Surgery and BF'ing a 3 yo

[mbl]

Hi,

I'm going to have a major surgery in a few months. At which time, my LO will just have turned 3. We're still BF'ing and he is still strong at night right now. Seeing all the drugs, I doubt I'll be able to nurse and he is not letting up at all; he needs the nipple to fall asleep, too. Sometimes I feel like I've created a monster. I yearn for a full night of sleep or one with only one interruption.

I would like to hear from you if you've have had surgery and how you handled the BFing. Did you have a medication issue that you couldn't? How did the LO react? How did you prep the LO? etc.

Also, I would also like to hear from you if you weaned your child around the age of three and how you handled it. It's a drama if I unlatch and then no sleep for hours. We co-sleep.

I wanted to go the CLW route, but I'm not sure we will be able to; I can't put the surgery off much longer.

Thank you,

mbl

[pbjmama]

First, I would have someone credible check the meds. If you would like to post what they are I can check my Hales 2008. I weaned my ds at 3.5 but we had been working towards it for a long time. It will be hard at first but to me it is like any other area of parenting. Sometimes you say no and deal with the tantrum, eventually they learn. Do you have someone who could help you at night?

[mbl]

I don't remember the names of possible drugs I was told could be employed... might has well be a foreign language. I probably won't be able to know what the anesthesiologist will use until I'm getting prepped... from what I understand, they all have different ways of handling things and also, it'll depend on me that day. After the surgery, again, depending on how it goes, I won't know until after what they will shoot my way. Based on the fact that for 2 weeks I won't be able to do squat, I'm figuring BFing will fall into that category considering the logistics. So, I'm going on the premise that I will have to stop and would like to prep for it. Not much help, am I?

As far as someone helping at night, I wouldn't count on it. DH hasn't been much help at all so far; he wouldn't wake up if the house fell on him. So pretty much, it's up to me to do it all.

I'm really feeling pinned to a wall right now. What method did you employ to wean your DS and over what amount of time? I have about 4 months if I start now. The bond is strong; I am afraid to undo what we have by refusing to nurse. I need help; I don't know where to start.

[rparker]

When I was planning a tubal ligation (that I later cancelled) I was told that the general anesthesia poses no risk to a nursing toddler once enough of it is out of your system that you're reasonably alert/awake... so in other words, you could breastfeed later the same day. I second the recommendation to get a list of post-op meds though and have someone check them against Hale (calling LLL's 1 800 # could accomplish this).

Could you talk to your son about the surgery and how it might impact breastfeeding? Around that age they're starting to become somewhat empathetic and are definitely old enough to have limits placed on nursing.

It's not the same situation at all, but I've been able to talk to my 2.5 year old about how pregnancy has impacted my milk supply and how that will change again when we tandem nurse. She's also really willing to be extra gentle and careful when she nurses now if I tell her that something she's doing hurts me and she understands (and reluctantly accepts) the idea of "mama milks are going night night." It might be possible for your son to accept temporary limitations on breastfeeding and/or to be extra gentle when he does breastfeed if he has the reasons WHY explained to him on a level he can understand.

I'm not trying to talk you out of weaning if that's in your best interest, but if weaning is difficult in the current dynamic of your nursing relationship then talking about the situation and the possible solutions with your toddler might be a good alternative. You could explain your dilemma to your son... he might come up with a solution that will surprise you.

[pumpkin]

You need to insist on a meeting with anesthesia. They will give you the run around, but it can be done. You can work up a plan and they can put a big flag in your file to assign an anesthesiologist who can actually handle you. Some are better at adapting to patients needs than others. You can also work out meds in advance with your doctor for post-surgery. I have to do both of these things because of some pretty serious sensitivities to a lot of the drugs they normally like to use.

There are cases where nursing won't be possible, but remember that women have c-sections and nurse immediately afterwards every day. I did without problem and that was even with having to take some unusual drugs that they don't normally use in ob. I just made sure to investigate them with my doctor in advance.

