14 yr old daughter lied, how should i deal with it? - Page 2

[LavenderMae]

I'm not really understanding how she lied. Was she not supposed to hang out with any boys at the dance at all? I don't consider what you described a date.

[choli]

Originally Posted by song_of_the_soule

Other people tell me that i should let her date now, all the kids are, and if i don't, she will do it anyway and just lie about it.

I do not want her to lose respect for me, or maybe she already is being that she LIED to me about something so important.

Which is exactly what happened.

You can tell someone they are forbidden to date until you turn blue in the face, it's really not going to be enforceable.

You'd be a lot better off allowing her to date and have her be open and honest with you.

[madeirameg]

Originally Posted by 2xy

You can either be a barrier or a door for your children. We don't protect them by forbidding things. They will just find a way to sneak around you to have what they want. They will be better protected by being armed with confidence and information, and the trust of their parents that they are capable human beings who can make decisions regarding their own lives.

I love this! You've managed to say exactly what I feel

[simonee]

My dd is only 11, but I'm absolutely confident I don't need to set up dating rules for her because she can do it herself. I trust her and her friends, and I know she has the confidence to make choices based on her own needs. And if she runs into a situation she's not comfortable with, I would really like her to trust me enough to ask for advice.

By forbidding things and setting rather arbitrary rules, I'm not sure if your DD feels she's got the space to trust you enough to be confident you give her the space she wants and are there for her when she needs it.

Also, I've never experienced or heard any good coming from grounding a 14-yo, not from the parent's perspective, anyway

[Arduinna]

I understand you being upset about her lying. I'm just not sure that I consider attending graduation as dating, when it could have been just an escort. Was it a friend? Is she secretly meeting up with this person and having a romantic relationship with them or was this someone that just went to the dance with her? What did you think she would do at a dance? Did you not want her dancing at all?

[savithny]

To clarify -- is she attending an all-girls school? Are there boys in her classes? Did you know there would be boys at the dance? Were you clear with her about your expectations that she should not dance, nor should she talk to any boys nor stand near enough to be photographed with one?

There will be boys at school dances. They may ask her to dance. She may stand near them. She may even talk to them. She probably already has talked to some of them in class or in the hallway, unless it is an all-girls school (you don't say).

If you knew there would be boys at this event and you let her attend, I think I (and most reasonable people) would consider that as constituting the right to speak with, dance with, and generally enjoy the company of boys in public spaces during the evening.

I think it's very important with preteens (and teens like your DD) to be clear about your expectations and what you mean by things like "dating." A lot of those words have different meanings now than they did when we were young -- and honestly, they had different meanings when we were young than they did when our parents were young! If you don't want her "dating" you need to sit down and define the term. Talk about what you do and don't plan to allow, and give some idea of why.

But at root, I think if you let her go to the dance and you knew there would be boys there, to call her out and say she "lied to you" about speaking to a boy -- even if it is obvious in the picture that they are quite friendly -- makes you the one in the wrong, not her.

[eclipse]

Originally Posted by simonee

My dd is only 11, but I'm absolutely confident I don't need to set up dating rules for her because she can do it herself. I trust her and her friends, and I know she has the confidence to make choices based on her own needs. And if she runs into a situation she's not comfortable with, I would really like her to trust me enough to ask for advice.

By forbidding things and setting rather arbitrary rules, I'm not sure if your DD feels she's got the space to trust you enough to be confident you give her the space she wants and are there for her when she needs it.

Also, I've never experienced or heard any good coming from grounding a 14-yo, not from the parent's perspective, anyway

Totally OT but, 11? When did that happen? (Liam is almost 10, so it makes sense, but still, 11?)

[journeymom]

I'll just throw this in there:

Group dates are a wonderful solution! Dating in groups is soooo much fun!

Our kids are allowed to go on group dates until they're 16. Then the single dates can commence.

Mom, this is one of those forks-in-the-road moments with you and your daughter. Look at the situation very carefully. I suppose she may have lied to you. But please be very careful not to blast her for this.

Frankly, how you approach this with her will help her set the tone for keeping it FUN, and happy and a little less intense, less involved at this tender age. If you have a good attitude about her, and demonstrate that you believe she's just a regular gal who has normal crushes and maybe even wants to kiss a guy... well by golly, she might be quite satisfied with just that for a couple of years.

If your fears are subtly communicating to her that you're afraid she's going to go get in trouble with the first boy she dances with, then she might tune you out, dig in her heels, or worse yet, believe it about herself.

