Considering a Family, Feeling Confused.. - Page 3

[eatnobeef]

Originally Posted by lilyka

My ex was never able to stop chasing his dreams (kid stuff. it involved touring around like a single guy, did not include a wife and kids.)

Which is why he is your EX

[lilyka]

Well that and the woman he was screwing for the last 7 years of out 15 year marriage. but she is the perfect non committal eternal girlfriend (never wants to be a mother and most likely won't get married) for his dream chasing....

[Jenne]

Okay, I have a few thoughts...

Some of the best man advice I ever heard was, "Pay no attention to what he says. Pay attention only to what he does." This also lets you off the hook for "reading into" what he is saying.

So, I divorced at 30 after 3 years of marriage. Other than my ex was a verbally abusive UAV he also announced right around our 1 year anniversary that he had changed his mind and didn't want kids. Ever. I had known since I was a child that I wanted to be a Mom. I decided that I would spend the year of my divorce dating as many men as I could. I would have a blast going on first dates. I spread the word to as many people as I could that I was looking for a great, kind, mature man. I dated a few losers in between. Then after a year I met my now dh. He was a wonderful, stable, kind, mature man and we were married within a year. He is everything I deserve. I'm so glad to be on this journey with someone who *wants* with all he is able to want to be here on *this* road with me. You deserve the same!

Next point--I told BFF a few weeks after I met my now DH that if things didn't work between us, I was not going to date anymore and instead was going to figure out how I wanted to grow my family as a single mother by choice. I did the math and new that I could afford to do it alone and that I had enough of a support system that I thought I could manage.

In summary--What do *you* want? Is your BF able to provide you with or help you obtain those things? If not, is there a way you can get those things and still have your BF? Or is your lack of compatibility a deal breaker? If it is a deal breaker how can you arrange your life to get the things you want?

Basically, my ex was never going to be the husband/father I needed him to be. I took steps to change my life to make finding the husband/father I deserved possible. I had a plan if that part of the equation didn't pan out.

You may feel your clock ticking but 34 isn't too late to make life changes. Hypothetically, if you started dating again--guys who were marriage material--and spent a year seeing who was out there, you'd be 35. Let's say at the end of that year you met "the one". You could date for a year and have a year long engagement to plan THE wedding (if you want to get married) and be 37 when you married. Then let's say you decide to wait a year before TTC. Then at 38 you get pregnant and have your first child. At 40 you could be well on your way to 3 or 4 years of happy marriage and child #2. But this is sort of the life I think you want from reading a short post on a forum...What do *you* want? How do you want to live your life?

I wish you all the best! You are in a challenging time in your life. But it could also be really exciting!!!

Jenne

[lilmom]

it's not too late, OP. Probably somewhere in your mind you are thinking, but if I break up with him, I'm taking that risk that I don't meet Mr. Wonderful who wants marriage and babies.

But personally, I vote for breaking up, acknowledging that it was a good thing, you learned alot, but now it's time for a real, grownup relationship with a man who has your same goals, on the same timeline.

I promise, there are lots of guys out there who want to get married to an educated, self-supporting woman who wants to be a mama. Guys who aren't perpetually chasing their youth, which is quickly fading into the sunset.

This BF has told you the truth. Be grateful for that. I married a guy (Ex!) who intentionally lied about not wanting children until we got married. He even admitted that he knew he was lying but knew that if he told me he didn't want kids that I would not marry him. Of course we got divorced. Then I met my wonderful DH, who did happen to want to get married & have kids. I'm your age too, and I really GET that clock ticking feeling.

But I think you will regret it way more if you stay, and hope for the best, rather than leave, and proactively SEEK what you are truly wanting in your life. Don't let any more time go by without making positive change for yourself. You can do it. You are WORTH having your dreams come true. Your future babies are WORTH making that choice, to provide them with a father who desperately wants to love them and parent them, and be your partner for life. Go for it!

[eatnobeef]

Originally Posted by lilyka

Well that and the woman he was screwing for the last 7 years of out 15 year marriage. but she is the perfect non committal eternal girlfriend (never wants to be a mother and most likely won't get married) for his dream chasing....

