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PDD-NOS: Questions for anyone who has knowledge of this - Page 2

post #21 of 31
My middle child is on the Autism Spectrum and has Tourette's Syndrome. One of her bigger issues as a child on the Spectrum are her emotional outburts (which are now infrequent). My other two do not have that spectrum piece.

For background for what I say -- In my experience with S, anything that increases her stress and worry (the anxiety piece) increases her tics (frequent hard eye squinting) which then gives her headaches. Stress and worry used to also increase the severity and frequency of her behaviors and outbursts. She'd just immediately react and act out because she didn't have any coping mechanism in 'her toolbox' as we call it to help her. Stress/worry + tics/headaches used to cause the biggest increase in negative behaviors because she just feels like crap all around - emotionally & physically. I say used to because we did have her on medication for a long while. Being on that medication got her to a place where she could take an active part in problem-solving when she got upset and worried. Now she knows what to do and can communicate before she gets to explosion point. She is no longer on medication because she has those tools and knows how to use them, and she feels so much more in control and happier.



Am I correct in thinking that you being able to present a realistic, do-able plan as a compromise would be necessary for him to be able to go home? Is feeling better part of what he wants? (I hope so because that really needs to be pressed)

The removal from home and a routine would absolutely cause any Autistic child to have an increase in negative behaviors and emotional outbursts. It is possible to live at home and get medication management and behavioral therapy. We did just that. BUT! In order for that to be successful, his home environment has to be one in which that can and will be done. The parents/guardians need to take an active, hands-on, 24/7 role in that process. Will the parents/guardians actually follow through with giving him meds, taking him to appointments or group sessions, applying suggestions, making changes at home, etc? The removal piece and many changes in placements concerns me. "as we have already been told by the Court Psychologist that this child is not competent for criminal charges purposes" concerns me. If his needs are greater than they think and he has an psych problem in addition to the Autism piece, he may truly need the residential to get him stable. We did not need residential at all, but we did have to make many a trip to Dartmouth Hospital to see the pediatric specialists there for ongoing checkups on S's meds and we kept a journal. We are very fortunate to have a great Autism Specialty team who has worked with my family for 10 years now, so that was already in place. They are a huge help and we have frequent contact and consults with them.

Quote:
I just don't think people get the child is not being deviant to be deviant, but because of the medical diagnosis.
I'd look for a listing of Autism Specialists in your area. They are behavioral therapists, but they approach it with an understanding of Autism as the root of the behavior and working with the specific needs of an Autistic child to find ways for the child to navigate the world in a way that works for him vs fighting the Autistic behaviors (which people unfamiliar with Autism can unintentionally do) and inadvertantly making the behaviors worse.
post #22 of 31
After all of that from me I feel this needs its own post --

I really, really, really think that to effectively represent him, you need to go see him, where he is, and how he is. As you said, certain info cannot be shared with you via phone or fax or paper because you aren't allowed to see the full files. You can see HIM, though. His current situation and demeanor needs to be documented and then documented again each and every time you go back. And going back is very important because if anything changes, good or bad, it needs to be presented. None of that can be done from such a long distance.
post #23 of 31
Thread Starter 
I want to thank everyone who has provided some good and useful advice in this.

I think I have a good start on where to go and what I need to look for. I need to go look through some records I have, to see what other issues, if any, that the child has been diagnosed with to see what effect they may have if any on the child.

I am not sure if I posted this here or not, but where I live, a child does not have to be neglected or abused to be removed from a parents custody. We often have kids removed and placed in Temporary Custody of Children's Services or the Court in Delinquency matters or even in cases where the parents are suitable but having trouble dealing with the child's needs.

Again, unfortunately, ETHICALLY my duty/concerns are not with are the parents able to provide what the child needs, but ETHICALLY my concerns and duty are to do what the child wants. But, I also want to make sure that in the meantime while doing my job, that the child is not in danger or in a harmful setting, even though that is not my job/responsibility/duty, because I don't want to see a child hurt by being in an inappropriate setting.

(Edited to add ETHICALLY, because my personal opinion may be different.)
post #24 of 31
Quote:
Originally Posted by khaoskat View Post
Again, unfortunately, ETHICALLY my duty/concerns are not with are the parents able to provide what the child needs, but ETHICALLY my concerns and duty are to do what the child wants.
Right. But sometimes to get what you want, first you have to get what you need. lol

I didn't mean you had to ensure the parents did those things. I meant that if the kid wants to go home, and sooner rather than later, doesn't the home environment factor in? His health? Doesn't it have to be proven that he CAN go home because the home is fine? Which would mean that info on what the home can provide him vs what the residential can provide him is important. Or am I misunderstanding? (because I'm interested so I really do want to understand )
post #25 of 31
Quote:
Originally Posted by khaoskat View Post
Unfortunately, I do not believe there is currently a treating therapist, or if there is, it is more medication management type of situation, as the child has not been in one area (ie city/county) for a long enough period of time to get established in services. Unfortunately, where I live, it can often times take up to 4-6 weeks, even with CPS involvement, to get services started.

