Both parents full time students?

[Ianthe]

I received a full tuition scholarship at a university where we had to move to a new town so that I could attend this school. DH was onboard with moving and me going to school full time, but also decided he wanted to start a year long masters program. He originally told me that he could/would do an online program for his masters so I was totally cool with it- so that he could be home with our super easy going one year old while I was at the university (our 3 yr old is going to be going to preschool). Now he informed me that he doesn't want to do the online program and intends to take in-person classes instead (which I am really mad about now, to tell you the truth). Now i don't know what to do.. I didn't want to put my one year old in daycare, they don't have a campus daycare to put him in.. we can't really afford a nanny or babysitter either.. if we did this DH will have to get additional student loans to cover the cost.

Is this possible? Is anyone doing this? I am feeling really dupped right now, and also that he is kind of stealing my thunder and not respecting the original intention of our move (being that I got a full scholarship to complete my degree). We were totally stuck and not going anywhere where we were, and I am the one that got us out of our situation and having a purpose.. I worked really really hard to get awesome grades (3.8 GPA) with 2 babies to take care of, and I don't think he is seeing that.

Anyway.. HE already has 25k in student loans and I really didn't want to rack up more.. but he is pretty much insisting that he go to grad school and I really don't have any say in the matter. I would feel much better about him doing the online program but it seams like that is out of the window now.

What would you do? What do you think?

[SoulCakes]

Hmm. This is really tough. On the one hand, I strongly feel that major decisions like whether or not to stay at home, how child care will be organized, whether someone is going to change jobs, etc., are joint decisions, not something to be made last-minute or without the enthusiastic consent of both partners. Your DH deciding NOT to stay at home with the baby--requiring child care for a very wee little one--is a MAJOR decision, and I think you guys should talk it out thoroughly. Can he wait and do the MA (MS?) is a year or more? Why now?

I would hazard a guess that his answer to that question is no, now! He's probably enthused about your schooling and feels motivated to get back on the academic slide. I would probably feel that way, too. Or maybe he found a really awesome program that is available to him now that you moved that he couldn't have pursued before. That's fine.

But what I would make sure of is that:

1. He really does want to do this particular academic program. It's not a passing flight of fancy. He's had an interest in this field for a while and is sure that it's what he wants--and needs--to do.

2. The MA/S does have real-world payoffs (i.e., career boost, greater income, he's going to further his education in that field).

3. He can't reasonably put if off until your little one is a year or two older. The agreement was that he would stay home. That's a huge thing to reneg on. He needs to show compelling reasons for doing it now (like an immediate, massive boost in income, basically).

As far as whether or not a two-student-parent family can work, of course it can. My ex and I juggled our <1yo daughter for a year while we finished up our degrees. We took classes at opposite schedules so that we didn't need to pay for childcare. Alternately, but more difficult to obtain in my experience, there's on-site university daycare. It was cheap but too popular (we never made it off the wait list). You also have to juggle study time with all the routines of the home. Not the most fun in the world, but not the least, either.

Student loans: beware. This is an even bigger reason to make sure he REALLY wants (needs) this program. If nothing else, make sure the master's program will increase his income enough to pay off the additional student loans.

On the other hand, I'm all for everyone going as far with their education as they want. BUT. Parents are not your average college student. There are far more responsibilities to be navigated. You can both do it, just make sure it's worth it.

Best of luck.

[Drummer's Wife]

Can he take evening classes? Or can you two schedule your classes so you only need childcare 1 day a week? Would he take at least half of his classes online?

I'm sorry you are frustrated. I would be, too. I have been going to school part-time for the past year, online, and start full-time on-campus courses next month. My DH has mentioned wanting to go back to school at some point, but is content with waiting until I graduate. He also has to work to support our family, so unless he did evening/weekend or online courses while keeping his job, it wouldn't be possible.

There are families that make it work, but I imagine they have help like free child-care from grandparents or don't see each other often b/c they are working and going to school opposite each other to avoid daycare costs. It's possible, sure - but probably not ideal unless you have a lot of help and financial stability.

[SoulCakes]

Sorry, just re-read your post and realized that you said there's no on-site daycare.

