Starting Drama

[mommahhh]

I'm not sure how to handle my 7 year old's attitude sometimes (in a positive, loving manner ). This behavior isn't new -- she has always had attitude. But maybe the intensity has increased, or maybe I'm just getting weary. I'm not necessarily trying to figure out what is causing it (because I really believe it is basically her personality...she's very much like my aunt). I'm more trying to determine how to interact with her in a positive manner.

Currently I try to start off gentle/kind/etc, but she doesn't let up and I end up becoming angry or weary and I just ignore her.

I'll just give one example. There is no real "reason" for this behavior that I can determine beyond wanting to start drama. Or not getting exactly what she wants and not wanting to compromise at all. Ex: (preface: we co-sleep most of the time) She wakes up early (before 7 a.m.), and wants to jump on the bed. Normally she'll just get up and go downstairs and I will wake up and follow in a few minutes. Today she's jumping on the bed. Early. I tell her to stop because daddy is still sleeping (and he worked late last night). Now at 7, this should be very easy to understand, and most of the time she would understand. Today she decides she wants to start drama.

She tells me there's nowhere else to jump. I tell her she can jump downstairs. She says no and keeps jumping. I tell her to stop. She makes a face at me and says WHERE CAN I JUMP THEN?? I tell her to be quiet since daddy is sleeping and to go downstairs...I'll be right down. She rolls her eyes at me and says that is stupid. Etc. My biggest issue here: She is 7. She is outright rude to me. I'm not ok with that. I'm not being unreasonable. She's trying to start something (why is beyond me). It is early and I don't feel like waking up that way. I get so irritated with her sometimes. But I don't want to be harsh. I want to deal with her in a positive manner. But she makes it so hard sometimes.

I feel like if I don't get a grip on this now, how rude will she be to me at 12??

[JL83]

It sounds to me that if she can't be respectful of the other 2 people she's sharing a bed with, maybe it's time for her to sleep in a different one. Or that's how it would shake out here. We're happy to co-sleep as long as the child is being polite and respectful. (One the child is no longer a baby and can understand the connection).

So, I wouldn't let her sleep with us tonight.

To me it's just like if my DH did something similar. He might have to sleep on the couch for awhile.

[One_Girl]

When my dd says something is dumb I tell her I am sorry she feels that way and repeat my instructions. We also talk later about the situation. Sometimes I explain why I made the decision I did but I try to ask her how she thinks I (or another person who was involved) might have felt about what she was doing or how she would feel if the situation was reversed, then I ask her to come up with a solution for next time that respects all people involved. If it is an ongoing issue I will also tell her that if she can't live up to her solution I will have to revoke the privelage of being in that situation until I feel like I can cope with it again.

[Forthwith]

Originally Posted by JL83

It sounds to me that if she can't be respectful of the other 2 people she's sharing a bed with, maybe it's time for her to sleep in a different one. Or that's how it would shake out here. We're happy to co-sleep as long as the child is being polite and respectful. (One the child is no longer a baby and can understand the connection).

So, I wouldn't let her sleep with us tonight.

To me it's just like if my DH did something similar. He might have to sleep on the couch for awhile.

I agree that it may be time for her to have her own bed, but I worry that presenting it this way would make her think of sleeping in her own bed as a punishment.

[Heavenly]

First of all, I think at 7 she is more than old enough to sleep in her own bed, in her own room, and she can jump there. Secondly if my child talked like that and acted like that when my husband was trying to sleep after working late I would be pulling them off the bed so fast their head would spin and they'd be sitting in time out as a way to start their morning. Then again, I have no problems with expecting kids to do what I said because I said so, so I'm probably not the best person to ask!

[NiteNicole]

Originally Posted by Kelmendi

I agree that it may be time for her to have her own bed, but I worry that presenting it this way would make her think of sleeping in her own bed as a punishment.

She's seven. I think that's old enough to at least start getting the idea that there are consequences for her actions.

If you don't want her to think she's being punished then give her a warning tonight before bed...we're happy to have you sleep here but if you can't get up quietly in the mornings, you'll need to sleep in your own bed. Then it's up to her.

[JL83]

Originally Posted by Kelmendi

I agree that it may be time for her to have her own bed, but I worry that presenting it this way would make her think of sleeping in her own bed as a punishment.

