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Andrew Wakefield banned - Page 3

post #41 of 95
Quote:
Originally Posted by Jadzia View Post
Have you actually ever read it? It was a case series about a novel form of bowel disease. It actually had very little to do with vaccines. It never said that vaccines cause autism. It only noted that many of the parents reported onset of symptoms after MMR and suggested that there be more study.

Case studies do not typically have a large "sample size" as they are only looking at the persons affected.
I have, indeed. It was about bowel disease and never claimed to prove a link between MMR and autism. It did, however, suggest a link and that it should be looked into further. It was only later in a press conference that Wakefield said that MMR causes autism and should be given in separate doses. He neglected to mention that he was being paid by an anti-vax lawyer or that he had patented a single-dose shot of measles two years earlier. And it wasn't until later that the investigation into the study revealed that the raw data the study was based on was significantly different than the study's report. There were changes of symptoms, diagnoses, and other significant facts. I am aware that case studies are studies of individuals. I was correcting the previous poster's belief that his study had a large sample size. I am also aware that an important part of case studies is accurately relaying the facts.
post #42 of 95
This article from the BBC has an interesting Timeline mentioning other studies

http://news.bbc.co.uk/2/hi/health/1808956.stm
post #43 of 95
Quote:
Originally Posted by maurice View Post
I am surprised that so many people on here "researched vaccines a lot" and "had never heard of Wakefield". I researched vaccines very little and had heard of him...for that matter, I would think his name/study is just part of general knowledge for most people. Perhaps so much hasn't been publised about his flawed study in other countries? I am in the US and has been in the news much over the years.
It surprises me too. I guess though it depends on where you go for your vax info?

Topically, has anyone else seen this? It seems to be flying round the net today.
post #44 of 95
Quote:
Originally Posted by tessie View Post
It surprises me too. I guess though it depends on where you go for your vax info?

Topically, has anyone else seen this? It seems to be flying round the net today.
To me it would be like saying that you had never heard of MMR. If you google MMR you can't help but find out about the Wakefield study.
post #45 of 95
Quote:
Originally Posted by Jugs View Post
Fair enough, but didn't Wakefield's findings pass peer review?
Indeed they did.
post #46 of 95
Quote:
Originally Posted by rhiandmoi View Post
To me it would be like saying that you had never heard of MMR. If you google MMR you can't help but find out about the Wakefield study.

I just tried it - he's on several of the top search results. I guess the non vaxers here don't use google.
post #47 of 95
Quote:
Originally Posted by tessie View Post
I just tried it - he's on several of the top search results. I guess the non vaxers here don't use google.
Some of us were non vaxing before google and the inter-webs were common. We used old, archaic books for our info.
post #48 of 95
Quote:
Originally Posted by sapientia View Post
Some of us were non vaxing before google and the inter-webs were common. We used old, archaic books for our info.
All Google has done for me is stimulate my ADD and make me more impatient.
post #49 of 95
Quote:
Originally Posted by tessie View Post
I just tried it - he's on several of the top search results. I guess the non vaxers here don't use google.
I guess it depends on how the individual did their searches; if you're not specifically searching information on the MMR or autism, then it is possible to avoid reading much about Wakefield. Its not like he has continuously been front page news since 1998.
post #50 of 95
Quote:
Originally Posted by Jugs View Post
I guess it depends on how the individual did their searches; if you're not specifically searching information on the MMR or autism, then it is possible to avoid reading much about Wakefield. Its not like he has continuously been front page news since 1998.
I know.

However he does feature on many of the sites I see mentioned here frequently.
post #51 of 95
I'd heard of Wakefield only from MDC in passing but I didn't actually come across him in my research because I started with a risk assessment of the diseases not the vaccines. I first decided if the disease was dangerous enough to be worth vaxing against before going on to look at the vaccines. Though I must admit I never did get as far as researching the vaccines as I never found something worth vaxing against.
post #52 of 95
Quote:
Originally Posted by maurice View Post
I am surprised that so many people on here "researched vaccines a lot" and "had never heard of Wakefield". I researched vaccines very little and had heard of him...for that matter, I would think his name/study is just part of general knowledge for most people. Perhaps so much hasn't been publised about his flawed study in other countries? I am in the US and has been in the news much over the years.
I made my decision 20 years ago, and I have so many other things I've spent time learning about that I don't keep up on all the recent vax stuff.
post #53 of 95
Quote:
Originally Posted by tessie View Post
I know.

