Wit's end, desperate, ped is now saying try 48 hr of soy formula**UPDATED....not how I'd hoped**** - Page 3

[DeChRi]

Patiogardener - it was the mini pill, which I stopped 2 days ago, just to be safe. It's my first taking BC pills in a few years, as last time I went the IUD route.

She gained 6oz/week over the last 4 weeks. Just so different than my other two...all born between 8'2" and 8'9", all 90-something percent for weight at 4 week check up, & my first two stayed there for months and months. So the sharp drop with #3 freaked me out, although not abnormal I guess.

So status: BC stopped 2 days ago, added in fenugreek/blessed thistle, cut out pretty much anything potentially allergenic. I'm literally eating 2100 calories/day of boiled free range chicken/turkey, yellow/green squash, millet, rice, water and a few blueberries. I'm a coffee addict so I've done half a cup the yest morn and this morn to avoid headache & will shoot for a cup of green tea tomorrow, then nothing. The LC and Dr both said that if it's food related, I'll know it in a few days. We also are doing the probiotics.

As of yesterday I went on bottle standoff with her it was so hard but really by evening she wasn't resisting like usual. And 36 hrs on the supply supps, as well as nursing/pumping every 1.5hrs gave an instant supply boost.

So far, today has been stellar. What I would call "normal" baby fussiness. Normally she would have cried 4-5hrs by now.

If she stays the route of improvement, I'll slowly start adding things back in to see what the culprit is.

I feel a bit less like my body is failing me now.

[JessicaTX]

She sounds a lot like my daughter who is almost 12 now and still has reflux issues. I ended up weaning her because I thought it had to be something I was eating, and I couldn't' survive on turkey and squash alone, i was too poor to afford that for every meal. I really think part of her issue was a lip tie, her frenulum on her front lip goes down between her front teeth, she spent a good bit of time in speech therapy because of it. I think a chiropracter really would be a good idea, at that time I could barely afford rent and rice, so trying to find one was out of the question for me, but hindsight...I think I should have pawned something to get her in. The pediatrician switched her to a hypoallergenic formula, but she still screamed and puked daily till she was about 10 months old. Once she wasn't lying down so much it mostly stopped, I had her on prevacid and didn't really see a difference, but I think that was because she puked that up too.

[princesstutu]

Oh, yay! I'm glad there's improvement. I was going to suggest a nipple shield if she seemed to like the plastic or there was something going on with the way your nipple and her mouth worked together that bothered her, but I'm sooo glad you don't need to do that.

I wish y'all continued success!

[PatioGardener]

Originally Posted by princesstutu

I wish y'all continued success!

me too!

[MonkeysRUs]

If there is a naturopath close to you who does muscle allergy testing on babies, it is a non-invasive way to find out what your baby may be allergic or sensitive to, without restricting your diet unnecessarily. Sometimes the sensitivities turn out to be something you wouldn't expect.

[boobs4milk]

! i'm calling classic nipple confusion. wooohooo for nursing without fussing!

[elanorh]

Good luck - it sounds like you're on the right track! I had a severely allergic reflux babe, never dealt with OALD but you've certainly gone through all the usual culprits and it seems you've found the solution. Hope you get back on track.

When I had to rebuild my supply, I used:
Mother's Milk Tea
Oatmeal (lots and lots of oatmeal)
More sleep (I know, ha ha ha )
Extra pumping after dd1 nursed per LC guidance (I don't know how much your supply has dropped though, you might not need to do this)
And ... since I was exclusively pumping at the time - I did notice that intimacy with dh seemed to stimulate my supply?

[DeChRi]

Total crash and burn. So utterly frustrated. Won't nurse, even after ditching bottles. Screaming screaming screaming. Eating 2000 calories/day of boiled chicken, squash and millet. Just water. Supply is plentiful. And notta. 3 days in and it's almost worse. Every attempted nursing session is a beating that ends in failure (except at night). She knows how. Between 10pm and morning she nurses great.

I am totally beaten. I'd hand her off w/ a can of formula to my inlaws right now just to get a break. I won't, cause they aren't here, but just saying...I'm that beaten. I don't know why she won't eat. Why she screams. I don't understand how I have breastfed 2 kids for a total of 6 years and am failing so miserably that this. I dunno if pain is making her not eat, if not eating is causing her pain. But holding all day while she cries and chokes is just about doing me in.