[mbl]

pumpkin,

Thanks for the advice; I'll see what I can do about the anesthesiologist. The thing is that babies at birth are around 8# while mine will be a whooping 30# and much taller which makes the nursing very challenging in comparison. I'm not sure it'll be manageable which brings me to the next reply.

rparker,

my DS is not very verbal yet. I scheduled the surgery for when he will be 3 (not by much) in hope we can communicate better, but right now, he cares more about nursing than my comfort. I tell him why, but it's still not hitting home for him. I'm working on it; I haven't given up. I'm waiting for his brain to get wired in that respect. *knock on wood* it'll be soon. Thanks for the LLL suggestion. I'll do that.

--

Maybe I'm worrying about all this too much. I just don't want to be caught by surprise; I doubt I'll have any help at all while recuperating. So I want to get my ducks in a row.

It just feels mind boggling right now with all the unknown factors.

[pbjmama]

Remember, you are the patient which makes you the client. Your doctor and the team of doctors doing your surgery work for you. You want informed consent so you need to know exactly what they will be doing when and what drugs will be involved. It is a very reasonable request. If they say it might be this or that you can check both. You should be informed of the various outcomes of surgery, nursing or not.

If you are able to get up to go to the bathroom by yourself and can expect your ds to be gentle I think you can nurse if you want. You may have to use different methods and positions.

When talking to your ds, I think you can keep it simple. Mommy is sick and doesn't have milk right now. At 2.5 to 3 he should be able to understand that, even if he is unhappy about it.

The LLL 800# is a good choice but be aware that the 2010 version of Hale just came out so many leaders don't have it yet. Most will or have access to another leader who will shortly. Any hospital LC should have the most update issue immediately after release.

As far as weaning in 4 months, I think it can be done if that is what you choose. Start cutting sessions with distractions or delays and limiting times on sessions with things like singing a song, counting down, using a timer. Offer treats or rewards as incentive if you wish.There may be some negative reaction to these things and that is okay, you take it as it comes and deal with it how you see fit.

I want to encourage you that you most likely can keep nursing if you wish, if your choice is to wean that is okay too. But don't get pressured into it with out real cause if you don't want to wean!

[mbl]

Thank you for encouragement. I did some self-questioning in terms of how I feel about weaning my son at this age. I wanted to do it when it turned 3 or so when a specific milestone was hit; one that makes him more empathic. However, I also have been wanting to sleep at night. I don't have a problem with daytime nursing, it's the night that is killing me right now with 4 to 5 times waking me up so he can nurse to go to sleep. I think it's also more of a nipple thing (comfort) than milk thing (nutrition) at this point; milk is just bonus during the comfort time. Essentially, doing it at least 4 months ahead of schedule b/c of his level of understand doesn't seem too palatable to me since I expect a lot of resistance.

I spoke to the nurse who said the narcotics they give for recovery are not BF friendly, but should ask the doc if there is something else he could give me. She said I should talk to the anesthesiologist and see what my options are. So, I'll see if this early in the game I can do that with both of them; so far the answers have been mostly, we have to see who the anesthesiologist is that day and what the outcome is and thus what I'll need. I can't wait until last minute if I need to wean... so I might have to start if I keep getting non-committal answers.

I was wondering, pbj, how did you do it at night or it was only daytime you had to worry about? I'm going to probably cover my bases and ask the night weaning question in a separate thread, too.

Thanks

[pbjmama]

I'm interested in what you find out from the doctors. Narcotics are often given during labor and delivery so surely there is so option for you.

I night weaned when my ds was just over a year and I was newly pregnant. He used a pacifier too so that helped I think. It wasn't too hard, my dh slept in another room with him and after about a week it was finished. There were times that we had regression like illness or traveling. I really started the limits when he was just over a year and tweaked them to my liking. During pregnancy I tried not to say no to nursing but just limit the sessions. After his sister came I let him nurse as much as he wanted again for a long time. I guess it was probably around 3 years when I really cut back on nursing sessions. I just felt done. It was a process for me too - how do you parent with out nursing, other ways to comfort, would he be jealous of his sister, etc. I went back and forth alot for awhile.

[mbl]

I'm supposed to get a packet in the mail. I'll see what's in there. I'll update as time permits.

DH is going to take a week off this July and we're staying home so we'll be weaning DS night time. I'll have the night shift and DH will get up with him so I can catch up with sleep; there is no way I can do it on my own since I work part time right now for a limited period of time. Let's hope 9 nights will suffice. I really don't want to wean during the daytime though, but I believe it wouldn't be as difficult. Nap time is another story and before bed... oh boy.