feel. While I understand your point and agree that we need to pursue the Lord regardless of how we feel, I think there is a need to point something out.

Feeling dry and feeling like you have lost the presence of the Lord are two different things in my own experience.

When I feel dry, may not have any hunger for the word nor any desire to listen to hymns. I may still talk to the Lord or pray, but I don't have the sense that I am receiving much grace or light. I still know the Lord is there and I believe in Him, but I may not have much desire to contact Him or spend time with Him. I view this feeling of dryness as quite a normal part of my christian life and just wait and pray for it to end.

On the other hand, feeling like I have lost the presence of the Lord is the scariest thing ever to me and I hate when that happens. I feel blocked and stuck regardless of how much I pray, sing, and read, I sense the Lord is gone. Usually it has to do with an offense toward another member of the body. Sometimes it has to do with a sin that I need to confess, but more than likely it is due to an offense. Offenses with other Christians can really hinder the flow of the Spirit because the same Lord that lives in me, lives in the person that I am offended with. When I am offended with another believer, in actuality I am offended with the Lord, too, sort of indirectly.

OP I don't know which is your case. I do know that you left the believers you were meeting with, and if you haven't gone to the Lord about it, that may be something that is hindering your relationship with the Lord. Even if you were right and they were wrong, you may have some things in your heart to let the Lord shine on and heal you. Talk directly to the Lord about it. Many time I am mulling something over in my mind and I think I have given it to the Lord, but really I am just in my mind wandering around. Try to have direct conversations with the Lord.

Fellowship of the Spirit is very sensitive. There is vertical fellowship which is the Lord as the Spirit flowing to you, and you flowing back to the Lord. Horizontal fellowship is the Spirit flowing among the believers. If a water hose gets blocked with dirt the water can't flow. Likewise, if our heart gets clogged up with unforgiven offenses or unconfessed sins the Spirit can't flow.

Hope this helps and sorry if I am stepping too far out there. I don't mean to presume anything. I'm just throwing some concepts or principles out there for your consideration.

No, that does help, and the way you explain it makes sense. Perhaps I am just dry right now and not lost. I am very upset about being abandoned by a faith community that I invested so much of my life in to. So perhaps that is coming out in my current feelings.

[Purple*Lotus]

Originally Posted by Magelet

I'm not christian, so maybe I come from a different perspective.

I'd say that it's perfectly ok. It doesn't mean you don't beleive in G-d, or that G-d rejects you. I think what it means is that you have been through a really really rough time lately. You may need to focus on earthly you for a while, and your healing, and when you are feeling a little more whole, you may be feeling more open to your connection to G-d. G-d is still there, and loving you if need support, however G-d can also understand and wait while you get yourself a little more straightened out, while you devote your energy to healing yourself.

Yes, I agree. It has been a crummy year for me and I am trying to rebuild and really figure out who I am. I lost so much of myself in an abusive marriage. I am realizing that the person I pretended to be all these years does not exist and embracing the true me is proving difficult.

[Purple*Lotus]

Originally Posted by _ktg_

s. My thoughts (again opinion) is that sense of community is damaged for you, by what your church did to you as a member, an active caring member. Shameful!!

I agree with Zoebird, and Annettemarie and was coming to offer just my suggestion from a different perspective to look for the little things. The joy in a sunrise or sunset, the laughter of children, the smile of babies, the cool breeze on a hot day. The divine works all around us, and even when we feel alone, abandoned, shunned - it is still working, just "whispering", nudging us and trying to direct us back to our paths in life or in new directions we need to be going.

I have been doing that. I have been close to tears lately by things I have seen. So I am feeling some things.

This has been such an interesting thread so far, I am still not done with the first page

[Purple*Lotus]

Originally Posted by Shami

My point is that Bunnyflakes should always endeavor to reconnect with God and then the healing comes with God as the source of her healing.
If you do a word search on "earthly" it is not positive. The Bible tells us to look away unto Jesus. Magelet admitted that she is not christian and I completely respect that and I completely respect her point of view. However, because I am christian and so is Bunnyflakes I thought it would help the op to point out certain principles, like looking away unto Jesus.
I know that our physical bodies can have a profound effect on our spiritual pursuit, but still believe we should look to the Lord for all things.

