Short Luteal Phase - how much of a problem is this with TTC?

[Marnica]

Hi - totally new to this forum.

I am 38 and am TTC LO#2. DS was a happy accident and is now a little over 2 years old.

We have only really been trying for about 3 months, I have been charting my cycles for a while now however. I have noticed that I have a short luteal phase. It seems to vary (which I thought it wasn't supposed to). I have some cycles where it was 8 days and some where it was 11. Most of the time it seems to be 10 days. From what I understand, this may be a problem with TTc as I am not producing enough progesterone for a pregnancy to occur and if it did, would put me at a high risk of having a miscarriage.

I'm also still BF, but not much at all.(once/day for about 2 min) I got AF back when DS was 13 months old.

My cycles are regular and are pretty much 29-30 days consistently. Ever since I had DS, my periods have been VERY heavy. They never were before. I had some ultrasounds done to rule out any cysts or other structural issues and my uterus is a -okay
I am concerned about this possible LPD or any other problem! I understand that B6 can help and have started taking 100mg daily. I also understand progesterone cream may be useful, but I'd rather not resort of pharmaceuticals! Any help/suggestions would be appreciated. This is all so new to me

[Blanca78]

Hi Marnica,
When I had my preconception appointment I told my doc that mine seemed to be around 10 days, and she did not at all seem concerned--she said not to worry about it unless it proved itself to be a problem, and even then it would probably be an easy fix. It turned out I was already pregnant during that appointment. It didn't work out, but since then I've been taking 100 mg of B6 and my LP seems to have gone up to 11-13 days (it varies a little month to month).

[Marnica]

Thanks for your reply.

From everything I've read 10 days or less is not good! The fact that your pregnancy didn't work out (miscarriage Im assuming...I'm sorry ) is also a concern because that is exactly what I have read. That a too short LP correlates with higher chance of miscarriage. I hope the B6 helps me too. I may schedule an appt with my doc to discuss my concerns if nothing happens in the next month.

[Kyamo]

I think breastfeeding can cause a short LP. I know you said you aren't nursing much, but it could still be a problem. Maybe after your DS weans the problem might fix itself.

[beachlover]

Even though you aren't nursing much, it is likely the cause of your shorter LP.

I'd try taking a B complex, maybe just start with 50mg a day. I did this to help my LP while nursing (actually still am and still taking it)and it lengthened my LP from 8-10 days to a very nice 13-14 days within about 2 cycles.

Nursing causes high prolactin levels which can inhibit Progesterone production. From what I understand the B6 in the B complex helps to lower your prolactin levels . It's best to take the B complex though, because they say that B vitamins work best together.

A LP of only 10 days is not going to be great to sustain a pregnancy. Not impossible, but certainly not great either.

[Blanca78]

Originally Posted by Marnica

Thanks for your reply.

From everything I've read 10 days or less is not good! The fact that your pregnancy didn't work out (miscarriage Im assuming...I'm sorry ) is also a concern because that is exactly what I have read. That a too short LP correlates with higher chance of miscarriage. I hope the B6 helps me too. I may schedule an appt with my doc to discuss my concerns if nothing happens in the next month.

No, mine wasn't a regular miscarriage. It was a molar pregnancy, which is a rare thing where there are double the paternal chromosomes--a complete freak accident, my OB assured me. When I asked her about the lp (before I knew I was pregnant) she just said, "That shouldn't be a problem." Later, my GP smiled and said pretty emphatically that "10 days is fine." There are also lots of women on these boards who have said they conceived with 10 or even 9-day LPs. Try not to worry too much! If you are having spotting or something during the LP, that might be a stronger indication of a defect.

[Maurine]

I had a 9-10-11 day LP, diagnosed through a 7dpo progesterone test (which isn't an exact science, either). I now take progesterone suppositories during the TWW. However, my doc said a 10 day LP wasn't a big deal, and I had to cajole a bit to get the suppositories.

Are you sure your LP is that length? You could have a slow temp rise. Does it correspond with a dry-up of CM? Or does your temp rise and you dry up the same day? If you use other signs (cervical position), do they correspond?

Otherwise, if you are concerned, I'd call your doc and confirm low progesterone by a blood test.