Oh gosh...that is no good! Hope you are blessed with a grown-up man these days! I think I'll be out and looking for mine real soon!

[eatnobeef]

Originally Posted by Jenne

Okay, I have a few thoughts...

Some of the best man advice I ever heard was, "Pay no attention to what he says. Pay attention only to what he does." This also lets you off the hook for "reading into" what he is saying.

So, I divorced at 30 after 3 years of marriage. Other than my ex was a verbally abusive UAV he also announced right around our 1 year anniversary that he had changed his mind and didn't want kids. Ever. I had known since I was a child that I wanted to be a Mom. I decided that I would spend the year of my divorce dating as many men as I could. I would have a blast going on first dates. I spread the word to as many people as I could that I was looking for a great, kind, mature man. I dated a few losers in between. Then after a year I met my now dh. He was a wonderful, stable, kind, mature man and we were married within a year. He is everything I deserve. I'm so glad to be on this journey with someone who *wants* with all he is able to want to be here on *this* road with me. You deserve the same!

Next point--I told BFF a few weeks after I met my now DH that if things didn't work between us, I was not going to date anymore and instead was going to figure out how I wanted to grow my family as a single mother by choice. I did the math and new that I could afford to do it alone and that I had enough of a support system that I thought I could manage.

In summary--What do *you* want? Is your BF able to provide you with or help you obtain those things? If not, is there a way you can get those things and still have your BF? Or is your lack of compatibility a deal breaker? If it is a deal breaker how can you arrange your life to get the things you want?

Basically, my ex was never going to be the husband/father I needed him to be. I took steps to change my life to make finding the husband/father I deserved possible. I had a plan if that part of the equation didn't pan out.

You may feel your clock ticking but 34 isn't too late to make life changes. Hypothetically, if you started dating again--guys who were marriage material--and spent a year seeing who was out there, you'd be 35. Let's say at the end of that year you met "the one". You could date for a year and have a year long engagement to plan THE wedding (if you want to get married) and be 37 when you married. Then let's say you decide to wait a year before TTC. Then at 38 you get pregnant and have your first child. At 40 you could be well on your way to 3 or 4 years of happy marriage and child #2. But this is sort of the life I think you want from reading a short post on a forum...What do *you* want? How do you want to live your life?

I wish you all the best! You are in a challenging time in your life. But it could also be really exciting!!!

Jenne

Thank you for sharing your story with me; your story inspires me that all is not lost...sometimes it is easy to fall prey to brooding and hopelessness...blah! And your advice about watch what he does, not what he says--I think I heard Dr. Laura say that once and remembered it in relation to this situation!! Is that where you heard it too?

Hmmmm, what do I want? In my ideal world, I want a life partner who will share things with me as equally as possible. Those things include finances, housework, emotional work, childrearing, and childcare. I want to be with a partner who shares many of my same beliefs and values, honors family and is in it to win it. Someone who I am attracted to, have awesome sex with, is fluid with gender expectations, is liberal, kind, generous, honest, loyal and healthy both mentally and physically. This someone may even come with a child of their own! I would be OK with that!! Now maybe I could have this BF and have those things too in another partner, but I am thinking it may be too hard to remain with him and find a partner to 'take his place,' so to speak. This BF thinks he is my 'life partner' right now, and he may have another thing coming in a week or two. *sigh*

I am also open to a platonic co-parenting arrangement where I may live with someone platonically and raise a little one together with them. I am actually pretty open to alternative lifestyle arrangements, but I am clear that I need support and enough adults around me who can help me nurture a little one. I know my support system here in my city of residence is pretty slim, so having a reliable partner around is essential. I used to be a nanny for a couple years in my early twenties and have mixed feelings about 'hiring help' as I used to be the help and I would feel excessively guilt-ridden if I could not pay top price..childcare jobs are one of the hardest in the world, and when I was doing that job, I realized that if it were my child, I would want to be spending all this time with them--I saw how much influence I had on the little one and how much their parents continually missed. And thank-goodness I was a very affectionate and responsible care giver! Oh I sure learned!

