Dad turned DS forward facing. HELP! Update post 10

[Super~Single~Mama]

I'm posting here too b/c I'm a single mama, and I hope some of you have insight about this issue and courts.

I'm willing to make a HUGE fuss about this if dad doesn't change it on his own. BUT - is this a big issue? or not when a court of law is concerned?

My ds is 18mo and 24lbs even (a few weeks ago anyway). He is in a Learning curve truefit that will rearface until 35lbs as long as he doesn't get too tall. he isn't yet (and has a ways to go - height is NOT a concern).

When dad picked him up today, he had turned his carseat around. I had to send ds with him per court order (its his visitation, he's not breaking the law, today there wasn't anything to be done). I told him that I would send him links, that I wanted him turned RF'ing again b/c its safer. I sent him a youtube video (thanks family safety forum!!) and I hope it will change his mind - I watched it and without the sound it terrified me!

Anyone who has fought this battle and won? If theres hope I will bring it up at the next court date, and I will fight to the death - but I don't want to look unreasonable. I will do research, and I will provide the court with whatever they want, but I need to know if its worth it - or if a court will just say, "Well, he's not breaking the law, so who cares."

Ok, more links and info would also be wonderful. Thanks!

[orangecanoe]

I do understand everything about the FF/RF debate, but I don't think it's worth your mental energy to approach this with guns blazing. I really don't. You're overstepping. I think you've done all that is reasonable to do with providing him good info and links. The videos are quite convincing if he is in the frame of mind to be convinced.

[Ceinwen]

This was a battle I lost last summer when my dd was 16 months old and my ex started taking my two kids on visitation - she could 'legally' be turned forward facing, and there was absolutely nothing I could do.

[StephandOwen]

Unfortunately, this is one of those "nothing you can do" issues. When my ex showed up for his visit after ds's first birthday he had the seat turned forward facing. I explained it was safer the other way and offered to fix it for him but he declined. As much as it killed me, there was nothing I could do.

Now ds is 6. He is big enough to ride in a booster but not mature/developmentally ready. We have a booster for him, and have tried it, but it is totally unsafe with him. Ex is possibly going to start having visits again by the end of this year (he hasn't had any unsupervised or in his car since ds was 2). Ex said he was going to put ds in a booster. I explained why this was dangerous and gave him alternatives. I would even buy a Graco Nautilus for him if he wanted me to. He didn't say he wouldn't use a 5pt harness, but who knows. If he shows up with a booster then there isn't much I can do about it.

[Super~Single~Mama]

Ok, thanks ladies. I sent him info, and hopefully he heeds it. I'm also going to check out my state laws - since the carseat manufacturer recommends waiting until they reach the limits of the carseat before turning around - so hopefully theres something in there.

[Goodmom2008]

In NJ, it is the law that a child under 12 months and under 20 pounds has to be in a rear facing child restraint. Your child would not fall into that category in my state and you would lose in court. And be seen as a controlling ex.

You need to find out what your state's laws are regarding car seats and kids. I suspect that it is probably similar to NJ. Which means this is a battle you won't win.

[Goodmom2008]

Originally Posted by StephandOwen

Unfortunately, this is one of those "nothing you can do" issues. When my ex showed up for his visit after ds's first birthday he had the seat turned forward facing. I explained it was safer the other way and offered to fix it for him but he declined. As much as it killed me, there was nothing I could do.

Now ds is 6. He is big enough to ride in a booster but not mature/developmentally ready. We have a booster for him, and have tried it, but it is totally unsafe with him. Ex is possibly going to start having visits again by the end of this year (he hasn't had any unsupervised or in his car since ds was 2). Ex said he was going to put ds in a booster. I explained why this was dangerous and gave him alternatives. I would even buy a Graco Nautilus for him if he wanted me to. He didn't say he wouldn't use a 5pt harness, but who knows. If he shows up with a booster then there isn't much I can do about it.

Have you looked at the weight limit on the car seat? Most 5 point harnesses have a weight limit of 40 pounds. If yours is like that and your child is over 40 pounds, he is safer in a booster seat than a 5 point harness.

