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would you be upset? uninvited from BD party after exposure to chicken pox - Page 3

post #41 of 185
Quote:
Originally Posted by MommatoAandA View Post
I would have chosen to keep my kids home personally most likely, but wow, it's JUST CHICKEN POX PEOPLE?! I had them, my cousins, brother, family, we ALL HAD THEM. Why is this all of a sudden such a huge deal?
Well, for me it would be a pretty big deal if I had to take two weeks off of work to take care of kids with chicken pox. My family would also miss our vacation.

If I lived with a frail elderly person or an immunocompromised person, I would probably also think CP was a big deal. If I had the rare kid who wound up in the hospital for CP, I'd think that was a very big deal. If I didn't have health insurance and my kid wound up in the hospital with CP, that would tip the balance into a *huge* deal. If I were in the first trimester of pregnancy, I would think it was a big deal.

If you don't feel that CP is a big deal, go ahead and expose your kids. But don't make the decision that CP is an equally minor deal to everyone you are likely to meet while contagious or potentially contagious. It isn't.

Opting out of vaccination means opting in to quarantine, if your kids are exposed to or infected with a vaccine-preventable disease.
post #42 of 185
I agree w/ everything Rivka5 said... And I also agree with MommatoAandA that CP just isn't that big a deal. Or at least I don't think it is in most cases. But I'd still resent having my kids purposefully exposed without my choice/knowledge. And DS isn't vaxed for it.

Someone else said something along the lines of a "surprise CP party." And yeah, the surprise element isn't good. My friend's daughter had a birthday party last winter and it ended up a "surprise H1N1 party." A mom dropped her DD off at the party, left, and within 5 minutes the kid was lying on the couch, feverish and moaning. So not only did my friend get to care for a vomiting, feverish, miserable little girl during her daughter's BD party, her whole family ended up with the flu the week before Christmas. The kids missed out on seeing their family, they didn't get their pics taken with Santa (an annual tradition for the family photo album), and Christmas Day was completely spoiled b/c the kids didn't have the energy to play with the few toys my friend was able to buy before everyone got sick and no one could go to church, which is a huge deal to them.

So yeah, my son isn't vaxed, and if/when he gets CP I'll take care of him. And maybe I'll even expose him on purpose if possible, but I want it to be MY choice. Not someone else's.
post #43 of 185
You are overreacting. It is just a birthday party and you are asking to possibly expose a ton of people without their consent.


FWIW, DD is non-CP-vaxed and she might have been exposed because her classmate came down with it last week, right before summer break. I am a little pissy because she only gets 1 month vacay from school and I don't want it ruined by CP.
post #44 of 185
Quote:
Originally Posted by MommatoAandA View Post
I would have chosen to keep my kids home personally most likely, but wow, it's JUST CHICKEN POX PEOPLE?! I had them, my cousins, brother, family, we ALL HAD THEM. Why is this all of a sudden such a huge deal?
Because while chicken pox might seem like no big deal to someone with a healthy immune system it can, in fact, be a huge deal to a immunocompromised child or adult, a pregnant woman, etc.
post #45 of 185
Quote:
Originally Posted by lalaland42 View Post
You are overreacting. It is just a birthday party and you are asking to possibly expose a ton of people without their consent.


FWIW, DD is non-CP-vaxed and she might have been exposed because her classmate came down with it last week, right before summer break. I am a little pissy because she only gets 1 month vacay from school and I don't want it ruined by CP.
THIS.

OP, I Wouldn't be upset in the least. Texts are short, it's what people do in 2010. I certainly don't think she meant offense by it. Don't sweat the small stuff.
post #46 of 185
Quote:
Well I do know this: next time I expose my children to something, I will NOT be telling ANYONE.
So you are okay with you getting to choose to expose or not but you're not willing to grant others that same courtesy? Because you might miss out on some social events if others choose differently than you?

Quote:
As far as I am concerned, it IS unreasonable for someone to completely ignore the time frame during which my children could be contagious.
Would you guarantee me... in writing... subject to a financial penalty... that it is impossible for your children to infect mine on day six of your children's exposure?

