Luke 16:1-18

[Nazsmum]

OK, so I'm doing a study of Luke. When I came to this parable it had me thinking what is Jesus really saying. So what do you think.

Thanks

[Bluegoat]

THis is a complicated story, isn't it? It seems to be saying many things.

I'm going to think a bit before I post.

[lilyka]

Well here is whst the notes in Bible say....

The point of this parable is that the world is better at using money to make friends that will take care of them than the rightous are at using money to "make friends" for the kingdom of heaven. And the friends we should be using money to make are the poor. We should give money to the poor in in return they will isten to our infuence (and we can influence them in spiritual things) It goes on to say that how we spend our money, which is never really ours, is a true test of our heart and determines what is in our heart. The church Fathers universally saw refusing to give money to the poor as embezzelment from God. Verses 10-12 esessentially is saying if we cannot use something as small as money to Gods glory how will we ever be able to handle true riches?

[Nazsmum]

lilyka- Thanks. Which bible notes are you using?

[Purple Sage]

Lilyka's interpretation makes sense to me.

[Bluegoat]

Yes, I think so too. We can't divorce how we use our money, possessions, time or talents from our spiritual life. If we are in business and we use our money and influence to ungodly ends, it shows where our real loyalties lie.

Money is really so basic - it's what measures our economic life, which is a big part of our individual life, and especially our life as a society. Yet it is common for people to understand economics apart from Christian principles.

[indie]

Here's a blog post from someone that I've found extremely helpful when I'm working through difficult gospel passages:


http://www.sarahlaughed.net/sermons/...ly_forgiv.html

[lilyka]

I was paraphrasing the notes from my Orthodox Study Bible.

I really like it. The notes often reference some of the earliest Christian writings and church fathers and how they felt about these things. Really really great commentary.

[The Amber Lily]

Some general thoughts:

The manager's relationship with his master was gone, and he was going to lose his way of making money, and therefore everything else. He was going to lose it all. So while he had the opportunity (the power, even), he did some favors for people so that he would have some place to go and some people who would help him. He acted quickly and smartly to save himself, even if it was at the cost of his master. I guess his master recognized that he was clever, and kept him on? So he didn't actually lose it all, in fact he gained the respect of his master.

So, use worldly wealth - money, possessions, position, authority, even knowledge - to do favors for people (who have not necessarily even asked for a favor), so that God will welcome you into eternal life? What do you think?

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10"Whoever can be trusted with very little can also be trusted with much, and whoever is dishonest with very little will also be dishonest with much. 11So if you have not been trustworthy in handling worldly wealth, who will trust you with true riches? 12And if you have not been trustworthy with someone else's property, who will give you property of your own?

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I find this is true even in terms of my life 'chapters', that as I am faithful in each place that God has given me - my home, my job, and my responsibilities in each - that God seems to say "Well done. You have completed this part. Here is the next." Or, how can I ask for more - a better house, a better job - when I don't have everything running smoothly where I'm at? "Be patient," God seems to say. I am to be faithful, and competent, with what I have first.

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13"No servant can serve two masters. Either he will hate the one and love the other, or he will be devoted to the one and despise the other. You cannot serve both God and Money."

14The Pharisees, who loved money, heard all this and were sneering at Jesus. 15He said to them, "You are the ones who justify yourselves in the eyes of men, but God knows your hearts. What is highly valued among men is detestable in God's sight.
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There also seems to me to be a parallel between the desperation of the manager, and our hopelessness as sinners before God. That if we wish to be commended by God, we are going to have to act quickly and be creative with the opportunities we have, because time is slipping away. That we will be judged based on how we used our resources, because that in turn reveals our beliefs and our hearts. We don't want to be found as careless and lazy and wasteful when God comes to hold us accountable. God's values are way different than the world's, and we will have to live according to God's if we are to enjoy our eternal life.

It's hard to pin down what I mean; I don't really understand this parable very well. I don't mean to start a discussion about faith and works though. I also don't think God honors dishonesty; I think that is made clear elsewhere in the Bible.

Any thoughts or corrections on my thoughts?

Thanks Indie, for the link; that's an insightful article.

[Purple Sage]

Originally Posted by lilyka

I was paraphrasing the notes from my Orthodox Study Bible.

I really like it. The notes often reference some of the earliest Christian writings and church fathers and how they felt about these things. Really really great commentary.

I have this bible on my Amazon wish list. I've downloaded four different versions on my Kindle, but this is the one I want in print.

[lilyka]

Originally Posted by Purple Sage

I have this bible on my Amazon wish list. I've downloaded four different versions on my Kindle, but this is the one I want in print.

It si totally worth owning in print. All the maps and icons are just beautiful.

[Tradd]

Originally Posted by Purple Sage

I have this bible on my Amazon wish list. I've downloaded four different versions on my Kindle, but this is the one I want in print.

I've got it in print AND on my Kindle.

[indie]

So I went to Bible study today after missing it a lot for work and we just so happened to be doing this passage (we are working through Luke). Very convenient timing.

[lilyka]

well, hey! Don't hold out on us..... share what your group discussed.

[Purple Sage]

Originally Posted by Tradd

I've got it in print AND on my Kindle.

If it didn't cost so much for the Kindle edition I'd buy both. I did get this book on Kindle that I'm going to start reading today.

Originally Posted by lilyka

well, hey! Don't hold out on us..... share what your group discussed.

Yes please!

[Nazsmum]

Sorry, my 16 mth old had surery and I have been very busy.

indie-are you using a book? Or just going though the book with a speaker?

The amber Lily-I'm going to read what you said again my son is crying......more later

[genifer]

I had such a hard time understanding this one and so havent posted on it yet. Now, after sort of just giving up on trying to break my brain to understand it, I think I finally get it and 'its' something I would have never thought...

I 'get it' bc I can be SO irresponsible with money. Dh and I are quite rash when it comes to spending and sometimes, nay, often we do very stupid things with our money. We'll be skint but kind of stressed and want a bottle of wine, for example, or we'll have an unexpected lovely, sunny day and have a day trip to the beach, spending more then we really should. We often find ourselves in a pickle bc of our own spontenaety... Otoh, we've also been known to give our last £40 to someone in need even tho it puts us out. We do this knowing the Lord will provide for us, and He always does. It used to stress me out and it really felt like we just couldnt help ourselves, we just arent that responsible with money. But saying that, we never go without, we have spontaneous holidays, camping trips, wonderful cheapish day-outs when the weather is lovely. Wonderful family time where we are making wonderful memories for ourselves. We never go without even tho we are always SKINT! lol. At the same time, we are very giving, and actually often excited when an opportunity arises to give, even if we might not have it to give!

It took me all day to get this and I finally did. What a blessing to understand this finally!