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how often/ for how long does your baby nurse?

post #1 of 26
Thread Starter 
I am still feeling confused about nursing. A lot of the time, particularly in the second part of the night... and I'm feeling worn down because of it.
So, when does your LO nurse? And how long does it take? I read some of LLL's "the womanly art of BFing" before she was born and all of those times they say "offer both breasts at each feeding" and "expect to nurse 30-40 minutes 8-12 times a day" and so on... and I have had to ignore that entirely for us.
Because of my oversupply and strong letdown, my LO has rarely nursed for more than 5-10 minutes at a time . My milk is starting to slow somewhat so in the daytime it often gets to what I would imagine a more "normal" supply is like, and then we have some really nice feedings that last longer, don't make a big mess, and don't end in frustration for both of us (although sometimes DD drops her latch and gets mad because she has to work for the milk rather than it just gushing into her mouth - but I just keep relatching her and it seems like practice and patience will help that).
At night, though, I am still feeling engorged and SO confused and frustrated. She sleeps from about 8pm to 2 or 3am, which is great! Then wakes up hungry and I go in to feed her. The problem here is that I have so much milk by that point, that it gushes out and she has to do the gulp-gulp-gulp thing to keep up, and I think she conks back out before she's actually full. Plus she is probably getting all foremilk, which makes her gassy and hungry again a little later.
Sometimes I try to pump off the "extra" milk before feeding her but of course that is frustrating to both of us too. Then I'm saving that milk for when I need babysitting, but I wonder if it's going to be all foremilk and make her unhappy and gassy then...
So this morning I fed her at 4am (thanks for sleeping 6 hours, baby girl! ), but she couldn't really settle back, so I ended up feeding and comforting her again at something like 5, 5:30, 6:30, 7, 7:30, 8:30, and 9:30. Now it's 10:30 and she's down for a nap, and no wonder. I'm exhausted! I feel like she's not getting enough good milk at once to keep her full and content! And I have been going to sleep at 10pm but think I will have to start going to bed at 8pm for a little while because I am SO TIRED in the morning with all of those feeds and frustrations.
I just find myself thinking more and more that if she was taking formula or rice cereal (if this were the 1950s!) she would be sleeping beautifully... everything I've read about oversupply, either I'm already trying (block feeding and sage tincture, which work great in the daytime) or don't help ("express some milk into a cloth diaper before feeding" - something that I have to do already since she pops off every few seconds when the milk is so strong).
I know she is still small, but at 7.5 weeks, shouldn't things be evening out a little more by now?! When will her stomach catch up to my supply so that she can latch on, nurse and nurse for more than a few minutes, and then be full or go back to sleep?
I also rarely feel like I know for sure if she's hungry or not. So I constantly offer and she constantly nurses a little bit. Sometimes she gets too much and barfs all over me. Sometimes I think she's not hungry and then she's starving. Is that just how it goes? I"m not trying to impose a schedule but I am wondering why her cues seem more and more confusing to me as time goes on...
post #2 of 26
I so wish I could help you, Jess. I have the exact opposite problem with my low supply. I nurse Cecilia about 8 times a day now (she's 8.5 weeks). During the day we first nurse on one breast, then nurse with a supplemental nursing system (SNS) on the other breast so she can get donated breast milk along with what milk I make. At night we bare nurse in bed, both of us barely waking up for it.
post #3 of 26
Thread Starter 
I've been thinking about cosleeping again (she's been sleeping in her crib in her own room for a few weeks)... the reason we stopped was because all three of us are such light sleepers, we were all waking up whenever anyone moved or made a sound. Plus I was nursing her at every peep which ended up waking her up a lot more... and she seems to do really well in her crib, for the most part, it's just the early morning feeds we can't get right. I do bring her to bed around 6 or 7am and we do okay, but I still wake her up every time I move and vice versa.
Oh, and I don't mean I am actually considering formula, just that I am frustrated.
Thanks for the input, I do wish our boobs would meet up somewhere in the middle! that's a funny visual
post #4 of 26
I wish they would too! I hate having to scour the earth for donors who have extra milk. I'm sure we're going to end up supping with formula because I'll be unable to find another milk donation.
post #5 of 26
short answer - whenever/all the time/I have no idea.