Also, I got a feeling reading it a second time that you're a little resentful of the fact that he's not acknowledging that this move is all about you. Maybe that's not how you really feel, but I can see how you might, and it's understandable. You worked really hard to get where you are. But at the same time, he might be picking up on that attitude, and it might be fueling his this-is-all-my-decision approach to his own education. It's really not all about you, or him. You'll both have to figure out what's best for all of you.

[Ianthe]

Originally Posted by SoulCakes

But what I would make sure of is that:

1. He really does want to do this particular academic program. It's not a passing flight of fancy. He's had an interest in this field for a while and is sure that it's what he wants--and needs--to do.

2. The MA/S does have real-world payoffs (i.e., career boost, greater income, he's going to further his education in that field).

3. He can't reasonably put if off until your little one is a year or two older. The agreement was that he would stay home. That's a huge thing to reneg on. He needs to show compelling reasons for doing it now (like an immediate, massive boost in income, basically).

This is a program that he really does want, yes. It is Masters of Natural Resources and he believes it will help him get the kind of job he really wants (forest service or blm). I think with a MNR wages start around 50k a year.

I know he doesn't want to put it off because he wants to start making better money to support our family. That is great! However, i think he is being selfish by not doing the online program for the sake of our family. I cannot take online classes for my program, I don't have the choice to. I did take online classes at the community college for the sake of our children, however.

I scheduled my classes for fall around my 3 yr olds preschool hours, with the belief that dh would be home with our 1 yo during those hours. They don't have a variety of classes with different times so I can't just take them all one or 2 days a week or I would.

---

I don't want it to sound all about me. I am totally ok with him doing a masters, but he told me he would and could do it online. Of course we discussed me applying to and attending this university before we did it. And unfortunately, it meant a move away from family who could potentially help with babysitting.

DH is very, very stubborn so if he makes up his mind about something I pretty much have no say in it I guess that is an issue for Parents as partners though! I just don't know what to do from here

NAK

[Ianthe]

I'm also kind of feeling like there are gender issues here too.. for example, I would be totally expected to fully support my husband if he was accepted into a great program with a full scholarship, and it meant a move with the family. I would be required or expected to watch my children and if I wanted to take classes I would be expected to do them around his schedule or online.

He didn't decide to start a grad program until after we decided to make this move (yes, for my education). Why can't he be expected to give me the same support that would be expected of me?

/rant.

[Bluebird9]

v

Edited by Bluebird9 - 11/27/11 at 10:07am

[Ianthe]

The in-person degree is the exact same thing! The only difference is online or in-person. He only wants to go to the in-person classes because he wants the inclass discussions. Which I totally understand, but I took several of my CC classes online, even though I really wanted to do it in person so that I could be home as much as possible with my family, I don't see why he can't do the same!

I wish I knew why he was being so stubborn! He is always so stubborn though, and I don't know what I can do about it.

[oceane]

how does your DH suggest your family organizes childcare? Since he won't be available as he said he would be, he must have thought of a solution? It would be unfair if now you also had to solve that problem!

[SoulCakes]

Originally Posted by oceane

how does your DH suggest your family organizes childcare? Since he won't be available as he said he would be, he must have thought of a solution? It would be unfair if now you also had to solve that problem!

It sounds like student loans are the proposed solution, which is not a great way to go.

Honestly, I took a few online courses, too, and the online discussions (though not real-time) were much more lengthy, involved, and well-thought-out than any in-person courses. People had time to mull the material over, respond, mull it over some more, respond again. I thought it was fab.

I think the bottom line is that he can't, as half of a partnership, make a unilateral decision here. You and he discussed the possibility of your move and why you would do it. Fair. You discussed childcare. Fair. I assume you didn't just say, "This is what I'm doing. You can either go along with it or stay here!" It's not fair of him to decide that, oh, wait, he WON'T be staying home with the baby. Too bad!

My 2 cents: I would propose that he either do the online course or wait until next year (when baby is older) to do the in-person course. Or say that if HE can arrange HIS courses so that you don't require additional childcare, then fine.

I love education, so I hate to sound like it's all on him to compromise, but since he has the option of online courses, you don't, and that was what you BOTH agreed to beforehand, then he doesn't really have any options. No one gets everything they want.

