oh, the screaming tantrums.

[babybirkel]

My 17 month old DS has started this thing where, when he gets frustrated, or if we tell him 'no' and redirect him, he will clench his fists and his face will turn red and he will SCREAM this intense, crazy, a little scary yell. I know part of it is a verbal thing -- he's very verbal for his age, but I think in the heat of the moment he's overcome by emotions and can only respond by screaming.

He also likes to pinch my arms while screaming when he is mad at me, or throw stuff....toys, books, etc.

But I am seriously at a loss as to what to do. I try to talk to him alot, like, "I know you're mad because you can't yank on the curtains/jump around on the couch/throw splash bombs at the cat/have to get your teeth brushed/have to sit in your car seat so we can leave, but we don't always get what we want, sorry." I try to encourage him when he gets frustrated while playing or something to say, "Stuck" or "Help, please..."

But seriously. The screeching/throwing stuff/hitting when mad has got to stop. Anyone have any advice?

[svs79]

My 19 mo DD has similar "tantrums", and from what I've read this is normal. When they are having a meltdown it is very difficult or impossible for them to understand your words, so the best you can do is make sure he is safe and let him fuss it out. I try to prevent the meltdown when I can, but it is bound to happen sooner or later and is completely normal. Here are some resources I have found helpful:

http://www.naomialdort.com/

http://www.earlyparenting.com/

Good luck, and remember this is only a stage and it will pass!

[AKA_PI]

OMG I am going through the same thing with my little one. I've started giving him timeouts in his room and ignoring him while he has his fit. When he's done, I'll then talk to him about "that not being nice and if he wants something he has to calmly tell mommy what he wants."

Does anyone have issues with discipling from the fathers? My little one see his dad has fun and games so when he disciplines him, he laughs. Whereas, if I do it, then he cries and gets upset but knows mommy means business. I always make him give me a kiss and I tell him I'm sorry but he has to learn that that isn't nice. It can't possibly work if both parents are consistent.

[ErynneM]

I've been using the techniques from "The Happiest Toddler on the Block" to good effect. I don't think ignoring a tantruming toddler is a good idea; how would you feel if you were upset and your best friends/significant other ignored you?

I am hoping he'll grow out of this soon, though; he's only 14 months old, and the screaming, stomping, throwing himself on the ground, and generally melting into a puddle of goo isn't much fun.

- E

[Baby_Cakes]

Originally Posted by ErynneM

I've been using the techniques from "The Happiest Toddler on the Block" to good effect.

OP - along the lines of the advice in this book, you may be using too many words when talking to your tantruming toddler. Try to keep it short and simple. "DS is mad. You're mad. You want to grab the kitty's tail! You want to grab it!" and see what happens. Acknowledge his frustration and his emotion, but keep it short.

When I do this w/DD, she immediately stops tantruming, and nods, b/c I "get it". Only then can I say, "No. We do not pull the kitty's tail. Come read a book with me." And we shut down the tantrum.

I highly, HIGHLY, recommend reading this book. It has helped SO MUCH in dealing with this type of behaviour, and it's gentle. It takes into account their feelings.

[LadyCatherine185]

Great advice from Babycakes and ErynneM. I would absolutely NOT put him in his room for "time out." It is developmentally and emotionally appropriate for them to have "tantrums" at that age. They cannot control their emotions/frustrations, and punishing them for having those emotions is counterproductive.

I did really like some of the suggestions in Happiest Toddler on the Block. I never did the "caveman" talk, but it definitely help me understand how to communicate better with DS. And at 17 months, they can most definitely (or at least should be able to if they are developmentally on track) understand most of what you say. Yes, shorten the sentence. "Liam is mad. Mommy's sorry. No knife, knife is dangerous." something like that. Use less words, but enough to get the point across. For some reason my DS gets over it much quicker if I give him a "reason" such as "it's to big/small/dangerous/can't reach it/in a few minutes" etc. And never just leave him alone or close him off. Sit with him and give him the words he needs and do what you need to calm him down. Distraction works well with my DS too, after I give him the reason. "I'm sorry, the knife is dangerous. It will hurt you. Let's have a snack/what about your big truck/let's read a book, etc."

[Dreamy]

Tantrums at this age are all about sculpting the emotional regulation systems in the brain - they are normal and necessary, and should certainly not be ignored or punished - that could lead to supression of emotion and difficulty handling stress in adulthood. I posted a long explanation about tantrums in this post: http://www.mothering.com/discussions...49&postcount=6

[babybirkel]

Cool, thanks everybody. I will try to shorten my sentences. Mostly I just let him scream in my presence, wait for him to calm down, distract him with something else, and move on. It just seems like 98% of my day is doing this, and it gets old. I suppose that's just life with a toddler, eh? I understand creating a "yes" environment but there are times (like at the store, etc) where that is simply not possible. We don't do "time outs." I guess I just need reassurance that my kid is not going to be a terror when he is three, you know? Does anyone else worry about that?

