Visitation options with stbx working night shift?

[simplemama32]

Does anyone have any experience with this?

STBX has been unemployed for awhile, but it looks like he will be back at work soon. The only thing is that he will be working night shift...either 3 pm to 1 am, or (less likely) 9 pm to 7 am Monday thru Thurs. Off work from Fri. to Sun. unless he decides to work overtime.

He's been unemployed since before we separated, so he's currently able to keep DS 1-2 days a week while I work (8-5), and then he also takes DS for a few hours on Sundays.

I'm wondering how on earth to work visitation around his job...? Sundays will stay the same, unless he works overtime occasionally. Saturday is out...well, I'd rather it be out, because I want that day for myself to spend with DS. Friday is out because STBX wants that day to catch up on his stuff/run errands without DS.

Mon. - Thurs...I have no idea what to do. Going by past experience (STBX worked a similar shift for a good portion of our marriage), he will sleep most of the day and then go to work. Best case scenario...he would be able to squeeze a couple hours with DS here and there during the week. *BUT* we also have to work around DS's nap schedule and soon-to-be daycare. It might be semi-manageable (if a PIA) now, but I'm also wondering what will happen when DS starts school in a few years...? He is 2 yrs. old right now.

We are just trying to work this out for ourselves right now as we haven't even begun the divorce process yet. Personally, I'd be fine with him only having DS once a week, but I would really like for DS to be able to see his dad more often.

Any ideas?

ETA: I'm mainly worried about working around the first shift option (the one that would be 3 pm to 1 am). The other one is less likely, and would at least offer the option of a few hours in the afternoon/evening. Thanks!

[Rosehip]

My ex had a crazy schedule. However, I was not going to bind myself & the kids into working around his schedule for the next 15 years. So, we set a very standard visitation schedule (Tuesday afternoon/evening) & EOW. Of course, if you can come to agreement, you can do anything else you want to. So, effectively, we schedule visitation as we go along. If things ever get too hectic/crazy, I can always default to the aforementioned schedule and he'll have to deal.

I would be wary of fashioning a very long-term arrangement based on what his schedule might be at a job he might have for an unknown length of time.

[maeby]

my ex works m-th 2-midnight. when we were together i would have my mom come over from 7-11am to watch ds and then ds would go down for a nap with his dad. if she couldn't come over then i would make ex get up at 10am to take ds and go to work and have my mom come over from 1 until I got home at 5 or 6. after my mom didn't want to watch ds anymore i tried to have someone else come over at 1pm but i was embarrassed that ex would always over sleep their arrival and need to shower, etc. towards the end of our relationship he got worse and worse and more and more angry about getting up at 10am and how little sleep he got that i found full time day care for my son. its so much better. but i do not get a weekend day of just us and that does make me sad. so right not ex has ds fri and sat 12-5 while i work and then he comes over for a few hours on sunday. he does not ask to have ds if he has a sudden day off and honestly - it is still difficult to get him to be up so i can work by noon on those days. so lame!

oh and i imagine that if he ever asks for it and i feel comfortable with it (meaning ds could get himself up and make breakfast because i know ex will sleep in until noon so we are talking 5 or 6 years from now) i would let ex have ds friday to sat afternoon every week. but we shall see if that ever becomes something he wants - i seriously doubt it.

[mama_ani]

My Littles' dad works straight nights 10pm - 7am. He works: two nights on, two nights off, three nights on, two nights off, two nights on, three nights off.
He never has the Littles the day after a night shift so it works out that he has them for the day every five days. In two weeks he sees them: Tuesday, Sunday, Thursday. Right now he takes them 8:30 a.m. - 3:30 p.m. If he takes them overnight then it is the normal visit day til the next afternoon.
So far this is working for us.

[MariesMama]

My ex worked shifts like this, and honestly, he claimed he could never take DD. Nevermind that when you work 4 10 hour days you get 3 days off, he just couldn't do it. So I'm happy for you that your ex still wants to see your DC!

Could he possibly pick your DS up in the morning before you go to work, spend some time with him, and then take him to daycare? How flexible is your daycare with being there/not being there? Could he pick your DS up from daycare for a lunch/park date before naptime?

