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periodontal issues

post #1 of 10
Thread Starter 
I see a holistic dentist who said that I have large pockets and lots of spirochetes down in the pockets, and they need to go in and "clean out" the pockets so that they will shrink back down to their normal size. This seems very agressive to me and I am wondering if I should pursue other alternatives or just do this treatment he recommended. it involves no abx, just herbs and essential oils, and in between the office treatments, I have to brush with a special paste and use an irrigator under the gum line.

Does anyone have any experience with this? My teeth are not lose or anything to that point.

post #2 of 10
If I had pockets, I would seriously look at my diet for allergens I am eating. Cut them out and add in gum healing foods like camu camu (up to a tablespoon a day), and lots of berries, oranges, etc (if those are allergens). My gums receded alot when I was eating gluten, dairy, and specific foods that I was sensitive to. Adding camu camu in was the best thing I could do at restoring life to my gums, and also working on gut healing. Many people report taking coQ10 helps too, and lots of b vitamins. I found that Lewis Labs Brewers yeast has really helped in overall health.

I think to start with I may get the pockets cleaned out, but take camu camu right away everyday after that to tighten things up quick.
post #3 of 10
Thread Starter 
Thank you! I guess what I am trying to find out is if having them cleaned out could be potentially harmful, because it's so deep, or if I may need to do that and then move forward on addressing the other issues. WHat do you think?

As for the camu camu, how much does one take, how often, etc? I have been using just the plain powdered sodium ascorbate, no bioflavonoids or anything.

post #4 of 10
Thread Starter 
Also, do you have a good source for where to get camu camu online? Thank you so much.
post #5 of 10
I do think that I would get the pockets cleaned out but have the camu camu around first AND cut out allergens. But all the other stuff you mentioned to be done I may not do them as I think that with the proper nutrients your body will start to heal the gums.

SA is good stuff, but I don't like to take it long term and that is just me. I feel prefer to get the vitamins and minerals from whole foods (don't quote me on that because there are some things we do supplement.) I would take up to 4 teaspoons a day. With healthy gums, I take 1 teaspoon. I started with a higher dose. And the amount you take also depends on the particular camu camu. I got a bitter white camu camu and I felt it did nothing for me. I would consider that unripe or just poor quality. The richer the color and sweeter, the better quality or better for the gums. If you want to spend alot on it, there are many good sites I know of, you can just google it too. Just make sure that you don't buy a white one. But www.herbalcom.com has it for the lowest price around, but you never know what the quality is going to be The last time I ordered it was a good one, but a few months ago, it was bad quality. I think if you order from there, you many get the batch I recently ordered from.

And how do you feel about taking coq10? That is supposed to do wonders restoring life to gums. And to encourage health, make sure you get enough b vitamins.
post #6 of 10
Thread Starter 
Thank you! I called the dentist's office today and asked a lot of questions. She said that I have inflammation and "pseudopockets", so sort of the beginning stages of gum disease. But no bone loss. And that the main thing is the high counts of bacteria in there (lots of spirochetes). She said that when she first goes into the pockets, she sprays everything down with a disinfectant that kills off the bacteria, either chlorhexidine or something called "Under the Gums irrigant which just has echinacea, gotu kola, and essential oils in it.

I just read about chlorhexidine on wikipedia and it is not something I want in my mouth. However, the fact is that if she is going in there and stirring stuff up, she has to use something to kill off the bacteria before it spreads throughout your system.

My pockets were size 2-4, with up to 3 being normal. And I had mostly 4's around all of my molars. So mostly the back teeth, but not as bad as I thought.
post #7 of 10
Thread Starter 
So, what should I have her do tomorrow?
post #8 of 10
The essential oil thing doesn't sound too bad.

I have some 3's and no pockets though and I am in no rush like I am going to loose my teeth. The color is great now and they are tightened up, but not grown back. I am not giving up hope though as I am seeing improvement. It is improving greatly as I am dealing with lyme.

So if it isn't that bad it may not be something you have to rush to do, but perhaps you could get it over with it. Only you could make that call. But seriously, dietary changes are important. And adding in rich healing foods like red peppers, strawberries, oranges, etc are important. Raw salads are great for the gums. These foods are important untill and even after you ge some camu camu. Not that I am pushing you to get some camu camu but that will really make a difference in healing.

I have learned that dealing with gum health just externally is just a bandaid for the problems and dealing with diet is the key to long term health. What the mouth is is just a reflection of the insides.
post #9 of 10
Thread Starter 
Yes, I definitely believe that too. We are on SCD, so we're already grain-free, sugar-free, etc. However, I know that I just feel better when I limit the almond flour baked treats and fruits, etc. What I have not gone on to do is to really start getting in the bone broth and fermented foods on a consistent basis. I've cut stuff out, but I know there are some things I need to add in for health and continued gut healing. Definitely will try the camu camu.

So do you think the whole idea of them needing to sort of disinfect the area is okay? I could ask her if she could just use the one with the herbs and essential oils and not the chemical antiseptic. This is a holistic dentist.
post #10 of 10
I do thin it is a good idea to disinfect the area, but only short term. Meaning not everyday IMO. I would go for the essential oil thing, but work on the other things.

I have cut out many allergens, but I know that if my gums are sore, I ate an allergen. They are my indicator sometimes. Something like camu camu can make me more able to eat allergens.

I have strayed away from bone broths as I am trying to get more minerals from nettles and greens and wild edibles more than bone broth lately. And we are allergic to all ferments. I am working on getting microbials from carrots juice and raw foods. This doesn't apply to all, but after going TF, I became a mess more than ever. So I am going more veggie for the time being or atleast the spring. But for others broths work wonders. I am not talking down about ferments and broths at all. Just go with your gut and not by the books, I have learned the hard way.
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