long answer - during the day - whenever, like whenever she seems hungry, or whenever I want to surf the web for a while, or whenever I want to just sit down, or whenever she fusses and can't be easily soothed, sometimes every 30 mins, sometimes every hour or two or three. DD1 nursed more like a "classic" baby - 20 mins per side, both sides, etc. I remember when she was little I could lay down in bed and watch a whole hour long tv show while nursing her. As she got older and older, the nursing sessions got shorter and shorter. DD1 also needed the boob to sleep at night and would spend half the night latched on. DD2 is different. Even from the very beginning she never nursed for long. When she is hungry and actively nursing she nurses for 5-10 mins. Anything after that is just comfort sucking/hanging out on the boob. She also doesn't really nurse to sleep - she dozes for a few mins and then wakes up again, etc. Unless we are side-lying in bed, then she'll fall asleep and stay asleep for a bit maybe 50% of the time. DD1 always nursed to sleep, always.
At night I nurse her whenever she wakes up. We started to put her in the crib when I noticed I was trying to nurse her at every little sound even though she wasn't awake, wasn't hungry and didn't want to nurse. Now she sleeps in her crib in another room and I can sleep through the noises.
We also have the nurse every 1/2-1 hour thing going on in the early morning hours most days. I think it is because she needs to fart or poop, has a wet diaper, just can't get comfortable, etc. not because she is starving. What I do when she wakes is I go into her room where we also have a double bed. I then will nurse her there and usually fall asleep too. I notice that if I leave her in the bed, but get up and go back to sleep in my own bed is that we both sleep better. She still continues to grunt, move and half wake up but it isn't waking me up and she seems to fall back to sleep. Can you try something like that?
post #6 of 26
when you get up at 3 or 4 can you pump just a little off the top to relieve the engorgement?

you just described danis nursing exactly
post #7 of 26
I have no clue. Usually at least every couple of hours. She nurses for at least 15 min a session.
post #8 of 26
It's still pretty random, but if we're home all day long it's a little more consistent. She usually does some sleepy cluster feeding between 6-8 am, along with the grunting and squirming that you guys have all described. Then she usually sleeps straight through in the swing until about noon, or possibly wakes up to feed once. Then she usually nurses every 2-3 hours during the day. Around dinner time she starts to cluster feed until bed time at about 11... but part of that is just that I know that sticking my boob in her mouth might shut her up. I don't think she's actually hungry those times. She is a very efficient nurser, and generally only nurses for maybe 10 minutes at the most. Every once in a while, if she's gone a long time without nursing she'll nurse for longer. And she'll comfort suck for longer, or dream suck, sometimes.
post #9 of 26
Thread Starter 
Quote:
Originally Posted by Carita View Post
when you get up at 3 or 4 can you pump just a little off the top to relieve the engorgement?

you just described danis nursing exactly
I do pump a little to relieve it, but it's hard to get it done while the baby is crying and hungry... phew!
It helps to know so many of your babies have similar "schedules". I will keep calm and try to stay patient with these 3/4 am feedings that are wearing me down. It won't last forever!
post #10 of 26
Heh, I can set my watch by charlie during the day. He eats every two hrs, and will wake from a nap if he's down.

At night he cues me by flailing and snorting, anywhere from every 2 hrs to longer stretches of 3, 4, a few 5s so far, and one 6!

I started out nursing him onone side per feeding because of preemie issues, but at 11 weeks and over 10 lbs, we're still at it. My boobs aren't lopsided and I like it for ease and eliminating worry of for/hindmilk issues.

We also typically go 15 mins, and that's the whole feeding! Letdown is pretty strong, still painful. If he's acting wiggly or gulping, I burp him and relatch. Occasionally I offer him the second breast just make sure I'm not keeping him from getting all he wants, but he doesn't want it.