[PatioGardener]

what about a tube at the breast to get a fast flowing start?

have you taken a look at the kellymom info on strikes? http://www.kellymom.com/bf/concerns/...to-breast.html

ignore this if it isn't a help. i really feel for you and wanted to try to suggest something helpful.

hang in there.

[maddymama]

Can you call a LC in your area to come to your house and visit with you guys? I really don't want you to give up in this, but it is obvious you are very stressed out and upset.

I'm glad that nighttime nursing is working out for you..... That is a huge plus. I wonder if your LO is too overstimulated by your surroundings and the nighttime is easier/less distracting. Have you tried nursing in a warm bath during the day? That sometimes relaxes my over-stimulated LO.
Also, would it be posible for your DH to take a few days off of work to help with the 11 yr old and the 2 yr old while you focus solely on the newbie? Or can your parents/in-laws help out? Stressing about the rest of your family can definitely feed into your LO's stress....
HUGS!
Please don't give up....
~maddymama

[Katie T]

I didn't read past the first page so sorry if this has been mentioned. But I wonder if she has a adversion to your breast because of the strong let down but if she is sleepy "forgets". I wonder if when she is sleepy if you recline in a chair or propped reclined on the bed (so you are laying more on your back than sitting up, hope that makes sense) it will slow let down a bit and she will get over the adversion of the strong let down.

If you can pump 4 oz easily I think your milk supply seems fine.

Hope you get it figured out, it is tough with a screaming baby. I had one but for different reasons and it is a trying time. You are a wonderfully loving mama to be working this hard to make this work. (((hugs)))

[terra-pip]

could you try to go veggie for awhile. chicken and any other animal product is still a foreign protein and not a humans natural diet imo. I have been on an elim diet these past weeks and have been eating a lot of fruit and veggies. really the only veggies you would need to watch out for would be gassy ones...broccoli, cauliflower, peppers, garlic, onions, citrus, tomatoes...but you ought to be able to eat everything else...potatoes, leafy greens, cucumbers, celery etc etc...and other than citrus you should be able to tolerate all fruits.

Also thrush? you don't always have to see tell tale white spots in the mouth or have nipple pain to have a problem with it. My oldest had some thrush issues when he was a newborn...i had it on my nipples and he was out of sorts but didn't have any white spots so i thought he was fine. but just really really fussy and i was on an elim diet...my midwife suggested i give him some nystatin drops, the same i was using on my nipples and he turned around quick. Thrush can be in their gut.


How's the rest of her development? other than nursing do you feel that she is where she should be at her age? 1 month right?

[princesstutu]

Does she prefer nursing lying down maybe? My dd3 used to scream her head off and refuse to nurse or come off the boob until I got in the bed. Then she'd go right to nursing and sleep. Very demanding period of her life. I got very little done.

[elanorh]

It's been awhile, but I know that either Prevacid or Prilosec (and I suspect it was Prevacid) had hidden dairy in it ....

I know you had a kiddo with reflux already. My dd1 started restricting her feeds to manage her reflux when she was less than three months old (I think really around 2 months). Could this be what's going on?

Don't make too many changes at once. Choose something to do and then stick with it. I'd say your options are:

1. Cut all dairy/soy/egg from your diet (or a TED) and do that for 2-3 weeks. No other changes. Watch for changes and see what happens.

2. Add probiotics to your and your little one's diets. There are dairy/soy/Big-8 free probiotics, and those are the type you both need. Do this for 2-3 weeks.

3. Try a different reflux medication. I know it's old-school now, but what worked best for my dd1 was Zantac, at the upper recommended dosage level, in compounded form (thick sweet syrup, NOT the icky mint stuff). Give that 2 weeks and see what happens?

4. Chiropractor or Craniosacral therapy if you're comfortable with that.

Personally - if I were you, I'd probably try doing 1 and 2 at the same time. Probiotics are good for us, and the two wouldn't mask each other.

Have you been remembering and using the environmental approaches to reflux that you probably used with your first? Upright after feeds, elevated surface for laying down for tummy time etc. etc.?