I dearly, dearly wish my parents had not assumed I was a hell bent for leather teen when I was all of 14 years old. I really wasn't.

[frugalmum]

Have you explained to her why she should not date at such a young age, or just lay down the law, expecting her to follow it? I don't know if you are a Christian, but there are many excellent books for young Christian women about saving oneself for married, "courting" instead of "dating," avoiding emotional promiscuity, etc.. We are very strict and conservative with our children but we always explain WHY and make sure they understand.

You said all her friends are dating-- perhaps the school / peer environment is an unhealthy one-- would you consider homeschooling, or putting her in a Christian school?

Society will tell you to be "sex positive" and allow her "freedom" but if you have strong beliefs on this matter, and know in your heart that your job is protect her, stick to your guns. But you have to do it in a loving, communicative manner, all the while accepting that it may not work and you must love her just as much nonetheless.

hugs {{}}

[bestjob]

The OP raises some interesting points, and I'd like to revisit those points. Who was the "date"? When was it arranged? Did her dd feel forced into it and why?

Community is a huge part of life, and this MDC community has come down strongly on the side of the dd and going to the dance.

But, does the OP's real life community support their family? I truly believe that real life is much more important than online life, and there may be many reasons for the parents to resist their daughter's decision to have a date.

[song_of_the_soule]

First of all, i would like to apologize for taking sooo long to comment on all your wonderful feedback. I tried a few times, but i have many children who vie for my attention and have very little privacy.

I do see the value in group dating and do allow it. My children are permitted to go out as a mixed gender group or go on group dates at the age of 14. I do not allow one on one dating until the age of 16 because i feel they will be more emotionally ready for the intensity of it all at that age. This is my hope anyway.

No, it is not an all girls school, and yes, in my opinion, it is not the healthiest environment. I know my daughter's friends at school do things that i would not allow in a million years. She often feels "different" because she does not do what they do and that i am more strict about what i want her around than some of her friend's parents (whom often leave their teenagers unattended with with alcohol in the house and opposite sex friends, if you catch my drift.)

When she is to go over to a new friend's house, I ALWAYS must meet the parents, scope the environment before i will allow her to spend time there. I do this for my children. It is our family rule that i must know the parents and they must have supervision. There has been times where i had to put my daughter (different daughter) back in the car and not allow her to visit her friend because that friend's father was drinking and smoking pot in the house, with the kids, handicapped ones at that! (my oldest has down syndrome, she is 16) My 14 yr old is a little embarrassed about this rule i think, because all her friends are so very unattended. I cannot have her in a place that could lead her down the wrong path.

I know she lied about the date because one of her friends posted a picture of my daughter on facebook and tagged her, so it showed up on my FB homepage. It was my 14 yr old and a boy looking very intense, standing chest to chest, holding each other (not in a buddy way, but in an we are intimate way.) I asked my daughter about the photo as soon as i seen it and she said "oh, we were just dancing." (which i have been ok with ever since she started going to dances at the age of 11.) The thing is, the photo was taken in one of the private areas at the graduation event, not anywhere near the dance floor, it was one of the conference rooms across the hall from where the party was occurring. He is a very bad apple boy too :-(

I know she is not sneaking around because she is not going anywhere but home for any length of time. I am encouraging her to spend time with friends, but she says they are not around. I hope she meets some new and wonderful ones soon. High school starts in a few weeks.

Someone asked if i was taken advantage of as a teen and thought that might be why i am limiting to my children. The answer is a big fat YES. I was completely unattended, given no structure or rules, no mentorship, nothing. I had to take care of my very sick (mentally and physically) and addicted mother and was afraid of my alcoholic father. Needless to say, i have no family supports now with my children and i work very hard to be everything they need to turn out right.

I really appreciate some of the feedback i have been given here. Boy, i wish i had that in my physical life. It sure does help to have someone else give feedback and ideas.

I agree that maybe i set her up to lie to me. All the other kids did have dates, she was not allowed to, she tried to respect me on it. I think that because she waited so long to say the hell with it and get a date, she missed out on the boy she really did like (and i think is a far better choice) and went with the one who was not the best choice.

I need to find a book or something, something to help steer me as i try to steer this family. I was thinking maybe the books "how to listen so kids will talk" and "how to talk so kids will listen." I think they are called that.

I have been so worried about my children being hurt that i have been a little overly strict. Also, i had been pretty much abandoned with them, the oldest being challenged (and my protection of her) had really set the tone for the family, and all the children that followed.