I guess that my main issue is that God should be the source of her healing. Focusing on the 'earthly you' and healing yourself takes God out of the picture all together.
Hope that makes sense. I don't know if we are disagreeing, Bluegoat, or if we use different terms to mean the same thing.

Yes, I see what you are saying here.

Originally Posted by Magelet

Like a PP, I agree paying attention to things like sunsets and majestic forests and children's smiles can help, by showing us G-d's presence in the world. they are such beautiful, powerful awe-ful things that they are clearly OF G-d, and thus a reminder of G-d, or perhaps a gift from G-d.

I have been doing this lately. I did not realize that it could be a means to get closer to God, but I see how it could be now.

Originally Posted by bluebirdiemama

I was thinking about those posts and was going to say soething like that, but didn't know how to say it.

I know that when I go to church on Sunday morning, I try to let absolutely everything go, and I feel as I let them go, I am more in tune with the Holy Spirit. It is so amazing, and maybe it's because I am a new Christian. idk. But I always try to let as much of it go as I can, the Lord is so wonderful and amazing, I really crave that closeness.

That is how I used to feel.

Originally Posted by Shami

In John, just before the Lord went to the cross, He prayed that all of the believers would be one, even as He and the Father are one. The oneness among us is way more significant than we realize.
Sometimes I wonder if I belong on some of these threads because when I have a disagreement with another believer I feel it is spiritually unhealthy and it does not build up or encourage the other person, or me, for that matter.

I think everyone has been very respectful here and I appreciate that so much I value everyone's input and am thankful that we can disagree, but in a gentle and understanding way

My initial thoughts are that perhaps I am just tired. I mean, it has been a bad year. I realize that I have been living a lie for 8 years. It is hard to come out of an abusive marriage and realize "Hey, this is not who I am!" Would things have been different for me if my church had rallied around me and supported me through the medical trials and the marriage troubles? I am not sure, honestly.

I was a very active member of my church. I think the thought of rebuilding that is daunting. Do I want to risk that? I mean, let's say that my next MRI has spots on it and I find out that I have MS. Can I get through it if my new church doesn't support me? Do I want to rely on them anyway? I think I need to concentrate on a support system of friends, perhaps. I felt so distant from my family when I was with my husband and he always went out of his way to make any potential friend feel so unwelcome. So maybe now I can reach out and form strong bonds with people and I wont notice if a church I attend cares about my problems or not.

That sounds so harsh, I don't mean it to sound that way. That is just how I feel.

I feel that perhaps I was silly to expect so much of people. This was not my first church. I was an active member of another one but I moved away. And at that church, I was almost too supported They were very involved in my life and encouraging me and even awarded me a scholarship for some of my education. If someone in my family was ill, they reached out to me. So perhaps I expected too much from the new church, if that kind of outreach is abnormal. But I don't really have anything to compare it to, really.

And perhaps having MS isn't as bad as I am making it out to be in my head? I realize that worrying about it wont do a single thing one way or the other. They will either find problems down the road or they wont. My temporary blindness was either caused by MS or a fluke. No answers there. No answers to be found.

At least with my marriage I am pretty much clear of that. I never have to be treated poorly by anyone again if I don't chose too. So that is something off of my mind.

Wow, sorry to have written so much! My thoughts are just flowing and I have always felt very safe here at MDC. Even with all of the members here, I have never once felt judged or mistreated, so I feel comfortable saying my feelings.

I have always had trouble praying. My mind wanders. I think a lot and I can't concentrate. I have never been able to be still with God. I have tried so much. I have OCD and I think that plays in to it. Like I want God to think that I don't love Him or that I hate Him because I want to keep Him away from me, perhaps because I don't believe that I deserve to be loved like that? I was never even able to work through this in therapy because I could never say outloud the problems I had with prayer. I really don't know why I have such trouble with this.

