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husband vaccinated my 20 mo old - Page 5

post #81 of 129
Quote:
Originally Posted by Arduinna View Post
If you are supposedly trying to do what is best for your child, you at least educate yourself.
Is this really true, though? Or at least, does educating one's self look the same for everyone?

When I was expecting my first child (lo, these 16 years ago), I thought I was educating myself. I read Parents, Parenting and Child magazines. I even read Mothering magazine!

I talked with my chosen pediatrician and other mothers I respected... and I fully immunized my firstborn.

It's possible to read the anti-vaccine information and either reject it as paranoid hysteria or at best, decide that the pro-vaccine information is more compelling.

I believe that the compliance rate in my state is upwards of 85%. Some of the non-vaccinators just haven't gotten around to it, can't afford it, don't have transportation, etc...

There is a small percentage of us who actively choose not to vaccinate because of our concerns with the long term implications of altering one's immune system, especially with suspect ingredients.

But I wouldn't go so far as to call those 85% uneducated or not trying to do their best by their children. This issue is so complex. Neither side can prove that they are absolutely, 100% "right". I've been studying, discussing, praying about this for almost 20 years and I still wonder if I'm making the best decision. My firstborn is fully immunized (by 1994 standards) and each subsequent child has gotten fewer and fewer vaccines until we reach my toddler, who has not had any.

Again, I think that this husband took a very wrong approach. I doubt that anyone here thinks it was appropriate for him to do this behind his wife's back. I truly hope that they can work on healing from this and in the future, how to make decisions when they disagree.

Quote:
If you would divorce him otherwise, then really, should you let your kids witness a relationship like that?
I would want my children to witness that a marriage can hit really hard times and the couple can work through them with success. Love, commitment, sorrow/forgiveness, growth in respect and improvement in communication... these are all qualities that I want my children to see in action.
post #82 of 129
Quote:
Originally Posted by maizy View Post
EIGHT SEPERATE NEEDLES! and all the toxins, animals products and filth.
I'd be running out of there as fast as possible. He not only did it behind your back, he then didn't tell you?!

Quote:
Originally Posted by earthmama369 View Post
The way he went about it is what would be the deal breaker to me. If I couldn't protect my child while married, I don't see much point in staying married to someone who felt it was appropriate to treat myself and my child that way.
Exactly this. It obviously doesn't make a difference whether she's around or not, because he went behind her back. I could never, ever stay with a man who respected and cared about me so little as to do something like that. *gag*
post #83 of 129
Quote:
Originally Posted by VillageMom6 View Post
Is this really true, though? Or at least, does educating one's self look the same for everyone?

When I was expecting my first child (lo, these 16 years ago), I thought I was educating myself. I read Parents, Parenting and Child magazines. I even read Mothering magazine!

I talked with my chosen pediatrician and other mothers I respected... and I fully immunized my firstborn.

It's possible to read the anti-vaccine information and either reject it as paranoid hysteria or at best, decide that the pro-vaccine information is more compelling.

I believe that the compliance rate in my state is upwards of 85%. Some of the non-vaccinators just haven't gotten around to it, can't afford it, don't have transportation, etc...

There is a small percentage of us who actively choose not to vaccinate because of our concerns with the long term implications of altering one's immune system, especially with suspect ingredients.

But I wouldn't go so far as to call those 85% uneducated or not trying to do their best by their children. This issue is so complex. Neither side can prove that they are absolutely, 100% "right". I've been studying, discussing, praying about this for almost 20 years and I still wonder if I'm making the best decision. My firstborn is fully immunized (by 1994 standards) and each subsequent child has gotten fewer and fewer vaccines until we reach my toddler, who has not had any.

Again, I think that this husband took a very wrong approach. I doubt that anyone here thinks it was appropriate for him to do this behind his wife's back. I truly hope that they can work on healing from this and in the future, how to make decisions when they disagree.


I would want my children to witness that a marriage can hit really hard times and the couple can work through them with success. Love, commitment, sorrow/forgiveness, growth in respect and improvement in communication... these are all qualities that I want my children to see in action.
I really liked your post especially the bolded part. So true. If this couple can resolve this issue and come out the better for it, they probably have a stronger marriage than most of us, as is obvious by the number of people who would have already been gone. I would not consider divorce over this (unless he plans to do this again) because I don't think he did it with malicious intent (to make you upset by going against your wishes for example). That would have been totally different. I also feel he caved to pressure, didn't know his options, that he could say no, I only want the polio one, etc.

I would try to help him understand why this could have been dangerous for your son, and what could have been done to decrease the chance for any reactions if you only would have known in advance. I think you can work this out.
post #84 of 129
Quote:
Originally Posted by VillageMom6 View Post
IsThis issue is so complex. Neither side can prove that they are absolutely, 100% "right". I've been studying, discussing, praying about this for almost 20 years and I still wonder if I'm making the best decision. My firstborn is fully immunized (by 1994 standards) and each subsequent child has gotten fewer and fewer vaccines until we reach my toddler, who has not had any.

Again, I think that this husband took a very wrong approach. I doubt that anyone here thinks it was appropriate for him to do this behind his wife's back. I truly hope that they can work on healing from this and in the future, how to make decisions when they disagree.