I really struggle, but so far, my kids are turning out very well. I am going to have to work even harder now because my exhusband is hinting at taking my two teenage daughters to live with him and his wife (they live 20 hours away!) I cannot have that, so i really have to get this all as perfect as i can.

How to strike a balance without being too strict or too permissive while not having a good support system, an adequate income, enough energy or time. Now this is the biggest challenge of my life.

In a few days my 14 yr old and I are going together for mother/daughter day to get her nose pierced. She asked my permission. i have a nose piercing, so i see how she would think it would look beautiful. I wear a diamond stud, have since the year she was born.

I hope this will help our relationship. They are all so very important to me and i want them to be happy and strong.

[2timestrouble]

I understand how you are feeling, me to (like others) have told my daughter she could date until 16, now here are my reasons:
-I say 16, but I am aware to the possibility that it will happen before, but I have the feeling that if I had say 12 is ok she will have one now.
-I think that when she have her first boy friend her grades will lower, and I understand why and think is normal, but this is her first school year she got into honors in school, this have change her actitud toward school, she is more happy and proud, I wish at least another year like this so she can really see the difference between the feelings of just an "almost fail" to "here is your medal of honor"
-Maybe other teens "dating" mature at early age, but my daughters is not so much, we talk a lot about boys, which I love because I get to see what is her thinking about boys and dating. many times we play "who would you rather date?" example: A guy that is kind of ugly but treat you amazing, or the super hot guy but is very coincided and egocentric? I see her thinking, lol. Many of her friends are dating already, and we talk about it, example: Mat broke up with Beth and 3 days later is dating Sue, and now Beth is so hurt. Isn't Mat one of the guys that you have a crush? Good thing you wait a little longer to get to know him better, I will be heart broken if you were in Beth shoes.
-Which it bring me to one of my most important reason for my daughter to wait a little longer, "I don't want her to get hurt, and I know it will happen because kids at this age get very passionate about this (AKA: He is the love of mylive and the only men that will be in my life, without him I will die....). I wish she can wait to be be more mature to pick and to deal with the brake up.
With that saying (which I know it was a lot of saying ) I agree with the others that the picture is not prove enough that she is dating, I have many pictures with men friends that I never dated or wanted date.
But if you find out she is dating, well, I will punish for lie but will be open to talk about the dating rule. If you have other daughters younger then her, I will make her also understand that if you accept let her date that you know that that will also bring changes to her siblings.
If your daughter is dating, I think that even if it wasn't the age you wish, you take this as a learning experience and a tool to bound with her.
Good luck to you.

[song_of_the_soule]

The "who would you date" game sounds like a great idea. We kind of do that too. She loves Adam Lambert, Johnny Depp, and Chriss Angel. She is an innocent type girl, but is a little bit of a melancholy artist type. I used to have a lot of artist friends, but i got married in 07 and my whole life changed (that marriage is separated right now.)

I like how you illustrated how your daughter's friends were hurt by the same boy because they did not wait to get to know him like she did. That is something she could relate to.

I really have to be mindful in my parenting, it is hard. I really do not like the way many people I know parent, so i am always on the look out for a mentor. So far, nada, but there have been some close ones. usually the really great ones have good family networks, whereas, i have none. I do not allow my kids around my family of origin often. It is a little tiring as i have to always gauge if they are sober or not, or appropriate. I really hate that, i wish there was an adult adoption agency lol.

[Storm Bride]

Originally Posted by song_of_the_soule

I know she lied about the date because one of her friends posted a picture of my daughter on facebook and tagged her, so it showed up on my FB homepage. It was my 14 yr old and a boy looking very intense, standing chest to chest, holding each other (not in a buddy way, but in an we are intimate way.) I asked my daughter about the photo as soon as i seen it and she said "oh, we were just dancing." (which i have been ok with ever since she started going to dances at the age of 11.) The thing is, the photo was taken in one of the private areas at the graduation event, not anywhere near the dance floor, it was one of the conference rooms across the hall from where the party was occurring. He is a very bad apple boy too :-(

I'm still not getting why you say she was dating/lying. Have you clarified that not dating means not talking to a boy anywhere except on/beside the dance floor? That does seem to be what you mean, and if I (as a woman of 42, with four kids) am completely confused as to what your rule actually means, I'm guessing your 14 year old dd is having trouble with figuring out the boundaries, too.