[Shami]

Originally Posted by Bunnyflakes

I am still getting through the first page But before I forgot, I wanted to comment on one thing:

I think the reason I think I *should* feel something, is because I *used* to feel something. So that is why it is strange for me. But if I look at it from the angle that I am not supposed to feel something, then yes, it makes sense. I just used to feel such powerful love for God. I can't put it in to words. But it was like this rush of emotion and happiness and sobbing with joy at the same time. I suppose maybe I think it should always feel that way? Well, not always, but you know, once in a while, at least.

Yes, I do believe you should/could/will feel this every now and then. The weeping with joy and a rush of the Lord being so real, the feeling of being filled, that light and supply. Sometimes my dry times go much longer than I'd like. Someone once told me that the water runs down into the valleys, too. Have you asked the Lord to water you? Maybe not in those terms, but ask the Lord to fill you, water you, supply you, make you hungry. Our God is a God of recovery. He is so ready to recover you back to Himself. He will restore your joy because of who He is, because He is faithful. Try asking the Lord to restore the joy of your salvation.
I am not sure of Sister Theresa's situation or relationship with the Lord. I am not the judge of that. However, I believe that something unhealthy is going on if the Lord's presence is gone. In a normal healthy relationship with the Lord, you can sense that He is there. Also, in a normal healthy relationship with the Lord we will experience hills and valleys, wet times and dry times.

[Bluegoat]

Originally Posted by Bunnyflakes

I have always had trouble praying. My mind wanders. I think a lot and I can't concentrate. I have never been able to be still with God. I have tried so much. I have OCD and I think that plays in to it. Like I want God to think that I don't love Him or that I hate Him because I want to keep Him away from me, perhaps because I don't believe that I deserve to be loved like that? I was never even able to work through this in therapy because I could never say outloud the problems I had with prayer. I really don't know why I have such trouble with this.

What kind of prayer are you using, Bunnyflakes? If you are having trouble with spontaneous prayer, perhaps a habit or discipline of "pre-written" prayers might be helpful. I know that people often feel this isn't "real" prayer, but I find when I am at loose ends, to go back to these regular, what some might call rote, prayers is very helpful. It makes sure that there is at least one time each day that I have set aside to spend with God; and it gives me something to say when I don't feel like saying much. And such prayers have the advantage that they are to some extent didactic - they teach us about God and his relationship with us, which can be very helpful in such situations.

I belong to the Anglican Tradition, so I use the Daily Offices in the Book of Common Prayer this way. I like Compline the best, it is fairly short, very beautiful, it is said late so the kids are in bed, and so peaceful.It's designed for two or more but is easy to adapt for one. Here is a link if you are interested, or any other prayers you like might accomplish the same thing.

[genifer]

Bunnyflakes. There has been a lot of useful advice here already so Ill just say what I think about it. Im in a very similar place. And Ive been here for a few years. I dont know about you but while I struggle with the same feelings you do about God, does he hate me now, have I done something wrong? I dont feel that way but its crossed my mind. I dont feel the joy of my salvation and my prayers lately have surrounded those feelings. I sometimes feel God has led me into a situation that I didnt ask for. I feel like if I had taken control out of his hands and let myself have faith in myself, I wouldnt have to deal with the pain of some of the things I dealt with over the last few years. At the same time I can see the beauty of wha God's doing with my life. Its not what I would have chosen for myself. I was naive and made some mistakes at a young age, just at the same time when I was saved and I know the Lord led me into the situations Ive faced... with Him knowing I would go thru them. Ive felt betrayed by God, Ive walked thru similar dry and dark places you described. Despite all of this, I can also say, simultaneously, that I do still trust God. I do still love Him with all my heart. Ive learned a lot about God during this time. Ive wrestled with a lot of things about God too. Ive been angry with Him, Ive even been tempted to say I hated Him, but I always stopped short, chosen my words carefully and said 'I really hate what Im going thru with ALL my heart!'

