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Mediation--from good to ugly

post #1 of 13
Thread Starter 
H and I had a mediation session last week with a very experienced mediator who is a practicing divorce lawyer, 15 years mediation experience, knows the laws and judges in our jurisdiction, etc., claims over a 98% success rate.

H went in not wanting to pay CS at all because I make more $ than him. I plan on going back to work PT after maternity leave. The mediator really laid it out for him and explained he had no choice, the CS forumula is what it is, and that H is actually very lucky that I'm going back to work at all and that I make a good salary.

He said that no judge will fault me for not going back at all until the children are at least two. H went on to say that he should go to PT schedule and the mediator told him he could, but the CS would still be calculated at his full time rate because he was intentionally under-employing himself. It was like a breath of fresh air! I just kept my mouth shut and let the mediator tell H all the things I've been trying to get through to him.

Of course the mediator said things in a more compassionate and neutral way, sympathized with H, yea it sucks you have to pay CS but you do. I also asked the mediator isn't the CS law changing soon and mediator also threw in that yes, the law has been updated and goes into affect in October. I probed a bit more and said, won't the calcutlations be even higher and he said yes they would, so it's better to agree now, so that you can be grandfathered in under the old law (thought this might help H to not drag this out).

Overall I was pretty happy with the mediation session and the competence of the mediator and we planned on resolving a few things amongst ourselves and going back to mediator in two weeks. The mediator thought we would only need one more session before he could complete the agreement.

Well, H tells me at dropoff yesteday, out of the blue, while I'm holding son who is feverish and cranky, and after I just spent 45 minutes commuting, that he's going for shared physical custody so he doesn't have to pay child support, and that with his schedule (4 days off in a row), there's no reason any judge won't agree to it, and that if I don't agree then he'll get a lawyer and take me to court!!!!! Well I of course lost it and totally not in the frame of mind to discuss this. Over the last few weeks I made a point of scheduling time with H when DS is napping or elsewhere to try to work out these things, or do it via email, not drop this "compromise" as H says out of the blue.

Yes, he said this is his compromise and that if I don't start negotiating he has no recourse. What???? I went into total defensive mode, then he brings up how I've cut him out of the new baby's life (I'm still pregnant!) by not finding out the sex when he wanted to find out and blah blah...it's my body until the baby's born, right? No according to him, he has every right to my medical records and medical everything as long as we're married, he says. What????

I don't even know what to make of it all. I've been crying all night and on the drive to work and even at work. Damn pregnancy hormones don't help.

I went through the entire 'what you wish you would have put in your agreement" thread and made up an agreement that I want to take to the mediator. Basically, I think if I give H more for the house to "offset" the CS for the first few years, he might not push shared physical custody with 4 overnights a week (can't believe I'm even writing this).

My sister thinks I should just get a lawyer now, file for back CS and nail him for being a jerk, but I'm afraid of what a judge might do and also, trying to be as strategic about this as possible. Gah.

WWYD at this point? Is shared physical custody really as hard as I'm imagining in my fear-driven mind?? Not seeing your babies for possibly 4 nights at a time (no way am I volunaritly agreeing to this with a breastfed infant under 1 year!!!) DS (2 in September) has NEVER spent a night away from me and H did very VERY little nighttime parenting when he lived with us...

I'm going to post my parenting plan in another thread for feedback.
post #2 of 13
Wow, Mama, what an ass...

Well, certainly NO judge will grant partial custody for a baby who's exclusively nursing; that's a given, so you at least don't have to worry about that. As for your other child(ren), man, don't know what your legal recourse is, but I would certainly make it known to the judge that REASON your H gave for wanting is was so he didn't have to pay child support.

Oh, that's so sucky of your H to do this to you... I don't blame you for crying, I would, too, but YOU CAN DO THIS. It sounds like your lawyer/mediator knows what he's doing - have you told him of this latest update? His recommendation may be for you to hire a lawyer, too, if you can afford it. :

Sorry I can't be more help, but I'm just getting started with this whole process myself...

Sending anti-jackass vibes your way!!
post #3 of 13
You can still have a lawyer while you go to mediation. Yes it's more mula, but at least you'll have representation hired to work FOR YOU, to give you a "lay of the land" in terms of what you can expect legally. You can have the proceedings drafted quietly while you continue to go to one last mediation session, with your proposed parenting plan in hand. See what comes of the mediation session.

If it fails, then you indicate in your sworn affidavit that you gave mediation a fair try, proposed some compromises and mention that your X wants shared physical custody specifically to reduce CS costs. Make sure that what you're proposing doesn't look like you're trying to take away his parenting time. Keep on facilitating visitation, but document EVERYTHING (lateness, missed appointments, last minute cancellations, any harassments or threats, etc). Have him served very quickly after mediation fails.

(this is what I did...we tried 2 mediation sessions and after a blowout, XH failed to show up to the 3rd session. The mediator wasn't phased and just produced a "mediation failed" report. I had him served for custody of my DD soon after.)

If mediation doesn't fail, then great, you can move on to another phase of your separation.

It doesn't hurt to be prepared...