Quote:
I do not see the need to avoid healthy vaccinated children, adults who have had CP, or the general public.
A. Vaccines don't always work, so those "healthy vaccinated children" could still get the pox.
B. You don't know which adults have had CP and which haven't. Even if you know everyone at the party, you don't know who they come into contact with.
C. It's not for you to decide who gets exposed.

Quote:
So if you do not vax and do not expose and they do not get it, what is the plan then? It is so severe and dangerous in an adult.
What you mention is a real dilemma. I was hoping that my children would just be randomly exposed to CP but they weren't.

That said, I, personally, could never ever intentionally expose my children. So when they reached the more dangerous age of 12-ish, I had them vaccinated. Was I 100% confident in my decision? No. But it was my decision to make.
post #47 of 185
Quote:
Originally Posted by rejoiceinlife View Post
Well I do know this: next time I expose my children to something, I will NOT be telling ANYONE. I only told 2 people (fellow non-vaxers) that I thought might want to expose their children as well. I will not make that mistake again, next time if someone wants to expose their children, they can come to me when and if my children actually have the illness.

As far as I am concerned, it IS unreasonable for someone to completely ignore the time frame during which my children could be contagious. I have no problem with asking us not to attend an event if we were in the contagious window, or others choosing not to be around us in that time frame. When people just ignore the facts, I guess I do have a problem with that. There is not an issue of anyone who is immune compromised or adults who haven't had CP here, either with the party or anything else that has come up (it's a small community and I do know). I don't have a problem avoiding people who perhaps shouldn't be exposed, like someone who is due very soon and her 1 year old, or a baby who was born premature, or a newborn...during the contagious period, as a common courtesy. I do not see the need to avoid healthy vaccinated children, adults who have had CP, or the general public.

And I feel like all this becomes a bigger issue when I now have the choice of avoiding every situation where I'd normally come in contact with any of these people for several weeks (and there are quite a few, church 2x/week, a volunteer thing this weekend, playgroups, etc), or simply going about my business as usual and letting people choose to absent themselves and their entire families (including adult males who have already had CP, which is ridiculous IMO) because we are there when they know my kids could not be contagious. Perhaps from the middle of next week on when they could be contagious I'll choose differently, but not right now. It's chicken pox, not small pox, and really, would people have been acting this way 10 years ago (or however long ago it was) before the CP vaccine? I cannot imagine people simply stopped sending their children to school and doing anything socially for months out of fear of contracting CP when it was going around unless there were some extremely compelling reason like a immune suppressed individual.
Prior to 1) the wide availability of antibiotics to treat the occasional complications of chickenpox and 2) the vaccine, chickenpox was a quarantinable illness. State departments of public health still have quarantine policies about it.

Yes, you're right, everyone got it, eventually. But everyone also kept their children home when they had it. IF they knew their kids were exposed, they kept them home when they were likely to be shedding virus (some quarantine polices included the entire incubation period).

As late as 1976, when I got them, the standard policy was that kids stayed home until the scabs had all dried up and fallen off -- it wasn't widely known that it was safe to be out and about earlier than that even at that point in time.

When childhood diseases were circulating naturally in the community, they behaved naturally. Which means they came and went in cycles. They arent' evenly spread around so that everyone could get a nice safe case when they were at the optimal age, not too young, not too old, not too pregnant.

And people knew that - they knew that there were people who would be hit harder and who should try to avoid infection. And so people who *were* infected were kept away from the general public. To protect those for whom it was too soon or to late for it to be "no big deal."

Chickenpox wasn't EVER seen as some kind of wonderful gift that people should be glad to get at any age! Parents of kids of "the right age" might have rushed to get their kids exposed -- but that would be because they knew if their kids didn't get it in this round, they might be much older before it came around again, old enough to be in the group more severely affected.
post #48 of 185
I would not be upset if I were in your shoes.
post #49 of 185
Quote:
Originally Posted by MommatoAandA View Post
YESSS thank you!

a little OT:
What scares me is that with less and less children having the chicken pox today because of that vax, my children will have less of a chance of getting the disease, so it seems that exposing them purposefully is the only way to get it done and out of the way. So if you do not vax and do not expose and they do not get it, what is the plan then? It is so severe and dangerous in an adult.