Here's the thing. I wonder if when we feel like you and I are feeling right now, that we may be on the cusp of something... big maybe, more growth, more freedom in Christ. Im so glad you know Jesus. One thing Ive learned during this time was that no matter what I said or did, no matter what Ive been thru, no matter how messed up in the head I feel, God is still God. He does still love me, he has never forsaken me, just like He promised. There have been times when I wanted him to just let me go, I didnt care if he let me die or let me burn in hell. Honestly, its a little painful to admit that, but its true. Whats amazing is that He never let me go. He held onto me with what I felt was a thin thread and he never let me fall. I still struggle to stay positive about things. Im working thru trusting again. You mentioned not feeling anything!! I can very much relate to that. I dont feel that rush of joy when praising, that welling up with squishy feelings that felt so good. Even when Im praising. I think this is about maturing, about our foundation in Christ becoming even more solid! This is whats happening to me. When I thought I was ready to throw in the towel, really what was happening was God was strengthening my faith in Him, growing me in wisdom, emotional and physical strength and I am just not the same person I was even a few years ago. I KNOW God more!! More about Him. Ive been thru all this with Him, my knowledge of God and my relationship with Him is all new again, different, more depth when I thought I had gotten there just upon being saved! ykwim? Its scary, but again my trust in God is sometimes bigger then I give myself credit for. I think I just dont want to go thru some things.

One thing I can remember from when I was first saved was this (). When I didnt want to read the bible, I thought it was satan making me feel that way (lol) so what I did was make myself read the bible. Now, Im at a similar place as you. I really sometimes cant take anything in when I read my bible. I get distracted, my mind wanders. But something that helps with that is to just read the same verses over and over..... and over and over and over and over again. This is meditating on the word. I take it real slow, with a determination that I AM going to understand this and it WILL go in! Psalm 139 has been so blinking inspiring for me right now! Check it out.

hugs to you!! Big hugs!


One thing I wanted to add is that what we are doing, that nonbelievers just cant understand and I honestly dont mean to sound patronising, but what we are doing is learning about God. Growing in the knowledge of Christ. I would encourage you to explore that a bit. Who is Christ? (The depth of this is what Ive learned over all this difficult time...). Oh my goodness... what he said was that we will know the truth and the truth will set you free. Knowing the truth about Christ, no matter what anyone says, He was here first, ykwim? If anyone knows truth, Jesus Christ does, lol. Im not here to debate this but to encourage you to explore this with the bible.

[The Amber Lily]

"I want to make it clear that I believe in God 100%. I believe that Jesus died for my sins. I have listened to other people talk about their various beliefs and religions, but none have ever felt as right to me as God sending His son to die on the cross for me. So if I believe that firmly, and I do, then why don't I feel anything at all anymore?

I feel far from God. "

This is really a common feeling. I get this on a fairly regular basis, as do a LOT of people I know. For me, it tends to be when I am not willing to go where He is leading me or let go of an attitude or something that He is wanting to change. Sometimes I know what they are, but often these blocks are so very subtle that I don't.

I read the Psalms then, because they are such intimate conversation with God. They are confession, praise, despair and hope all mixed together. Also, I bring the anger, resentment, 'why are you crushing me', 'why am I so far from you', 'I want to be close again', etc, to Him in prayer. I speak in my thoughts, or sometimes out loud if I am alone, and I speak as if He is right there beside me, as if He is there in my mind with all of the confusion, anger, and grayness.

Psalm 51 is a good one, as is 55. Seems like the 40's and the 50's would be helpful. I just flip through and read and pray what catches my attention, then move on to the next one. 42 and 43 I think speak to this very thing; here is Psalm 42:5.

"Why are you cast down, O my soul?
And why are you disquieted within me?
Hope in God, for I shall yet praise Him "


"I think maybe God doesn't want me anymore? Maybe that is why I have zero desire to pray, zero desire to go to church. .... I worry that He is done with me and doesn't want to use me for anything. ... Then I wonder if it is because I am so obese, that He is disgusted that I abuse my body so much? Or if perhaps He is upset that I let my husband abuse me so much and did not ever step out in faith and try to get my life back together. Or maybe this all means that I really *don't* believe in God? "


These are all lies. I'm sorry to be so blunt, but I think that's the best way to be with a lie. These are straight from the enemy who prowls around like a lion, looking for people to devour. He is a liar, and these are his lies.