However he does feature on many of the sites I see mentioned here frequently.
But does he come up referencing topics other than MMR and autism? I can honestly say that I first heard about him on this board. I looked into him briefly, but by that point I had done research in many other areas of vaccines vs natural immunity, and he hadn't come up in those areas. I had heard of the MMR/autism link, but given what prompted me to start looking into vaccines (not the autism link), my research didn't lead me to anything Wakefield related.
post #54 of 95
Dear Pro-Vaxers,

Oh good heavens almighty! OK, OK, we get it. His study was bunk. His study contained conflicts of interest. We've seen him on the pillory time and time again. Can we give it a rest, already?? You can renounce him and retract his work and waterboard the poor man and do whatever it takes to make an example out of him. But none of that will convince parents to vaccinate their children "fully." Could you direct your energies to a more productive cause, please? For example, how about some longitudinal research on vaccine safety??

Signed,
Parent whose vax decisions have nothing to do with Wakefield or autism
post #55 of 95
i never heard of the guy. my decision was based mostly on personally working with people with who have MR and other disabilites directly caused by vaxines
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post #56 of 95
Quote:
Originally Posted by Suka View Post
I wonder whats going through the minds of non-vax mammas on here? Do you feel betrayed? Do you still stand by your decisions?
My DP is from the UK. He has not been formally diagnosed with Asperger's syndrome, but a therapist suggested that he might have it after working with him during college. His father also shows similar signs of having it.

He was forced (literally held down by nurses) to have an MMR shot during a "catch-up" school program when he was nine years-old. No one cared that he had already had measles and mumps as a kid. This pisses him off a lot. The number of kids who got the shot was more important to healthcare professionals than what was appropriate for him as an individual.

Soon after he got the shot he developed chronic bowel disease (he alternated between diarrhea and constipation, which is what a lot of parents of kids who regressed into autism describe). He still has it now at age 25, but it has gotten better with some natural treatments and improved nutrition. Now instead of diarrhea every other day he gets it once a week or so.

Our kids will not be getting MMR because of this.
post #57 of 95
I had not heard of Wakefield because my vaccine research started in 1987 when I was told that I was not 'immune' to Rubella when I went for my marriage blood test and it was recommended that I get it.

My mother was a pediatric nurse and was responsible for getting grants for our city for vaccination programs. She was flabbergasted that I tested 'nonimmune'. The fact that I had also managed to get the mumps and measles after vaccination never seemed to cross her radar.

Bright, flaming, blazing RED flags went up for me at that moment. The more I resisted, the harder my mother pushed. I started to realize that the woman was blind and brainwashed as far as vaccines were concerned. It was then that I realized neither me, my pets or any future children I might have would not be getting anymore vaccines - not until I had done a ton of research.

So, long story short, when I made my decision not to vaccinate, I had never heard of him. The study hadn't even been done yet.

and I didn't own a computer (unless you consider a comodor 64 a computer) and the internet and google were still science fiction as far as I was concerned.
post #58 of 95
Quote:
Originally Posted by Turquesa View Post
Dear Pro-Vaxers,

Oh good heavens almighty! OK, OK, we get it. His study was bunk. His study contained conflicts of interest. We've seen him on the pillory time and time again. Can we give it a rest, already?? You can renounce him and retract his work and waterboard the poor man and do whatever it takes to make an example out of him. But none of that will convince parents to vaccinate their children "fully." Could you direct your energies to a more productive cause, please? For example, how about some longitudinal research on vaccine safety??

Signed,
Parent whose vax decisions have nothing to do with Wakefield or autism
Some of your fellow anti-vaxers seem to disagree and are standing up for him. I think that's what people are responding to.
post #59 of 95
It's not like this wakefield guy is the be-all end-all of anti-vax opinion.
There are a million reasons, and a million reactions that have led many of us to the decision not to vaccinate. So one guy isn't credible. Doesn't change the fact that I lost the use of my legs after my polio vaccine (regained it soon after) or that my brother had such bad reactions (his body wouldn't even allow the shots to absorb, he got huge abcesses at his injection site and the doc told my mom 'no more shots'.) That's just the beginning of issues in my family.
When I got pregnant the first time this set off a huge study of vaccines for me. Most people who decline shots are well educated as to WHY they don't get them, they don't base it on one doc on google.
I don't even vaccinate my dog.
post #60 of 95
Wakefield had zero (or close to zero) influence on my choice not to vax, so no, it changes nothing for me. I think he had some valid points, but he did some crap thats not right, and he's paying the price for that. Has he been scape-goated? Absolutely. Do other people do the same/similar stuff? Probably. But that doesn't make it right.
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