doc just told me my 4 mo. son needs circ

[prairiebird]

Um, I'm kind of freaking out here, because I did my research and although my oldest two boys are circumcised, my current infant son is not. I have had no problems at all. He's seen the same doctor off and on since birth. We went in for a 4 month check up and she says, "You have to take him to get circumcised. See how small the hole is for his urethra? It's shrinking and soon the foreskin will be too tight and it will close and he'll need emergency surgery or have kidney problems from urine backing up."

I was really kind of floored since I've had no problems with her prior to this. She went on to give me info about how his risk for cancer is increased with a foreskin and how there are many problems and frequent infections. When I asked her why I'm seeing more information regarding keeping boys intact, she denied this and said that everyone still recommends this.

She made an appointment for me with a urologist next month.

Now first of all, has anyone even heard of this shrinking opening thing? Because this obviously scares me, but the rest of her information sounded like a bunch of misinformation and scare tactics. I'm just shocked though to hear this from her. I switched doctors last year because that one was horrid, and was happy to find this new one. Now I'm worried. And I don't want the baby hurt either way, with an unnecessary circ on an older infant, nor because I didn't act soon enough on this narrowing hole thing she's claiming.

Should I go to the urologist appointment just to ease my mind about it? I'm wondering if he'd be a bit less drastic about things. I was also thinking that I should let the baby have some naked time and watch his urine stream since I haven't seen it in a while (he never pees during diaper changes and he's usually submerged in his bath.) His diapers still seem full. In fact, I was just complaining that I'll have to strip them again because they're leaking.

[jocelyndale]

Find another ped, preferably one without a vendetta against normal genitalia.

Seriously, she's wrong. She shouldn't be messing with his foreskin at all. His foreskin shouldn't retract at his age. When he urinates, the sphincter at the end of his foreskin will dilate. After he's done peeing, it will close again. The opening will likely only be obvious while he's peeing at this age.

Don't go to the urologist--there's not a problem here other than your pediatrician being dangerously pro-circ.

[dianakaye]

Yeah, you're doctor sounds a little bit 'off' to me. I've never heard of a hole closing up. Plus, even if the hole needed to be a little bigger, is it really necessary to amputate the entire foreskin? Seems like there would be other solutions if that really were the case (which I doubt).

The cancer thing is so ridiculous it's not even funny. The risk of penile cancer is so minimal, he's more likely to have breast cancer than penile cancer. Infections are rare and easily treated with antibiotics, not surgery. She sounds ridiculously pro-circ. Frankly, I'd change doctors if I were you. Has she been retracting him? I wouldn't be surprised because she seems to not know a thing about intact penises.

[glongley]

Wow. What ignorance. I would be looking for another doctor for your son. This woman seems to know nothing of the intact penis (i.e. it's normal for the foreskin outlet to be tight and appear very small in a young child), and her enthusiasm for the supposed medical benefits of circumcision shows her anti-intact bias. The "shrinking opening" scare is completely unfounded. As long as your son is peeing normally (yes you could have a look when he's uncovered, but really just having good wet diapers and no pain is all the confirmation you need), basically everything you've described is NORMAL. I.e. no need for panic, no need for referral to a urologist.

You can read about normal foreskin development here:
http://www.cirp.org/library/normal/

You can read about some of the reasons that ill-informed doctors sometimes give for why a boy "needs" to be circumcised, and why its virtually never so:
http://www.mothering.com/health/prot...advice-parents

There's lots more that could be explained about this, but the short answer is, don't panic, you son's penis is just fine - and start looking for another doctor.

Gillian

[IndigoKoi]

Wow.... I have never heard of anyone saying anything about a shrinking meatus on an un-circumcised penis. I'm currently in nursing school, and though I'm no doctor or expert, they have never mentioned anything of the sort during class or during clinical rotations in the hospital. The frame of mind of professors and also of the nurses/doctors I've met in the hospitals is that it is totally up to the parents on what there preference is, and one is not necessarily healthier (in terms of infections, etc) than the other.

I know you have the urologist appointment, but is it also possible for you to find another ped for a second opinion? I definitely wouldn't do ANYTHING until I had at least a second opinion and fully researched the issue your current ped is proposing. And if your baby seems to be having normal wet diapers, and doesn't seem distressed with his urination, I really would not be inclined to believe what your pediatrician is saying.