As for marriage, eh, I don't really believe in it right now. I believe in life-long commitment, but the state sanctioned stuff is not for me, nor is the wedding industry. I would like to have a commitment ceremony of some sort, though. I think that I am already really pretty clear with myself and and pretty self aware, and if/when I venture forth to find that illusive father to my children, I will find him pretty fast--that is if this situation is totally unworkable with my current dude. I feel like I am still in the negotiation stage with my BF, but as another poster pointed out, he's told me the truth about his desire to venture far and wide and spread his rock and roll across the land. Unless we create a truly alternative family and add another adult or parent to our current partnership...and that is not beyond the scope of reality as we are already in an open relationship

Thank you for asking me those questions!! That was super helpful...all this writing I am doing on here today has been very cathartic. Everyone here has been supportive and has offered awesome perspectives that help me think this out for myself. I can only hope this discussion in turn has helped someone, somewhere who may also be struggling. This is a challenging point in my life, but I feel it will work itself out with a little thoughtfulness and care.

Okay--so anyone out there have a gay brother who wants a baby and a co-parenting situation?? Seriously!!! (Queer friendly here)

[eatnobeef]

Originally Posted by lilmom

it's not too late, OP. Probably somewhere in your mind you are thinking, but if I break up with him, I'm taking that risk that I don't meet Mr. Wonderful who wants marriage and babies.

But personally, I vote for breaking up, acknowledging that it was a good thing, you learned alot, but now it's time for a real, grownup relationship with a man who has your same goals, on the same timeline.

I promise, there are lots of guys out there who want to get married to an educated, self-supporting woman who wants to be a mama. Guys who aren't perpetually chasing their youth, which is quickly fading into the sunset.

This BF has told you the truth. Be grateful for that. I married a guy (Ex!) who intentionally lied about not wanting children until we got married. He even admitted that he knew he was lying but knew that if he told me he didn't want kids that I would not marry him. Of course we got divorced. Then I met my wonderful DH, who did happen to want to get married & have kids. I'm your age too, and I really GET that clock ticking feeling.

But I think you will regret it way more if you stay, and hope for the best, rather than leave, and proactively SEEK what you are truly wanting in your life. Don't let any more time go by without making positive change for yourself. You can do it. You are WORTH having your dreams come true. Your future babies are WORTH making that choice, to provide them with a father who desperately wants to love them and parent them, and be your partner for life. Go for it!

The jury is still out on the outcome of this relationship with my current BF. AND you are right about me being worth my dreams coming true. They will come true, maybe just not with this fella. AND this is an adult relationship--he's an adult and so am I, we just have different priorities and that has to be honestly acknowledged. I am so grateful that he is being honest with me, and in my mind, that is super adult and mature. So cheers to him in that respect, and I am going to thank him for that the next time I speak with him

Man, this clock ticking feeling is INTENSE and defies logic at times. Which is why talking this out with many others right now is essential. My sex-drive and strange baby-thinking mind tell me to just get knocked up! It is insane!!! I grew up as a girl *never wanting kids* and then it was like this alien implanted something in my brain that re-programmed me to procreate!! Powerful! Thank goodness I have some wits left about me.

[Linda on the move]

Originally Posted by eatnobeef

Man, this clock ticking feeling is INTENSE and defies logic at times.

I understand.

If it helps, I'm 45 and everything still works right if I wanted to have another child. I seriously considered it 2 years ago, at age 43 (which is the same age my MIL was when she had my husband).

Couple of other thoughts -- although you say that you love this guy, you have no desire for his dreams to come true. You think his dreams are stupid and childish and that it will all be better when he gives them up.

It goes the other way around, too. He has no desire for your dreams to come true. Your dreams feel like a trap to him.

When two people are right for each other, they deeply desire the other person's dreams come true for them. You guys will never have that.

My advice isn't about your relationship with him, but about your other relationships. You say that you don't have much of a support network where you live except for him. Start working on building yourself a real life with a real support network. You've been putting all your energy into a sexual relationship which doesn't sound like it has a future, and IMHO, you need to diversify and start putting effort into friendships and intended community.