If it were me, I would ask ex what he thinks and go from there. Some people can't schedule things around work (especially with non-traditional hours) and some can. Good luck to you and your DS!

[Super~Single~Mama]

Have you considered EOW?

[simplemama32]

Thanks, everyone. I am trying to discuss this with stbx, and I'm trying hard to be fair and reasonable and accomodate his schedule as much as possible, but it is tough.

Last night, I called him so DS could tell him goodnight, and we ended up in a horrible argument over this week's visitation (thankfully not in front of DS...thank goodness for my parents!). STBX has not wanted to take DS any day this week because he is waiting on a phone call that will give him more info. about his job. OK, I understand that a job is important...I really, really do...but am I wrong to think it's unreasonable for a father to not see his child because of a phone call that will last for maybe 10-20 minutes?? He hasn't even mentioned coming to see DS in the evenings, or me bringing DS to see him.

Anyway, I asked him last night if he'd received the phone call yet, and he said no, so I said, "OK, well I guess we'll just see you on Sunday, then." (the next day he usually has DS) And he said, no, he wants to see DS on Saturday, too. Which is absolutely fine by me. I understand that STBX hasn't seen DS all week, and if I were him, I'd want to see DS, too. I just wish I'd had more notice (we'd already made plans for Sat....but fine, I can cancel), and I don't want it to become a pattern of STBX having DS *every* weekend for the entire weekend, if at all possible. I told STBX all of this, too...

Yeah, me and my stupid big mouth. He became very indignant and started talking about "divorced father's rights"...basically that it was his right to have his son for the entire weekend *every* weekend if his job prevented him from seeing him during the week, and that "if you go through with this divorce, you need to realize that this is the sort of thing that will happen."

The kicker is that the last thing I want is to keep him away from DS. But though he's been very good about keeping to the visitation we've decided on up 'til now, there are several things that just make me .
Like not seeing DS this week...like not wanting to have DS on Fridays because that's when he has to go to the bank and the grocery store ...like bringing DS back to me by 2:30 on Sundays because he "didn't realize he could have him the whole day."

Whew...sorry, rant over! Back to the original reason for my post...I do like (as much as I can like any of this, anyway) the thought of the standard visitation schedule we could fall back on or work around, depending on circumstances.

[simplemama32]

Thyra -- yeah, I think that's what we'll most likely end up with. I'm not crazy about it, but I don't know that anyone thinks their visitation schedule is wonderful.

I worry about DS going on overnights because he is very attached to me. I'm the only one who can get him to sleep at night, he's still nursing and co-sleeping, etc. I know we can work around all of that, even if it will be difficult, but my heart still breaks for DS. I'm hoping to put off overnights for awhile anyway and then gradually work up to that. I'm fine (I think) with stbx having him all day Saturday and Sunday EOW, but him staying overnight with me.

[Super~Single~Mama]

Originally Posted by simplemama32

Yeah, me and my stupid big mouth. He became very indignant and started talking about "divorced father's rights"...basically that it was his right to have his son for the entire weekend *every* weekend if his job prevented him from seeing him during the week, and that "if you go through with this divorce, you need to realize that this is the sort of thing that will happen."

Umm....this isn't true. He doesn't have the right to parent whenever and however is convenient for him. Do you have a court ordered visitation schedule? If not, I would get one. And then follow it to the letter - if he doesn't hold up his end of the deal, thats his problem not yours.

[Super~Single~Mama]

Originally Posted by simplemama32

Thyra -- yeah, I think that's what we'll most likely end up with. I'm not crazy about it, but I don't know that anyone thinks their visitation schedule is wonderful.

I worry about DS going on overnights because he is very attached to me. I'm the only one who can get him to sleep at night, he's still nursing and co-sleeping, etc. I know we can work around all of that, even if it will be difficult, but my heart still breaks for DS. I'm hoping to put off overnights for awhile anyway and then gradually work up to that. I'm fine (I think) with stbx having him all day Saturday and Sunday EOW, but him staying overnight with me.