I've done some quick research just now, and perhaps these two sites may give you some more information. Your ped probably thinks your child has phimosis, but it's really natural and normal for an un-circed penis to have a smaller opening.

http://www.vascularsurgicalexpertise...cumcision.html

http://www.mothersnature.com/toddler...safeguard.html

[ElliesMomma]

what doctor makes an appointment FOR YOU for a urologist? unheard of in my experience. the most i ever got for a referral to a specialist was them giving me a printout with some recommended names.

is there any chance that this ped. is driving "business" to the urologist (i.e., all intact boys, she sends to him for circumcision, and perhaps benefits in some way monitarily?)

if I were you, i would definitely do the naked time and watch him pee. if it's a good strong stream, do NOTHING. cancel that urologist appointment. start seeing a new pediatrician -- someone outside of that practice. start all over with a new ped. at your son's 6 month appointment and SAY NOTHING about the previous comment re: your son's "narrowing hole." see if the new doctor picks up on this "condition" (WITHOUT your "prompting"). if the new doc doesn't see it, then it really is bosh. if on the other hand the new doc sees it too, then maybe it is worth investigating... without the expectation of getting a full circumcision.

let us know how this turns out!

ps: do not go to the urologist for a second opinion. he will already be ready to do the circ., and may even "force" you to submit your son to it right then and there. horrible things like that have happened, according to other people who have posted on these boards. it could be done on your son with no pain relief even. do not trust the urologist. he is a SURGEON. surgeons do surgery.

if you cannot for some reason find a new pediatrician, i'd say see a "family doctor" and, again, do NOT prompt the doctor by mentioning this previous "diagnosis" -- just see if the new doctor comes up with it on his own.

good for you, momma, for protecting your son!

[SashaBreeze]

to everything everyone has said thus far.

I just wanted to add one thing though. I would NOT go see the urologist that the ped recommended and scheduled you with. For one thing it is unnecessary but most importantly most doctors tend to recommend and work with like minded dr's. I shudder to think what the urologist that dr. would recommend would do and want to do to your little boy.

[A&A]

Originally Posted by jocelyndale

Find another ped, preferably one without a vendetta against normal genitalia.

Seriously, she's wrong. She shouldn't be messing with his foreskin at all. His foreskin shouldn't retract at his age. When he urinates, the sphincter at the end of his foreskin will dilate. After he's done peeing, it will close again. The opening will likely only be obvious while he's peeing at this age.

Don't go to the urologist--there's not a problem here other than your pediatrician being dangerously pro-circ.

If he can pee, he's fine.

[tennisdude23]

Everyone recommends circumcision? Uhmm, totally untrue. Most of the world does not circumcise, and no single medical society recommends it. Please print some pamphlets for her and change doctors. Kids at that age have really tiny openings. That's normal. You would know if he would be having trouble with urination, and no the foreskin opening just cannot close up and fuse together. I'm pretty sure that's impossible. To add about the cancer, he has a higher risk of breast cancer. Perhaps, you should cut away his breast tissue as well and when he gets older pull out all his teeth because of tooth decay and the risk of infections.

[Savoir Faire]

She lost her credibility with me when she pulled the infection and "everyone else is doing it" card.

My 4-year-old non-circed son has never had any sort of infection, or funk, or whatever else people tried to scare us with.

I'd get a second opinion. Preferably with someone with an open mind.

[jumpmama]

I have read a lot of info on foreskin/circ/noncirc and never once did that ever appear in any article or any "con" of not circing.

just sounds like you need a new doctor!

[chaoticzenmom]

Ugh, I've dealt with the same thing before. My son's ped. at 1yr stated that his pee hole was too small and that he should be retractable by 1yr old and that we needed to circ. Fortunately, I have a European DH who knew better and we switched peds. The next ped never mentioned retraction or foreskin or anything. At 10, he stated one day that he was retractable...as is normal for boys. It's not supposed to retract until they have hormones that allow that to happen, like breasts with girls.

My 3 sons all had pinhole sized holes at birth until about a year and then the hole started to get larger. I was inspecting the pinhole in my newborn once and he started peeing. The hole got very large while he was peeing and then back to pinhole sized when he was done. It is a sphincter, afterall.

There's no need for a urologist, but you do need a new ped. Maybe find a European one? Or in the future state that you'd prefer they not do a genital exam. They can just write "patient refused" on that part.

[MCatLvrMom2A&X]

1) the tip of the foreskin is a sphincter just like the anus when not in use it clamps down tight to keep stuff out. I bet you money if you watch him when he urinates you will see it in action.

2) find a new ped or at least do not let this one touch your ds's penis and do not ask penis advice from her she will just scare you needlessly like this time.