I would have chosen to keep my kids home personally most likely, but wow, it's JUST CHICKEN POX PEOPLE?! I had them, my cousins, brother, family, we ALL HAD THEM. Why is this all of a sudden such a huge deal?

I had a horrid case of chicken pox. In my throat, vagina, ears, nose, eyelids, but hey, its done and over with. Those who are vaxed and unvaxed and not exposed cannot soundly say the same.

ETA- I would not be upset though at being uninvited. I can respect someone else's decisions even if I don't agree with them.
My husband has had chicken pox three times. He seems to not develop an immunity. He was vaccinated for them as a child before the first time he got them. Each run gets worse. You bring your kids to a birthday party that we're at because we have a child and now my husband gets to deal with a fourth run of the chicken pox? Or would you rather that we always stay home when there are children around because "it's just chicken pox?"

One of my good friends is the sole caretaker for her elderly mother. She often has to pass up family events or events where lots of kids are invited. Why? Her mother has never had chicken pox and she wound up with them after a 4th of July BBQ one year. She had to hire someone to care for her mother during this time and stay with friends who didn't mind the exposure. She's now out of work and couldn't afford to hire someone again - so she gets to stay home because "it's just chicken pox."

Many people have more than one child - so should I not bring my 9 month old to my 7 year old's birthday party because it's "just chicken pox?" Pregnant moms? People who want to visit sick relatives? People who need to travel by air soon? That's a whole lot of people staying home so that your kid with chicken pox exposure can come to the birthday party.

Children are not the only people who get chicken pox. Children at the birthday party are not the only concern.

If you have known exposure to something that could be as serious an issue for so many people as chicken pox, I'd appreciate it if you stayed home. If I am the host of an event and know that you have a known exposure and you don't let me know that you're going to not attend, I'm going to un-invite you and probably be pretty cranky about being put in the position of "uninviting" someone to my kid's birthday party.

Some people I know recently spread hand-foot-and-mouth around to their friends because they were told they were "outside of the contagious window." Another friend wound up giving a pregnant friend of ours parvovirus (and exposed me) because she's an ER doctor and "wasn't in the contagious window." I can't tell you how many times I've heard "But I wasn't contagious! You must have gotten parvo/mono/chicken pox/hfm somewhere else!" Heck, I've heard this excuse used among adults for STIs. The windows are a guideline. If you know you're exposed, find fun things for your kids to do at home until you know you are healthy - this is part of the planning for exposure.
post #50 of 185
Quote:
Originally Posted by baglady View Post
Maybe it's more about the other kids at the party. She may be afraid that other parents will find out that she knew about the exposure and be upset that she didn't warn them. Or, maybe she's afraid others will find out before the party and not bring their kids.

That was my first thought.
Or a pregnant woman. When Iw as pregnant with my third, I avoided any pox, because we knew she would be in the nicu after birth (chd diagnosed in utero) and if my unvaxxed older children contracted it, they would not have been able to see her.
post #51 of 185
Thread Starter 
Quote:
Originally Posted by VillageMom6 View Post
So you are okay with you getting to choose to expose or not but you're not willing to grant others that same courtesy? Because you might miss out on some social events if others choose differently than you?
I would be perfectly fine with it if my kids came down with CP or measles or mumps randomly. Sure it might be a horrible time, I might have a young baby, whatever...part of life as far as I am concerned. Or at least, life as it used to be.

Quote:
Would you guarantee me... in writing... subject to a financial penalty... that it is impossible for your children to infect mine on day six of your children's exposure?
The burden of proof is not on me to "prove" that the timeline the experts give is accurate. Bottom line.

Quote:
A. Vaccines don't always work, so those "healthy vaccinated children" could still get the pox.
B. You don't know which adults have had CP and which haven't. Even if you know everyone at the party, you don't know who they come into contact with.
C. It's not for you to decide who gets exposed.
People seem to have the idea that's it's only possible to contract chicken pox if you are knowingly exposed to it by someone else. Many times parents have no idea where their kids contracted it! So I'd say it's part of life, and I do not believe "not vaccinating" means I'm obligated to quarantine my family any time they have been exposed to any vaccine-"preventable" illness. Aside from the fact that I am not exposing ANYONE to CP at this point.


