Dr Lisa Masterson gives bad advice again! - Page 2

[kittywitty]

Originally Posted by rivkah

I actually think this is good advice. I think many, many women experience nipple pain at first that pretty much goes away once their nipples toughen up. Certainly my experience. I guess she could have added something about making sure latch is good and there is not a tongue-tied issue...

I agree. I know everyone says pain does not equal normal, but I did all 4 times even without latch issues and so did my mom and most people I know.

[SubliminalDarkness]

I happen to feel that it would be to moms' benefit in general to let it be known that breastfeeding is not always wonderful and lovely. Yes, sometimes it hurts and is exhausting. That does NOT mean it won't work for you. It is "normal." Yes, some potential problems should be ruled out, but it does not mean that there is necessarily a problem.
And yes, the callous thing is a bit of a harsh exaggeration, but the general idea is sound.

[PatioGardener]

Originally Posted by laohaire

Well, I think the best answer is: "Hmm, let's check your latch. Position looks good, latch looks good. Swallows per suck seems good. This seems like normal adjustment - many women do report some discomfort or pain while establishing breastfeeding, but it typically resolves within 2 weeks. Some women like to use Lansinoh on their nipples, though not everyone likes it - would you like to try some?"

Not just dismissive "it's normal."

especially the lansinoh. who knew a little lanolin could be so comforting! mine was never 'pain', just 'discomfort', but it still sucked (pun intended ) for about 10 days.

[Mamapits]

she did suggest that mom could use creams and such.

BUt again I have to come back to that I wish she would have encouraged her to get things checked out.

What if I as a future child birth educator, I prepare the women I will be working with that there is a possibility of pain. If I just make it seem normal, then there could be a problem and then mom won't go for help because she was told that breastfeeding hurts and it is normal.

I guess it is all in the wording, maybe something like pain COULD indicate that there is a problem so seek specialized help to rule all else out. Again, I would have to go back to pain is not normal or all pain is not normal.


not feeling as annoyed by her since hearing about your experiences. I really had no idea.

I wonder if part of it is my breastfeeding friends not wanting to share if they had painful experiences either because they didn't feel normal or because they are afraid to turn other moms off from breastfeeding, going back to how we are doing a dis service by not telling the truth.

[Chavelamomela]

Bfing first kid was hard, for 6 weeks or so. And I worked on the latch, but it still was uncomfortable for a while, especialyy at the latch-on (deep breathing!). then it got better.

There was a 1 yr break between nursing ds1 (nursed for 2.5+ years) before I got pg with #2. When ds2 was born, he nursed like a champ and I was a stickler with his latch, and 3 days old felt about the same as 6 weeks old did with ds1! amazing!

I think its partially a matter of working on the latch and just that the first time is hardest.

[PatioGardener]

Originally Posted by Mamapits

I wonder if part of it is my breastfeeding friends not wanting to share if they had painful experiences either because they didn't feel normal or because they are afraid to turn other moms off from breastfeeding, going back to how we are doing a dis service by not telling the truth.

there is a campaign in nova scotia along those lines: http://www.first6weeks.ca/

see commercials here: http://www.first6weeks.ca/learning/l...#tvcommercials

i agree that pain should be investigated - could be a tongue-tie!

nak

[2boyzmama]

Lots of things can cause pain, bad latch, thrush, tongue tie, engorgement, etc. But pain can also just be "normal" and part of the adjustment your body is going through.

Think of it this way...if you were to suck on your own finger for hours upon hours of every day and night suddenly, when that finger has never been sucked on before, it would no doubt get a touch tender, don't you think? Now add in the fact that breast tissue is much more sensitive, less exposed to the elements, and all the hormones of post-partum, and yes, you can have pain.

And that pain can be normal.

I have been breastfeeding for 5 years straight now, with no break between kids, and tandeming for 3 years. Yet I still had pain as my body adjusted to my new infant's mouth, suck, latch, and increase in milk supply.

[Ninetales]

Our first two weeks were absolute hell. I was sure the latch wasn't right, even though every nurse and the IBLC said it looked right to them. It hurt so bad that I was sure it must be wrong because I had always heard it's not supposed to be toe-curling painful. Maybe it was right and it was normal pain, I don't know. She was also so big and heavy it was hard to hold her and get her in a good position.

Then I got bloody and scabby and she started to refuse nursing. A weekend off, using the pump instead, and she was back on. It still hurt but it was workable. It got even better after she started getting chiropractic. After those first two weeks everything was perfectly fine. We've had absolutely no issues since. So I really don't know what's normal or not, still.

I never know what to say either. I want to prepare people who I talk to that it may hurt, but I don't want to scare them off. I know someone who was scared off BFing - she didn't even try because of all the horror stories.

[~Charlie's~Angel~]

I wish the "experts" had told me that when I had my first son. Maybe I would have been more prepared for it, and our BFing relsitionship would have lasted longer.

But no, all the "lactation consultants" kept telling me, 2days after giving birth, that if it hurts, im doing it wrong. Gee, THANKS! Loads of help!