I would want my children to witness that a marriage can hit really hard times and the couple can work through them with success. Love, commitment, sorrow/forgiveness, growth in respect and improvement in communication... these are all qualities that I want my children to see in action.
Totally agree with this. Very thoughtful.
post #85 of 129
Wow, very shocking. Maybe your MIL had some influence to his decision? Maybe he felt pressured my everyone around him telling him that all children should get vaxed? I think that you and your husband really need to go to counseling. It's not okay to make major decisions about your child without the consent of the other parent, especially about your child's health and well being! Your husband should be ashamed about going behind your back and putting your son's health into his hands without even caring about your strong personal belief to not vax.
post #86 of 129
[QUOTE=lilmissmommy;15617622] It's not okay to make major decisions about your child without the consent of the other parent, especially about your child's health and well being! QUOTE]

Just being the devil's advocate here...couldn't the father make the same argument?

I very much agree he should not have vaccinated the baby under these circumstances. I also can see where he might have believed he was helping his baby and his opinion was not being heard. I do realize he was given reading material but maybe that's not his learning style. I could see my husband thinking I was being condescending unless I was careful with my phrasing as I handed over a packet to be read before I would discuss anything further with him.

Sorry that you're having to deal with all this. I'm not saying the way you handled the discussion was incorrect. I'm just a little shocked at all the divorce advice.
post #87 of 129
Quote:
Originally Posted by maizy View Post
I am livid and I totally agree with much of your posts. I feel like divorcing him. I mean clearly there are other issues here. He constantly makes decisions without discussing with me but never to this severity. I did tell him last night this was a "deal breaker" but he has me in check mate. He is a loving dad. My sons adore him, I hate divorce. My kids will suffer if we are not together. If we did not have kids I would NOT be with him but we have kids and like someone mentioned in the post he could still do things w/o my ok.
mama i dont know how old your other kids are.

but the bolded reason is the reason why i would divorce him.

totally.

my children would suffer more in a different way - watching a relationship which really isnt one. where there is no truth. no communication.

vaccinating in your case is just the symptom, not the 'disease'.

but if i was thinking of leaving or even contemplating that i have had enough of this - the whole issue of how this was done would be the last straw on the camels back.

i am not asking you to divorce.

but look at the dynamics of what YOU want. YOU YOU YOU. you owe that to your kids.

however know i come from a single perspective myself. i walked out of mine. and it is the best thing i could have done for my dd. she has an adoring father. and an adoring mother. we just dont live in the same house.
post #88 of 129
I'm not sure which is worse - the 8 vaccines or the betrayal by the husband.

Does he at least regret the decision? Does he understand the amount of toxins that the vaccines have deposited in his son's body? Or is he still glad he did it?
post #89 of 129
After reading through this thread, I'm not sure which is worse, either... the 8 vaccinations at once, the betrayal of the husband, or the fact that so many people are offering up their advice to the OP to divorce her husband without even really knowing either of them.

I think it would be respectful of the OP to let her make the judgements about her life and where she wants to go with her marriage without our interference, however well-intentioned.

She didn't start this thread to ask us whether or not she should divorce her husband - as I understand it, she needed a place where she could find a shoulder to cry on and somebody who could relate to what she is feeling.

Let's try to be there for her and not add to her distress by suggesting the normal thing to do would be a divorce.
post #90 of 129
Try to understand why he did this. He did not do this to HURT you, he did not think "say, I'd like to really betray my wife", he consciously made the choice to go behind your back because you wouldn't back down and he thought he was acting in the best interest of his child. NO loving parent goes and sticks needles in his kid for kicks, he obviously thought he was doing the right thing. And to be fair, if YOU thought that there was something (other than vaccinating) to be done for the safety of your child, and your husband wouldn't budge, wouldn't you do the same thing? You know that parent feeling, your child's safety comes before ANYTHING else, it's just an instinct. But don't misunderstand me, you should feel hurt by it (and I really am sorry that you have to deal with this), but if you take a deep breath and ask yourself, is this the end of the world? I hope the answer is no. Hopefully you can have a gentle discussion, get some counseling, and move on. Forgiving and letting go (while not ignoring the issues that need to be worked out), is one of the most freeing things you can do for YOU. From what I've read you're staying in this relationship, bitterness & anger will do you no good. They are valid feelings that indicate a problem, and I hope you can resolve it gently for everyone's sake. It's hard to see when you're in the swamp, but this IS green grass on the other side! Hugs mama.
post #91 of 129
In post 59, amnesiac explained why every vaccine for his age group was given, instead of just the polio vaccine that the husband supposedly asked for. It's because the Texas health department uses VFC (Vaccines For Children), a federal vaccine program that requires that kids be completely brought up to date on a visit. If you go to the Texas health department for vaccines, you absolutely cannot pick and choose.