3) cancer the appt with the urologist you will just be spending money on a visit that is in no way needed.

4) the only way the opening would close up is if he is forcibly retracted over and over causing scar tissue and even then circ would be the last resort to fix it.

[2xy]

Your doctor is extremely ignorant and biased regarding this issue. That's all I have to say about that.

Originally Posted by chaoticzenmom

At 10, he stated one day that he was retractable...as is normal for boys. It's not supposed to retract until they have hormones that allow that to happen, like breasts with girls.

The "normal" range is quite wide for retractibility. Both of my boys were fully retractible by age 5. Honestly, by the age of 10, I can't imagine either one of them announcing the status of their penises to me.

[prairiebird]

I'm really glad you all are confirming what I was suspecting. I was just sort of shocked when she was going on about it, because she seemed to be quoting all the misinformation I've heard. She thankfully has not forced any sort of retraction, so that's good. She just said the "hole was getting too small."

I'm wondering if travel out-of-the-way for a ped, if that would help? We only have two peds in our county that take the medical card, so when I switched, I thought I was safe with this newer doctor. (This is also why they made the urologist appointment- they make appointments and give me a sheet to bring to the specialist. I have to go to the one she gives me the referal to, unfortunately, or pay out-of-pocket.)

I'll watch the naked time just to double check the stream, but I haven't noticed any crying upon urination or anything like that.

Thank you all, and I'll keep this thread updated as we move along. I was very happy with my decision not to circ after I'd done so for my earlier sons (based on the same misinformation given to me 10 years ago, but I wasn't as research savvy then!)

[TCA2008]

PLEASE educate this doctor - it is sad, and yes, we know they should know, but so many don't - they didn't get any instruction on normal foreskin and function.

Please do see her again, at least just to hand her this:
http://www.intactamerica.org/sites/d...skin_Facts.pdf

and firmly but politely tell her that you've done research and feel comfortable with your son's foreskin, you are aware that circumcision is almost never done in Europe, but their penile cancer rate is no higher that the US, and ask her to please read the foreskin facts handout and then put it in your son's chart.

Yes, you should watch the stream of urine - as long as the stream is fine, he is fine, in rare cases, the foreskin opening will get narrower - and then the stream is a trickle. In those cases, the answer is not circumcision,but treating the problem - sometimes, if the foreskin has overexposure to chlorine, or bubble baths, it can become irritated - the answer in those cases is a lot of soaking in plain warm water, and less exposure to irritants. Most likely though, all is fine.

After you've confirmed his urine stream is fine, you can also express that to the pediatrician - he is urinating just fine, the research you've done confirms that he is normal, you are not concerned and you do not want to discuss if further. If you continue to take your child to her for care, politely request that she does not touch his foreskin during check-ups.

[Magali]

Just echoing the great advice from the mama's here. I would never go back to that particular Dr. again. And I would definately not see the specialist.

[billikengirl]

Please do some reading about protecting your perfect son from ignorant doctors. I recommend anything by Dr. Paul Fleiss
http://www.mothering.com/health/prot...advice-parents

Also his book What Your Doctor May NOT Tell You About Circumcision.

[yarngoddess]

Prairiebird- I'm so glad that you've been able to "see through" all this B.S. Scary doctor! I hope that you are able to find a new doc that is better at taking care of children with alternative (meaning not typical) bodies lol. You know, intact and delayed vax/no vax.

Have you checked into Family Practice doc's or Osteopathic Doc's? They often are better at dealing with a more family approach. I use doc's offices only for the occasional check up and sick care. I'm not interested in their "opinion" regarding my parenting practices or my personal beliefs. I learned long ago to set those personal boundaries, and I use the "Bean Dip" method regularly with doc's

I hope you've cancled the appt with the Uriologist's office. If you look through these threads there was a momma that had her son traumatised by the "Specialist" in a matter of seconds I just don't see the point of going to this appt if your DS is NORMAL!!!
BTW- So glad that he's really not having problems.

[chaoticzenmom]

Originally Posted by 2xy

Your doctor is extremely ignorant and biased regarding this issue. That's all I have to say about that.



The "normal" range is quite wide for retractibility. Both of my boys were fully retractible by age 5. Honestly, by the age of 10, I can't imagine either one of them announcing the status of their penises to me.

Yeah, he was quite embarrassed after he said it. He came out of the bathroom and said "hey, it goes all the way back now." and then realized what he had just said. I asked him if he'd like for us to throw a party I think I scarred him for life.