It's not a punishment. It's a consequence!

If you DH jumped on the bed while you were trying to sleep, would you like it? I know I'd tell him off pretty quick. And if he kept doing it every morning, I'd come up with other sleeping arrangements.

I also wouldn't worry about her seeing it as a punishment. In some ways it is... But it's also reasonable.

Maybe phrase it to her as a choice. Either she can choose to respect her dad sleeping in bed and jump elsewhere, or you will choose for her. And if you choose, you'll be choosing for her to spend the night in her own room.

[Forthwith]

Originally Posted by NiteNicole

She's seven. I think that's old enough to at least start getting the idea that there are consequences for her actions.

Originally Posted by JL83

It's not a punishment. It's a consequence!

If you DH jumped on the bed while you were trying to sleep, would you like it? I know I'd tell him off pretty quick. And if he kept doing it every morning, I'd come up with other sleeping arrangements.

I also wouldn't worry about her seeing it as a punishment. In some ways it is... But it's also reasonable.

My problem with the idea of kicking her out of the family bed as a punishment has nothing to do with thinking that she shouldn't face consequences for her behavior. It's a practical objection - it will probably be much easier to get her to stay out of the bed if she wants to sleep in her own bed. And if she thinks it's a punishment she won't want to stay there.

If I were the OP, I would want to avoid setting myself up for unnecessary conflict with what sounds like a strong-willed child. As a former strong-willed seven year-old girl, I can attest that it never ends well for anyone.

[lab]

Originally Posted by Heavenly

First of all, I think at 7 she is more than old enough to sleep in her own bed, in her own room, and she can jump there. Secondly if my child talked like that and acted like that when my husband was trying to sleep after working late I would be pulling them off the bed so fast their head would spin and they'd be sitting in time out as a way to start their morning. Then again, I have no problems with expecting kids to do what I said because I said so, so I'm probably not the best person to ask!

Amen Sister!!!!!!

[karne]

You could try putting a cot or a sleeping bag in your room if there is too much angst about putting her in her own room and telling her that she can either choose to sleep peacefully in the bed, or avail herself of the other choice. We co slept through this age as well, and fortunately or unfortunately being woken poorly never made me think carefully about how to phrase things. If my kids were fooling around and someone was trying to sleep we asked them to leave. It wasn't an option to stay in the bed.

I agree with not setting up fruitless power struggles, and it sounds like this is but one of the OP's issues w/her child.

[lilyka]

Um, I am with heavenly on this. she is SEVEN. She creates drama because she has a great audience and there are no consequences for her surley attitude. And this is all attitude. She was not born this way. This is not just who she is. You can change this. And if you start it will be a long hard road. but it will be worth it. Just be ready for her to test every limit you set. First and foremost if she even thinks for a second about not respecting the other people sleeping in the bed it is time for her to have her own bed. it is not punishment (not that it would matter to me if my child saw it that way) it is a consequyences. You act socially unacceptable you lose the privledge of being social. Secondly if my child dared to speak to me so disrespectfully I doubt she would be having the oppritunity to talk to much of anyone for the rest of the morning (or until she could talk nicely) as she would be spending some quality time in her room. I really cannot imagine my children thinking they could insit on jumping on the furniture anywhere in this house much less a bed where someone is sleeping. This goes beyond her back talk and such. She clearly had no regards for your husbands feelings or needs or yours. This is not drama. You really to look at her attitude and think about how you can help her be more respectful of you and think more about the needs and feelings of others in all situations. The bed situation seems like a great place to start. Start with the rules. no jumping on the family bed without permisison. Explain to her how this takes everyones needs and feelings into consideration for sleeping. (lets face it. she can be awake anywhere and you have given her to ok to jump on other furniture) if there is any breaking of this rule, arguing about it, drama, bad attitude, back talk or whining about the rule the next night she will sleep in her own bed. End of discussion. and then enforce it 100%. no apologies. no drama on your part. repeat repeat repeat. then move on to something else.

[mommahhh]

Thanks guys. I didn't mean to indicate that she always jumps on the bed. I just meant that was today's example of annoying behavior. It could be any number of different ways that she decides to express the power-struggle. I don't just sit there and let her do it....I'm just meaning that is the type of mouthiness she displays sometimes.

