I have to nightwean or I'm going to lose it...

[mormontreehugger]

So I know a lot of moms disagree with nightweaning this soon, (DS is 9.5 mos old) but it needs to be done. I have had one full nights sleep (six hours straight) since January and it is really hurting our relationship. Getting up 5 times a night to nurse him, even co-sleeping, is too much for me. Maybe I'm just weak or something but I'm starting to get really angry in the middle of the night because I can't just wake up, pop the boob in, and fall back asleep. I have to be awake most of the time or his latch gets lazy and then I'm dealing with more nipple pain all day the next day which adds to my frustration. I do NOT want to be the demon mother who gets mad at her kid for something outside his control. But lately I've had a very hard time not yelling or getting upset with him for not going back to sleep because he wakes up an hour after the last time I fed him. I've used terrible language, and been thisclose to actually shaking him. I have to put him down and walk away and scream in the closet so I don't hurt him. The next morning I'm completely devastated over my lack of love and patience and absolutely hate myself.
I've come to the conclusion that I either have to nightwean now, or make a final decision to not have any more children so I won't mess them up too because obviously I can't handle babies because I'm defective.
So anyway, I'm thinking about trying to just partially nightwean from 12 to 6. If I can have 6 hours a night uninterrupted I can be a good mom again. Even if it's just a couple times a week. That one night of sleep that I got was so amazing! I felt like supermom all day and was pretty much dancing through my chores. This should be a good time to do it because I think we finally have stopped teething (he has EIGHT teeth.) and he's not in some huge developmental milestone phase as far as I can tell.
Any advice or ideas? Obviously he won' be crying it out or anything, and I have the no cry sleep solution, so that should help too. I'd like to know what any veteran mommas have to say though.

[aikigypsy]

Sleep deprivation sucks. I don't do well with it myself.

I didn't night wean my DD until she was over 2 years old, so I probably don't have any great advice, but before that she was down to 2-3 times/night for a long time, except for brief bouts of illness, teething, jet lag, etc. 6 times a night is a lot. What is the longest time your baby usually sleeps at night? Are you also sleeping then? I found that if I didn't fall asleep with DD, I was always exhausted, because that first stretch was the longest. Do you think you could cut back to one feed at 1-3 AM, then 6 AM? Does he ever take a bottle? Could someone else bottle feed him back to sleep once in the night?

I think that full nightweaning is best done a little older, but that wasn't always the advice and previous generations of babies survived OK. Montessori and Waldorf systems both advocate weaning at 9 months. It's a defensible option to nightwean now, especially because you're feeling so desperate.

That said, it will probably take a few nights to a week of more intense sleep deprivation to get through. My DD, now 2.6, still sometimes stirs in her sleep and asks to nurse in the wee hours of the morning, but 95% of the time she settles back to sleep without actually nursing or getting up.

One further thought -- is your baby's diaper dry, or does he need to pee in the night? Elimination discomfort of one kind or another might be a factor in his frequent nightwakings.

[zinemama]

Then do it. I have been there with the sleep deprivation and I think it's better to nightwean than to lose it as a mother and be angry all night long.

[dividedsky]

i just wanted to say... 9mos is a tough time. i have twins. my boys slept HORRIBLY around that time. i think it's a whole developmental/teething thing. i was also going totally insane. i stuck with it and just weaned them fully @ 16mos... the night time was the last to go. i think it would have been MUCH harder to night wean @ ~9mos. which doesn't mean it can't be done..... but just be aware that it'll probably take more really rough nights to get there than it would later on.

do what you have to do to be a sane and happy mommy. but also be aware that they your bean may be waking for reasons other than to nurse... like you could nightwean him and then he keeps waking for tooth pain/wet dipe/developmental insanity/etc. it could be that he's just waking to nurse b/c he's dependent for sure... but i really think the 9 months time is a tough time for sleep and there's more to it than that.

but yeah, if you're losing it... don't feel bad for trying. and don't feel bad if you can't stick with it. do what feels right for everybody and be gentle on yourself!

[mormontreehugger]

Aikigypsy--I don't want to make him full nightwean quite yet, it's just that one stretch of time I need. I'm hoping if I nurse on demand before and after he'll get used to getting his nursing done then.. Maybe I'm too optimistic..

I really should sleep when he does, and I've sorta been doing that. I just crave that solitude at night, ya know? So it's partly my fault.

His diaper shouldn't bug him because it's the MotherEase dry weave kind and his skin is usually mostly dry in the morning (after 11-12 hours of sleep) I do EC part time and have considered trying that at night but I can't figure out how to do it without making him mad because I'm not nursing him. I'm thinking about just trying for a half hour or so to get him back to sleep without nursing before I give in and nurse him to see if he's ready. If I do it for a few nights running I should get a good idea I hope.

Zinemama--Thanks for the validation. It's hard to decide to do something like this in this community because I feel like I've failed or something. I tend to beat myself with ideals. Maybe I'll be able to do better with the next baby. If I'm brave enough to have another one...