Regarding gender roles... yeah. I hear you. That was one of the main reasons my ex and I divorced. It was all about him, and while he didn't really make it that way (although he did refuse to move for my education, something he had promised for years... so maybe he did make it that way), because he was the man our families fell in line behind him. OF COURSE I would try to fit in my courses around his career. OF COURSE I would somehow figure out childcare (and that why I have this massive amount of student loan debt--don't recommend it).

Anyway, you have my sympathy.

[Ianthe]

Originally Posted by SoulCakes

My 2 cents: I would propose that he either do the online course or wait until next year (when baby is older) to do the in-person course. Or say that if HE can arrange HIS courses so that you don't require additional childcare, then fine.

I wrote him a big long email yesterday (sometimes discussing in person doesn't get us anywhere) and basically said this. He is also planning on going to the Family and Human Studies building to make sure they don't have childcare there, and if they do; how we can get DS2 in there. I would much prefer that if he is in childcare that it is an on-campus facility, run by students who try really hard to be attentive to children and babies (and I could take nursing breaks between classes). We'll see.

As it is, I cannot rearrange my schedule to fit his needs (wants)... My program only offers one class at a certain time every other semester. I worked really hard to try to get all my classes during 9-2, my son's preschool hours.

[oceane]

lizzy, I hope he'll figure something out!

[nolansmummy]

Both my dh and I have been full time students for three years now. Up until now we've made it work by just staggering our school schedule so someone always is available with the kids. It has been hard, lots of driving back and forth etc. but it was free. Now, we are putting dd in 3day preschool and ds is in 1st grade.

Is there any way he can take a night course or a weekend course or just take classes when you will be home?It doesn't really seem right that he can just make this decision without discussing it with you. Have you asked him about what he thinks will happen with your kids while you both are at school? (Or was it him who suggested the student loans?)

[Ianthe]

Originally Posted by oceane

lizzy, I hope he'll figure something out!

Thank you

Originally Posted by nolansmummy

Is there any way he can take a night course or a weekend course or just take classes when you will be home?It doesn't really seem right that he can just make this decision without discussing it with you. Have you asked him about what he thinks will happen with your kids while you both are at school? (Or was it him who suggested the student loans?)

I looked at the classes available in person for his program and they are all the same time as mine.. unfortunately, the only night courses available are general studies courses and not a whole lot of program specific ones. He thinks it is perfectly acceptable to be able to put DS2 (1 yo) into childcare, and I'm not really thrilled about it. He was the one who suggested the student loans to cover it, but we have our other living expenses to take care of (My grant money will cover about 80% of our rent, and we need to cover the rest, plus utilities and gas money, etc).

[Ravin]

l would look for a good quality licensed child care provider and apply for food stamps, medicaid, and childcare assistance in order to minimize the amount of money you have to take out in loans. Set a budget ahead of time, factoring in your bills and expenses and school costs, and take only the loans needed to meet the budget.

We'll be in the 2-student-parent boat a little over a year from now, as DH is starting his freshman year of college this fall and if all goes as planned I'll be starting law school Fall 2011. New baby will be 5 or 6 months old when I start school, and we homeschool our older daughter who will be in 3rd grade when I start back to school, so it's really going to take some juggling. I plan on using the flex enrollment option if I get into the law school I want (at the same uni DH is attending). If needs be, we will find child care; preferably we'll be able to hand baby off to each other on campus, attend class different days, or something along those lines. Options may be limited, though, because both our tracks only have so many open classes we need, and there's a possibility they'll overlap. Our Uni has some subsidies available for childcare (or did when I went there), but only one subsidized childcare facility takes infants (with a long wait list), and none of them take school-aged children, so it's possible the baby will be in childcare while DD spends the occasional hour on her own in a reasonably safe place (a study lounge near one of our classes, perhaps) doing "homework" (defined in our house as any schoolwork she does on her own). I could also see hiring a student to watch them for x hours a week on campus (perfect job for an early childhood or elem ed major).

I'm assuming things will all work out somehow. They generally do.

Really explore your options, get whatever assistance you can find, and then see where you're at.

[~D~]

Subbing for now, will post more later.
I feel your frustration, mama.

[Sierra]

Has anyone ever faced anything like the following? I know the situation is unique and this is a longshot, but I could use some tips:

I am moving from MA to CT to go to Yale for grad school next year. I'm currently the full-time breadwinner and dw, who never received her undergrad, has limited earning potential. I think I've posted about this before. Anyway, we own our home in MA and our realtor is not hopeful about us being able to sell it.

