Need opinions on classroom incident...so upset

[KyleAnn]

I am very upset right now and really just wanted to pick some of your brains on an incident that occured yesterday. I will try to make it as short as possible...

Ds (in grade 1) goes to a wonderful Montessori Academy which we love, love, love...but we have had some trouble this year-mainly with one of the students in his class.
Background-he went to K with this boy, they were "friendly" in school then, we tried a few play dates but soon realized that this boy was not a good fit for my son. He was very wild, mean to ds, had behavior issues for which his mother was seeking professional help, etc. For whatever reason these two could just not get along-my son has never had this issue with any other child ever, we decided to just cut ties with them.
First grade starts and it turns out this boy is in his classroom. Sigh. Shortly after the year begins, after talking with his teacher, we find out that these two have the same issue in the classroom-cannot work together, be near each other, etc. It was a constant battle for the teacher and her assistant to keep them apart. We approached the subject at the first markings conference, talked about moving ds into another classroom-teacher and I decided that we would stay put for now, see how it goes, she did not want to lose him as a student and ds truly does adore her.
Issues continue here & there, some weeks on an every other day basis...

Well yesterday I pick ds up from school-they have a valet pick-up system so we do not go into the school to pick them up, they are brought out to our cars. Ds gets into the car and hands me an "Accident Report." It explains that him and this other boy were near each other when they shouldn't have been and the result was this other boy badly cutting my ds's arm with scissors. Once I was no longer driving I took the bandage off of ds's arm and saw the mark-it was way worse then I would have thought, an extremely deep v-shapped gash. Deep. At this point I was very upset and immediately called the school and spoke with his teacher. She explained that it happened during a work time, they were both supposed to be at different tables, working on a project, both wandered off near the trash can. Apparently the aide was not there so the teacher was distrated for a moment with other students when it happened. Story goes, my ds was using a hole puncher to punch scrap paper into the trash can. The other boy was snipping scissors at my ds, trying to cut the little piece of paper that ds had in his hands, the scissors "slipped" and harmed my ds.
Teacher said she talked to both boys-the other boy said it was an accident, my ds said he thinks it was an accident. They both got talked to about it. She apologized to me. End of story.
I stewed on this all night and woke up today still very much upset. I understand they said it was unintentional but I feel very unhappy with the outcome of this situation. I know if my ds had done this to another child, I would be mortified. You could bet your a$$ I would be calling this other parent to apologize, and I would expect some sort of repurcussion to follow-accident or not. They are old enough to know that you do not snip scissors wildly at someone. I don't even know what type of outcome I am hoping for...I am just upset, as I don't feel like it was handled properly. This child has been a thorn in my side for a long time and now it has resulted in my ds getting physically hurt. This wound was bleeding on & off and oozing all night and was painful to my ds, who is normally a tough little booger.
Please know that I realize my ds plays a big part of the problem-he is no angel and I know that. In this situation he should have been following directions and been at his table and we are dealing with that.
My husband is like, "eh" about the whole scenario. He backed me on calling the school and letting them know how I felt, but in true man-style has already moved past it.
Am I being ridiculous here? Accidents happen, just let it go? I would really love to hear any thoughts here...

[earth-mama]

I think this is a hard situation. If I was you, I also would be upset. I have a few questions: is this the first time that either boy has been physically injured by the boys interactions? Does this incident seem to show a pattern of increased issues or an escalation of the interaction between the boys?

It very well could have been an accident that your son was cut, but it seems to me that both boys are old enough to understand that scissors are dangerous and can cause injuries. Snapping scissors at someone or their possessions is, in my opinion, an act of aggression. I'm sure that the teacher and the aid are doing the best they can to watch the boys, but in a classroom full of children they can't possible watch them every minute. If either boy is actively seeking the other out I believe more incidents are going to occur.

Some thoughts about the cut--are the classroom scissors very sharp? My recollection of classroom scissors is that they are not super sharp and in order to cut someone deeply the cutter would have to be actively cutting--I'm not sure that just a snap of the scissors would do it, but if they are pointy and sharp they may.

My gut instinct is to tell you the these boys need to be separated either moving your son or the other boy. You don't have any control over the other boy, so it would probably have to be your son. My guess is that both boys would be better off in different classrooms.

I don't know how well you know the other boys mother/parents, but you could call her and discuss the incident (calmly with the goal of reaching a suitable solution) if you know her well enough.

On a personal note, if it was my son I would move him to a different classroom.

I hope that helps.


Partner to (7 years) Mother to Lily (16 months) 2 and 1

[hillymum]

Flesh isn't easy to cut with scissors so I find it hard to imagine this was an accident. How long til the end of your school year? If, like us, it is only another week I would make sure it was clear that my ds was not to be in the same class as this boy ever again. If it's longer than a week I am not sure.. I think I would just ask that special effort be made to keep the two sererate.