As the attorney, my job is to get what the child wants....so for instance if the child wants to go live with Captain Kangaroo, that is what I have to fight for. (Ok, I am using a far fetched example on who a person may want to live with.) My job is not to look out for the child's best interests, that is the GAL's job.
Ooh that is a real bummer about therapy. What about a social worker? They should have a really good feel for what this child should need if they are a decent worker...

As far as Captain Kangaroo...I really truly don't mean this to be snarky, but if your only job is to respresent the child's wishes and not their best interest, why are you bothering to ask if residential is appropriate? It shocks me that the role of a child's attorney would not be to respresent their best interests. In the state in which I live, that is exactly what the attorney is suppposed to do. I really do give you credit for researching what is best for this kiddo, but I am just confused about roles I guess.
post #26 of 31
Thread Starter 
Quote:
Originally Posted by APToddlerMama View Post

As far as Captain Kangaroo...I really truly don't mean this to be snarky, but if your only job is to respresent the child's wishes and not their best interest, why are you bothering to ask if residential is appropriate? It shocks me that the role of a child's attorney would not be to represent their best interests. In the state in which I live, that is exactly what the attorney is suppposed to do. I really do give you credit for researching what is best for this kiddo, but I am just confused about roles I guess.
Where I am, an attorney is an attorney - you represent your client. In this case my client is the child. The child has stated preferences, and my job is to represent the child's preferences and the child wants.

We also have another person that comes into play in most cases involving children, and that is called a Guardian Ad Litem. Many times in Court, to save time/money, etc, the GAL and Atty are the same person. There are times this does not work, because what the GAL may believe to be in the best interests of the child is not what the child wants. So, they have to appoint someone to represent the child. The role of the GAL is to do an independent investigation and make a determination as to what is "in the best interests of the child".

Why am I trying to find out the information - because in the end, I believe that the best way to get what my client wants is to ensure that everyone is on the same page about what the child's true needs are and how to best serve those needs. If I can work with the attorney (or attorneys as the case may be) for the parents, and get us all working towards the same goal and ensuring that everything is in place, etc, then it makes it easier for me to represent the child and get the childs wishes.

Also, I feel that if I have a better understanding of the diagnosis and needs of the child, I will be better able to represent the child and also most importantly, how best to communicate with and work with the child to prepare for trial.
post #27 of 31
Thread Starter 
Quote:
Originally Posted by fullofgrace View Post
I didn't mean you had to ensure the parents did those things. I meant that if the kid wants to go home, and sooner rather than later, doesn't the home environment factor in? His health? Doesn't it have to be proven that he CAN go home because the home is fine? Which would mean that info on what the home can provide him vs what the residential can provide him is important. Or am I misunderstanding? (because I'm interested so I really do want to understand )
You are correct...home environment plays a huge role. All I can do as the chlid's attorney is communicate with the parents attorney/attorneys as to what needs to be done from my client's perspective. Then it is up to them to discuss it with their clients and go from there....
post #28 of 31
Good luck with the case. I hope you are able to make substantial progress, particularly placement in a more appropriate environment, quickly for the sake of the child.
post #29 of 31
Quote:
Originally Posted by APToddlerMama View Post

As far as Captain Kangaroo...I really truly don't mean this to be snarky, but if your only job is to respresent the child's wishes and not their best interest, why are you bothering to ask if residential is appropriate? It shocks me that the role of a child's attorney would not be to respresent their best interests. In the state in which I live, that is exactly what the attorney is suppposed to do. I really do give you credit for researching what is best for this kiddo, but I am just confused about roles I guess.
There's another attorney involved called a guardian ad litem, who is appointed by the court. It's that attorney's job to make recommendations regarding the child's best interests. It's the job of the child's attorney to give the child a voice in court -- to say what the child wants and argue for that.

Both interests -- what's best for the child AND what the child wants -- deserve to be heard in court.
post #30 of 31
Thread Starter 
RiverTam - can you come advocate in front of a Magistrate I have that position....Magistrate refuses to appt. a child his/her own attorney and the child has clear wishes/desire that are 100% in conflict with the GAL...the child has no voice in Court....
post #31 of 31
I think I'm a little far away.
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