[LadyCatherine185]

9 months is a HUGE time for development. Mine was starting to walk, though most are starting to at least crawl/pull up/cruise furniture, etc. And 8 teeth? You're about halfway there.

That said, trust me when I say I KNOW how horrible sleep deprivation can be. At 9 months we were lucky to get an hour stretch from DS. The good news? I did things to make it easier on myself for the short term (until he started sleeping better) and waited until he was old enough and ready to nightwean.. and last night he slept his first TEN hour stretch. He has been pretty much STTN since 19 months old or so, after some gentle nightweaning and moving him to his own bed.

I suggest waiting a little longer. He is so young, so much going on, it is going to be TOUGH on both of you to try anything like that right now. He won't understand what is going on.

A few things you could try---

*Make your bed comfortable enough so that you can wake and go back to sleep easily between wake-ups. If that means side-carring a crib, kicking your DP out, getting a new mattress (we got a memory foam mattress topper and I LOVE it), whatever makes it easier on YOU.
*NAP WHEN HE NAPS, go to bed earlier. If he is sleeping 11-12 hours at night, you should at least try and be in bed for 9-10 of them.
*Have your DP take part of the night
*Have your DP take your DS out on the weekend mornings for breakfast/to the park/run errands, etc so that you can clock a couple extra hours
*I am a huge fan of blackout curtains and white noise

it will get better, just hang in there a little longer!

[neveryoumindthere]

Originally Posted by zinemama

Then do it. I have been there with the sleep deprivation and I think it's better to nightwean than to lose it as a mother and be angry all night long.

:

nak
I nightweaned ds at 5 months old..it was that or suicide..it got that bad. It's intimidating to admit that around here but there it is.

It was THE single best parenting decision I've ever made. He's STTN (12-14hrs) straight ever since and the is the happiest, most wonderful kid EVER! (he's my 3rd--baby#4 is a good sleeper so far)

I will not hesitate to nightwean a young one again ---well before I hit rock bottom. It saved our family and our relationship.

I totally get where you are coming from.

eta: we did NOT nightwean by CIO

[aikigypsy]

Originally Posted by mormontreehugger

His diaper shouldn't bug him because it's the MotherEase dry weave kind and his skin is usually mostly dry in the morning (after 11-12 hours of sleep) I do EC part time and have considered trying that at night but I can't figure out how to do it without making him mad because I'm not nursing him. I'm thinking about just trying for a half hour or so to get him back to sleep without nursing before I give in and nurse him to see if he's ready. If I do it for a few nights running I should get a good idea I hope.

If you want to try, here's how I did it (before giving up on nighttime EC when my DD was around 12 months old.) Latch on. Sit up on edge of bed. Pull down diaper and position over container and cue. Reassemble and lie down again. Sleep.

For the bedside EC container, I used a rectangular tupperware, maybe about a half gallon size, with a lid. I think it might be trickier with a boy, but anyway you should be able to do a pee-while-nursing hold at his age.

Also, the first few nights it took about an hour to get DD back to sleep without nursing. Look up the Dr. Gordon nightweaning program -- usually a link to it pops up on threads like this, and it might be a good approach even though your baby is under 12 months old. It worked pretty well for us (not perfectly, but well enough).

[KatWozBlue]

I feel for you, you have to give yourself permission to do it, period. If it is no longer working for you, then you have to make a change. I nightweaned my daughter around 10 months, best thing I ever did, I was so tired and I had a 3 year old that needed my attention and once I did, she stopped night waking and is a great sleeper.

Just tell yourself that it will be okay and that you will be a better mother for it. Good luck and don't be so hard on yourself.

[peainthepod]

I nightweaned mine a month ago (he was 18 months) because I'm pregnant and already having trouble sleeping and the night nursing sessions were making me want to crawl out of my skin. He has a tendency to clamp down with both jaws when he nods off on the breast, so I was waking up in agonizing pain at least once a night. After he drew blood a few times, I knew I had to do something.

I agree that 9.5 months seems early, especially around here, but you have to do what's best for you. If nightweaning is the only way to save your sanity, then do it. Nightweaning my son allowed me to be a better mother (and better person) by allowing me to sleep for longer than an hour at a time, as well as saving our nursing relationship because I no longer had to dread that every time he latched on, he was going to nearly tear my nipple off once he fell asleep. We still nurse 3-4 times a day (even though my supply is very low due to the pregnancy) and I cherish those sessions more than ever.

[Catherine12]

I feel for you. My dds were only waking up once a night at that age, which was manageable, but my ds was like yours - frequent wakings. So we nightweaned. It was a long process but I don't think it was traumatic for him.

I think there are two main aspects to night-weaning. First, your ds has to learn how to get back to sleep without nursing. Second, he has to readjust his meal schedule so he's not expecting to eat at night - if his body is cuing him that it's time to eat, he will wake up. Once he's out of the habit of nursing at a certain time he may stop waking at that time (though of course there are reasons for children to wake other than hunger).