Don't worry about the averages! I do hope your supply continues to normalize more and more...
post #11 of 26
fwiw... f you are considering bedsharing again, i find side laying nursing helps control the anount of air she gets. and if she s popping off with only a mnute feed, i would go ahead and bup her, even if she does wake up. i found quickly that even though i had to be more awake for one good feed, i got to sleep longer because of it.

now that said, dani is usually awake by 6-6:30 as well but stays that way since little borther is up as well. so i am jealous that you can actually get a little extra sleep LOL. to cope with getting up so early, I go to bed with her at 8 when she goes down - might watch some Tv in bed and surf the net and usually call it a night by 9:30. if i stay up late like i used to in the old days, it just makes me grumpy.
post #12 of 26
I forgot to mention times in my post above. We typically go to bed between 9 and 10 (she's generally been out for 1/2 an hour to an hour at that point after being nursed to sleep). Somewhere in the middle of the night we side nurse on whatever side I didn't nurse her on before bed (I lay down on the appropriate side so I don't have to think at 2 in the morning ). Then we're up for the day at 5:00 or so. I change her diaper then, after going all night without a change (we still use disposables at night; my MIL got us a Costco case of size 1's that are big on her but not too terribly big). Like Symphony, she's ready for a nap really soon after getting up; she's usually asleep by 6:00.
post #13 of 26
Jess, you and I have the same boobs!

With my first DD the over supply and crazy squirting let down were so bad. It was absolutely miserable and I had no idea what to do. I sprayed milk everywhere, all the time. I was always engorged. DD choked and spit up like a fire hose, even out her nose several times a day.

This time around I have the same issues except I got some great ideas from my midwife. (I know you're doing some of this already!)

I started out block nursing from the beginning and this has made a huge difference. I've found for it to be effective I have to be extreme about the blocks of time. I nurse on the left side all night long, then on the right side from waking up until after lunch. I do the left side all afternoon, then the right side in the evening, left all night long...

When I first switch boobs she chokes sometimes. It's really annoying, but what helps is for her to nurse/gulp for a minute then pop off and breathe while milk sprays out. I tuck a cloth wipe under my boob like a bib. She gulps and pops off over and over. DD2 doesn't spit up like DD1 because I've discovered a great secret--I sit her on the baby bjorn potty right after a gulping nursing session (or I hold her with her knees bent, hands under her fat thighs, over the sink) and that EC position gets out all of the gas! She belches like a man, hiccups, and then sharts out foamy gas bubble filled poop. After 5 minutes of that she's happy and relaxed. I so wish I had thought to try that with DD1!!

It works great at night too. DD2 will start grunting and squirming and farting in her sleep, so I pull off her diaper and potty her--she burps, farts, and her body relaxes. We go right back to sleep!

Another thing I've found for oversupply is to avoid all oat products. For some reason this is a major trigger for my body to make gallons of milk. I regret it the next day if I accidentally eat anything with oats in it!

And pumping--with DD1 I pumped the extra. After she finished nursing I could get 9 ounces from one side. I stopped at 9 ounces just because that's how big the bottle was. Insanity. My midwife (she's also an LLL leader) told me not to pump this time. It gives temporary relief, but it encourages your body to just make MORE milk.

Oh and there is a bit of hope--with DD1 despite everything my supply slowly regulated itself a bit so that by 6 months there was less spitting up and less milk spraying. She totally stopped spitting up somewhere around 8 months! It was amazing, one day I suddenly realized she hadn't soaked anything in baby puke...it stopped abruptly for some reason. So don't worry, the leaking and engorgement do get better with time.

Oh one last thing, I forgot. With DD2 I found a nursing position that keeps her from choking! At night when I'm engorged we nurse in bed with her laying on top of me. She lays kind of on her side, with her stomach against my stomach. That way the milk has to squirt uphill and it doesn't drown her!
post #14 of 26
I waited until dh got home to answer this as I wasn't sure of my memory:P

Right now R nurses pretty randomly. She'll be 7 weeks tomorrow. She can go up to two hours without eating during the day if we're doing things but if I'm home she'll nurse a lot more. She tends to cluster feed a lot upon waking up. As the day progresses, she'll spend about 15-20 min on each breast.