That said, of course the husband should have gotten up and run when he heard that. I'm sure the OP would have gladly paid out of pocket for a single polio shot at a doctor's office rather than her toddler get every vaccine on the schedule.
--------------------------------------------
Edit: Hmm, this is weird. I did some undercover work (lol) and called one of the regional health departments in Texas, that gives vaccines to children. I asked if I would be allowed to come in and just get the polio vaccine for my unvaccinated 2 year old. The nurse said, "Why would you want to get the polio vaccine? There is no risk of your child getting polio." I said, "Um, I guess I need to do more research." (OK, that was embarrassing). I then asked her if I would be allowed to come in and get just the DTaP. She said of course I could. I said, "But someone told me that you participate in Vaccines For Children, a federal program that requires that all the vaccines are given." She said I was the parent, and got to choose.

So now I don't know what to think. I'm sure it depends on the particular office whether you get a nasty nurse or not (this one was nice). But now I'm thinking that there may be some flexibility with the federal VFC program. Like maybe it's not *absolutely* required to get all the vaccines. Of course, it's very likely the husband was told it *was* required.
post #92 of 129
[QUOTE=SC_Jan;15618888]
Quote:
Originally Posted by lilmissmommy View Post
It's not okay to make major decisions about your child without the consent of the other parent, especially about your child's health and well being! QUOTE]

Just being the devil's advocate here...couldn't the father make the same argument?

I very much agree he should not have vaccinated the baby under these circumstances. I also can see where he might have believed he was helping his baby and his opinion was not being heard. I do realize he was given reading material but maybe that's not his learning style. I could see my husband thinking I was being condescending unless I was careful with my phrasing as I handed over a packet to be read before I would discuss anything further with him.

Sorry that you're having to deal with all this. I'm not saying the way you handled the discussion was incorrect. I'm just a little shocked at all the divorce advice.
I'm shocked by the divorce advice also. What he did was wrong, but he is a loving father.
post #93 of 129
^ Did you guys miss the part where she stated that if they didn't have kids, she wouldn't still be married to him?

Sounds like there are a lot of other things going on in the marriage than "just vaccinating" the child. Not only are they lacking communication, but there will probably be trust issues, etc.

This vaccinating was not the problem in the marriage...just one more symptom of the other problems that are in the marriage.
post #94 of 129
Please remember that this forum hosts discussions specifically pertaining to vaccine issues. Marriage discussions are hosted in Parents as Partners.

Please continue any further discussion regarding marital issues in general either privately or in PasP. Should the discussion continue to stray, the thread will be closed.
post #95 of 129
How did you not notice where the injections were given? Did you not change his diaper for a few days?
post #96 of 129
Hoping you feeling a bit better....

How's your lo doing?
post #97 of 129
Oh wow. My husband and I initially disagreed on vaccines but he would never have done this.

To me the issues are:

1) Refused to discuss with you even though lines of communication were open
2) Went behind your back and lied

I would have been upset with my husband if he announced, "You know what, I know you're anti-vax, but I'm not, I want to keep our daughter safe, so I'm taking her in." Upset, yeah. And I would try really hard to prevent it. But I wouldn't consider it betrayal. That's honest, open, adult communication and decisions. His right to decide as much as mine.

But to ignore the discussion? And then just do it and lie about it? Insane. I don't know whether I'd divorce (because of the kids) but I'd consider the marriage over as far as being between him and me.
post #98 of 129
If it were me...I honestly don't think my husband would have been able to walk after I found out about this....I'd also have a good chance of being in jail with assault charges being filed...

I can't imagine someone doing such a thing against their spouses wishes! Husbands and wives should not lie, cover up things, or ignore each other in such a fashion. Something is VERY wrong here. The vax thing is awful and I would be livid, but I couldn't stay with someone who could do something like this against my wishes...and then not even let me know afterward so I could make sure my child was okay!
post #99 of 129
Quote:
Originally Posted by maizy View Post
EIGHT SEPERATE NEEDLES! and all the toxins, animals products and filth.
Sorry to dissent, but this is not the act of a loving father. Clearly he did not research because nothing supports giving this many vaccines in one incident. I pray your child does not have any long term problems. I would divorce someone over this. Just making those choices and ignoring my voice as a co-parent would be enough.
post #100 of 129
I can easily see how someone who hadn't read anything about vaccinations, had grown up thinking they were good, preventative measures, and who (like me) is easily swayed by insistent medical "professionals" into doing something they're not comfortable with could have been pushed into a position where, in the moment, getting all those vaccinations seemed like the "right" decision. This hardly makes someone worth divorcing. To me, the fact that he hid it from you may indicate that he realizes he got bullied into it and doesn't want to own up to something that might have been a mistake. I mean, think of the "I-told-you-so" he'd be in for!

Of course, this is just speculation on my part. You know best whether the above situation is likely. I just encourage you to seek counseling on this breech of trust (together would be best, but individual counseling is invaluable as well if he won't agree to go). A separation might be a good way to show him you're serious about the trust issue. A divorce is the last option. For me, divorce is for abuse & infidelity. If this trust issue is really a symptom of emotional abuse where he constantly invalidates your feelings and positions through his condescention and actions - then perhaps divorce should be on the table. If it's not, then I wouldn't put it on the table no matter how betrayed I felt by his actions. This may not be your feeling about divorce - I'm just trying to offer counter-argument and a different perspective to all the divorce-him-immediately talk.
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