He'll be fine on oevernights. Truly. My son does ok on his overnights with his dad, and occasionally I really enjoy getting enough sleep. If you end up in court they will order overnights for a 2 year old - If you start them now you can start with one night, and then go to 2 nights after he's used to one night. But, if you hold off on overnights until there is a court ordered schedule it will most likely go to 2 nights right away. IMO, its better to do things on your own time frame rather than the courts. And, even though the standard is, "Best Interest of the Child" it feels much more like "what is convenient for the court to order" sometimes.

ETA - your ex does have the right to overnight parenting - so again, better on your terms than the courts.

[Rosehip]

Correspond only in writing. For a while, I went so far as to let his calls go to voicemail if the kids were not around, and then email back saying. I did the same for text messages. I emailed my response. If he leaves a message that is nasty, or makes me angry, I always sit on my response for at least 12 hours so I'm engaging in a heated back & forth.

Send him an email with plans that you make for your son as soon as you make them (birthday parties, trips, etc.) and then if he wants to make last minute plans, keep your cool, and forward the previously sent email, with a polite note - "Unfortunately, as I'd previously mentioned, DS & I have plans on Friday. Perhaps another time, with more advance notice, would work."

I doubt a judge is going to make you & DS jump hoops around this guy's imagined responsibilities (really - you can't have your kid around because you MIGHT have a phone call??? I've been job hunting for for a month and my kids have not died of neglect) and I don't think you should set a precedent of doing so. Stay calm & hold your ground.

[maeby]

Originally Posted by simplemama32

there are several things that just make me .
Like not seeing DS this week...like not wanting to have DS on Fridays because that's when he has to go to the bank and the grocery store ...like bringing DS back to me by 2:30 on Sundays because he "didn't realize he could have him the whole day."

lol- sounds just like my ex who often can not come to see ds on fridays because has so many errands to run and when pressed i find out he has to go to walmart (his bank) and pay a water bill... that's it. i do quadruple that in a day and still have our ds full time. and i wonder how this man would ever survive as a solo parent.... iyiyi!

[simplemama32]

Originally Posted by thyra

Umm....this isn't true. He doesn't have the right to parent whenever and however is convenient for him. Do you have a court ordered visitation schedule? If not, I would get one. And then follow it to the letter - if he doesn't hold up his end of the deal, thats his problem not yours.

Nothing court ordered yet. We haven't officially started the divorce process...I was hoping we could get some things (house on the market, parenting agreement/visitation) worked out between ourselves as much as possible before bringing lawyers into the mix. But that might not work out as planned.

Our state doesn't have legal separation, so we each have equal rights to DS until our divorce is final.

[simplemama32]

Originally Posted by Rosehip

Correspond only in writing. For a while, I went so far as to let his calls go to voicemail if the kids were not around, and then email back saying. I did the same for text messages. I emailed my response. If he leaves a message that is nasty, or makes me angry, I always sit on my response for at least 12 hours so I'm engaging in a heated back & forth.

Send him an email with plans that you make for your son as soon as you make them (birthday parties, trips, etc.) and then if he wants to make last minute plans, keep your cool, and forward the previously sent email, with a polite note - "Unfortunately, as I'd previously mentioned, DS & I have plans on Friday. Perhaps another time, with more advance notice, would work."

I doubt a judge is going to make you & DS jump hoops around this guy's imagined responsibilities (really - you can't have your kid around because you MIGHT have a phone call??? I've been job hunting for for a month and my kids have not died of neglect) and I don't think you should set a precedent of doing so. Stay calm & hold your ground.

Unfortunately, he has limited computer access and no email account. Otherwise, I would *love* to limit a lot of communication to writing. I'm currently just printing out a hard copy of our visitation schedule, a month at a time.

[Super~Single~Mama]

Originally Posted by simplemama32

Nothing court ordered yet. We haven't officially started the divorce process...I was hoping we could get some things (house on the market, parenting agreement/visitation) worked out between ourselves as much as possible before bringing lawyers into the mix. But that might not work out as planned.

Our state doesn't have legal separation, so we each have equal rights to DS until our divorce is final.

I say you should file ASAP to avoid him making these kinds of threats against you. A temporary visitation schedule can be part of getting things moving, and it can be worked out either between you and him and a mediator, or it can be done through lawyers. I don't recommend waiting until things are in order b/c then he can continue to make threats about taking your ds - which is not good.