is this even legal?

[chelsmm]

My pedi just told us that he and his partners have decided on a minimum vaccine policy. They now require HIB and DTap in order to be a patient. My kids are unvaccinated. I really like this one pediatrician, and I'd like to continue going to him.

Is this even legal? I mean, I know they are a private practice, but in MA, where I live, we have a religious exemption on the books. So, isn't his practice discriminating against me based on my religious choices? (not vaccinating IS against my sincere personal beliefs, so I'm not lying when I claim it's religious. This fits the MA law). Can a private practice discriminate against someone based on their religion? I know a store or restaurant can't even if they are privately owned. And I assume that most pedi offices take some govn't money with regards to vaccines, is that correct?

Anyone have any ideas about this? Am I in a position where I could write a letter and fight this? I really like our doctor overall. My kids like him. I'd like to keep him.

Thanks, Chelsea.

[MommatoAandA]

Originally Posted by chelsmm

My pedi just told us that he and his partners have decided on a minimum vaccine policy. They now require HIB and DTap in order to be a patient. My kids are unvaccinated. I really like this one pediatrician, and I'd like to continue going to him.

Is this even legal? I mean, I know they are a private practice, but in MA, where I live, we have a religious exemption on the books. So, isn't his practice discriminating against me based on my religious choices? (not vaccinating IS against my sincere personal beliefs, so I'm not lying when I claim it's religious. This fits the MA law). Can a private practice discriminate against someone based on their religion? I know a store or restaurant can't even if they are privately owned. And I assume that most pedi offices take some govn't money with regards to vaccines, is that correct?

Anyone have any ideas about this? Am I in a position where I could write a letter and fight this? I really like our doctor overall. My kids like him. I'd like to keep him.

Thanks, Chelsea.

I was booted from a private practice for not 100% vaxing (I'm in MA). I actually am glad they did though. I don't want to go to a DR that is so oppositional towards my beliefs that the office and other medical staff are nasty to me and will not sign certain forms (yes this happened to me). They even made up a fake bill and said I didn't pay it, nor did I cancel an appt that I missed (which I never made). I wasn't dealing with that crap anymore.

They can, unless you want to make a fuss and fight them in court, and by that time, you probably will not want to go to the office anyway. We are in the market for a new pedi, but I am having a hard time finding one (there is one naturopath here and he is not very nice at all). Not sure what we are going to do. Sorry mama!

[Emmeline II]

Originally Posted by chelsmm

Is this even legal? I mean, I know they are a private practice, but in MA, where I live, we have a religious exemption on the books. So, isn't his practice discriminating against me based on my religious choices?

Anyone have any ideas about this? Am I in a position where I could write a letter and fight this? I really like our doctor overall. My kids like him. I'd like to keep him.

Thanks, Chelsea.

Yes, it is legal. The just need to give you written notice and treat your children until they have a new doctor (more like 'needed' treatment; if your child has a condition that cannot tolerate a break in care).

The exemptions are for school attendance.

[chelsmm]

Ok, so now my problem is that he didn't tell us until after the visit. So my insurance co will get charged for a yearly physical for both kids. They only pay for one a year. No new doctor is going to assume care for my kids until they do their own physical. So I will have to pay out of pocket if I try to find a new pedi before Jan 2011. Can I expect my current md to care for my kids all the way until then?

[Marnica]

Originally Posted by chelsmm

Ok, so now my problem is that he didn't tell us until after the visit. So my insurance co will get charged for a yearly physical for both kids. They only pay for one a year. No new doctor is going to assume care for my kids until they do their own physical. So I will have to pay out of pocket if I try to find a new pedi before Jan 2011. Can I expect my current md to care for my kids all the way until then?

Why wouldn't a doctor assume care without a full physical. My DS has switched docs without a full physical and I have done this plenty of times as an adult. (They only pay for a physical every 3 years for an adult under my plan). This is not realistic and I would think if you explained and provided your previous records that would suffice.

Docs are supposed to care for your kids until you find a new doc, but there is no legal ramifications. It is just an AAP guideline. They can tell you beat it at any time.

[chelsmm]

Our insurance will only pay for sick visits for the remainder of the year. So you think if I get a new doctor and bring the old records they will take over care without ever even meeting the kids?