You may get far more clarity and peace on the boyfriend situation when it isn't your whole life.

[lilyka]

thats a VERY good point!!!!

Also I want to say it is good you two are being honest about your goals/dreams are and your vision for a meaningful life long family relationship are. I think the number one reasons people end up in stupid relationship disasters starts with dishonesty. Not only to others but to themselves. I think there were things my xh said to me that he really wanted to be true about himself and really thought he could bring it to reality. And then it did not happen.

[GuildJenn]

Originally Posted by Linda on the move

Couple of other thoughts -- although you say that you love this guy, you have no desire for his dreams to come true. You think his dreams are stupid and childish and that it will all be better when he gives them up.

It goes the other way around, too. He has no desire for your dreams to come true. Your dreams feel like a trap to him.

When two people are right for each other, they deeply desire the other person's dreams come true for them. You guys will never have that.

My advice isn't about your relationship with him, but about your other relationships. You say that you don't have much of a support network where you live except for him. Start working on building yourself a real life with a real support network. You've been putting all your energy into a sexual relationship which doesn't sound like it has a future, and IMHO, you need to diversify and start putting effort into friendships and intended community.

You may get far more clarity and peace on the boyfriend situation when it isn't your whole life.

I think Linda's advice here is spot-on. I was thinking of adding a post about how building a family with a "fixxer-upper" boyfriend doesn't work. If you're waiting for the big change, it's just - not good. I've read the discussion about growing up and honestly - many people don't (in the sense of settling down, having kids, getting a paycheque more regularly), and it is truly okay that they don't if they're not dragging a family through poverty.

You don't want to become the impediment to his happiness. Nor he yours.

My husband and I have remarkably similar goals most of the time and support each other a lot - and parenting has still been somewhat of a challenge at times. I can't imagine trying to manage it with someone who isn't fully invested and whose life choices I saw as immature or could not respect.

I'm also 39 and pregnant; we were actually more infertile in our 20s and early 30s than we have been since, but we might be an outlier couple that way.

[eatnobeef]

Originally Posted by Linda on the move

I understand.

If it helps, I'm 45 and everything still works right if I wanted to have another child. I seriously considered it 2 years ago, at age 43 (which is the same age my MIL was when she had my husband).

Couple of other thoughts -- although you say that you love this guy, you have no desire for his dreams to come true. You think his dreams are stupid and childish and that it will all be better when he gives them up.

It goes the other way around, too. He has no desire for your dreams to come true. Your dreams feel like a trap to him.

When two people are right for each other, they deeply desire the other person's dreams come true for them. You guys will never have that.

My advice isn't about your relationship with him, but about your other relationships. You say that you don't have much of a support network where you live except for him. Start working on building yourself a real life with a real support network. You've been putting all your energy into a sexual relationship which doesn't sound like it has a future, and IMHO, you need to diversify and start putting effort into friendships and intended community.

You may get far more clarity and peace on the boyfriend situation when it isn't your whole life.

That was pretty harsh, Linda On The Move. I have a lot to say back to that, but I'll probably just end up sounding defensive.

[spughy]

There's always someone who takes constructive criticism too far, please don't let it bother you. And, I don't think it's realistic to think that you need to meet someone whose dreams mesh perfectly with yours, but I do think that you need to be able to have faith in your partner, and it sounds as if that may be lacking right now? Part of life, and success in life, is understanding when to yield for a time, when to let things go, and when to hold firm. People who build dreams together generally do better together. If those dreams can incorporate parts of the individual dreams, so much the better - and I'm not convinced that you and your BF couldn't come to that, if you both wanted it. The question is, if he can alter his dreams a bit to mesh with yours, will you believe in what you dream together? Will he?

[eatnobeef]

Originally Posted by lilyka

My ex was never able to stop chasing his dreams (kid stuff. it involved touring around like a single guy, did not include a wife and kids.) I coerced him into marriage (I very in passionately said "listen. I want marriage and family and kinda quick. if you are not wanting that that is fine and all but I need to move on. the clock is clicking and I ma not backing down on this so either take me as I am or I am out of here." its not that I didn't love him dearly but just because you love someone doesn't mean they are husband and father material) and a family (he asked me how I would feel if he changed his mind about children I told him I would want to kill myself. for religious reasons I do not believe in divorce, so I would have been stuck and I would not have killed myself but a life sentence with a man who flushed my every dream down the toilet would have felt like death and would have killed out relationship and my spirit.) and it ended in absolute disaster.

