How do you "talk you kids down"?

[*LoveBugMama*]

Let me try to make this understandable.

MY son has lots of anxiety, for different things. Some days I just think he feels like the whole world is a very scary place. Other days are a little better. He has had periods where the anxiety has been so bad that he has said he wanted to die. (At age 6, because going to school just scared the living daylights out of him.)

Right now, what scares him the most is evenings. The dark. Going to bed. The sounds he hears when in bed, and that he can`t instantly identify the sound. He also reacts pretty strongly to me/his father trying to make him visit his old class at school. (He is homeschooled the rest of this year, but will be going bakc to school in the fall, then starting in fourth grade. He will be 9 in a few weeks.)

Sooo, my question is this: How do you talk them down? When they have worked themselves up, anxious, scared and kinda angry because they are scared and anxious. Anyone know what I am talking about? I spend quite a bit of time talking him down every night now. He wakes in the middle of the night, anxiety flaring because it`s dark, he heard a sound, he can see a glimpse of the world outside because the curtains arent`t as thigtly shut as he wants them to be etc. And then I have to calm him. I talk, talk and talk. I stroke him, give him backrubs etc. But I am sooooo tired. This can go on for several hours, in the middle of the night. Last night it was from 4 Am until almost 6 AM. This evening I had to do the same, because he started getting anxious and angry because we are visiting his school tomorrow.

How do you do it? Any tips that has worked great for calming a child with anxiety? I don`t want this to turn into a thread about US, my child. I hoped we could share tips on how to calm anxiety WHEN IT HAPPENS. Any tips you have tried that acutally helps the anxious child calm them selves? (That is the hardest part, I think. Cause he is just. not. listening. to reason. at that point, YK?

[Momma Aimee]

subbing, my 4.5 year old has anxiety -- though as of now not as bad as your son.

I fine my issue is IF and WHEN I can be 100% on with him ... him only, not trying to shop, not trying to watch both kids, not trying to ______, then i can manage him failrly well -- but do you know how hard it is to be 100% on with one child ALL THE TIME in the face of real life and with another child ....and then sometime sit like i make it worse, but most of the time i make it better -- so i am left feeling usless and lost and fusruned most of the time.

OP -- I know you son is 9 so I am sure any suggestions i have you have tired .......but i will toss it out there anyway ........what about a sound machine for bed.?? get one with like 10 sounds, he can choose the sound and trun it up as loud as he wants. When i lived in an anpartment in kansas City alone the ONLY way I slep t any was my sound machine ....i heard too much (cars, people, things i didn't know what were....). Drowning it all out is the only way i was ok ....

[pixiekisses]

I don't have any idea about this, I just wanted to send some hugs and good thoughts, love. I get tears in my eyes reading how hard life is for LoveBug when he should be a care free 9 year old. s

[karenstir7]

As far as visiting the school- maybe sitting with him and drawing a map of the school. Talk about some of the positive things about school. Does he have any friends at the school you guys can talk about? What are his favorite subjects? If you know what his triggers are at school maybe you can come up with ideas for him that he could do if he starts experiencing anxiety. Is there a counselor or psychologist at the school that could help you?

[Fay]

The key is prevention. Once he's all worked up, it is extremely difficult to talk him down. You can teach calming tools ahead of time...deep breathing, chanting, visualization, etc...which he can use when the need arises. Chanting and singing are processed in the brain stem, which automatically releases calming hormones. My DS1 is very religious, so we would recite the Hail Mary when he was getting anxious. Visualization exercises are also proven to help... there's a series of books by Maureen Garth that are filled with simple visualizations for children, the titles of her books are Moonbeam, Earthlight and Star Bright. Calming sensory input can make a big difference. I often give my DS1 a drink of cold water and a heating pad on the back of his neck when he is upset. He also likes to wrap himself in blankets -- weighted blankets (or any type of deep body pressure) work very well in this situation, because they are known to trigger the production of serotonin. Even playing with play dough, silly putty or moon sand can help calm a person. We have a sensory table in our dining room that is currently loaded with moon sand -- my kids have been quite happy the past few days!

[beachbaby]

My suggestions may be way off, since my DD is only 4, but some things that have helped in the moment:

--not trying to reason--once I see that it's not working, I just try to acknowledge her feelings and repeat back to her her fears. She usually bursts out crying and then after the release of tears, is somewhat more able to rationally talk about the issue causing the anxiety.

--deep breathing/relaxtion before bed. Our EI person gave us a relaxtion script that we use on particularly wound-up evenings.

--Rescue Remedy!

--Inerrupting the anxiety loop with some sort of physical activity...DD has SPD, so we try for some proprioceptive input like bouncing on a yoga ball for a few minutes. Gum chewing also helps.