And the biggest advice of all (and since this is your third I know you've heard it before BUT) -- call a friend or relative. Have them come over and help. Ask them to wash the dishes, sweep/mop the floor, play with the two year old, take the 11 year old to do something special as a reward for all her help -- whatever you need that person to do. Repeat this often. You're in a difficult situation and the more stressed out and tired you are, the more difficult it will be to handle the situation effectively. If you have to be preemptive and tell the friend(s) not to discuss or advise re: breastfeeding etc., go ahead and do that. If they're a good friend, they'll bite their tongue and not say anything, if you ask them not to.

[DeChRi]

A sincere thank you for all of the advice.I'll try and comment on as much as I can.

I do sometimes wonder about overstimulation. Also, I'm going to loop back w/ the LC and LLL and get some refreshed opinions.

DH is going to shoot to be home a bunch the next couple days so I can focus on DD3.

As far as going veg, I just don't think I can do it. If I KNEW it would work, I would do it.

Regarding nursing laying down. I've tried that all during the day...and to no avail. When she is upset, no position matters.

Here is the big observation I've made: Nursing seems uncomfortable to her. I can get her to latch on, nurse nurse for 60 seconds (latches, letdown kicks in, good flow going), then suddenly gets agitated and pulls off and screams. Not one time has she dozed off at the breast, or accepted it as comfort. It's very much a source if irritation for her. Which makes me feel horrible.

I'm just stumped because she is ok at night.she sometimes is sleepy-fidgity, but never cries or really wakes. She settles in and is fine till morning.

But today she would just be sitting there, then would wrench all up with her body and cry and cry. Totally appeared to be in pain.

I will as the Dr about thrush, absent of white spots. I'm making a beginning of the week appt to loop back w/ our Dr.

The elimination diet doesn't really bother me..I just wanted best chance and fasted chance at knowing if it was diet or not. I figured at the end of a week I'd notice Some difference.

I really just can't figure this one out.

[boobs4milk]

does she have torticollis? my dd had tort and she seemed in pain unless i used pillows to position her.

and if you are stressing, she'll be able to tell. can you nurse in a warm bath? that always relaxes us.

s

[smpayne]

Not really any helpful advice, but my ds#1 did this almost from the beginning. I was too uneducated on BF to know that the paci he had been using since birth may be part of the problem. He would scream bloody murder as soon as he got close to my breast. Talk about PP meltdown. As I look back, he reacted the same way to a couple of bottle nipples that he refused also and I don't think he like a lot of skin to skin, he got too hot. He definitely had a nipple preference and it wasn't for me. Other than nipple preference, he as pretty laid back, he would even take cold bm or formula straight from the fridge. Now ds#2 was just the opposite.

[LadyCatherine185]

I only read the first pages of replies, so forgive me if I am restating something.

My DS did the exact same thing your DD was doing, and it was silent reflux. Same fussy/crying behavior during the day, but nursed fine at night. Prevacid was the magic bullet for him, but only after being on it for 2 weeks. I would try different medications, if you have not already. He also had several food intolerances, dairy being the biggest one. I would work on cutting out the top 8 allergens.

A few things that helped my DS to nurse until we figured out the cause-- rocking/bouncing while nursing and nursing standing up. He would always nurse best right after waking up/still sleepy.

I hope you get this figured out soon!!

[PatioGardener]

Originally Posted by DeChRi

Nursing seems uncomfortable to her. I can get her to latch on, nurse nurse for 60 seconds (latches, letdown kicks in, good flow going), then suddenly gets agitated and pulls off and screams.

what does she look like when she does this? my guy popped off and arched back with his head to one side. the paediatrician said it was classic reflux behaviour. he's on prevacid twice a day. we are thinking of going to 3x/day. here is the dosing: http://www.marci-kids.com/dosing.html

to you

[LadyCatherine185]

Originally Posted by PatioGardener

what does she look like when she does this? my guy popped off and arched back with his head to one side. the paediatrician said it was classic reflux behaviour. he's on prevacid twice a day. we are thinking of going to 3x/day. here is the dosing: http://www.marci-kids.com/dosing.html

to you

we also gave my DS his prevacid twice a day for awhile.