Can you make it clear to your ds that it's in his best interest to stay away from this other child? I would be really mean and explain to ds that this other boy does bad things, likes to hurt him and is not safe to stand next to.

I would also go to the principle and talk about this. I know teachers/schools like things to be delt with quietly as it reflects badly on them, so sometimes you have to be extra extrovert to deal with these situations! I've gone to the district superintendent about an issue because the principle wanted things to be left as they were!

[lach]

I'm really surprised that if the situation between the boys is so bad, that one of the boys has not already been moved to a different classroom. In a regular classroom where kids are at their desks and it's pretty easy for a teacher to regulate who works with who during group projects, I can see how it might be more trouble than it's worth. But keeping the boys together, when they have to have a rule that they're not allowed near eachother, sounds like far more trouble than moving classes would be.

This doesn't sound like an accident to me, except in the "well I didn't mean to hurt him THAT badly" sort of way... which IMO doesn't count. And it certainly sounds like a situation worthy of a bit more than an "accident report" on a piece of paper. Those are just to create paper trails for when kids trip on the playground and such. If a child gives another child a deep flesh wound, that merits at least a phone call. More like the school head coming out to your car and explaining what happened.

I think that, based on what you say, the school is handling this very poorly.

[lach]

I wanted to agree with the other two posters that it's pretty hard to cut someone with scissors. Particularly if they're the usual kids scissors you find in classrooms with the dinky little blades. I'm thinking about my sewing scissors, which I keep pretty sharp, and I think it would take a lot of force to get those through someone's arm. Arms are pretty big and the scissors would have to be open pretty wide and the arm would have to be pretty far up the triangle to get that much force.

[KyleAnn]

Thank you ladies, I really appreciate your thoughts.

To answer some of the questions...
No, neither of the boys have ever been hurt-it isn't (until now), a physical thing. They just move to sit by each other, always end up walking with each other, playing together, etc. when they are told every day to stay away from each other. The outcome of their daily antics is they start bickering and then the teacher needs to step in.
We have told ds over 100 times (seriously), about how he needs to stay away from this boy, walk away if he comes by him, talk to his teacher...but they are incapable of doing it. It is insane.
I know that the teacher cannot watch them every minute and when she apologized I explained to her that I wasn't upset with her, but I do agree-this boy is plenty old enough to know that you do not snip scissors at someone. The fact that he did it and then caused harm to my ds with no repurcussion is what I think has me so upset.

As far as the actual scissors go-I haven't seen them, but when we talked yesterday his teacher said they were indeed the childrens safety scissors. At that point I said to her, I don't understand how kids scissors can puncture the skin and cut that deeply and she agreed and said "she was surprised & didn't understand it either."

I do not feel comfortable calling this boys mom-he has told my ds that his mom doesn't like me lol, which I can understand after we basically cut them out after the final, horrible play date they had.

I know I should have moved him out of there from the get go-I am kicking myself that I didn't do it sooner. At this point ds has 12 school days left. He teacher informed me on the hush/hush that this other boy would not be returning to the school next year. While she agreed to continue to monitor the boys, should I go in and try to still have him moved out of his class? I feel so stuck-I do not want him near this other child but I feel awful taking him away from his friends with only 12 days left.
It took everything I had not to march back in there so far today...I will be picking ds up at 3:30 so we will see what happens.

Thank you again-having others to bounce my thoughts off about this is so helpful!

[bri276]

No other advice on the child from, but if that cut is the way I'm imagining it from your description, I'd be upset the school didn't call me to inform me that my child was injured and let me decide whether to come in and take a look at it to see if he needed to go to the ER. If it is very deep, bleeding and oozing it might need more wound care than just a bandage over it to minimize the risk of infection and scarring.

[lach]

If there's only 12 days left, I would leave well enough alone. Hopefully DS has learned his lesson that he should listen to you and stay away from this child! I know that's an awful thing to say, especially since the "lesson" was an actual injury. But just looking for a half-in-jest silver lining...

And I don't blame you for not moving him out. I think the school should have been aware that this was an issue, and it was their responsibility to have made a decision that one boy or the other needed to be moved. You sort of implied in your OP that the situation at school is such that either the teacher or the aide is always with them to make sure that they're not interacting... that is totally ridiculous in a Montessori classroom. Hindsight is always 20/20 and all, but a school should have the experience to see that there was a good chance this situation would end violently.

I wonder if this boy has issues with other children too. I hope that next year is better for both of the kids.