She does have her own bed and her own room, but she sleeps with us.

I guess I need to be more firm.

[Norasmomma]

Originally Posted by Heavenly

First of all, I think at 7 she is more than old enough to sleep in her own bed, in her own room, and she can jump there. Secondly if my child talked like that and acted like that when my husband was trying to sleep after working late I would be pulling them off the bed so fast their head would spin and they'd be sitting in time out as a way to start their morning. Then again, I have no problems with expecting kids to do what I said because I said so, so I'm probably not the best person to ask!

Me too, sometimes I think kids are given waaaaaayyyy too much free rein.

My DD is similar, in fact I could see her doing the same exact thing, but she's almost 4.

[rightkindofme]

Well... honestly... I think you are going to find that the slightly more authoritative parents are going to say, "I would shut that down right quick" and the more child-led parents are going to say, "You need to figure out her deeper need..."

Uhm, I'm more authoritative. You are rude to me and you get to spend some time by yourself. I'm not rude to you so I'm not going to put up with it. (That said my daughter is allowed to tell me if I am being rude and I will absolutely take a time out so that I can change my attitude.) I think civility is mandatory. I model paying attention to how your actions affect other people and it is a HUGE deal to me. I am not ok with my kid treating me badly. I was abused enough by my bio-family growing up, thanks.

[JessicaS]

I don't use time outs but if my dd woke up my dh after he worked a lot I would have her helping with his chores around the house since he would be extra tired from her disrupting his sleep.

We generally have her help with our chores as consequences since time out is just her sitting around and she doesn't realize how much we do that way. That would be in addition to her chores.

[rightkindofme]

Originally Posted by abimommy

I don't use time outs but if my dd woke up my dh after he worked a lot I would have her helping with his chores around the house since he would be extra tired from her disrupting his sleep.

We generally have her help with our chores as consequences since time out is just her sitting around and she doesn't realize how much we do that way. That would be in addition to her chores.

Oooh. That is brilliant. I don't think it would work well with my two year old but I will try to remember that for when she is brilliant.

[JessicaS]

My two year old will pick up the dog food when he dumps it out. I think once they get about four they realize that picking up is no fun

[annettemarie]

Moving to the Gentle Discipline forum.

[lmk1]

Originally Posted by mommahhh

Thanks guys. I didn't mean to indicate that she always jumps on the bed. I just meant that was today's example of annoying behavior. It could be any number of different ways that she decides to express the power-struggle. I don't just sit there and let her do it....I'm just meaning that is the type of mouthiness she displays sometimes.

She does have her own bed and her own room, but she sleeps with us.

I guess I need to be more firm.

I think the keyword is "power struggle". If you have a strong willed child, you can end power struggles by breaking their will, by always giving in, or by doing the best you can in each and every situation, and trying to make sure that she learns the reason WHY we do certain things. The best solution to me is the 3rd. However it's not an instant solution, as few parenting solutions are. You have to figure out what is the lesson you want her to learn in each and every case. So, with her jumping on the bed, 1 - pick her up if she's not being cooperative and carry her out. 2 - discuss with her how Daddy is very tired and needs to sleep in and therefore we are going to respect his need for more sleep 3- ask her if she thinks she can be ok with being quiet in the bedroom while Daddy is sleeping in the future, or what can she do to help take care of that (a possible solution would be to sleep in her own bed) - this is not a punishment if not presented as such, but an emphasis on Daddy's needs and how she can help. And it addresses the actual lesson - we need to consider the needs of other people, especially people we love and that love us.

I really don't agree with the super authoritarian parents, because, yes you can POSSIBLY end the power struggle and get your way, but that doesn't teach your kids anything except that while you're bigger or they're living in your house, they follow your rules. It doesn't teach them to think about other people's needs. We have one good example of that in my family, who always insists on telling me how he was raised (he did what his parents said or else) and let me tell you, he's the least respectful of other people and their needs. So maybe he was coerced into behaving how his parents wanted, but he sure didn't learn how to consider what other people need or want. And I really think that you need to consider what kind of adult you want your kid to grow up into.