--We just read a children's book in our OT's office about sensory defensiveness (one of DD's big issues that leads to her anxiety) and it labeled the things that trigger overresponsiveness as 'busy bees buzzing'. Since then, DD has been able to label her feelings as 'busy bees buzzing' instead of shutting down...the label helps her self-calm and sort of puts a humorous spin on it (and my DD typically does NOT do well with any sort of making light of things when she's in the middle of an episode like this). I haven't read it, but I've heard good things about this book. It might have similar analogies that he might be able to draw on in the moment.

I hope this helps some.

[Linda on the move]

Has he had cbt (cognitive behavoiral therapy)?

My DD's therapist worked on tools like deep breathing, connecting with the moment, etc. and helped her figure out which situations to apply which technique to.

My DD has a fish tank next to her bed and we leave the light on while she is falling asleep. We leave a couple of inches of space at the top with no water so the sound of the water falling down from the filter is louder. It's really nice both as white noise and as something to look at and focus on.

[Learning_Mum]

OK, I know you said that you wanted to talk about your son and not us but I think I might have some helpful advice? Also, I don't have a child with SN so take from it what you will.

Having suffered from anxiety the best things I have found are deep breathing (this is best when you first start feeling anxious, so might be something to work on when he's feeling OK)

Staying in the moment. Can you talk to him about how warm the duvet feels, how soft his PJ's are etc to get him focussing on what is going on right that second? As you said that noises can scare him I guess I wouldn't focus on that unless maybe you have a CD that you can put on to drown out any outside noises?

Work on senses. Maybe try giving him peppermint oil to smell or jasmine oil (which is meant to help with depression and anxiety) and just get him to take big deep breaths of it. Something he can rub in his hands, like a smooth worry stone? Repetitive movements such as rocking, stroking etc seem to happen naturally when you're experiencing anxiety so having something to rub will give him something to focus on.

Try having him sing a repetitive song with you or chant. Even saying Om might help, or just a droning hum. Humming actually causes our brains to produce something (can't remember what right now) which is good for us. I remember my sister saying when she had anxiety when her third was a baby she would sing the Barney song (I love you, you love me etc) over and over to herself.

I think the key is really trying to get him to focus on the moment so his brain can switch off from all the horrible thoughts that are going on.

I really feel for any kids that may have anxiety. Having experienced it myself it can really feel like you're losing your mind. It is so hard to deal with as an adult I can't imagine how hard it must be to deal with when you're a child that is still learning to identify with your emotions anyway.

[Momma Aimee]

Originally Posted by beachbaby

My suggestions may be way off, since my DD is only 4, but some things that have helped in the moment:

--not trying to reason--once I see that it's not working, I just try to acknowledge her feelings and repeat back to her her fears. She usually bursts out crying and then after the release of tears, is somewhat more able to rationally talk about the issue causing the anxiety.

--deep breathing/relaxtion before bed. Our EI person gave us a relaxtion script that we use on particularly wound-up evenings.

--Rescue Remedy!

--Inerrupting the anxiety loop with some sort of physical activity...DD has SPD, so we try for some proprioceptive input like bouncing on a yoga ball for a few minutes. Gum chewing also helps.

--We just read a children's book in our OT's office about sensory defensiveness (one of DD's big issues that leads to her anxiety) and it labeled the things that trigger overresponsiveness as 'busy bees buzzing'. Since then, DD has been able to label her feelings as 'busy bees buzzing' instead of shutting down...the label helps her self-calm and sort of puts a humorous spin on it (and my DD typically does NOT do well with any sort of making light of things when she's in the middle of an episode like this). I haven't read it, but I've heard good things about this book. It might have similar analogies that he might be able to draw on in the moment.

I hope this helps some.

do you know the name of the book your read with teh bees idea? sounds like something that would help Theo -- is he learning to say "I have big emotions"

[Momma Aimee]

Originally Posted by Linda on the move

Has he had cbt (cognitive behavoiral therapy)?

My DD's therapist worked on tools like deep breathing, connecting with the moment, etc. and helped her figure out which situations to apply which technique to.

My DD has a fish tank next to her bed and we leave the light on while she is falling asleep. We leave a couple of inches of space at the top with no water so the sound of the water falling down from the filter is louder. It's really nice both as white noise and as something to look at and focus on.

I plan to put a fish tank inthe boys room as soon as i can trust them not to MESS WITH IT When i was little i saw a movie with a bedroom with a fishtank built into the wall -- and i have lusted after that ever siince.

[beachbaby]

Originally Posted by Momma Aimee

do you know the name of the book your read with teh bees idea? sounds like something that would help Theo -- is he learning to say "I have big emotions"

It was this one. I was surprised DD connected to it. Hope it helps your DS, too.

