Family Integrated Church? - Page 2

[AFWife]

Originally Posted by vbactivist

Like cappucinosmom said - Some are wonderful. But the ones I have found in my area tend to be this way. Very patriarchal too, as far as girls are not encouraged to go to college because they are expected to be keepers at home, and nothing else. I am not saying there is anything wrong iwth that, just not what I believe.

I may ask him about this feelings toward GKGW and The Pearls...I know our old pastor encouraged blanket training from the pulpit. (Thankfully I didn't hear it as I was changing DS in the nursery at the time...DH told me about it later. He said something about "putting an object on the table and swatting them when they reach for it to teach them no" and DH's reaction was, "Well that's not fair")
I don't have a problem with patriarchy and women being keepers of the home. I also don't have a problem with women attending college...but I do believe my proper place is the home. (I don't force that on anyone but I'm not ashamed to admit it )

[BetsyS]

My church isn't "family integrated", but it is welcoming of babies and children in church. There is a difference.

We do kids in church through worship, then everyone leaves (if they want) to go to their Sunday school classes, from about 6 months through 5th grade. It works very well for us. My 3.5 year old loves his class. My almost 2 year old does not like to separate, nad he chooses to stay in and listen to the sermon. When he is older, he'll go to class, too.

On these threads, there is always a lot of comment from Catholic/Orthodox types because they have *always* had babies/children in the pew, but they also have like 15-20 minute sermons, you know? In our church, we do worship for an hour, then a sermon for an hour. That's a long time for some 3 year olds to sit still.

[AFWife]

Some advocate it because the Pearls are "Christian"...kind of like the Ezzos are "Christian" as well.

[beanbean]

I attend a Family Integrated Church and it is, by a huge margin, the healthiest church I've ever been involved with.

The leadership does an excellent job of encouraging and helping train men to be servant leaders in their homes, which is an area I think tends to be extremely weak in most churches. In my experience, many churches are geared towards/run by women to the exclusion of men and their unique calling and needs.

As far as child-rearing "methods", etc, our view is "in Christian essentials, unity, in non-essentials, charity." I would say that we definitely encourage christian private school or homeschooling over government schooling, but it's not a requirement and someone who had their children in PS would not feel "called out" or admonished. We trust each family to do as they feel led.

I know of one mom that likes the Pearls' methods and others that really dislike them; some families are big on vaccines, some don't vax -- there is a wide range but our general view towards God's intention for families connects us in a way that those other issues cannot divide.

I will say, by a large majority, the congregation leans "crunchy conservative" -- politically aware and involved, proponents of extended BF, organic food, naturopathy, homebirths, opposed to abortifacient birth control, etc. Those things are not tenets of the church, just conclusions most of us have come to through our own relationships with God. Those things are not discussed in the service, but only found out by getting to know each other.

If you don't like the first FIC you visit you may want to try another -- culturally they can vary, although you'll find certain commonalities between them.

HTH!!

[Annemarie42]

We attend an Episcopal church and it is very flexible about children-- there is a nursery available (with silent pagers, so they can page you if your child is fussy), but children are welcome to attend the service. There is programming for older children which they are welcome to attend (or not), but everyone returns for the Eucharist.

[wombatclay]

~~~~~~~~~Just a friendly reminder ~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~

When posting, please keep in mind the MDC User Agreement and the guidelines of the Spirituality Forum. Everyone is being wonderful, and I would love for this discussion to continue, but please do remember that:

We host discussion of nighttime parenting, loving discipline, gentle weaning, natural birth, homebirth, successful breastfeeding, alternative and complementary home remedies, informed consent and many other topics from a natural point of view. We are not interested, however, in hosting discussions on the merits of crying it out, harsh sleep training, physical punishment, formula feeding, elective cesarean section, routine infant medical circumcision, or mandatory vaccinations.

(so conversations that drift towards discussions of authors or practices that involve physical punishment or harsh parenting styles are not ok, if you must comment on these please resort to a PM)

The Spirituality board is a forum of support, respectful requests of information and sharing of faith and practice. To uphold this purpose the board will not host discussions of debate or criticism. Disagreements about spiritual issues should be set aside out of respect for the diversity and varying interpretations and beliefs that we hold as a community.

Like I said, this thread is fine at the moment, but I want to ask people to avoid getting side tracked into subjects that fall outside the MDC User Agreement.

Thanks all, and thank you for sharing your voices and experiences!

~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~

[Tradd]

I used to drive by a small church where I used to live that had "Family Integrated Church" on its sign. After a while, I googled the phrase and found this website:

http://ncfic.org/

Turns out the church I drove by was actually listed in this website's directory of family integrated churches. They're related to Vision Forum, which is very conservative, very patriarchal, etc.

[Arduinna]

Originally Posted by fierrbugg

Ladies, let me first say that I am honestly asking this question (because I don't have any living kiddos) - and not trying to start an arguement. My church has a family area so that parents can attend to their kids mid-service without worrying about disturbing the service itself and it has never occurred to me that this might be offensive. Why do you think having a seperate place for parents who want to or need to keep their lo's with them is such a bad thing? Is it the way that these particular people addressed the issue w/ you? That you don't trust/know the children's workers/volunteers? Or something else?

Our pastor asks that we not bring small children (under 6 at least) into the big service because he knows that they get bored, he talks about adult themes (marriage, sex, sin, etc.) and moreover he wants as few distractions as possible. At the same time they've never kicked anyone out of the big service for bringing small children in. Furthermore Pastor has made it abundantly clear we are a church where kids can literally run through the halls without being shushed. I also volunteer w/ the preschool ministry where the kids are free to run, jump, play, dance, sing, holler - whatever they want to do while still hearing a message that they can relate to. In the new building we'll be moving into next month, they have a slide in the wall for preschoolers to come into the classroom. Our church does extensive background checks on all children's, medical and safety team volunteers. Anecdotally we have one little boy that cries his eyes out every week when he's being dropped off, but within 5 minutes is running around crashing into things and terrorizing everyone. He is a handful but such a sweetheat and we have the space, personnel, activities etc. to address his needs while his parents' spiritual needs are getting filled each week.

The problem isn't the existence of an area behind glass for kids and parents, the problem is insisting that all parents use it, or that all parents must send their kids to the nursery.

In the Catholic parishes I've been to children are welcome at any mass, even if the parish has a cry area behind glass. At the novus ordo parish there is a cry room but many parents don't use it and no one would presume to suggest they do.

At the SSPX parish there is no other option during services but to sit in the pews. There is no child care, no cry room and no nursery. I love seeing the children at mass.

Personally I don't get the desire at some places to shut children out of services.