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enzyme mamas, advice please

post #1 of 7
Thread Starter 
A couple of months ago, I started taking digestive enzymes. I'm sure I have leaky gut and have had it for years. Going raw helps tremendously, but I fall off the raw wagon pretty often. Fall off the no-sugar and no-grains wagon, too.

I'm currently taking Daily Essentials Enzymes by Source Naturals. It has vegetal analog of pancreatin, acid-stable protease, lipase, alpha-amylase, amyloglucosidase, cellulase, hemicellulase, and lactase in it. I've read websites and threads here and I feel overwhelmed by the info. I know I have a problem with dairy, so I know the lactase is good for me. Dairy consumption leads to yeast overgrowth in my body (we're down from the anaphylaxis (sp?) it used to bring, so yay!).

The baby has had difficulties digesting my milk since she was born, basically. She's 6months old now. She still breaks out in eczema, loses pigmentation, and gets itchy/hives sometimes, but not as often. I don't see a direct correlation btn what I eat and when she breaks out.

Earlier in the week, tho, I chewed up some veggies and some meat and gave it to her b/c she screams her head off for my food when I'm eating and she can't chew. I did it twice and then I noticed she broke out in hives for the first time in weeks and had a rashy bum, which she has only had once since she was born, no matter what else was going on with her.

Now, I'm wondering if something else is going on or what. Why would my saliva break her out, if that's what happened? It seemed like that's what happened. Should I take a different enzyme pill? Or...what?

I don't have undigested food in my poo, like I read about in another thread. I have lots of stinky gas lately. I've been dealing with constipation, too, so I figure that's the source of the stinky gas. I didn't notice a major change with my body and how it works after I started taking the enzymes a couple months ago, either. Maybe I should try something else?

My dd was born with her pancreas wrapped around her intestine and had surgery to reroute her intestine, so I get cautious about food and her sometimes. I let her have stuff, but I watch her carefully since she's had these issues her whole life. I don't want to cause an obstruction in her gut and then she has to have surgery again. So, I keep trying to find ways to deal with our gut issues, but maybe I'm taking the wrong enzyme or taking the wrong approach? She was itchy all day yesterday and broke out again. I asked a friend about giving her enzymes and I see folks here give their kids enzymes, but I'm afraid it'll worsen her sitch. Did she probably react to the enzymes in my saliva and that's why she broke out after I gave her chewed food?

Sorry if this is rambly. nak and screaming baby today
post #2 of 7
Thread Starter 
bump
post #3 of 7
Several thoughts...

Do you know it's the lactose in milk you react to? Ana reactions are often to the proteins, in which case it's the protease content in the enzymes that (may) help, not the lactase.

No idea what a vegetable analogue of pancreatin is like - you might try the real kind and see if it makes a difference for you? If you didn't notice any changes after starting the enzymes, it could be you don't need them, or you aren't taking the right ones or a big enough dose for what your body needs.

Your little one, has she eaten the same foods that you chewed for her and been fine? (Wondering why you're suspecting your saliva instead of the food itself).

I wouldn't do enzymes with a 6mo.

It sounds to me like you are still eating something you react to, and maybe something she reacts to as well. What are you currently avoiding? Have you tried a top 4 or top 8 + corn elimination diet? (Top 4 = dairy, gluten, soy, corn. Top 8 = those plus fish, shellfish, peanuts, tree nuts).
post #4 of 7
Don't know what exactly to say about enzymes, but mamafish's suggestion sounds very reasonable (as always ). Increase the amount of enzymes possibly change them to a broad spectrum (Trienza is a great one) and/or add animal pancreatin. I am, however, a big fan of probiotics. Since you eat a lot of raw foods, do you also do fermented vegetables? I would start doing that (if you are not doing it already), also you can give your LO some juice (I think you can start as early as few weeks with fermented vegetables juice). If you see a reaction, then I think you probably see die-off, which would be a good sign, the probiotics should help. You could, of course, also buy them. Suspecting the saliva for the rash makes me think that maybe the saliva was too acidic, or maybe had some yeast, bad bacteria?
I wonder if it is not so much the food itself, but some other property of your digestive system that was offending.
post #5 of 7
Thread Starter 
Thank you.
Quote:
Originally Posted by mamafish9 View Post
Several thoughts...

Do you know it's the lactose in milk you react to? Ana reactions are often to the proteins, in which case it's the protease content in the enzymes that (may) help, not the lactase.

No idea what a vegetable analogue of pancreatin is like - you might try the real kind and see if it makes a difference for you? If you didn't notice any changes after starting the enzymes, it could be you don't need them, or you aren't taking the right ones or a big enough dose for what your body needs.

Your little one, has she eaten the same foods that you chewed for her and been fine? (Wondering why you're suspecting your saliva instead of the food itself).

I wouldn't do enzymes with a 6mo.

It sounds to me like you are still eating something you react to, and maybe something she reacts to as well. What are you currently avoiding? Have you tried a top 4 or top 8 + corn elimination diet? (Top 4 = dairy, gluten, soy, corn. Top 8 = those plus fish, shellfish, peanuts, tree nuts).
Yeah, I do think it's the milk protein I'm having a problem with, but it only started after I had kids. Pre-kids, I drank a half gallon of milk a day, at least.