Seriously, I know you love him and I don't doubt for a second he loves you but he does not want kids and you cannot for a second think he is going to magically warm up. Most men in that impossible position will bolt. My dad did (my mom was sure if she had a baby he would stay and mature and ...yeah...no. I was six weeks old) My husband left (he wanted a girlfriend and left me for a girl who would be the perfect girlfriend. she lives in another country, will drop everything for him, doesn't want children, can't have children with him and has disposable income. his dream girl) after I had my third. I was pregnant when the affair started. And this story has been repeated with so many people I know. IN a relationship with a great guy. girl wants domestic bliss. he does not. she doesn't believe him. She gets pregnant either by trickery (forgetting to take the birth control) of convinces him to do it for her. and BOOM disaster. They all thought he would suck it up and be a man once the baby got here. and he didn't. Don't risk it.

regarding moving in together. I do not know anyone who would live with someone before they were married. I just don't. None of them are religious. There are lots of reason. Some people just don't like living together when they are not married. For a lot it came down to making the break up complicated (i know several girls who stayed in terrible relationships, long dead, because they couldn't get out of the lease. seriously. whatever his reasons, no one is irresponsible simply because they don't want to live with someone they are not married to. there is no rule, written or unwritten saying this is expected or some sign of commitment. But perhaps he just doesn't feel comfortable explaining his real reasons why.

at any rate, just because he doesn't want o move in or have kids doesn't make him a bad guy. it doesn't even make him a bad boyfriend. but it very well make him the wrong guy for you. the wrong boyfriend.

I know it sucks. I am 35 and I want to have another kid sooooo bad. and not be a single parent. i want a loving sweet here for me sort of husband. (the kind I never had ) and a loved and wanted baby (even though I have three kids none of them was ever joyfully conceived or announced. No blissful nine months of joyful expectation and sharing hands on the belly, listening to heartbeats, holding my hand during prenatal visits. nope. i was the bad guy for getting knocked up. and it suuuuuuuuuuucked being that guy.) I want all of it. I want the whole experience. from planning the pregnancy to sharing it, to being totally love crazy over this new little person and excited to be stuck to each other for the rest of our lives. but I am 35. single. with no hope on the horizon. But no way, no how will I settle for anything less this time. I would rather skip it then make the mistake of hitching my ovarian cart to a reluctant, non excited future father.

Yours is definitely a tale of caution. I do not want to squelch anyone's dreams. I do not want to box any one in. He is definitely reluctant. The moving in thing...I guess we live in different places with different cultural norms-most couples I know live together before they marry, and I honestly would not want to commit my life to someone w/o practicing being a roommate first, just seems like common sense to me. But, you may have a point in saying that there may be other reasons why he does not want to live with me

I'm just feeling pretty down and sad at the moment. My heart doesn't want to follow my head.

[AllisonR]

OK, your BF wants to be a rock star. How serious is he being in achieving this goal? I mean RIGHT NOW? Is he practicing hours every day, is he doing the really yuck work that has to be done to take off - trying to get gigs, trying to schmooze with other musicians... (OK, I don't know music industry, but I know fine arts, and believe me, it isn't all about sitting in a studio making pretty pictures - more than 50% of the time is going to galleries and trying to get your name and face out there and getting rejected, networking with other artists, sending out promo material and getting rejected, approaching alternate spaces and getting rejected, and if you do get in, then carting the work there and back on your day off and selling only 2 paintings, maybe nothing, for your efforts. Next day, repeat, rinse.... Point is, the arts are really hard, and it is a pipe dream if you aren't putting in the effort and trying really, really hard. If you are trying really hard, then it is a learning experience, and it will pay off in small ways (though not much money for the time invested), and in the long hall can pay off tremendously (though the chances are slim). If you try really hard and don't "make it" you can still feel good about yourself because of your efforts (self-realization here). Unfortunately, in the arts, there is not much in between no income and a generous income.