[StephandOwen]

Originally Posted by Goodmom2008

Have you looked at the weight limit on the car seat? Most 5 point harnesses have a weight limit of 40 pounds. If yours is like that and your child is over 40 pounds, he is safer in a booster seat than a 5 point harness.

Yes, hence why I said I would buy ex a Graco Nautilus (which harnesses to 65 pounds) if he would use it. DS is in a Nautilus in dp's car and in a Britax Regent (harnesses to 80 pounds) in my car

[Super~Single~Mama]

Originally Posted by StephandOwen

Unfortunately, this is one of those "nothing you can do" issues. When my ex showed up for his visit after ds's first birthday he had the seat turned forward facing. I explained it was safer the other way and offered to fix it for him but he declined. As much as it killed me, there was nothing I could do.

Now ds is 6. He is big enough to ride in a booster but not mature/developmentally ready. We have a booster for him, and have tried it, but it is totally unsafe with him. Ex is possibly going to start having visits again by the end of this year (he hasn't had any unsupervised or in his car since ds was 2). Ex said he was going to put ds in a booster. I explained why this was dangerous and gave him alternatives. I would even buy a Graco Nautilus for him if he wanted me to. He didn't say he wouldn't use a 5pt harness, but who knows. If he shows up with a booster then there isn't much I can do about it.

BTW Steph, has your ex called Owen lately??

[Super~Single~Mama]

I think he is required to follow the manufactures instructions!! He ISN'T!! Learning Curve TrueFit instructions say to leave rearfacing AS LONG AS POSSIBLE!!! I think I can make him turn him around!!!

I can't find in NYS laws that the requirement is 1yo and 20lbs - I think its the instructions of the carseat!!! I might be able to win this one! I'll be doing more research, and I'll show him what I find before we go to court (next court date is Thursday, ugh) but if I'm right he's not following directions!

AND - the NYS DMV website recommends leaving the child rearfacing to the weight and height limits of seat! DS is at neither the height OR weight limits! I'll be printing out a whole ton of info for ex this weekend, and giving it to him when he returns ds on Sunday.

[kryztuh]

I believe the AAP also revised their guidlines last year to say a minimum of 12 months/20 pounds, but they recommend RF beyond that to the limits of the carseat. Might help.

[lilyka]

Originally Posted by thyra

AND - the NYS DMV website recommends leaving the child rearfacing to the weight and height limits of seat! DS is at neither the height OR weight limits! I'll be printing out a whole ton of info for ex this weekend, and giving it to him when he returns ds on Sunday.

If I were your ex then I would just a buy a different seat. Some people just prefer to have their kids forward facing. I think the more you push the more he will resist your pushing. There is a way around the law. Use an approved carseat that meets his needs. And he has every right to do this. Which would you rather your son be in: a safe careseat of your chosing facing forward? or a less safe carseat facing forward? i really think you need to let this go.

[orangecanoe]

I'm really sorry this issue is weighing on you so heavily. You sound very stressed. There is no law that I know of that requires rear-facing to manufacturer's specifications or recommendations. Perhaps you could get it written into your parenting or visitation agreement, but this is not a hill I would die on. If the babe was over twenty pounds and under a year and he had him turned around? Yes, then I would fight, but the law isn't on your side here.

[Minxie]

Originally Posted by thyra

I can't find in NYS laws that the requirement is 1yo and 20lbs - I think its the instructions of the carseat!!!

There are several websites that summarize the car seat laws for each state. Here is the Governors Highway Safety Association list:

http://www.ghsa.org/html/stateinfo/l...fety_laws.html

[blessedwithboys]

I hope you are able to use the proper use clause to get what you want. My exdh let ds2 sit in his lap and "drive" the car down their semi-busy/semi-quiet residential street. When my lawyer heard about it, she jumped all over him and scared him into promising never to do it again. She was an ex-MP, so maybe that helped. LOL

In your shoes, this is something I totally would fight about. I let food go a year ago, but I still remind ds about using a booster every. single. time. exdh comes. I hug and kiss ds and then ask "What are the three things you need to ride in a car?" and he says "Booster seat, head rest, shoulder belt, and I need to call you if any of those are not available, right mama?"