[Marnica]

Originally Posted by Maurine

I had a 9-10-11 day LP, diagnosed through a 7dpo progesterone test (which isn't an exact science, either). I now take progesterone suppositories during the TWW. However, my doc said a 10 day LP wasn't a big deal, and I had to cajole a bit to get the suppositories.

Are you sure your LP is that length? You could have a slow temp rise. Does it correspond with a dry-up of CM? Or does your temp rise and you dry up the same day? If you use other signs (cervical position), do they correspond?
Otherwise, if you are concerned, I'd call your doc and confirm low progesterone by a blood test.

Honestly I haven't gotten into too much of the other stuff. I can look back and see about temp rises. I have sort of paid attention to CM, but not as much as I probably should be (as I said I only got serious about TTC 2-3 months ago). It seems that after ovulation, the CM begins to dry up fairly quickly.

Nursing could be a factor I guess. I figured since I wasn;t doing it much it probably wasn't and I know plenty of women who get Pg while nursing .
I really believe in CLW and don't want to wean DS, but I also don't want to wait to conceive. I'm 38 and not getting any younger!! I guess I will give the B6 for a bit and see how that goes.

[JessieBird]

From what I have read, nursing even just once a day can affect your cycle. My LP was only 5-6 days long when I got pregnant this time. I thought it would be absolutely impossible but voila! I was still nursing DS but very little - once or twice a day and AF had been back for about 5 months. I took B6 and used natural progesterone cream as well as soy isoflavones (I know soy is controversial while bf'ing but I felt comfortable with it). None lengthened my LP (though they might have after a few more months) but I got pregnant anyway and it's stuck nicely.

May I ask - are you absolutely sure of when you are ovulating? I just ask because you say that you haven't looked too closely at your temps, CM and other aspects of your chart. So how are you determining when you ovulate? Perhaps you are off by a few days and that your LP isn't as short as you think. A few months of charting your signs more closely (which hopefully you won't be able to do because you'll get pregnant!) may show things more clearly. If you use FF, post a link to your charts.

[Lyss]

Crashing from March DDC - my LP for my last two pregnancies was 4-6d. I had regular progesterone tests with second pg, and it was REALLY low, but we didn't supplement.

I was still nursing when I got pg w/ #2, and I took Vitex (chasteberry) to improve my chances. The first month I took it, I got a BFP. Good luck! You can google it to find out dosages, safety during nursing, etc.

*eta, this pregnancy is a surprise, and I am 37 and still have a 4-6 day LP. We were preventing (although not well, clearly) and I certainly didn't have any vitex this time. I have classic symptoms of low progesterone (and have for years): night sweats, etc.

[konayossie]

I've had my cycle back for about 14 mos, am still breastfeeding, and my LP was 7 days when I started charting 3 cycles ago. I was already doing B-6, Vitex,and Maca, added in progesterone cream (non-Rx) for the 2nd cycle, and all I got was an 8th day, but I had spotting from days 6-8DPO. I went to the midwife at that point and showed her my charts and told her I did not want to wean and asked for a progesterone script. she gave it to me and I am now 8DPO for the first time with no spotting yet. woo-hoo!

[Marnica]

Originally Posted by JessieBird

From what I have read, nursing even just once a day can affect your cycle. My LP was only 5-6 days long when I got pregnant this time. I thought it would be absolutely impossible but voila! I was still nursing DS but very little - once or twice a day and AF had been back for about 5 months. I took B6 and used natural progesterone cream as well as soy isoflavones (I know soy is controversial while bf'ing but I felt comfortable with it). None lengthened my LP (though they might have after a few more months) but I got pregnant anyway and it's stuck nicely.

May I ask - are you absolutely sure of when you are ovulating? I just ask because you say that you haven't looked too closely at your temps, CM and other aspects of your chart. So how are you determining when you ovulate? Perhaps you are off by a few days and that your LP isn't as short as you think. A few months of charting your signs more closely (which hopefully you won't be able to do because you'll get pregnant!) may show things more clearly. If you use FF, post a link to your charts.