I ask all this because I think it affects everything. If he is really busting his bum and you get pregnant, he might end up trying to be the good father figure and really resent you "taking his chance away." If he is not busting his bum, then maybe he is living in a dream world and a pregnancy is forcing reality to intrude into his fantasy.

[eatnobeef]

Originally Posted by AllisonR

OK, your BF wants to be a rock star. How serious is he being in achieving this goal? I mean RIGHT NOW? Is he practicing hours every day, is he doing the really yuck work that has to be done to take off - trying to get gigs, trying to schmooze with other musicians... (OK, I don't know music industry, but I know fine arts, and believe me, it isn't all about sitting in a studio making pretty pictures - more than 50% of the time is going to galleries and trying to get your name and face out there and getting rejected, networking with other artists, sending out promo material and getting rejected, approaching alternate spaces and getting rejected, and if you do get in, then carting the work there and back on your day off and selling only 2 paintings, maybe nothing, for your efforts. Next day, repeat, rinse.... Point is, the arts are really hard, and it is a pipe dream if you aren't putting in the effort and trying really, really hard. If you are trying really hard, then it is a learning experience, and it will pay off in small ways (though not much money for the time invested), and in the long hall can pay off tremendously (though the chances are slim). If you try really hard and don't "make it" you can still feel good about yourself because of your efforts (self-realization here). Unfortunately, in the arts, there is not much in between no income and a generous income.

I ask all this because I think it affects everything. If he is really busting his bum and you get pregnant, he might end up trying to be the good father figure and really resent you "taking his chance away." If he is not busting his bum, then maybe he is living in a dream world and a pregnancy is forcing reality to intrude into his fantasy.

No, he's busting it. He's in the studio 20 hours a week with his band and he is really on the other members for following through with learning new material and making it to practice sober (there is a heavy drinker in the band who struggles). He is trying to get gigs, but those have been few and far between. Like all of us, there are so many other factors in his life as well: health issues, other side projects, finances, etc. that affect his abilities to succeed. His band is really very good, but like you were saying, the chances of 'making it' the way he specifically wants to make it seem pretty slim. One thing I want to make clear: I support him being a musician. I support him being successful--I find it hard if not unethical as a friend to him and a partner to support something that is most likely doomed to failure. It is not that I think his dreams are stupid or childish, they are not realistic. I am honest with the people around me, as I want my people to be honest with me. Would I be awesome and supportive to be like, 'oh ya, follow your bliss, you'll make it just fine!!' Um, no. I'd be totally blowing smoke you know where. He does not have the connections he needs out there, nor the practice playing live. I know he is really going to put in the effort--he's made that clear. He's talked about quitting his day job and jumping in the van and just driving--forget that he has $18 to his name right now. Perhaps I am more of a pragmatist. I've suggested that he try another avenue using music to make money, like teaching or directing. He was very offended I suggested it, and accused me of being 'selfish.' He is pretty inflexible about all this. He's gotta do what he's gotta do though and if he needs to fail and it makes him feel like a man, alright then. So it is time to be real and just say, look, good luck fella, talk to you on the flip side of all this.

It is tough and sad and I actually think he'll look back and regret all this. If I stay I risk some serious regrets.

[eatnobeef]

Originally Posted by spughy

There's always someone who takes constructive criticism too far, please don't let it bother you. And, I don't think it's realistic to think that you need to meet someone whose dreams mesh perfectly with yours, but I do think that you need to be able to have faith in your partner, and it sounds as if that may be lacking right now? Part of life, and success in life, is understanding when to yield for a time, when to let things go, and when to hold firm. People who build dreams together generally do better together. If those dreams can incorporate parts of the individual dreams, so much the better - and I'm not convinced that you and your BF couldn't come to that, if you both wanted it. The question is, if he can alter his dreams a bit to mesh with yours, will you believe in what you dream together? Will he?