[BunnySlippers]

[QUOTE=lilyka;15660621]If I were your ex then I would just a buy a different seat. [QUOTE]

You would endanger your child's life just to be right?

OP- I would push. It is in your childs best interests to be as safe as possible. Hopefully your ex will realise it is a true safety issue and will flip the carseat around.

[lilyka]

I do a happy dance the day I can turn them around. and an even happier dance they day we are done with harnesses. I do tend to go on the bottom ensd of things. I do not get uptight over carseat saftey or even so much over car saftey, but that is not the point. Except I can understand your xh thinking on this.

My xh thinks I do things dangerous to my kids. (I let a friend smoke a cigar outside, while playing with smoke bombs. My dd took a picture and put it on facebook. My kids have their face buried in toxic smoke bombs and my xh pictches a fit about second hand smoke from a cigar that is 10 feet away, outside) Him calling me a bad mother did not make any progress in getting to me to think this was a bad idea. I will not read any crap he gives me about the dangers of second hand smoke. I am not an idiot or flighty. I know the risks of second hand smoke. I think hanging out as a family and having a spectacular time far outweighs the risk of a waft of smoke. I have made a decision about what is and is not acceptable and he will not change my mind. No matter how controlling or bossy he tries to be about it.

the point is he is also a parent and he gets to make these choices as well. Being able to choose and pay for his own carseat for his child to ride in his car during his parenting time is his perogative. It sucks losing control over these things but lets face it; we have. And it sucks. I know. My ex does all kinds of crap that I am pretty sure will screw my kids for life. I can ask my xh not to do certain things with my kids but at the end of the day so long as he is within the law and within our agreemnet there is NOTHING I can do and the more I push or try to control, the more this will become a power struggle. When our children are with their other parent, their other parent gets to make the choices that work best for their family and their lives. and he does not sound cooperative and being combative will only make him dig his heels in. And this is something really easy for him to get around and it sounds like he will do it just to win. This is one of those things I would ask "Is there any way I could convince you to turn the seat around? any way I could make that workable for you?" (would you be willing to buy one rear facing he can keep installed in his car. It is so much easier to install the forward facing. is there a rear facing one that is maybe easier to get a big kid in and out of? ) and if he can't be sweet talked I would drop it because turning it into a power struggle, one he CAN and WILL win, is not going to be helpful to you or your son. I would rather my child be in a safe car seat forward facing (I am assuming this is high quality car seat) than a cheap one his dad bought just to win a fight. At least you can have that much.

[Goodmom2008]

Originally Posted by thyra

I think he is required to follow the manufactures instructions!! He ISN'T!! Learning Curve TrueFit instructions say to leave rearfacing AS LONG AS POSSIBLE!!! I think I can make him turn him around!!!

No, he's required to follow the law, which doesn't always agree with the manufacturers guidelines. The best place to find out what the law is regarding this is to contact a place that inspects that car seats are installed properly, the police station may be able to point you in the right direction unless they are able to answer the question for you.

[Goodmom2008]

Originally Posted by lilyka

I do a happy dance the day I can turn them around. and an even happier dance they day we are done with harnesses.

I went forward facing at a year old. My youngest stopped screaming the whole time we were in the car. Rear facing does make them sick.

But I did do a happy dance the day that all carseats and booster seats were gone. My kids are 8 & 10 and over the weight limits for booster seats.

[Ceinwen]

Originally Posted by Goodmom2008

No, he's required to follow the law, which doesn't always agree with the manufacturers guidelines. The best place to find out what the law is regarding this is to contact a place that inspects that car seats are installed properly, the police station may be able to point you in the right direction unless they are able to answer the question for you.

While I hope you found a loophole thyra, I really do think she's correct.

The law trumps manufacturer's guidelines.