The thing I found to work best was to have dh handle one of ds's wakings instead of me. If I went to him, he would not accept soothing other than nursing, but dh could rock or pat him to sleep without him getting so upset. And after awhile, when ds wasn't used to nursing at that particular time of night, he started sleeping through to his next accustomed feeding. We gradually worked him down, one feeding at a time. He didn't actually sttn until about 15 months, about 5 months after we started the night-weaning process, but there was steady improvement in how I felt each time we got him to drop a waking. And I'm sure the gradualness made it easier for ds to adjust.

[JessBB]

IDK if nightweaning this young would be wise from a nutritional / milk supply standpoint. Is there any way you could go to bed earlier or sleep later? Also, it's no guarantee of improved sleep.

[dziwozony]

My mom had a little sign in the kitchen that said, "If mama ain't happy, ain't nobody happy!" & it's so true! If you feel like you are about to lose it & it's negatively affecting your relationship with you child, then you need to make changes.

AP is about finding your own style of compassionate parenting that fits in with your individual famiy. NOT getting out an AP check list & feeling guilty about where you feel you're failing.

I don't have any practical advice, as I am cosleeping with my 17mth old & want to start nightweaning, but as a solo mum I have no idea how that can happen! I'm not sure how mums manage to cosleep & nightwean.

But good luck in finding family harmony & tune out anyone that tries to make you feel guilty about it. FWIW, I did also find 9mo to be a disruptive night phase, where I was tempted to give up cosleeping, but the phase passed.

[penstamon]

I agree that you need to do what's best for you and your family. While I would like to continue night nursing, I think DH and I have decided to start the nightweaning process soon (he's almost 11mo) because I think DS is ready and we desperately need a change at night. I don't think your LO is too young physiologically and there must be consideration for all the family members here.

Best of luck to you!

[ktmama]

I tried nightweaning ds around 10 months and it was a very traumatic four nights, so we stopped. HOWEVER, he did make some sort of connection (or maybe it was just the timing) and he started sleeping better. At that point, our problem was waking at night for 90 minutes at about 2:00 am every night and general difficulty falling back to sleep once he woke up.

I really feel for you mama. I have two other kids and I work pt and night waking has almost done me in. There is hope. My ds is 12 1/2 months and just this week started sleeping two big five hour chunks and another 1.5 hour bit in the early morning with no prolonged night wakings.

This I can handle.

When I was in your shoes, we had some "rules" that helped me cope:
1. If I had fed ds within the last two hours, dh got up and put him back to sleep
2. Mama sleeps in on Sunday for as long as she wants. This usually means that I get up at about 10:30 to put the baby down for his nap, but then I get to go back to bed if I want.
3. No one (including me) gets to put undue pressure on me for anything including housework, remembering things or sex.

Within these parameters I could cope. I hope that you can find a plan that works for you and I hope, if you do decide to nightwean, that your baby begins to sleep better.

[jennybear]

Have you tried moving him to a crib/his own room?

I remember reading that co-sleeping babies wake much more frequently to nurse.

[dahlialia]

IDK if there is anything in my experiences that might help, but I will share anyway.

DD1 was a terrible sleeper. and I had a hard time adjusting to motherhood. DH took her for a 6-hour stretch in the night, and offered her a bottle if she seemed hungry. She started off drinking an ounce or two, but soon enough would just get by for 6 hours without. Please note, though, that this made NO difference to her sleep. She was 5 years old before she slept through the night with any regularity. All it did was enable DH to bear the brunt of some of it, so I could get uninterrupted sleep.

DD2, is a slightly better sleeper. She and I co-sleep. I rarely get more than 2-hour stretches, but somehow, I'm just more ok with it. She does settle more easily, and I'm so used to side nursing that I barely even notice the process. DH gets up with the girls and does the school drop-off, baby in tow, so I can get a little extra sleep. I also sometimes will doze with DD2 when she has her afternoon nap.

[clemrose]

Originally Posted by mormontreehugger

I really should sleep when he does, and I've sorta been doing that. I just crave that solitude at night, ya know? So it's partly my fault.

My second child is 8.5 months and I've finally realized that my need for sometime EVERY evening after my kids go to bed is as valid as my need for sleep. It is as important to me being a good mom as is me feeling rested (which I don't! my 8.5 mo old nurses every 2 hrs around the clock on good days!). I've felt guilty about that need for 3+ years but I shouldn't and you shouldn't either.

So don't beat yourself for needing that time. I think if you can nightwean between 12 & 6 then do it. Part of being a good mom is realizing your own limitations and working within them.

Good luck.

[mamazee]

Go ahead and try, but if it doesn't work because of his age, at least have your dh get up with him in the morning and give you some uninterrupted sleep-ins. My first was a horrible sleeper, and that's what saved me. Good luck though!

[MissLotus]

Just like you respect other people's boundaries, you need to respect your own. You sound like a caring mother, you are attentive to your child's emotions and nutritional needs, so hey, if night-weaning for a chunk of time each night is the boundary you need to set to be a better mom and a happier human being, that will benefit your child so much more than miserably plugging along doing something that is making you sleep-deprived and impatient. It is totally okay to take this step, and I bet your child will continue to thrive... you'll see!