You know, it doesn't really matter what anyone else thinks. I feel quite hurt about the whole situation, and that hurt only increases when someone snatches a child up and leaves when they see my kids because "his mom doesn't want him exposed to chicken pox". If it were up to me I'd go to my parents' in a different city for a week or two and leave the whole situation behind, but DH doesn't want that. At this point I would be perfectly happy not to go anywhere where I know anyone for the next couple of weeks. And I think it's just as well that I probably won't see my friend for the rest of the month...I don't think I could even look at her right now. Hopefully I'll feel better about the whole situation in a few weeks.
post #52 of 185
Quote:
Originally Posted by iamama View Post
I would be miffed that yet again I witness ignorance and fear beats science and fact.
Huh? Chicken pox CAN be dangerous for some people - and I don't vax for it. But like I said above, I was having a sick baby, and I didn't want my kids to get chicken pox right before she was born, so that they would be able to see her.

Not sure what is ignorant and fearful about that scenario...
post #53 of 185
Quote:
Originally Posted by rejoiceinlife View Post
The burden of proof is not on me to "prove" that the timeline the experts give is accurate. Bottom line.

Actually, the burden of proof is yours in a situation where you have knowingly exposed your child to chicken pox and will then be in contact with children/adults who DO NOT want to be exposed. If you have exposed yourself and cannot guarrantee that you are not contagoius on day 6, 8,l or whatever then you need to remain away from others who do not wish to be exposed until the infectious period has passed.
post #54 of 185
Well, here is what is says about when your kids are contagious.

Quote:
When and for how long is a person able to spread chickenpox?

A person is most able to transmit chickenpox from one to two days before the rash appears until all the blisters are dry and crusted. People with a weakened immune system may be contagious for a longer period of time.
In my experience (and I have lots of experience with Chicken Pox) the kids tend to break out between 10-14 days after being exposed. So, that means that IF your kids were exposed six days ago, they could be contagious in anywhere from two to five-ish days from day six. I think that's a chance some people just aren't willing to take.

YOU said it will have been only six days on the day of the party... but, other parents might not completely trust that. I know you can count.. and there is no reason to lie about it. But, some parents jump the gun a little, and may think you might have miscounted. (or rounded down)
post #55 of 185
OP, I'm a little confused you started this thread asking people if they agreed with you or thought maybe you were over reacting. Then when not everyone agreed with your point of view 100% you seemed to get angry or upset with them for not thinking the exact same way you do about this situation and said it didn't matter what other people thought. Which is it?
post #56 of 185
Quote:
Originally Posted by rejoiceinlife View Post
I would be perfectly fine with it if my kids came down with CP or measles or mumps randomly. Sure it might be a horrible time, I might have a young baby, whatever...part of life as far as I am concerned. Or at least, life as it used to be.



The burden of proof is not on me to "prove" that the timeline the experts give is accurate. Bottom line.



People seem to have the idea that's it's only possible to contract chicken pox if you are knowingly exposed to it by someone else. Many times parents have no idea where their kids contracted it! So I'd say it's part of life, and I do not believe "not vaccinating" means I'm obligated to quarantine my family any time they have been exposed to any vaccine-"preventable" illness. Aside from the fact that I am not exposing ANYONE to CP at this point.


You know, it doesn't really matter what anyone else thinks. I feel quite hurt about the whole situation, and that hurt only increases when someone snatches a child up and leaves when they see my kids because "his mom doesn't want him exposed to chicken pox". If it were up to me I'd go to my parents' in a different city for a week or two and leave the whole situation behind, but DH doesn't want that. At this point I would be perfectly happy not to go anywhere where I know anyone for the next couple of weeks. And I think it's just as well that I probably won't see my friend for the rest of the month...I don't think I could even look at her right now. Hopefully I'll feel better about the whole situation in a few weeks.
Re the bolded:
And people DIED. If you choose to risk yourself or your kids- that is your choice. You do NOT get to choose to willingly and knowingly expose anyone else.

Adults who have had CP are at risk for shingles. Ever had it? Ever known someone with it? Not fun. Ask my mom how fun it was when she got them in 2003 at the same time my dd died.

The burden is on you to NOT willingly and knowingly put others at risk for exposure without their prior knowledge and consent.