[*LoveBugMama*]

Thanks for all the great suggestions!

The worst is when his anxiety flares when we are out and about. He will NOT let anyone see him when upset, so he either "swallows" it (making him hysterical without words, shaking and whispering to me while trying to hide/run away etc.) or he will try so hard to look cool that he starts hyperventilating when we finally are alone somewhere. Luckily, we haven`t had any of these episodes since he stopped going to school but I anticipate them coming back when he starts again.
When we are home, he atleast isn`t full of anxiety about SHOWING his anxiety. (Does that make sense at all?? It seems like he has almost as much anxiety about others seeing/knowing that he has anxiety, than about the anxiety itself.)

What works best for him, seems to be pressure and humming. If I make swooshing/humming noices, and at the same time gently, but firmly puts
pressure on his back/head/legs, it seems to calm him somewhat. Sometimes I pretend to be a wave, making swooshing sounds and talking very quiet about the sea and the waves. When HE tries to calm himself, his first choice would be tv. He seems to get calmer by watching a cartoon or something.

[Momma Aimee]

Originally Posted by *LoveBugMama*

Thanks for all the great suggestions!

The worst is when his anxiety flares when we are out and about. He will NOT let anyone see him when upset, so he either "swallows" it (making him hysterical without words, shaking and whispering to me while trying to hide/run away etc.) or he will try so hard to look cool that he starts hyperventilating when we finally are alone somewhere. Luckily, we haven`t had any of these episodes since he stopped going to school but I anticipate them coming back when he starts again.
When we are home, he atleast isn`t full of anxiety about SHOWING his anxiety. (Does that make sense at all?? It seems like he has almost as much anxiety about others seeing/knowing that he has anxiety, than about the anxiety itself.)

What works best for him, seems to be pressure and humming. If I make swooshing/humming noices, and at the same time gently, but firmly puts
pressure on his back/head/legs, it seems to calm him somewhat. Sometimes I pretend to be a wave, making swooshing sounds and talking very quiet about the sea and the waves. When HE tries to calm himself, his first choice would be tv. He seems to get calmer by watching a cartoon or something.

have you tried a weighted blanet for helping sleep???

(I want one for me)

and the antirest about being anxious i fully understand -- i live it.

[*LoveBugMama*]

Originally Posted by Momma Aimee

have you tried a weighted blanet for helping sleep???

(I want one for me)

and the antirest about being anxious i fully understand -- i live it.

Never tried a heavy blanket. But I have thought about it several times. But not because of the anxiety, though. He loooves pressure. It calms him down, as I said. But he also loves pressure when NOT needing to calm down. He loves roughhousing, me "lying" on top of him, pressure from pillows, he loooves when his dad throws big, heavy pillows on him while he lies on the floor. Makes him laugh hysterically. : So I have thought about getting a weighted blanket because of that. What makes you think this would help with regards to anxiety, by the way? I`m always open to new ideas!

Had a REALLY rough night. He is sick, and that always makes everything worse. So he kept us awake from 2 AM until 5.30 AM last night, crying and shaking uncontrollably. Poor, little guy.

Thanks for great advice.

[VisionaryMom]

I also would try a weighted blanket. It's hard to explain why it works, but it's helpful - almost like a physical force calming you down.

I also would try white noise. I went through a terribly traumatic period as a young teen when my mother's ex was trying to kill us. He was able to sneak into our house a couple of times, and I became absolutely panic-stricken if I heard noises at night. It helped to have a fan on to help drown out the noise. Now, for my DC I prefer to use meditation music to help them focus on the music and remain calm.

Perhaps he is too young for this, but another tool I find helpful is the "what's the worst that can happen?" exercise. You go over with him the worst thing that could happen (well, really barring catastrophic events, but still...) and talk him through how he would handle it. So, if he goes back to school, what's his fear - that he will get an answer wrong in front of the class, drop his tray at lunch, no have any friends? Help him talk through those scenarios so he's prepared.

[Momma Aimee]

Originally Posted by *LoveBugMama*

Never tried a heavy blanket. But I have thought about it several times. But not because of the anxiety, though. He loooves pressure. It calms him down, as I said. But he also loves pressure when NOT needing to calm down. He loves roughhousing, me "lying" on top of him, pressure from pillows, he loooves when his dad throws big, heavy pillows on him while he lies on the floor. Makes him laugh hysterically. : So I have thought about getting a weighted blanket because of that. What makes you think this would help with regards to anxiety, by the way? I`m always open to new ideas!

Had a REALLY rough night. He is sick, and that always makes everything worse. So he kept us awake from 2 AM until 5.30 AM last night, crying and shaking uncontrollably. Poor, little guy.