Re: your X wanting control of your medical care while you are pregnant...you really need to consult with a lawyer on this one. I personally think it's baseless but you really need to check...
post #4 of 13
Even at the age of your oldest, I don't think the guidelines would support having four consecutive nights apart. I think two is the max recommended. It sounds like if money is the motivating factor, then a trade-off with his share in the house might work. It sounds like his sudden change of heart was equally intended to rile you up and extend the back and forth.

Do you have an agreement to follow through with mediation exclusively? Even if you are mediating, you do need your own lawyer to go over the agreement. I would say that it's probably wise to stop trying to talk to him about this except through a third party.

Have you read Mom's House, Dad's House yet? Although I can't see a judge ordering that amount of time with him, you still will need to forge a long-term parenting agreement of some sort. Sounds like he still needs some major cooling off time. Ugh.
post #5 of 13
that is so whacked! i wish i had some words of wisdom. he has no right to make medical decisions for you and no right to your medical records. that is the only thing i really know.

i don't think joint custody is the worst thing in the world, especially when it's done because both parents genuinely want that time with their kids because they love them and enjoy parenting. when one parent is going after that to punish the other parent or to avoid paying cs? blech. i hope you get sole custody. judges are supposed to decide these things based on what's in the kids' best interests. "i don't wanna pay" has nothing to do with what's best for the kids. maybe he's just trying to scare you, or to get joint custody on paper but with no intention of actually taking his awarded parenting time.
post #6 of 13
Thread Starter 
Thanks for the replies. I've had some time to calm down about the whole situation. To be considered shared physical custody, H would have to have DS for 35% of overnights or 128 days a year minimum. I seriously can't see that happening, especially when DS is so little, H has no interest in overnights, since he hasn't asked for a single one since he's been moved out. He does see DS a few times a week during the day, and I'm happy that he's involved and do want to continue that relationship (and I'm documenting everything).

It's all about the CS amount. The mediator told us that if you agree to a CS amount much lower than the formula, the judge will review it and has the discretion and apparently uses it in our jurisdiction to change the CS to match the formula or won't grant the divorce. H is worried and is trying to find ways to reduce his obligation.

I think him throwing in the comments about the medical stuff is his way of trying to hurt me because he feels I'm out to get him by asking for CS (crazy I know).

And the mediator did tell us that after he drafts the separation agreement, we each should absolutely hire our own lawyers to review the agreement and make sure we are comfortable with it before we sign. I've got some recommendations for great lawyers from my sister who works in forensic accounting on high dollar divorce cases and won't hesitate to go down that road if the mediation fails.

Thanks again everyone for the words of encouragement. It really really helps.
post #7 of 13
he sounds like a real winner
post #8 of 13
I was told the same thing about CS here in Quebec when I wanted to offer XH a lower amount than the provincial standards: I just can't do that. The judge would overturn my decision summarily.

Do you have written proof from him that he wants shared custody to lower his CS amount? I wonder what the judge would do if he saw that...
post #9 of 13
Quote:
Originally Posted by kryztuh View Post
I've got some recommendations for great lawyers from my sister who works in forensic accounting on high dollar divorce cases and won't hesitate to go down that road if the mediation fails.

Thanks again everyone for the words of encouragement. It really really helps.
Honestly? I would start getting some consultations NOW so that you have a lawyer on retainer if you end up needing one. This way you have some time to find one that you really mesh with, that you like and who agree's with you on your major points. Not all lawyer's are created equal (DUH!), but even great lawyers don't always get along with their clients. It's always good to be prepared. Especially since this mediation doesn't seem to be going so great.
post #10 of 13
Your stbx isn't going to be able to get any type of control over your medical care (I am assuming that you are in the US). He can't make you go to a certain doctor, he can't get any information regarding any of your check-ups (including sonograms and pictures of sonograms), he can't even be in the delivery room without your permission. Even if you are married. You are an adult and the HIPPAA laws apply. He's trying to intimidate you and is hoping that you aren't aware of your rights.

As for going for shared custody, is he exercising all of his parenting time now? If not, start documenting it. It won't help his case if he isn't seeing them as much as the temp plan allows or keeps blowing off visits even if there isn't one in place.

However; if you are in one of the stupid states that have a presumption of 50/50 physical, you are going to have a battle on your hands. One that you may very well lose if he is using all of his parenting time. And this includes with a nursing newborn. Some states won't even let you use the argument of bfing to prevent 50/50. You really need to find out the laws in your state.
post #11 of 13
I have been through this twice with friends and the sooner you have a lawyer the better. The men feel less able to intimidate you when they have to go through a lawyer to get to you! Don't let him get to you with that cutting him out of the baby's life. He did that all on his own. He has zero rights to your medical information. Even your midwife's office can't leave lab results on a shared voice mail or give him any information about your pregnancy. Its a HUGE HIPPA violation. You are in no way required to share visits, ultrasound pictures, or any of this pregnancy with him married or separated!
post #12 of 13
I think you should nail him and not give at all. Let him pay the higher child support when it goes in to effect. Good luck.
post #13 of 13
Make sure you let the midwife know that he might try to cause troubles at the birth or with records. I would not have him at the birth. You only should have SUPPORT people there, not mean rude people there.
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