Thanks for that. I didn't let the *constructive criticism* bother me, which is why I didn't respond. But it was harsh without really knowing me, which we risk by hanging our guts out online in forums like this.

I agree with your ideas about yielding, letting go and holding firm. I don't know if we can come to any sort of compromise right now, but I am willing to wait for him, a year or two, to get this out of his system. I'll support him leaving and doing it--with no bun in the oven or already hatched, and I will wait, albeit with the option to date other people. My timeline is to get pregnant in 1 year. I'll hopefully be ready at that time--but I may not be either, no one can tell. I am definitely not ready to get pregnant *right* now. I just pretty much announced to him that I'd be ready in about a year's time, which gives him time as well to give his tour a shot. He seems to think that he'll be traveling a lot over the next 5 years, though. That is the part that seems unrealistic. It is all hypothetical, and I am annoyed with talking in the extreme hypothetical about things that have not yet come to pass. I am pessimistic about his touring idea, and I ain't going to pretend it is a good idea. But I *do* hope he succeeds! Sometimes our others do things we don't agree with or even remotely support--that is reality. I've done somethings that he disagrees with, and he's honest about it, and I thank him for that. I feel pretty torn up about all this in general, it is hard but I trust I will make the right choice for myself.

[Linda on the move]

Originally Posted by eatnobeef

I find it hard if not unethical as a friend to him and a partner to support something that is most likely doomed to failure. It is not that I think his dreams are stupid or childish, they are not realistic.

I'm not saying that you should support someone's dreams when they seem unrealistic to you. I'm saying that his dreams seeming unrealistic to you is a big red flag.

When the right guys tells you his dreams, you'll think they sound cool. You'll want him to have his dreams and for your dreams to merge together into a wonderful life.

He's talked about quitting his day job and jumping in the van and just driving--forget that he has $18 to his name right now.

he is not father material at this point in his life.

I'm not trying to mean. *most* women need a lot of social support while raising a child, more than a partner can provide. A sympathetic person to talk to, another set of hands to hold the baby while shopping, a friend to drop dinner off when a breast infection sets in. It takes a village and all that.

You were offended by my suggestion that you need broader social support. It was VERY good advice. Even if you had the perfect partner it would be good advice.

Having a baby is tough on relationships, and many couples who both want the baby and dreamed of how wonderful it would be really struggle once it is here because it adds so much stress to the relationship.

[AllisonR]

Linda, I totally disagree with you, and totally agree with you....

Originally Posted by Linda on the move

I'm not saying that you should support someone's dreams when they seem unrealistic to you. I'm saying that his dreams seeming unrealistic to you is a big red flag.

When the right guys tells you his dreams, you'll think they sound cool. You'll want him to have his dreams and for your dreams to merge together into a wonderful life.

Disagree here. She can think his dream is cool, but be truly honest about it as well. I'm a painter, and I work hard at it, and promote my work. But I also work a "day" job and take care of my family and do laundry and a million other things, because it is necessary, but also healthy and balanced in my relationship with DH and my DS and DD. Now I could quit my job tomorrow, DH's income is enough, and say I'm just going to be a fine artist, and try to make money at that. And doing it full time I would probably make a lot more money with art than I do now. But it would still be 1/10th or 1/25th of my previous income. Or I could say I am going to only do art, not a "day" job, but then I will do all the childcare (not interested) or all the cooking, cleaning, bill paying, misc errands.... It doesn't matter really how you divy it up, that's between the two people, and it is never exactly "fair", but it has to b reasonably balanced, or there ends up a lot of unhealthy resentment and stress. In the OPs scenario, I just don't see what the guy is going to contribute. She is the main bread winner, so maybe in a different relationship he could be the stay at home dad, but according to the OP, his view on childcare was yuck. He won't be financially supportive, at the moment he can not be emotionally supportive, and he plans on traveling so not even being physically present and supportive. I just can't see what he could contribute. And a baby is hard, even if you have the income, support and extra hands. Seems to me it would be easier for her as a single parent.

Originally Posted by Linda on the move

You were offended by my suggestion that you need broader social support. It was VERY good advice. Even if you had the perfect partner it would be good advice.