God always wants you. God never leaves you. God is never disgusted with you. God never judges you based on appearance. He knows you, He knows your heart. He knows what you've been through, He knows what you've suffered. He doesn't hold that against you. In addition, you are also forgiven in Christ. Anything in your past that is your mistake is forgiven, washed away to the bottom of the deepest ocean, as far as the east is from the west.

Here is a song for you, by Audio Adrenaline called 'Ocean Floor'. It's one of my favorites.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=F_i2xsRiXDU

[The Amber Lily]

Originally Posted by Bluegoat

I have read your other posts, and I really think you need to find a new church, one with leaders who are a lot more spiritually mature than the ones at your old church.

This.

[lolar2]

I don't have anything to add to the religious discussion, but MS can be very mild or very severe or anywhere in between. So if you do have it, it is entirely possible that it won't be as bad as you fear.

Also, are you taking any new-to-you medication? A lot of medications have emotion-related side effects (I myself get depressed on Benadryl and panicky on penicillin).

[Purple*Lotus]

Well I am going to try some suggestions. I will start with some daily Bible reading. Then I am going to try to just talk to God and see how that works out for me

[bluebirdiemama]

bunnyflakes. I feel a lot of love for you, and I feel like I can relate to the way you feel. When I moved to the US 15 years ago, I quckly developed a hatred for myself and killed myself inwardly. Especially right now I can really relate to your struggles with who you are... I am right there too. I am tryng to trust the Lord, to take away the things that aren't of Him, and don't benefit me or anyone else. And He is showing me self truths that are... really beautiful, and bring me joy. It's crazy to experience, and hard to hang on to, when I do experience it. But I see that I am in the process, and I can trust God to get me there....


We had an amazing message yesterday, and I was thinking that you would really benefit from it. I want to give you encouragement, and hope I can type this out the way it sounds in my head....


Genesis 50:20 ... "You intended to harm me, but God intended it for good to accomplish what is now being done, the saving of many lives."

This is Joseph speaking to his brothers. After having suffered hardships and mistreatment, at the hands of his brothers especially, is saying that all his sufferings had been worth it to reach the accomplishment of God's will.


Isaiah 43:2 .... "When you pass through the waters, I will be with you;
and when you pass through te rivers, they will not sweep over you.
When you walk through the fire, you will not be burned;
the flames will not set you ablaze."


Phillipians 1:12 .... "Now I want you to know, brothers, that what has happened to me has really served to advance the gospel."

Paul... after being imprisonned in a dungeon, all his hardships for the advancement of the gospel.


...


Romans 8:18 ... " I consider that our present sufferings are not worth comparing with the glory that will be revealed in us."

Not to say that our sufferings are not significnt, but that the result, if we allow the Lord to work in us, will reveal the Lord's glory. And if our suffering is intense, and painful, and longlasting, then how magnificent, glorious, wonderous, mind-bogeling amazing! is the merciful power of God that brings us through it, and to an end of peace and clarity!
And our Lord is faithful! These are the things He has promised! You can count on them!


Here are some points to help you through...

1. We need a new perspective, Romans 8:18.
2. ... patience, vs. 20-25.
3. ... understanding of Providence, v. 26-27, 28
4. ... and keep praising, v. 28

I have a couple other thing I would like to say but my kids are becoming unruly....

[Purple*Lotus]

Originally Posted by bluebirdiemama

l


Genesis 50:20 ... "You intended to harm me, but God intended it for good to accomplish what is now being done, the saving of many lives."

This is Joseph speaking to his brothers. After having suffered hardships and mistreatment, at the hands of his brothers especially, is saying that all his sufferings had been worth it to reach the accomplishment of God's will.