I'll just have to call and see, I guess. I'm really frustrated at our doctor.

[Deborah]

Check the laws in Massachusetts. If the exemptions are religious and medical only, getting parents to have a couple of vaccines basically will destroy their hope of claiming a religious exemption, which is usually all or nothing. Unless, of course, the parent claims a sudden conversion.

I'm not sure about the religious discrimination question being moot. Exemptions are for school attendance, true, but a parent with a religious reason against vaccination shouldn't be denied medical care for their child. I think they are discriminating and that it is a religious discrimination problem. But bringing a lawsuit would be expensive because it would be establishing the ground.

You could try just threatening them with one and see if they back down. They might not have thought through the ramifications of this stance.

[chelsmm]

THis is kind of what I was thinking. I was considering having a lawyer write a letter, just to let them know they were not legally allowed to deny medical care to us based on our religious decisions. I wouldn't consider a lawsuit ever, but I was thinking of a letter from an attorney.

MA is religious and medical only. We don't vaccinate at all, so we would be fine to claim religious exemption. Vaccines aren't even mandated, except for entry to school, right?

This is so annoying.

[Deborah]

What do you have to lose? Except the cost of asking the attorney to write the letter.

[rabrog]

Vax aren't mandatory for schook, either. That's what the medical and religious exemptions allowed in your state are for.

Jenn

[crunchy_mommy]

I used to work for a pedi office in MA and they wouldn't accept patients who didn't vax. So I'm assuming not only is it legal but also more widespread...

I think having a lawyer write them a letter couldn't hurt though, since you'd have to leave the practice anyway, and it never hurts to question... because it might sway them, or make it easier for someone else to fight them down the line, etc., though I wouldn't write the letter in expectation of any real legal outcome in your favor.

ETA: You are correct, the exemptions are only for school entry, there is no law that you have to vaccinate, but we had a discussion of doc's requiring vaxes not long ago on this board (don't know where the thread is) and I believe the consensus was that if they are a private practice they can make their own rules.

[isign]

Originally Posted by chelsmm

Our insurance will only pay for sick visits for the remainder of the year. So you think if I get a new doctor and bring the old records they will take over care without ever even meeting the kids?

I'll just have to call and see, I guess. I'm really frustrated at our doctor.

We just did this. I found a wonderful vax friendly ped (thanks MDC mamas!!) and was so ready to 'fire' my old ped. I called them up, made a well baby visit for one, and a sick visit for the other. No problems, we went in, filled out paperwork, and we were good to go. I did have their records sent before the visit since I had to pay $1 per page to pick them up myself.

[chelsmm]

I'll call and see then. I don't want to do a well child visit because my insurance won't cover it. I'd have to pay in full. I didn't know if a new md would take my kids without a well visit first. I guess I won't know until I call.

I'm kind of over my initial anger about this. I am most annoyed now that he waited until the end of the visit to tell me.

But, I'll get over that too

[MountainMamaGC]

You dont need a physical. Just get the records from this recent physical sent to your new ped.

[Emmeline II]

Originally Posted by Marnica

Docs are supposed to care for your kids until you find a new doc, but there is no legal ramifications. It is just an AAP guideline. They can tell you beat it at any time.

It is not criminal, but it can result in a malpractice claim or board complaint.

Abandonment-
1) the termination must be initiated by the doctor, not the patient; 2) it must be done without giving the patient sufficient time to find another provider; and 2) there must be a need for additional care.

[Emmeline II]

Originally Posted by chelsmm

THis is kind of what I was thinking. I was considering having a lawyer write a letter, just to let them know they were not legally allowed to deny medical care to us based on our religious decisions.

I haven't read anything saying they (legally) cannot. Doctors have the right to treat or not and not following orders (even for religious reasons) appears to be a legal reason to fire a patient.

[caned & able]

Dr. Richard Moskowitz in Waterford, MA accepts patients who do not vax. There are others.

My personal experience is that MA is a strange state for medical issues.

As for your doctor discriminating against you for your religious beliefs, remember that he can come back and say that your beliefs are endangering his other patients. You are not of course, but the case will be made should this case come to court or mediation.

[PuppyFluffer]

Would you consider a family practitioner? They generally don't have the vax agenda like peds do.