Now all my kids did this but started to slowly regulated around 8 weeks. By the time we hit the 3 month mark, they were a lot more regular (minus teething issues and growth spurts). At that point, I'd find a rhythm such as nursing every three hours for 10-15 min on each breast.

At night, she does go up to five hours without nursing.
post #15 of 26
are you nursing on oneside for many feeds before switching boobs?

pepper does exactly what we do! it is a system that is working out great for us! It also is great for him cause he likes to comfort suck! (and won't take a soother!...and hasnt really found a finger yet either). So every time I swap a boob he gets a decent sized 'meal' - and all the times hes wants to comfort suck in between (I stick with that same boob) - he can do and just gets a decent snack then. This also means that whilst his first meal was mostly foremilk - his 'snacks' are deff hind milk. (I can see this - the foremilk is very thin and looks like water whilst the hindmilk is thicker, stickier and looks very white - more like milk!).

I had the same issue with DS1. I was talking about it with a friend before Hamish was born - and that was the advice she gave me so I kept it in mind in case it became a problem again with DS2. When it deff was a problem - is when I started doing this (exactly the way pepper described!). I must have started it around 2 weeks. Now at 6 weeks, it seems we have a very good system going on for ourselves! So - try it and give it time to 'work'.
post #16 of 26
Our nursing and schedule is pretty random during the day.
I have the same pouring choking issue and can only nurse from one side at a time. I also only use that side for the next snacks too. If I even tried to switch all she would do is cry from the let down. I have to put a cloth diaper in between me and the baby to catch all the pouring before she will latch on again.
From my experience Ive learned NOT to pump from morning engorgement after the baby is about 4 weeks. It just makes more milk. We just suffered through it this time and the difference Ive noticed is that In the evening its not as bad, and it helps because she needs to suck more before finally crashing out.

My milk becomes normal for each baby at about 6 months. I can still only nurse from one side for a feeding, but the baby can keep up.
It sounds like you have the same thing.
post #17 of 26
I am not really paying too much attention to which boob I use when... I'm sort of letting instinct guide me on that? I just give her whichever boob feels like the one to give her. I try to give her the right one more often, especially when I feel like she's just comfort nursing. It produces quite a bit less than its lefty sister, so I figure her nursing on that one more may help even things out. BUT, the left one gets engorged way faster. It's kind of annoying, since my left boob was already bigger before I got pregnant, and now it's just comical. I can't wear some of my shirts just because my boobs are SO lopsided.

I think my supply may be pretty perfect, she generally fills up on one boob, so I know she's getting foremilk and hindmilk. The only issue is that sometimes she's still hungry after one boob and I don't always recognize this. It takes a few minutes of her popping off and on and being angry for me to realize that it's not a burp she needs, it's the other boob.
post #18 of 26
That should be 8 weeks not 7 (can't even remember my own baby's age). She's eight weeks today (O.M.G.).

Rhi: I'm like you. I don't really have a system but I don't really need one (I did with ds...we had major over supply issues). Sometimes with R, I get a heavy let down and she chokes, etc but not often. I don't know if my left has more milk but it is bigger, and all my kids have rejected the leftie sister Thus we comfort nurse on right and I pump on the left (I need milk for later on).
post #19 of 26
what are the logistics of pumping while feeding? L mostly eats in cradle/cross-cradle, so won't her body be in the way?
post #20 of 26
Quote:
Originally Posted by rhiOrion View Post
what are the logistics of pumping while feeding? L mostly eats in cradle/cross-cradle, so won't her body be in the way?
I use the football hold when I pump so no idea how one would do it with the cross/cradle hold. Sometimes I just wait until she drifts off to her sleep and then I pump a bit while she's snoozing. I guess what's key is that I'm not aiming for much...an oz per day makes me happy!
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