I struggle with knowing when I am being too firm and when I am being too wishy-washy.

He's really a pretty easy-going kid most of the time.

I should check out Happiest Toddler. I loved Happiest Baby. Sometimes though it seems like the gentle discipline methods don't work with my son, at least not as well as Dr. Sears promises they will. And then I am at a loss.

[LadyCatherine185]

it sounds like you are doing a great job mama! How verbal is he? Does he have any signs? Teaching my DS "please" and "all finished" before he became more verbal helped a lot. We do use the word "no" here, but we don't do timeouts, or punishments really.. but for example if we are outside and he keeps running into the road, the "punishment" is that we have to go back inside.. Definitely check out Happiest Toddler. It will get better! Just in the last couple weeks DS has started actually LISTENING to me when I say "no" or ask him to do something! He is very verbal though, so I think that has a lot to do with it. Give it some time, it will get better.

[Dreamy]

Originally Posted by babybirkel

I guess I just need reassurance that my kid is not going to be a terror when he is three, you know? Does anyone else worry about that?

It's hard when they're in the pre-verbal stage, but these are the main points I try to keep in mind (from the thread I linked to above):

Originally Posted by Dreamy

-Tantrums are key times for brain sculpting. The emotional regulation of a child’s feelings during storms of feeling enables him to establish essential brain pathways for managing stress and being assertive later in life.

Originally Posted by Dreamy

There are two types of tantrums:

Distress Tantrums (DTs)
-DTs happen because essential brain pathways between a child’s higher brain and lower brain haven’t developed yet – these are necessary for managing big feelings.
-As a parent, your role is to soothe your child during these tantrums. If you get angry, he may stop crying, but this may mean that the FEAR system has been triggered, or he may have shifted to silent crying, which floods his brain with toxic levels of cortisol.
-When a child has a distress tantrum, you can see real anguish in his face – he needs comfort.

Originally Posted by Dreamy

Little Nero Tantrums (LNTs)
-A child having a LNT doesn’t experience or show the anguish, desperation or panic that characterizes the DT, and doesn’t have stress chemicals flooding his brain and body.
-There is usually an absence of tears, and the child is able to articulate his demands and to argue when you say “no”.
-A LNT is about a child trying to get what he wants by bullying his parents into submission.
-If you reward frequent LNTs, you are in danger of setting up a trigger-happy RAGE system in your child’s brain. This is because the mere experience of rage without capacity for reasoned thinking can result in rage becoming a part of your child’s personality.

(There's lots more in that thread).

I'm still working on differentiating the different types of tantrums. For example, when he's overtired and melting down because he wants to go for a bike ride instead of sleep, I'll stay with him, calmly repeat that he's tired, and we can go for a ride after dodo, and try to distract him with questions. "Do you want to cuddle with teddy bear? Do you want num nums?" Eventually he comes to me for a big hug. If we're in a store however and he keeps running away from me, risking getting hit by carts, I'll give him a few gentle warnings before restraining him and dealing with the meltdown. In both cases I feel I'm being fair while still remaining gentle and setting limits, which he will need to learn in order to function in society. I'm also working on standing my ground when "demands" are made. If he asks "Cookie?" and it's not mealtime, I'll likely give him a cookie. If I say no and he starts stomping and hitting, I absolutely won't give in to the tantrum, since that's the type of thing that reinforces tantrums/using rage to manipulate people.

[babybirkel]

So I have been trying the Happiest Toddler method, and I think it really works!

Example: DS was very, very overtired and grumpy (he took an early nap today, did not sleep well last night, kind of has a cold) and after he was finished eating his dinner, he held up his plate like he was going to throw it (he does this often -- holds something up before he throws it and watches our reactions). I said, "no, we don't throw our food" and moved too take his plate away from him, but before I could he dumped his plateful of peas on his tray and then pushed them over the edge on the ground. sigh. he waits and watches for our reactions before he does these kinds of things, he knows that what he is doing isn't what he is supposed to be doing. Anyway, I responded by saying "no, we don't throw our food" again, and getting him down from his high chair. He responded by throwing a massive tantrum -- screaming, kicking, head-butting, all of it. I said, in a similar tone of voice as him, "You want to throw your food! You want to throw it! You REALLY want to!!!" and he stopped, looked at me, and nodded YES. Then I said, again, "We don't throw our food." and suggested he find his ball and throw that instead.

Tantrum over.

Anyway, I tried it again a few more times before bed and it worked each time. I was very pleased.

To the OP regarding the different types of tantrums: he definitely has tantrums where he is really just overwhelmed or scared or who knows what, and as his mom I can feel my reaction to him change. I HAVE to pick him up and hold him. He usually runs to me for a hug anyway. Other tantrums, where he is just pushing boundaries and whatnot (like getting ready to throw something he knows he's not supposed to and watching to see how we will react), I just try to calmly repeat the "rule" or whatever (like, we don't throw our food) and not give in.

Thanks for all the advice here, ladies! I really appreciate y'all.