Thanks for great advice.

Pressure can help with anxiety -- be calming -- and sleep issues - laying there not sleeping, night time fears and so on -- is anxiety in one way or another -- the pressure, the calming -- might help him with sleeping ....make him feel more safe of some physical level.

[LynnS6]

I just scanned the responses, but I didn't see these two books recommended:

For you:
Freeing your Child from Anxiety by Tamar Chansky

For you to work though together:
What to do when you worry too much

Other things that I've learned echo some of what other people have said: It's best to work on these tools when he's not in the middle of a panic attack.

When he's in the middle of it, all you can really do is hold him, rub him and wait for it to pass. But at other times you can work on these strategies so that when the panic attacks come, he can begin to use these other skills. I'd start with some deep breathing and relaxation stuff, I think. Have you tried relaxation tapes? Someone here posted some for kids once... vague I know, sorry.

He is old enough for cognitive behavioral therapy to work, and so I would encourage you to look into that. Again, it's not a tool for the moment, but it will give him tools for the moment.

You might also want to look at Sensational Kids, since it sounds like he's got some sensory stuff going on too. There are, at the end of the chapters, suggestions for things sensory kids can do to help self-regulate. They might help too (though how you're going to do heavy work at 4 am might present a challenge!)

[Momma Aimee]

Originally Posted by LynnS6

I just scanned the responses, but I didn't see these two books recommended:

For you:
Freeing your Child from Anxiety by Tamar Chansky

For you to work though together:
What to do when you worry too much

Other things that I've learned echo some of what other people have said: It's best to work on these tools when he's not in the middle of a panic attack.

When he's in the middle of it, all you can really do is hold him, rub him and wait for it to pass. But at other times you can work on these strategies so that when the panic attacks come, he can begin to use these other skills. I'd start with some deep breathing and relaxation stuff, I think. Have you tried relaxation tapes? Someone here posted some for kids once... vague I know, sorry.

He is old enough for cognitive behavioral therapy to work, and so I would encourage you to look into that. Again, it's not a tool for the moment, but it will give him tools for the moment.

You might also want to look at Sensational Kids, since it sounds like he's got some sensory stuff going on too. There are, at the end of the chapters, suggestions for things sensory kids can do to help self-regulate. They might help too (though how you're going to do heavy work at 4 am might present a challenge!)

"hevey work at 4am" = weighted blanket !!! works for me personally ....







ok a general question -- i guess --

i KNOW i need to teach my 4.5 DS copeing skills when NOT anxcious, or overly silly or _______. butttttttttttt he doesn't seem to 'get it". maybe it is jsut him?

We talk about "when you get big emotions you can _______ let's pratcie now" and then when he HAS them i say "let's _______ like we praticed" but -- it just is not connection.

I know the ansious / stressed / emotonal state is a differnt state physically and mentally then the "calm" state and i know learning is state dependant ....my husband teachs firearms and he says you have to do so so so so so so many reps becuase if you NNED the skilsl the only way to access them is for them to be an automatic memory -- whne you are that sressed you can't THINK about think about what you are supposed to do ...

so have i jsut not "gotten there yet" with my son -- and he just need about a zillion more "calm" state reps so that he can access that skill when anxious .....

or is he not understanding what i am telling him "we pratice theis now, then when big emotions hit we do it again" ???

( it seems like the 2nd but i kinda hope it is the first ...)

thoughts????

[LynnS6]

so have i jsut not "gotten there yet" with my son -- and he just need about a zillion more "calm" state reps so that he can access that skill when anxious .....

or is he not understanding what i am telling him "we pratice theis now, then when big emotions hit we do it again" ???

( it seems like the 2nd but i kinda hope it is the first ...)

thoughts????

I think it's both -- really being able to think cognitively about your behavior and plan what to do is a late developing skill. That's why most people who do cognitive behavioral therapy won't do it with kids who are under 8. They just don't have the executive function to be able to implement the techniques.

I think, however, that you can work on the skills without complete understanding. So, if you can get a gazillion reps in for deep breathing, then maybe when you ask him to do deep breathing when he's freaked out, he might be able to do it.

A lot, at this age, is really prevention, rather than after the fact.

[*LoveBugMama*]

Thanks soo much for great responses!

I just ordered a book today: When my worries get too big, by Kari Buron. It`s a bokk for the kid, but since it`s in english I will be reading it for/with him. His english is very good for an 8YO Norwegian kid, but still not advanced enough to be reading stuff like that alone.

I will be looking around online to see if I can get a weighted blanket in this country.

And a big YEAH to those saying that you need to teach/practice when the kid is calm, and NOT in the middle of a panicattack/anxiteyepisode. There is NO way I could get anything rational through to him at that point.