If I let my dd go to a dance, I'd expect her to be dancing with, talking to, and maybe even gazing at, boys. None of that means "date" to me, though.

[lisarussell]

From her perspective, this was important to her, too. I don't understand the logic behind saying no to something a child really wants and expecting them to go against their own inner guidance in order to follow your rules. It doesn't sound like the basis of an honest and respectful relationship, nor does it sound like a healthy life skill. You might want to consider TRUSTING her judgment and creating a new relationship where she trusts you, too. Otherwise you'll end up with a sneaky child who doesn't trust you enough to ask your advice or listen to you. If you don't trust her judgment, she's not going to STOP making decisions just to please you, she's going to simply develop a "secret life" working ever harder to meet her own personal needs for autonomy and not getting caught by you.

Have you read "respectful parents, respectful kids?"

I suggest you have an open and honest conversation with her- without blame

"I have to tell you sweetie, I really felt my heart sink when I saw that photo of you at the grad party. It really looked like a date photo and I admit, I have a lot of hangups about you dating. I know you're getting older but part of me will always see you as my baby. I'd love to get to know this amazing young woman in my home. I'm sorry if I made you feel like you couldn't talk to me. I want to be here for you. Watching you grow up has been one of the biggest blessings of my life and I don't want to miss out on the next few years just because I have a hard time accepting that you're growing up. The main point is that I want you safe. My biggest concern is that you'll end up in some irreversible bad situation. I know I can't protect you if I don't give you the tools you need to make good decisions. I love you. I'd love to hear about the fun you had at the dance."

Then- forever after, resist the urge to tell her what she can and can't do. You can offer advice and try to help her see other perspectives but bossing around a teenager is really counter productive.

She NEEDS your advice, not your judgment. You can't expect to boss her around her whole life and then when she heads off to college, suddenly believe that she's going to be able to make good decisions. THIS is the basis of rebellion; arbitrary impersonal rules that go against her personal inner knowledge. Making decisions and learning from your own mistakes is VERY IMPORTANT.

It FEELS BAD to go against your parents. It also feels bad to not be trusted. It also feels bad to have no adult to consult with. She needs to be making her OWN decisions, from a perspective of happiness, love and personal responsibility. Making good decisions takes PRACTICE. You can not know what goes on in her world 24 hours a day. You don't know every little thought in her mind and every little thing she hears from her friends. YOUR VOICE should not be "one more obstacle to happiness." You don't want to TRAIN her to talk herself out of the bad feeling that comes from going against you. She will never trust your advice if you don't trust her judgment.

My aunt was 16 when Grandma told her she couldn't participate in Senior Ditch day because she hadn't brought up her math grade. All her friends were meeting at mcDonalds on the highway to caravan out to the beach. Because Grandma said no, Cheryl headed to McDonalds AFTER sneaking out of school. When she arrived at McDonalds, the other kids had already left so she hitchiked toward the beach.

About 3 weeks later, a 13 and 9 yr old boy found parts of her dismembered body floating in a lake.

The trucker who picked her up was never prosecuted for her murder, but 12 years after we lost Cheryl, he was arrested for an identical crime, and later confessed to a few more. He's serving a life sentence now.

nothing is more important than an honest, open relationship with your kids and if you're not letting her make her own decisions, especially about things that are VERY important to her, then you're not going to have one.

Originally Posted by song_of_the_soule

Hello, i have a 14 yr old daughter who is absolutely beautiful. One of the rules i have is that she is not supposed to date until she is 16. Her father (who lives in another city now) agreed that she would not be allowed to until then, but now said i should let her have a graduation date, hmmmmmm.

Wellllll, you see, she just graduated grade eight, and looked perfect for her grad. I do not allow revealing clothes either. Her choice was a long, sparkly, purple gown. She looked amazing in it, in fact, she looked 20 *sniff* the problem is, after much protest by her, i still stuck to the initial rule of no dating until 16, even for her grade eight grad, where all her friends had dates. She finally stopped protesting and accepted, so i thought.

I found out through a photo leak on facebook that she indeed had a date for her grad.

how should i deal with this? Should i let it go and not tell her I didn't believe that they were "just dancing" like she had told me when i asked about the photo (it was not even taken on the dance floor.) Should i ground her, talk to her, if so, say what? i mean wow, she lied to my face about it. It really is not like her, we have always been very close.

Other people tell me that i should let her date now, all the kids are, and if i don't, she will do it anyway and just lie about it.

