How would you have handled this?

[mom2happy]

This is about my angry 7yr old dd who I speed typed a dramatic confusing post about a while back.
It was so long that I dont want to put anyone through reading it.

In short, she is beautiful, intelligent, sensitive, creative, strong willed, volatile, angry, sweet, and pretty self centered with a mean streak.
Wow!
Im sure many children are all of these things too, but I know from other moms and my 5 yr old that she is a HARD one!

Yesterday my mom was here for an hour so I could do yoga downstairs.
I heard her saying "stop doing that".
She had to keep explaining why and saying stop about 10 times and letting her know she was disappointed that she wasnt listening. Grandma told her to please move away from where she was and DD just said NO!
I had to come up because it was going nowhere.
This has been happening since dd was 3. It happens with me all the time too, but she will listen -and then mouth off like crazy!

I asked dd what happened and she said that she was putting a towel over the baby's (3 months old) face. Grandma said stop because baby is too young for that and it will scare her. Dd said she wasnt getting scared so she kept doing it. I know my mom tried what she could, blocking the baby, taking the towel, etc.
Its like dd has no respect. She knows I wont be happy and that she'll have to hear me talk about it. She always even says sorry and feels remorseful.
I told her I didnt know what to do yet because I was so upset that she treated her Grandma this way and that I couldnt do my workout. I told her to go into her room till I could talk calmly.
She started screaming (this is the real problem) that Grandma is a poop and that she doesnt like her or me.... on and on.
She does this when ever she doesnt get her way or I have to repremand her.
Of course she came out 15 min later and hugged her.
This is just getting to be a routine and its getting ridiculous.
She cant be behaving this way forever. She is 7 yrs old and going into 2nd grade.
This is just one example of the many types of flare ups and wig outs she does. Im just wondering if theres anything else I can do.
I use the same type of discipline for 5 yr old ds and it works.

[hermionesmum]

I have one of those, and I wouldn't have handled it any differently. If anyone has any dazzling insight I'm all ears! In the meantime you have my sympathy and deepest respect for not having lost it!

[NellieKatz]

There's a book I got out of the library called Angry Children, Worried Parents, and it had some very very helpful tips in it. I recommend getting that book.

We have tried to be very reasonable and democratic and fair and all that, and yet we found that when our son (7) wouldn't get his way he'd lash out, usually with his hands. He doesn't do this at his school, and has learned many very good conflict-resolution skills with them--it's mostly with us that he did this. We decided that it was not fair for the family to be held hostage to his angry reactions, and we drew a line. The book had very helpful tips for how to accomplish this, and we've had good luck. I think it's important that the child knows that he cannot terrorize the family, and that the parents are in charge of keeping order & peace.

Sorry if I sound like I am rambling. I have just a moment to write and then I have to go back to work. Check out that book. It took me a long time to get an "angry children" book because I was not about to characterize my DS as "angry." He's not angry all the time so I didn't put that label on him. But when he started using angry words and hits to express displeasure at not getting his way (on a regular basis) I knew it was time. I'm glad I did.

I also have a real low tolerance for kids making their parents beg or repeat themselves. Like when we're at the beach and we're not ready to go in the water with him (for safety, as he doesn't know how to swim) and he starts to charge toward the water, and I yell his name and he makes me holler it three times before he will stop. Or when he's holding onto Daddy's sweater and stretching it way out, in a playful way but still destructive to the sweater, and Daddy says Stop, and it takes Daddy 3 or 4 requests......this happens all the time. I decided we need to put an end to that. We will not beg to be heard. When you mentioned that it took Grandma numerous requests before your DD would stop putting the towel on the baby, I thought of this. It's exhausting to Grandma to have to beg, repeat, and risk sounding like a braying donkey or a nag in the process. Grandma should say it once and only once. DD can of course question Grandma as to why she shouldn't do that--I'm a big advocate of explaining Why, but if Grandma says Stop, DD needs to stop. So maybe you can get some help from the book I recommended, because it helped us.

[mom2happy]

Originally Posted by NellieKatz

There's a book I got out of the library called Angry Children, Worried Parents, and it had some very very helpful tips in it. I recommend getting that book.

When you mentioned that it took Grandma numerous requests before your DD would stop putting the towel on the baby, I thought of this. It's exhausting to Grandma to have to beg, repeat, and risk sounding like a braying donkey or a nag in the process. Grandma should say it once and only once. DD can of course question Grandma as to why she shouldn't do that--I'm a big advocate of explaining Why, but if Grandma says Stop, DD needs to stop. So maybe you can get some help from the book I recommended, because it helped us.