We may be able to find someone to rent our MA home for around the same amount we pay in mortgage, probably less. My plan for that scenario is that I take some money from my taxes this spring and use that through the year to cover any difference between the mortgage and rental income plus any necessary repairs, etc.

Then in CT, we have the challenge of starting up anew. I have a full tuition scholarship (there is a chance it will be reduced next year, as I have taken a one-year deferment and have to reapply, but I am trying not to worry about that). This leaves the cost of living, plus school fees, books, and medical.

I probably can stash away money, again from taxes next spring, in advance to help with my first year's worth of school fees and books. Not sure what I will do after that.

I am hoping that we will qualify for the state medical program, Husky. I haven't figured it out exactly yet.

If I can take care of those things that way, the challenge that is left over is living expenses. I am really trying to avoid student loans. This is especially important to me because both my children have special needs, but in particular my ds may have long term care needs and it will not be a good idea for me to get into debt just in case. To date, I have stayed entirely out of debt with the exception only of my mortgage.

It looks like we should be able to secure some kind of housing, with a lot of effort and probably by downsizing into a dorm-style apartment building owned by the grad school, that includes utilities and costs about $1300 per month. As long as we are successful in doing so, we can downsize to just one car (selling our other car will hopefully get me enough cash for a laptop...it isn't worth much). I'd love to go car-free, but dw's parents are aging poorly and live in MA, and she really depends on being able to go there to help out on a regular basis. Insurance should be cheaper than $100/month, we're hoping, and I'll throw another $100 in for gas. So that's $1500. Since utilities would be included hopefully in our apartment, this means we should be able to get by with about $2000/month. Or is there something I am not thinking about?

This would mean that dw and I would each need to earn $1000. I am considering, however, that I may not be able to manage a professional job while in school. Doing work, like I do currently, in which I end up "taking my work home with me" on mental and emotional levels, takes a lot of energy. So if I work, I feel like I should do something that is mindless, and preferably something that might even allow me to study during work hours (parking attendant at a slow parking garage, like my dw did a number of years ago, or night security in an office building, for example). Alternatively, I keep thinking how great it would be if we could find a way for dw to go back to school, probably not full-time, but part-time anyway. And I really wish there was some way to keep myself from having to work more than a minimal work-study position so I could actually focus on school. I have a learning disability that makes school extra challenging, and while I was able to maintain a 4.0 in undergrad, I am not sure I can do that and care for the kids now. The only ways I can think of to get by with minimal paid-jobs would be to either take out the loan and risk my ability to care for ds later, to miraculously find a scholarship for which I qualify and am accepted that covers all living expenses, or to seek state assistance. We could probably do it if we worked some and additionally got section 8 housing and food stamps.

Some issues. Just looked up section 8 housing vouchers and they are not even accepting applications at this time due to the length of the waiting list. My other problems are (1) I can't apply for assistance until I am living in CT, but all my decisions center around my eligibility for help, and (2) The house we currently own is a big issue in getting help. It is considered an asset, even though we can't live in it once we move to CT, and it is going to be bleeding money if we have to find a renter due to the bad market. Once we put in our rental income, we'll exceed income limits even though that money will get flipped straight into our mortgage and still not be enough to cover the entire cost.

What can we do?

[Ianthe]

Sierra,
Will you qualify for pell grants? That is where the majority of our living expenses will come from, which is about $5500 a year.. you bring up a good point with the tax return money as well, that will probably have to pay for my summer school and living expenses. We usually try to take a small family trip with some of it too (travel is our special treat to keep our sanity!).

If you think it would be good for your dw to start an undergrad program she should probably wait until you are citizens in CT so that tuition rates are lower for her. There are lots of scholarships out there for women who have a large break in between highschool/GED and college, and then she will also get pell grant money for living expenses. Even without scholarships, at my CC, going full time, I received about $2000 in pell grants after tuition and fees were paid.

You could totally sell your car if you lived in student housing.. you wouldn't need 2 cars if you are living so close.

I don't know what else I can tell you, besides, CONGRATS on your scholarship!

[Sierra]

That's a really good point. If memory serves, Pell grants are not available for grad school, only undergrad, but that would be one more argument for dw going back to school. Hmmm.