Oh Boy Do I Need to Vent - advice? - Page 2

[violet_]

Originally Posted by PoppyMama

yeah. I think denying a child's request to take his new underwear with him is weird and their mother would still need to send clothes even if they weren't returned. What's the alternative? Send them naked. I sent my son on a visit with his dad wearing a brand new coat. The only new new coat he'd had in years. They didn't return it and have failed to mail it back. Doesn't mean I will send him without a coat if they visit him when its cold. That only punishes my son.
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We didn't send him naked, nor did we send him without underwear. We sent him in whatever pair he put on that day (which happened to be from our stash that we purchased, knowing their mom sometimes doesn't pack any underwear at all). We did keep the rest of our stash, since we will be seeing him again before they are outgrown, and we don't like to have to go out and buy packs of underwear, socks, and clothes before every single visit. If she sent stuff back ever, then we'd feel more comfortable sending things. But she doesn't, and we aren't made of money. We can't send her new clothes every visit, after paying thousands per month in child support (that, theoretically, she could use to, oh, I don't know, maybe clothe the children), and thousands more in travel. In many cases, people here are discussing EOW visits -- surely you don't expect them to buy new outfits every week or two to send over and never see again? It just doesn't make sense. And, in my experience, the clothes that we do lose over to her house never even get worn -- they get thrown away and the kids don't get to wear them at all. So who does it help to send them?

Regarding your son's coat -- I know what you mean -- we've lost nice winter wear this way too, as there really isn't an alternative. I mean, we can't send them without a coat. One time we even handed the brand-new winter stuff over on purpose, as the kids were growing fast and we weren't planning to have them for cold weather again for a while, so we figured they'd at least get some use this way. Turns out we did have another visit in the cold soon after, but weren't even loaned back the stuff we bought them. It was very frustrating.

So, in general here, our policy is to send them home in stuff they came in or stuff they brought, and keep our stash for later.

[Ceinwen]

Just a comment on what my ex and I did re: the clothing issue.

He gives me money at the beginning of spring/fall and I go and buy new clothes for our girls to leave at this place (they visit EOW) and we just let the clothing rotate in and out (what they wear to his house may not be what they wear home) without issue.

I absolutely realize that for most people this wouldn't be feasible, but for us it solved the issue of the girls not having proper sized/appropriate (season wise) clothing to wear there. Also, it stopped me from freaking out if I sent them in something expensive (bit of a clothing snob here) and them coming home in something too small/ripped/stained.

It wasn't that my ex didn't want the kids to be dressed appropriately, he just really didn't know what they needed. So, it took the pressure off of him to organize and buy clothing. I bought everything in matched outfits, which made it even easier for him.

[pinksprklybarefoot]

Originally Posted by weezix

So do people in this situation just make sure they do laundry on the weekends before they go back? I guess it's really not a HUGE deal but I work my butt of on laundry all week because we have a large family and I really don't like doing a small load on the weekend just to clean 2 outfits - especially if we have plans and are busy.

We don't always wash things before sending them back to DSD's mom's, and we request that things are returned to us unwashed (I am *extremely* particular about laundry, partially because I buy nice clothes and resell them, partially because I was brought up that way). After this many years, we have it figured out - if we have time to wash things from DSD's mom's, we do. If not, they are sent back dirty (it is not uncommon to see DSD's mom a day or two after the switch at a school event, etc.). It hasn't been a real big deal.

Each house has DSD half the time, and each house has a way that they do things. Due to this, DSD has a full set of belongings at each house (clothes, shoes, backpack, lunch box, etc). On switch day, everything is returned to the other house (if no before). It works for us. It may seem silly, but the thought of having to hash out which lunch box/system DSD should use with DSD's mom seems ridiculous. Same thing with style/type of clothing. It is much easier to have two sets.

If we were in the OP's situation and were out doing family things on the day of a switch, we would probably just have the kids change upon arrival at the receiving parent's house. We (the house on the receiving end) have done this before on summer days just to make things easier - nothing to remember to pack for the following week.

[weezix]

Originally Posted by PoppyMama

I also don't see where any of this is father related. My point is that the kids are the ones suffering in the stupid clothes game. Why put the kids back in ill-fitting clothes to send them home?
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EXACTLY how I feel. Wow, after reading all this I actually DO feel better knowing that this isn't just MY problem. I really thought the response would be to not be so nit picky. So what I've decided to do is just make sure I get their laundry done on the weekends while they are here. I'll start a box in my laundry room of clothes that fit them that I can pick up for free from nearly anywhere and when they don't have appropriate clothes to go home in, or if their laundry is still in the dryer, or if they simply come not wearing underwear etc, then I will just pick out of the box and assume it won't come back (and if it does, it will go right back into the box). As far as winter stuff goes, I actually already have winter jackets for them that I picked up for super cheap that were really nice, so before the weather gets cold I'll ask their mom if she wants to buy them off me. If not, then it will be up to her to send them in jackets. We will just make sure when we pick up that we ASK for a jacket if they leave the house without one (this will be tricky when picking up from school though). And I will keep the ones here I bought for them as "spares" if she doesn't want them. Whew.