[Climbergirl]

If there is only 12 days left, I would leave him there. I would also make it very clear to the school that you do not want these kids in the same classroom next year. I know you have hush/hush info, but I would act as if I didn't. I would also ask if there can be an additional aide that floats through to help out (or at least ask the school what they are going to do to prevent this in the future).

But honestly, with 12 days left, you would probably cause more distruption to your son by pulling him and putting him in a new classroom. My guess is that everyone is probably more on the alert after this incident. I, at least, hope so.

I am not sure if that happened to my son that I would describe my reaction as upset. Livid would be more like it. I am so sorry that happened, but hopefully, things will improve with this kid gone the next year....

[MattBronsil]

Just a thought...it sounds like there is a lack of overall conflict resolution strategies in the classroom between these 2 students. I think one of the first problems is that they are actually told to not go near each other at all. That's about as effective as trying to shove mud into an oil leak a mile below the ocean....at least in the long run.

Who needs a friend more than the child that has trouble making friends? Who needs to resolve problems more than the child who treats other children disrespectfully?

My gut instinct is not to begin with the question of what the school is doing to keep them apart. Even if they are in different classes, they still have a chance of seeing each other throughout the school year. The question and the focus, especially in a Montessori environment, is what they are doing to find peaceful resolutions to the problems they are having.

[b_light]

Originally Posted by MattBronsil

Just a thought...it sounds like there is a lack of overall conflict resolution strategies in the classroom between these 2 students. I think one of the first problems is that they are actually told to not go near each other at all. That's about as effective as trying to shove mud into an oil leak a mile below the ocean....at least in the long run.

Who needs a friend more than the child that has trouble making friends? Who needs to resolve problems more than the child who treats other children disrespectfully?

My gut instinct is not to begin with the question of what the school is doing to keep them apart. Even if they are in different classes, they still have a chance of seeing each other throughout the school year. The question and the focus, especially in a Montessori environment, is what they are doing to find peaceful resolutions to the problems they are having.

Soooo happy to hear this answer! THIS was why we chose Montessori for our kids




These boys sound like they have a similar vibe as my son and his cousin. They are younger (3 and 4), but they are best friends despite that they fight all.the.time. When they were 2, it was every 5 minutes (max) and someone was getting hit. Very very exhausting. And I watched my nephew in our home for awhile when they were both 2.

Anyhow, with these 2, they had a recurring dynamic that was fairly predictable. My nephew would do something that annoyed my son. My son (on a good day) would ask him to stop/for space/for him to be quieter. My nephew would get closer to him and very frequently back him into a corner (not maliciously, he's a higher energy kid who likes to be close to his playmates). Then my son would hit (if he hadn't already).

When I watched both, I tried to teach them conflict resolution skills and let each tell the other how he was feeling (often reminding the listener to listen). By 3, they often solved their own problems.

When I'm not watching both, I remind my son of our 3-step plan. 1) ask his cousin to stop using his "regular polite voice" (I recommend the wording, "I don't like that game, can you please stop", which he uses frequently) 2) if his cousin doesn't stop, to walk away and 3) if his cousin follows him/backs him into a corner to ask an adult for help.

I feel good about this plan because it gives him tools to solve the problem peacefully himself, yet allows him to ask for help with tattling if he's in over his head.

Is there a recurring dynamic with these boys where some type of plan like that could work?

[KyleAnn]

Yes! I completely agree that they need to be practicing conflict resolution-after meeting the first time with ds's teacher, when we decided to not move him out of the class, this was one of the reasons why-we really hoped they could work it out.
How these situations are resolved every.single.time, I honestly couldn't say. I do know that this boy has given my ds the "Peace Bear" many a time...used to make peace with someone you upset & apologize, etc.
The dynamic between them is they seem to think they are friends but truly have clashing personalities. This boy is very bossy & says hurtful things to get a reaction out of ds, push his buttons...ds is one of those kids who wants to be friends with everyone and a bit too sensitive. So for example, a recurring scenario is this boy telling my ds to do this or that, ds saying no, other boy threatening to tell, not be his friend anymore, teasing, etc. Ds gets upset, they start bickering (becomes a distraction to others or to them from getting things done)....teacher separates them.


Since the incident, ds has stayed away from this boy. I have checked in with his teacher, at that time I let her know how and why I was so upset and felt better about it afterwards.
I know this sounds terrible but with only a week left, I am just hoping these last few days go well and then hopefully we'll never see the kid again.
I feel totally awful saying it, but that is honestly how I feel. I'm sorry. I think after a verrrrrrry long year and a half of this, spanned across two different schools I am just ready for it to be finished.

Thanks again everyone for all of your responses. They were all helpful and they really did make me feel better/calmer!!