She actually did explain that the baby was making a scared face and that it wasnt nice to cover her eyes.
I do always ask why because sometimes that helps.
Like today
Dd always wants to be FIRST at everything. She runs to do everything first.
They were getting into the pool today and ds actually made it to the ladder first and she was trying to pull him off. I went over and told her that wasnt fair to him and that she got to be first 3 times already. She was doing this over and over to upset him to say I won and you lost. I asked her why she was doing that. She said "because I want to, its fun" It was terrible.
I told him he could be first this time and that this was not a nice game.
As he was climbing up the ladder she slapped him on his wet back very hard.
I told her her pool time was over for the day.
She stomped around and screamed in the yard that she wishes her brother was dead!
This has been her phrase directed at who ever in the family made her mad every time in a situation like this. If I ask her why she's saying it, she says the reason (basically because she's mad as heck that she couldnt behave in a horrible way and get away with it). She says its the person's fault that made her mad that she's saying it.
I tell her how hurtful it is and have even cried about it. She feels very badly about it and even cries too. She says she wishes she didnt get so mad and that she wishes she could forget those words. She says she wishes she knew how to stop the tantruming and acting out.
I know how much she loves her brother and everyone in our family and she really is a sweet girl, but just so incredilbly emotional and has NO impulse control whatsoever.

and thanks, Ill definitely check out that book.

[heartmama]

I hope sunmama finds this thread. She has great insight dealing effectively with volatile explosions from a child this age. You might want to do a forum search of her posts.

[momeclectic]

I too have a strong willed 7 year old daughter, who also has sensory processing disorder. I find disciplining her is different from her 5 year old brother. He is easy, laid back and a simple request to him usually does the trick. With my dd, I could request/explain for the rest of my life and it will not penetrate her brain. She is strong willed and takes any request as a "request", an option. Everything is a negotiation, argument....The book "Setting Limits with your Strong Willed Child" and "Raising your spirited Child" have been fabulous resource books for our family. We are learning to speak less and have more boundaries. My daughter is happier too. I know some persons on the forum find "cool off", time outs to not be GD, but my daughter needs to separate herself from others in order to learn to self regulate and calm down. She puts herself in her room sometimes to cool off. All I know is that each family is unique and one size discipline does not fit all. The best of luck; I know how frustrating a strong willed child can be.

[Heligirl]

Oh goodness, this sounds so very frustrating for you. My first thought reading your stories is there may be some level of sibling rivalry involved too. I'm reading "Siblings Without Rivalry" right now and have found it really, really helpful in situations like yours. There are some great tips in there you can use exactly for the two situations you described (the baby and the towel and the pool with her brother).

The two things that come directly to mind in those stories are 1) your daughter is hearing what she can't do a lot, and 2) you're having to referee. Have you had any luck rephrasing your words - "you can put the towel over your face and play peek-a-boo." Just a thought. It's a little thing, but each time a child is told what they can't do it is like adding another straw to the camel's back. They want some power, so showing them what they can do (or even helping them discover what they can do on their own) helps over time.

I'm also learning a lot in that book about how to coach rather than referee between siblings. Suggesting the kids work out a way to resolve problems themselves takes you out of the picture. When you tell her it's her brother's turn, there is that competition. Teaching them how to work out problems on their own will be a life skill that will put them miles ahead.

Hope this helps some. I know it's not a quick fix, but this positive discipline parenting does show results in time with consistency. Hang in there my dear and kudos for keeping it together this long!

Jen (aka Heligirl)

[mom2grrls]

How does she sleep? That's a lot of times my first question lol
I remember reading in Sleepless in America that the author(Mary Sheedy Kurcinka) used a basic baking soda/vinegar volcano model to demonstrate to kids about feelings can build up and then eventually explode. She would ask them to list things that normally cause them anger/anxiety, etc and add baking soda each time(hopefully i'm remebering right lol) then the final straw would be the vinegar. That way they could identify and parents could ask "are you gettiing bubbly inside right now?" She would also ask them what things made them happy/feel secure so that they could learn to ask for those things when upset. Perhaps your daughter needs some tools like this.
Also remember she won't be behaving like this forever, so many things are just phases and will pass. 7/8 has been a more difficult age for my girls with "mouthing off"(I put in quotes b/c kids sometimes are really not trying to be rude) and such but it gets better around 9/10.