As far as the visitation issue goes, we are going to set up Mediation and go in and talk to the lawyer. As a pp said, it's what the agreement says, she can't take that away from him, he's entitled to it.

[-Resque-]

We had been having this problem as well, although not to the same extent... it was the grandparents mainly getting upset- they would buy her a cute outfit, someone would accidentally send her to the other house in it, and the original house would never see it again. It worked both ways for us... both my fiancee and his ex were guilty of it. Neither one of them really cared all that much, however. Both houses dress her size and weather appropriately.

What DID matter to us was the toys. We share custody 50/50, and toys kept making their way out of our house, never to be seen again. This didn't happen the other way, simply because I'm the organized one out of all three of us, and felt bad not returning the toys to her mom's. We work hard to be able to provide her with extras, and she's the kind of kid who doesn't take her "things" for granted... yet she's only 6, and can't yet be depended on to remember which things belong to which house. We reached a point about 6 months ago where we barely had ANY toys here, and she was starting to watch too much TV because of it. This wasn't done maliciously on her mom's part, however...she just sucks at remembering things.

We put into place, "Dad's toys and clothes stay at Dad's house." Her mom sends her in an outfit on Wednesdays and gets her back in the same, cleaned, outfit on Saturdays or Sundays. She cooperated with us by sending back all of the clothes she felt had originated at our house, which I thought was really nice. Her mom will still send toys with her, because she does realize that she'll get them back as long as I've seen then come in... not so much if it's her Dad on duty, LOL. We do NOT send toys with her anymore. She commented once that Mom let her bring her toys, but once we explained our reasoning, she was on board, and she knows she can take them again once she's old enough to remember. She's very self-aware and agreed that I was the only one "good at remembering" in the family.

[aricha]

Originally Posted by PoppyMama

For the people who have distance visitation (summers and such) what is the point of keeping the clothing you get for them and not allowing them to return with it? There is a good chance it won't fit next time they visit. Really? Not allowing them to keep their underwear? Weird.

Like violet, "summers and such" is at least once a month, despite the distance between houses. She doesn't outgrow clothes from one month to the next, and honestly she doesn't always outgrow them from one year to the next. And we have other children and a long tradition of handing clothes down from one child to the next, so just because she has outgrown them doesn't mean they are no longer useful to us.

[LittleBlessings]

Originally Posted by jstpmm

We have the same problem as well and there is a big size difference in the 2 kids. So we have been doing what pinksprklybarefoot said, returning the kids in the clothes their mom sends them because she would keep what we would buy them.

we also have that problem and do just that but it brakes my heart that this is the way it has to be

[vannienicole]

Something to remember is that your kid's clothes aren't YOUR clothes or the other parent's clothes.....they are the kid's clothes. So what if they go to the other house? That's one more properly fitting outfit for the kid to wear. Document how much you spend on clothing and the such for the kid, make sure you have adequate visitation (don't just start giving up days) and make sure that CS is properly calculated. Only then will it be "fair" for you and for the child.

[weezix]

Originally Posted by vannienicole

Something to remember is that your kid's clothes aren't YOUR clothes or the other parent's clothes.....they are the kid's clothes. So what if they go to the other house? That's one more properly fitting outfit for the kid to wear. Document how much you spend on clothing and the such for the kid, make sure you have adequate visitation (don't just start giving up days) and make sure that CS is properly calculated. Only then will it be "fair" for you and for the child.

I'm trying not to let this response bother me but it REALLY does. I clothe FOUR other children. We have a VERY tight budget and my kids don't even get NEW clothes. I've send numerous outfits back to their mothers house hoping that at least they would have something decent to wear over there. They STILL never get worn and they still never make it back. To say the kids clothes are THEIRS...who is the one paying for them? I certainly don't have the money to buy 4 extra outfits a month for each child that I will never see again.

[LionessMom]

my dsd's ncp loses everything. i have seen her house and it is gross and cluttered. my dsd has learned to not take anything to her moms house if she doesnt want to lose it. her mom dresses her in dirty stuff. when she had her 2 week summer visit, dsd said she didnt change her underwear once for 4 days. she also said her mom took her to eat at the salvation army every day. really, i could have given them food. i have told her mom to send her back in the clothes i sent her in (which are play clothes i dont care about). she comes back in stuff 2 sizes too small . all i can do is clothe her properly. her mom has always been like this. there were so many times (when she had custody) that we would pick her up in the winter and sxhe wouldnt even have socks on. seriously. i am so glad we got custody. her mom will go out and help buy clothes for our house, when she has a job, and when she has money, which she hasnt for about 3 months now.....

so i hear ya. it is frustrating when it seems like the other parent doesnt care as much. just send her over there in appropriate clothing. dont send extra clothes. if she comes to your house in clothes that are inappropriate or too small, get rid of them and dress them right in clothes that fit. bc you care about the child.

and if visits are court ordered, take them. i would ask for more. maybe even pursue custody. esp if mom seems like she isnt providing adequately for their needs.