The baby did not react to the foods when I gave them to her directly, only after I chewed it. I chewed greens and chicken for her. If I gave her those foods directly, she'd not react, they'd just get pooped out. Maybe she reacted b/c her body was actually trying to digest them when I chewed them? She generally poops out whole foods if I don't mush them up in some way.

Currently, I'm avoiding dairy and soy. That's all consistently, b/c I cut out all the top allergens and corn when she was younger and noticed no clearing of her skin. For a while, I even cut out bananas. I cut out oats. Eggs. I don't eat beans b/c when I eat pinto or black, she gets hives.

Cutting out the foods has benefit us b/c she no longer gets hives and itchy rashes all over her face, neck, and chest all the time. So, I've been fine with giving up foods and adding them back in slowly. But the only time her skin has been clear was the week she couldn't nurse or eat anything b/c she had had surgery on her intestines. She has these spots/blotches (dime-sized), one on each side of her neck, that look like soft, vulvar skin, if that makes sense. I was thinking yeast, but...maybe not. Doctors have been no help. The spots get itchy sometimes and she keeps thrush.
Quote:
Originally Posted by dulce_mami View Post
Don't know what exactly to say about enzymes, but mamafish's suggestion sounds very reasonable (as always ). Increase the amount of enzymes possibly change them to a broad spectrum (Trienza is a great one) and/or add animal pancreatin. I am, however, a big fan of probiotics. Since you eat a lot of raw foods, do you also do fermented vegetables? I would start doing that (if you are not doing it already), also you can give your LO some juice (I think you can start as early as few weeks with fermented vegetables juice). If you see a reaction, then I think you probably see die-off, which would be a good sign, the probiotics should help. You could, of course, also buy them. Suspecting the saliva for the rash makes me think that maybe the saliva was too acidic, or maybe had some yeast, bad bacteria?
I wonder if it is not so much the food itself, but some other property of your digestive system that was offending.
I'm waiting on some dairy-free yogurt starter to come in (back ordered) so I can make yogurt. I have sometimes eaten real saurkraut and I drink Good Belly, a probiotic drink, but I can't stomach the fermented veggies right now. I'll look for the fermented veggie juices, tho.

I did up my enzymes and I wonder if that's part of the gas and constipation. Is that possible? I take them on an empty stomach sometimes so they can do the extra work they can't do when they're busy breaking down foods, but...I wonder if I should stop cuz I've always been regular until recently, no matter how poorly I may have eaten. I haven't read that enzymes can clog you up, tho.

I was wondering the same thing about my digestive system. Ugh.

Thanks, y'all, for giving me more to think about. I think I may stop taking the enzymes and see if things improve for me.
post #6 of 7
Strong proteases can totally cause constipation. They can also cause die off and release metals in your gut - so I would move slowly with a nursling. And do what you have to do to poop at least daily, so the toxins you are releasing don't get reabsorbed into your bloodstream (and then breastmilk).

It sounds to me like you have another food allergen in there somewhere, just not top 8 or corn. Does food journaling help you identify anything? Or are you taking any supplements that might have hidden ingredients? (If you post links to what you take, I'd be happy to look).

I think it's entirely possible that prechewing her food caused your DD to start digesting it, instead of passing the food through whole, and that caused some of the issue. If you puree the same food, what happens?
post #7 of 7
Thread Starter 
Thanks. I haven't food journalled in a while, because it didn't seem to help. At one point I was only eating about 4 foods (right before she went to the hospital) and she still had rashes and hives. We (the nurses, doctors, and I) had hoped the surgery would remedy the sitch, but nope. I had stopped eating so many things at various points and since it didn't improve her skin, I started taking it easier on myself. Oh, I don't eat rice, either, because she'll get hives sometimes. That's the problem. Reactions don't happen consistently, so I'm never quite sure what's going on. Doctors just say she's too young to allergy test and that it definitely sounds like she's sensitive to something. They also say this is just a 'cosmetic issue', which I find really insulting. This is about her health.

I was totally thinking about that reabsorption. It's pointless to get the stuff out if it just goes back. Oh! I wonder if the reabsorption is why I've been having such a hard time resisting certain things lately? I know the yeast is out of control again and I've been trying to figure out why b/c although I've been making treats, I haven eaten waaay worse and nothing got worse.

So, actually, maybe all this is a good sign.

Can't find links to the supplements I'm taking, but they are: 365 Everyday Value Adult Multi for Women 1 Daily by Whole Foods, Fish Oil by Finest Natural, and Balanced B-Complex Vitamin C with Rose Hips and Rice Bran by Finest Natural. Finest Natural is from Walgreens. I don't take supplements daily, b/c I forget.

I haven't pureed any food for her. I have given her jarred baby foods a few times and what happens is that her poop becomes thicker and if it's sweet potatoes, her poop changes color. She has very watery poop on a regular basis. That's her "normal". When it thickens up, I don't know what that means. She has never had poop that is what I would call normal, breastfed baby poop. Never curdy looking at times or anything like that. Just yellow water, basically. No substance unless she's eaten baby food, which I don't like to give her b/c I feel I still don't really know what's going on. And, if I give her some of my food, it just comes out looking the same way it went in.

When it comes to that, i'm never sure how much of this is the food and how much is her intestine issue. But she hasn't gotten hives from pureed foods. I've never noticed a reaction from the 3 or 4 times I've given her baby food. It used to slow her system down for 2 days and she wouldn't be able to poop and she'd be kinda miserable, but now, it doesn't seem to slow her down. Of course, I've only done it once in the past month.
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