I do not want her to lose respect for me, or maybe she already is being that she LIED to me about something so important.

I am new to teenagers, please help!

[journeymom]

Someone asked if i was taken advantage of as a teen and thought that might be why i am limiting to my children. The answer is a big fat YES. I was completely unattended, given no structure or rules, no mentorship, nothing. I had to take care of my very sick (mentally and physically) and addicted mother and was afraid of my alcoholic father. Needless to say, i have no family supports now with my children and i work very hard to be everything they need to turn out right.

I'm so sorry! That was so unfair for you. I can totally see why you responded to this situation with panic.

You're a wonderful mom! You're working so hard to get it right. I know your plate is really full but if you could carve out some time to invest in yourself, individual therapy could be very helpful. A safe place to explore your childhood experience, and work through how it's affecting your life today would strengthen you.

Originally Posted by Storm Bride

I'm still not getting why you say she was dating/lying. Have you clarified that not dating means not talking to a boy anywhere except on/beside the dance floor? That does seem to be what you mean, and if I (as a woman of 42, with four kids) am completely confused as to what your rule actually means, I'm guessing your 14 year old dd is having trouble with figuring out the boundaries, too.

If I let my dd go to a dance, I'd expect her to be dancing with, talking to, and maybe even gazing at, boys. None of that means "date" to me, though.

I agree.

[Honey693]

Originally Posted by choli

You can tell someone they are forbidden to date until you turn blue in the face, it's really not going to be enforceable.

You'd be a lot better off allowing her to date and have her be open and honest with you.

This. I wasn't allowed to date until I was 16. I had a date for 8th grade grad, dated him all through high school, college and we're now married. I lied to my parents about it for 2 years, snuck around to see him, etc. Other than that I was a "good" kid. Never got in trouble, great grades, good friends, etc. I hated that I couldn't talk to my mom about boys, but there was this stupid arbitrary rule that was based on my age and not my maturity level that my parents would. not. budge on.

[choli]

Originally Posted by YoviC

-I think that when she have her first boy friend her grades will lower, and I understand why and think is normal, but this is her first school year she got into honors in school, this have change her actitud toward school, she is more happy and proud, I wish at least another year like this so she can really see the difference between the feelings of just an "almost fail" to "here is your medal of honor"

I have a 16 yr old daughter. She has had boyfriends, she has had times with no boyfriend. Her grades have never been affected either way. I really don't understand why you would assume that her grades would lower if she has a boyfriend, and that it would be normal for that to happen. I would think the opposite, that it would be very abnormal.

[A&A]

Originally Posted by savithny

To clarify -- is she attending an all-girls school? Are there boys in her classes? Did you know there would be boys at the dance? Were you clear with her about your expectations that she should not dance, nor should she talk to any boys nor stand near enough to be photographed with one?

There will be boys at school dances. They may ask her to dance. She may stand near them. She may even talk to them. She probably already has talked to some of them in class or in the hallway, unless it is an all-girls school (you don't say).

If you knew there would be boys at this event and you let her attend, I think I (and most reasonable people) would consider that as constituting the right to speak with, dance with, and generally enjoy the company of boys in public spaces during the evening.

I think it's very important with preteens (and teens like your DD) to be clear about your expectations and what you mean by things like "dating." A lot of those words have different meanings now than they did when we were young -- and honestly, they had different meanings when we were young than they did when our parents were young! If you don't want her "dating" you need to sit down and define the term. Talk about what you do and don't plan to allow, and give some idea of why.

But at root, I think if you let her go to the dance and you knew there would be boys there, to call her out and say she "lied to you" about speaking to a boy -- even if it is obvious in the picture that they are quite friendly -- makes you the one in the wrong, not her.

[A&A]

Originally Posted by lisarussell

It FEELS BAD to go against your parents. It also feels bad to not be trusted. It also feels bad to have no adult to consult with. She needs to be making her OWN decisions, from a perspective of happiness, love and personal responsibility. Making good decisions takes PRACTICE. You can not know what goes on in her world 24 hours a day. You don't know every little thought in her mind and every little thing she hears from her friends. YOUR VOICE should not be "one more obstacle to happiness." You don't want to TRAIN her to talk herself out of the bad feeling that comes from going against you. She will never trust your advice if you don't trust her judgment.


nothing is more important than an honest, open relationship with your kids and if you're not letting her make her own decisions, especially about things that are VERY important to her, then you're not going to have one.