No, I have been paying alot of attention to temp, not so much to the other stuff like CM or cervix positioning. Sorry if that was unclear. I have over 6 months of cycles that I have charted so I am pretty sure when I am ovulating. I am using fertility friend online, not sure how to post a link? I am techically challenged!!

[Marnica]

Originally Posted by Lyss

Crashing from March DDC - my LP for my last two pregnancies was 4-6d. I had regular progesterone tests with second pg, and it was REALLY low, but we didn't supplement.

I was still nursing when I got pg w/ #2, and I took Vitex (chasteberry) to improve my chances. The first month I took it, I got a BFP. Good luck! You can google it to find out dosages, safety during nursing, etc.

*eta, this pregnancy is a surprise, and I am 37 and still have a 4-6 day LP. We were preventing (although not well, clearly) and I certainly didn't have any vitex this time. I have classic symptoms of low progesterone (and have for years): night sweats, etc.

I'll look into Vitex...Thanks!

I have another question about temps themselves. Is a pre o temp in the 96's too low?? It usually fluctuates in the 96's pre - O and then goes up to the mid to high 97's post O. It rarely gets above 98, although sometimes it does. Is this a problem. I have read that too low BBT's may be problematic in TTC??

[Marnica]

bump

sorry but I'm hoping someone has an answer for me about the "normal" range for BBT??

[bcblondie]

Before I had ds, temps in the 96's were very normal for me. Sometimes even the low 96's. After o, 97.4 was GREAT for me.
It CAN mean hypothyroidism... i think. But I didn't have the other risk factors so I think I'm fine.
Now that i"ve had ds, 97.1 or 2 is normal for pre o, but sometimes right before O I dip to 96.8 or 9. After O I'm sitting around 97.7.

Question, do you temp very early in the morning? Temps are usually lower earlier.

[Marnica]

Originally Posted by bcblondie

Before I had ds, temps in the 96's were very normal for me. Sometimes even the low 96's. After o, 97.4 was GREAT for me.
It CAN mean hypothyroidism... i think. But I didn't have the other risk factors so I think I'm fine.
Now that i"ve had ds, 97.1 or 2 is normal for pre o, but sometimes right before O I dip to 96.8 or 9. After O I'm sitting around 97.7.

Question, do you temp very early in the morning? Temps are usually lower earlier.

Yes, pretty early about 5:45am every day when I get up for work. I know everyone is different and what is normal for 1 person may be not for another, but just want to make sure my temps are in the range of normal KWIM?

[bcblondie]

Yep. I think considering how early you temp it's very normal. Fertility friend has a gallery you could flip through.

[hilary549]

i def had temps in high 96's when i was ttc #1. and got preg w/in 5 cycles. but there are things you can do, and as pp said, it might be slight hypothyroid? maybe get thyroid test done just to see? but also supplements can help, the ones mentioned and i think marilyn shannon recommends increasing vit a/d intake (you can get this stuff that does not taste good but boosts both, it is fermented cod liver oil with butter oil and is supposed to be super good for you, try the blue ice brand.) maybe check out the weston a. price foundation website stuff about fertility, they have some good stuff and lots of nutritional info. hope that helps.

[katiedidbug]

I haven't read what everyone else wrote, but I'd suggest taking more like 200 mg of Vitamin B6 as recommended by Marilyn Shannon, author of "Fertility, Cycles and Nutrition." When I took 200 mgs of B6 my lp lengthened significantly.

[Marnica]

Hilary549 - I already take CLO and supplement with 5,000mg of vit d. I looked into the Ice Blue brand...Holy Cow!! I can't afford that!!
My thyroid was tested not that long ago and everything was "normal" but I also know that docs usually do not ask for the right tests, so??


Katiedidbug - did you take a lower mg of b6 and it wasn't effective, but 200 was?? Everything I have read says to start at a lower dose. I will look into the book you mentioned. Thanks. I suppose however that since it is water soluble, taking 200 couldn't hurt right??

I have started the chasteberry. I'm taking the herbpham brand extract. 60 drops. Is that enought?? I was going to get pills, but I read that if it didn't state it was standardized on the label, that you really have no idea how much your getting and it may be a waste of money. I did find 1 brand that was standardized, but it had millet listed in the ingredients section. I am allergic to millet. Ugh!!