The attitude of entitlement and total lack of care for others choices is what gives non-vaxers a bad rap.

For the record- I don't vax. But I'll be damned if I want anyone but myself making the decision as to if and when I expose my children to something.
post #57 of 185
I would uninvite someone who has a cold and that is a lot less annoying to catch than chicken pox, though around here people cancel coming if they know they have even a mild illness that could spread to other kids. You exposed your kids to something that is generally quarantined, the fact that you are fine with them getting even more serious illnesses that require quarantine doesn't give you the right to decide to infect the world with chicken pox, mumps, measles, whooping cough or whatever else your kids have just so they can have birthday cake. I got chicken pox when I was five and I still vividly remember how horrible it was, I would never wish that on a child. I would be annoyed with someone choosing to expose my dd to a cold, irate if it was something worse like strep, chicken pox, whooping cough, or measles. I am surprised that you didn't choose to do the courteous thing and cancel going to the party to cut down on your risk of infecting another person, that is something that moms tend to do where I live. I bet your friend is just as annoyed by your lack of courtesy as you are at being uninvited. I suggest using the money you would have spent on a present to buy cupcakes, sickie food, and some movies to watch when your kids have full blown chicken pox. It is going to be a miserable few days for them.
post #58 of 185
Quote:
Originally Posted by rejoiceinlife View Post
Well I do know this: next time I expose my children to something, I will NOT be telling ANYONE.

And I feel like all this becomes a bigger issue when I now have the choice of avoiding every situation where I'd normally come in contact with any of these people for several weeks (and there are quite a few, church 2x/week, a volunteer thing this weekend, playgroups, etc), or simply going about my business as usual and letting people choose to absent themselves and their entire families (including adult males who have already had CP, which is ridiculous IMO) because we are there when they know my kids could not be contagious. Perhaps from the middle of next week on when they could be contagious I'll choose differently, but not right now. It's chicken pox, not small pox, and really, would people have been acting this way 10 years ago (or however long ago it was) before the CP vaccine? I cannot imagine people simply stopped sending their children to school and doing anything socially for months out of fear of contracting CP when it was going around unless there were some extremely compelling reason like a immune suppressed individual.
If you want to have this attitude toward your friends, fine, but I wouldn't be surprised if they stop inviting you anywhere at all. Then you won't have to worry about being uninvited.
post #59 of 185
You knowingly expose your children to an illness, you have to be willing to accept that other parents won't want to expose their children to yours until they feel comfortable about the illness not being passed on. I'm with a few of the PP's in that I would have uninvited my children my self in that situation. I would not be offended if they ask my children no attend either.

Quote:
Originally Posted by MommatoAandA View Post
I would have chosen to keep my kids home personally most likely, but wow, it's JUST CHICKEN POX PEOPLE?! I had them, my cousins, brother, family, we ALL HAD THEM. Why is this all of a sudden such a huge deal?
Why is it a big deal to some? DD's last birthday she invited someone from her class who was immuno-compromised. It would be a huge deal to that child's parents and it was a huge deal to us. We went out of our way to make sure that party was as safe an environment for that child as we possibly could and with the help of the other parents managed to pull of a party that all the kids enjoyed. I would have been royally PO'd if someone had though "Well it's just chicken pox, whats the big deal?" and came anyway. I would have also felt horribly guilty if the other child had caught something because another parent couldn't understand that something as simple as chicken pox or even the common cold is a big, potentially life threatening deal to someone else. You can't tell just by looking at someone who is at risk for these complications either.

I would have gone so far as to turn someone away at the door if their child was noticeably sick. It was right in the invitation "please do not have your child attend if they are sick, or been recently exposed to someone who is sick."
post #60 of 185
I wouldn't have been offended. The host has the right to make decisions about her own party, and about her knowing exposure to illness. Personally, I'm quite glad to have sick kids (cold, chickenpox, whatever) around me and my family. I don't think healthy human beings were ever meant to be cut off from illness through hygiene/isolation, and I have strong doubts that doing so is in our best interests from a health standpoint.

And, OP...wish you were close to me. I've tried to expose my kids to chickenpox twice and it still hasn't taken.

ETA: I do understand that different people have different comfort levels with this, so I'd probably have uninvited myself, in any case.
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