[vannienicole]

Originally Posted by weezix

I'm trying not to let this response bother me but it REALLY does. I clothe FOUR other children. We have a VERY tight budget and my kids don't even get NEW clothes. I've send numerous outfits back to their mothers house hoping that at least they would have something decent to wear over there. They STILL never get worn and they still never make it back. To say the kids clothes are THEIRS...who is the one paying for them? I certainly don't have the money to buy 4 extra outfits a month for each child that I will never see again.

It doesn't matter who pays for them. If someone buys you a shirt, is it your shirt or theirs? I understand budgets are tight and it just plain sucks that the other parent doesn't send them in decent clothes. My ex sends my son to my house in all sorts of wrong sized clothes (once in sandals 3 sizes too small! ). Unfortunately there's nothing that can be done but documenting as much as possible and asking for more time to make sure that the kid has their needs met (with you, since that where it seems that is happening).

This wasn't an attack of any kind. Custody issues blow. It's not fair. I was trynig to help you get another idea to help you find peace with your irritation . We can't control what the other parents do....just what happiness the kids can find when they are with us.

[lilyka]

Originally Posted by weezix

So do people in this situation just make sure they do laundry on the weekends before they go back? I guess it's really not a HUGE deal but I work my butt of on laundry all week because we have a large family and I really don't like doing a small load on the weekend just to clean 2 outfits - especially if we have plans and are busy.

Yes. that is exactly what my xh does. We have truly different opinions on what makes for appropriate clothes, what makes for a good fit etc. I choose the clothes I choose for a reason. I am the one who has to get cranky picky girls up and ready for school in the wee hours of the morning. I am the one with high standards for modesty. And I was sick of picking out clothes that worked for us only to get skanky undersized/ill fitting complicated stuff back. Or getting half an outfit back. (useless for both of us!)

If she sent clothes wouldn't you wash them before you sent them home anyway? You don't send a kid home with dirty clothes. If they came clean you should send them back clean. Laundering the kids clothes is part of parenting them.

Also since he picks them up at school sending extra clothes meant sending them to school with a suit case. and me packing every week (so not going to happen. They still would have had a bag of clothes for dads house that would have sat in the garage between visits and they still would have had the exact same two outfits at every visit and I still would have expected them to come home freshly laundered and ready for the next week. why not just keep them there?). I sent a bunch of things over to his house and he bought some things. They have tennis shoes at both places. snow boots and snow pants go back and forth. He often thinks I under-dress them I often think he overdresses them for the weather. Now they have clothes for over there. They do laundry on Saturday and they wear home what they wore there. It just works more smoothly and they don't end up not having what they need because they have what they need at both places. The only time I send extra is if I am picking them up for church or something and they need church clothes. He took them to a wedding and I sent church clothes for that as well. Fancy dresses are not something they need at his house so there is no reason for him to keep stuff there.

And things still get mixed up sometimes. I try to make sure stuff gets where it belongs. If xh calls and says "all of Ava's undies/socks have disappeared" I would run a pack over because we don't know how it happens (she leaves in a pair and comes home in a pair it should balance out right....but she is truly amazing this way) but I would rather have a stash at his house that I paid for than worry about her not having any or having home grumping about that i don't send my kid in appropriate underwear.

and yup, sometimes my kids show up with mismatched socks (matching socks are just not something we value at 6AM) and they look like he!! because they have either spent a day at school or a day playing. And they get themselves ready in the morning because i have to be at work early. They do their best but they don't look fantastic. If my xh was concerned about them being dressed to impress at school he can up the child support so I could stay at home and spend time getting them ready every morning. They would look fantastic I promise. If their dad were heading to a wedding or somewhere they needed to look nice he could call me ahead of time and I would get them ready but as a general rule we don't spend a lot of time dressing up and staying neat. Especially for something as mundane as a pick up or drop off.

it took us a while to find something that works but I think we have landed in a comfortable spot.

AND

The clothes are mine. I pay for them they are mine. The kids do not have a right to do whatever they want with them. the clothes their dad buys are his. If I decide its time for a certain item to move down to the next kid its time and no one gets to say 'but thats mine" with the exception of "the Beatles shirt" If she out grows it it will probably morph into a pillow case or something....If I am sick of looking at something, tired of the fuss it is causing, if I decide it has become too revealing, i get rid of it just because. And I can do that. Because I paid for them. And we don't own family property.

[beep]

What do your kids/stepkids have to say about their clothing and managing stuff in two houses?

[knitterma]

Originally Posted by Momtwice

That's because for any decent mom, (with or without a step- at the front,) it's about putting the kids first.

As a kid who grew up with clothes that didn't fit or were old or out of fashion, this thread hurts to read.

Venting on a message board like this is a healthy thing to do. Not giving in to the games other people play (for instance if you felt the other parent had plenty of money/clothes and were not sending them along) can also be a healthy thing to do depending on the circumstances. Actually allowing children to go without what they need is not.

I agree. My ex-husband will often keep my boys clothes that fit and send them to school the day i pick them up wearing highwater pants. It isn't fair to me at all to have to keep buying them clothes to wear at their dads. However, there is no way i am going to send them out in the world wearing clothes that obviously don't fit them.