Isaiah 43:2 .... "When you pass through the waters, I will be with you;
and when you pass through te rivers, they will not sweep over you.
When you walk through the fire, you will not be burned;
the flames will not set you ablaze."


Phillipians 1:12 .... "Now I want you to know, brothers, that what has happened to me has really served to advance the gospel."

Paul... after being imprisonned in a dungeon, all his hardships for the advancement of the gospel.


...


Romans 8:18 ... " I consider that our present sufferings are not worth comparing with the glory that will be revealed in us."

Not to say that our sufferings are not significnt, but that the result, if we allow the Lord to work in us, will reveal the Lord's glory. And if our suffering is intense, and painful, and longlasting, then how magnificent, glorious, wonderous, mind-bogeling amazing! is the merciful power of God that brings us through it, and to an end of peace and clarity!
And our Lord is faithful! These are the things He has promised! You can count on them!


Here are some points to help you through...

1. We need a new perspective, Romans 8:18.
2. ... patience, vs. 20-25.
3. ... understanding of Providence, v. 26-27, 28
4. ... and keep praising, v. 28

I have a couple other thing I would like to say but my kids are becoming unruly....

thank you those are really helpful. I get frustrated sometimes and I want to scream "Okay, really, enough, dump this on someone else!" which is really selfish and immature of me It is hard for me to see my current situation as anything other than just plain bad luck. But it is nice to see that it could be for something greater

[Purple*Lotus]

I have a bit of a happy update.

I have been reading a bit the past three days. I found this Guideposts magazine with verses to read. Tonight's was Romans 12: 9-21

And hello, WOW Did I ever need to read that!

9 Don’t just pretend to love others. Really love them. Hate what is wrong. Hold tightly to what is good. 10 Love each other with genuine affection,[e] and take delight in honoring each other. 11 Never be lazy, but work hard and serve the Lord enthusiastically.[f] 12 Rejoice in our confident hope. Be patient in trouble, and keep on praying. 13 When God’s people are in need, be ready to help them. Always be eager to practice hospitality.

14 Bless those who persecute you. Don’t curse them; pray that God will bless them. 15 Be happy with those who are happy, and weep with those who weep. 16 Live in harmony with each other. Don’t be too proud to enjoy the company of ordinary people. And don’t think you know it all!

17 Never pay back evil with more evil. Do things in such a way that everyone can see you are honorable. 18 Do all that you can to live in peace with everyone.

19 Dear friends, never take revenge. Leave that to the righteous anger of God. For the Scriptures say,

“I will take revenge;
I will pay them back,”[g]
says the Lord.

20 Instead,

“If your enemies are hungry, feed them.
If they are thirsty, give them something to drink.
In doing this, you will heap
burning coals of shame on their heads.”[h]

21 Don’t let evil conquer you, but conquer evil by doing good.

Basically I have carried around a lot of anger towards my STBX. Why can he live well, go out to eat, have money to buy things, etc, when he has no job? Why am I working so hard to pay bills, some of which I have only because of what he did? Why is his life good after he abused me for over 8 years, and mine feels like it is in the gutter?

You know, why isn't he suffering because I think he deseves it?

But after reading this *ironically enough, today marks the 9 year anniversary of the day I met him, so yes, I NEEDED to read this today* I realize that this is not at all about me. It is none of my business how his life is. How do I even know his life is good? Maybe he is suffering but I just don't know it? And even if he is, again, none of my business. It is God's business, not mine. The only thing I can control is saving the money to file for divorce. Only 99 more dollars to go, and I can file. That is all I can do, so I am just going to push the rest away and concentrate on that. I have to know that it isn't about wanting to see him suffer or be punished. That is out of my hands. I can't pretend to know more than God does about this!!

So I thought I would share!

[bluebirdiemama]

What a wonderful thing to be freed from !!!

[Shami]

Wow, what a break through! I am so happy for you and I really appreciate the update on how you are doing. It seems like you may have experienced the stretching forward and forgetting things which are behind that Paul talks about in Philippians. Praise Him! He is so faithful when we seek Him.