[Hopesmommy]

Originally Posted by annettemarie

Yeah, the callous part was weird. But you do kind of "toughen up" and get used to things.

Yep. I've had four kids and I've definitely experienced some pain during the beginning because I just wasn't used to having someone "suck on me" 24/7.

Latch was fine...

[purplepaperclip]

Oh holy hell, it can be "sawing at your nipples with a dull serated knife" pain. Crying while your are holding your newborn to your breast, clenching your teeth, toe-curling, silent screaming pain. And everything was fine. No tongue tie, no latch issues. Just pain in the beginning. If you just founf discomfort consider yourself fortunate.
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[Ellien C]

I experienced a lot of pain, too. I took Tylenol to keep nursing. I figured that was better than not. And my pre-baby nipples were too sensitive to touch. At 5 months PP, my nipples are STILL too sensitive for anyone to touch them. I don't think there is anything wrong. This is my second child and he is growing well. This time around the engorgemen pain was MUCH less but I surprised that I still had nipple pain the first few weeks. Baby # 2 latched in the hospital but it hurt so much I was sure that wasn't right. Turned out to be fine. Just painful. I feel like my pain only lasted a month. But I get new pain when trying new positions (side lying or tummy-tummy). I figured I had the wrong sort of "callouses."

[Swan3]

Originally Posted by purplepaperclip

Oh holy hell, it can be "sawing at your nipples with a dull serated knife" pain. Crying while your are holding your newborn to your breast, clenching your teeth, toe-curling, silent screaming pain. And everything was fine. No tongue tie, no latch issues. Just pain in the beginning. If you just founf discomfort consider yourself fortunate.
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Same here, with both who both had wonderful latch and no tongue-tie...The second time it dawned on me...I have HUGE breasts. The areola are large as well, so for her to latch well onto this large area with her tiny tiny little bird mouth...something's gotta give! As she grew (especially as her mouth grew larger) I got more comfortable. That's just my take on it!

[Skippy918]

It was toe curling, teeth clenchingly painful for me when breastfeeding DD1!
I wish I had known that it could be, I felt like a complete failure at breastfeeding until we finally got it together after 8 long weeks. Inverted nipples and engorgement combined with a sleepy 6 pound baby led to bleeding and pain that was so bad I wanted to use that stupid can of formula that I got in the mail!

I have HUGE breasts. The areola are large as well, so for her to latch well onto this large area with her tiny tiny little bird mouth...something's gotta give! As she grew (especially as her mouth grew larger) I got more comfortable. That's just my take on it!

I had pain starting around week 2. My son liked to eat every 2 hours and feedings would last an hour. I dreaded feeding him cause it hurt so bad. I cried when he latched on. It was awful. Made labor seem like a cakewalk. He tore up one of my nipples and since he was always feeding, it never had a chance to heal. I tried so many creams and pumped for some feedings. He was so tiny that it was hard to get my nipple in his mouth. Saw an LC and his latch was good for the most part except sometimes it was a little shallow. He got enough milk though. After week 8 it got better. He got more efficient and reduced his nursing time and his mouth got bigger so it was easier for him.

[accountclosed2]

My midwife made sure I had lansinoh, and recommended that I keep up paracetamol (if in pain) and Rescue Remedy and what-not. She came over every couple of day once DD was born and she checked the latch, and the nipples and positioning etc. And asked me questions about the pain (toe-curling, screaming, pain with let-down? Normal. Chafed, sore nipples? Yeah, with latch ok, also normal). No, she wasn't an LC, and she didn't stay and observe for a longer time, so she missed that there were transfer issues (supply issues/swallowing issues, still not sure what caused it), but they were unrelated to the pain anyway.

I think it is a good thing to prepare mothers that some initial pain is normal - doesn't mean all women experience pain, but that it is total normal to do so. Which on the other hand doesn't mean that all pain is normal. And that it is a good idea to have somebody check the baby's latch etc.

But I've met far to many women who claim they "couldn't breastfeed", because of the pain, so they had to stop (usually within the first 5 weeks). Along with "I didn't have enough milk", this is the most common reason I've heard from women not breastfeeding (where I live, everyone, or nearly everyone expects to breastfeed, "if you can", as some say).

[Mandynee22]

Originally Posted by annettemarie

Yes, it can absolutely be normal. I've actually often thought we do women a grave diservice when we don't tell them breastfeeding can be painful in the first few weeks, because then they freak out and assume something is terribly wrong. When you have a little person sucking on a part of your body 24/7, you can experience some discomfort as your body gets used to things.

Exactly. And when my then 2 yr old got really sick and nursed way more than normal during his hospitalization it hurt...and i cracked and bled too. When the baby was born it hurt then too even though DS was still nursing. It's a change and different. I think it's pretty normal to hurt even when there's no latch problem

[ErinYay]

ITA with PP, but adding that letdown can be uncomfortable to down right painful as well. I've actually found that letdown is more uncomfortable as time goes on (OAL, oversupply, and let down on both sides, multiple times per feeding).