Having a baby is tough on relationships, and many couples who both want the baby and dreamed of how wonderful it would be really struggle once it is here because it adds so much stress to the relationship.

This I agree with. Like you said - it takes a village. Having all your eggs in one basket isn't healthy, nor conductive to making clear decisions. The bigger support system you have, the easier it will be for you. Different people have different things they can offer to a relationship.

[Bia]

I'm there with you on the clock ticking... I'm 36, and have been a mother (several years ago... fostered for several months with adoption in the works before the bio family changed their minds, long story) and have been pg (miscarried after losing foster son) so for me to know exactly what I'm missing as well as always having my foster son in my heart... well, you can imagine how difficult it is for me to still be waiting for the right man and waiting to be a mom again, as I can imagine how hard your situation is for you right now! I'm sorry you have to deal with this.
Everyone has given you great advice but I wanted to add something. When I was a mom before it was complicated, having to co-parent in a horrible situation with a man who should never have had any control over a child's life, and it led me to know for certain that I will *never* knowingly put myself in such a vulnerable co-parenting situation again. I will either be in a committed relationship with a man who is in agreement with me on all major parenting issues (for me things like home birth, vaccination, circ, etc), which we will talk about before ttc, or I will use a sperm bank.
Please do yourself a huge favor and read through these forums... find all the major issues that you will not compromise on... write them down and get clear. If you are planning a baby, planning who will co-parent with you... discuss these issues before conceiving.
All the best to you. I hope you can reach a decision that feels right and brings peace.

[Qbear'smama]

Originally Posted by Jenne

Okay, I have a few thoughts...

Some of the best man advice I ever heard was, "Pay no attention to what he says. Pay attention only to what he does." This also lets you off the hook for "reading into" what he is saying.

So, I divorced at 30 after 3 years of marriage. Other than my ex was a verbally abusive UAV he also announced right around our 1 year anniversary that he had changed his mind and didn't want kids. Ever. I had known since I was a child that I wanted to be a Mom. I decided that I would spend the year of my divorce dating as many men as I could. I would have a blast going on first dates. I spread the word to as many people as I could that I was looking for a great, kind, mature man. I dated a few losers in between. Then after a year I met my now dh. He was a wonderful, stable, kind, mature man and we were married within a year. He is everything I deserve. I'm so glad to be on this journey with someone who *wants* with all he is able to want to be here on *this* road with me. You deserve the same!

1) ITA with the advice. My ex said all the things he knew I wanted to hear, but his actions indicated otherwise. I wasted a lot of years listening and ignoring what he was doing.

2) The above scenario happened to me too, even divorcing at 30 after 3 years. My ex sprung that "changed my mind" thing on me, too and I knew it was a dealbreaker and told him so. I think he was shocked to hear that and tried to placate me with "well, I'll do it for you if that's what you want" No, I wanted a guy who would be as excited about a baby and a child as I was and who wouldn't throw it in my face at 3am when the poop hit the fan with a screaming baby (possibly literally!). In counselling I realized that what I wanted was just not compatible with who I wanted it with and that I could still have those things, just not with him. I definitely could have had an "oops" with my ex, but I knew I wanted more for my kids in a dad, maybe because I had a crappy one and wanted more for them. My current DH loooooves being a dad and watching him interact with our DD has been so amazing, I wish every kid had a dad like him. Like a PP said, you so don't want to be that person who screwed up his life by getting pregnant, your child will pay the price for that. People told me that my ex *might* change if I just went ahead and got pregnant and I honestly thought about it in my darker moments, but in the end I was not willing to take that chance and I know that it would have broken my heart to see that my partner was not as into having this child as I was.

I remember fully how shattered I was when I realized that the one I was with was not the one I needed to be with to be truly happy. I know how sad you feel about this! But I am so much happier now than I ever would have been with my ex who would have half-assed his way through parenting (if he went as far as half-assing it!) and making me feel like crap for having a baby. You so deserve to have parenting be as amazing as it should be, rather than "yes, I'm happy to be a mama, but I wish his dad was more into it" knowing you made the wrong choice.