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Adoption related-Still food obsessed - Page 15  

post #281 of 343


Wow. not to be a jerk, but have you read this thread? 
 

Quote:
Originally Posted by prettypixels View Post




Well obviously she is still hungry, so you need to give her something that actually fills her up.  Just putting little nothings into her mouth over and over is not going to make her feel full.  Cheese.  Yogurt.  Nut butters on bread.  Skip the rice puffs.  

 



 

post #282 of 343
Thread Starter 
Quote:
Originally Posted by pumpkingirl71 View Post


Wow. not to be a jerk, but have you read this thread? 
 



 


Thanks, pumpkingirl71.  I'm getting tired of responding to the people who act like I'm not feeding her anything but rice puffs and wondering why she is still hungry.

 

Anna

 

post #283 of 343


 

Quote:
Originally Posted by Irishmommy View Post



Quote:
Originally Posted by Youngfrankenstein View Post



I think you're missing the point.  As a fat person I can tell you that when your brain wants to eat, you eat!  You eat way beyond what is comfortable.  You could eat ANYTHING and still want to eat more and more.  I truly don't believe this is about what foods the baby is eating. 




And I truly believe it is partly about what the baby is eating.

I forgot til just now, my parents fostered. They had a little girl who was like this. One memorable day, she ate a whole loaf of bread and butter, 17 or so slices, then went home to my mom. And then ate a full lunch. I don't believe that would be possible with higher nutrition dense food.


You're right.  I was being hasty in my reply.  I am just trying to say that it isn't ALL about what she's eating.  I do think the OP should focus on changing up the diet and I think she will try it.  I was just saying I can understand, as a "normal adult" that sometimes you're brain keeps telling you to eat and eat. 

 

post #284 of 343

Anna,

 

I'm sorry that this seems like it's not working... i just wanted to send out huge hugs. Is it possible (and I *know* what a pain in the butt this is), but to have it so she doesn't have to ask you for the food. I have a 19 month old now, and to do this would make me nutso since he would make such an colossal mess.

 

I just suggest this because it might give you a break from having to be so focused on how much she was eating.

Quote:
Originally Posted by ram3113 View Post




Thanks, pumpkingirl71.  I'm getting tired of responding to the people who act like I'm not feeding her anything but rice puffs and wondering why she is still hungry.

 

Anna

 



 

post #285 of 343

Ok, new to the thread and just reading a bit of the history, and something struck me in one of your recent posts...You said she had H. pylori and reflux.

 

Is she still being treated for her reflux?  I know you said she was treated for her H. pylori, but if she is having silent reflux, it could be hurting her.  After doing research because my youngest developed reflux, one of the things that kids do when their reflux is acting up is eat.  Why, because it helps relieve the stomach acid.  Also, your syliva helps reduce stomach acid.

 

Since, she is a bit older, have you tried, between meals, giving her chewing gum.  If her reflux is acting up, this might help.  I know a lot of people are against gum, but in your case it may be helpful.

post #286 of 343
Thread Starter 

Actually, she had H. Pylori, and was treated for that.  After the treatment all of her symptoms got worse.  She was never diagnosed with reflux, nor was she tested.  ALL of the doctors I saw blew me off completely because she could gain weight, so in their eyes there was nothing wrong with her.     

I have information that even from her first days in the orphanage she cried a lot, and wanted to be picked up, and wanted bottles sooner than the other kids,  and had a slightly distended abdomen even then.   No one ever felt there was anything to warrant testing, etc.   She was in the orphanage from about 3 weeks to 8 months.  

I have wondered if she could have silent reflux many times, but no doctors would consider it.    If she wasn't gaining weight, but growing taller, they would be concerned.  But because she isn't growing taller but gaining weight, they won't even consider there might be a problem.  It's as if the doctors only see one thing...that she gains weight and is not emaciated.   The fact that she dropped from the 50th percentile in height to the 5th didn't even register with them.

 

And there might not be....but it would be nice to know that definitively, too.  

 

Oh...and I'm quite sure she wouldn't be able to chew the gum and not swallow it.  She is about 28 mo. old.  But you're right, that probably would help.

 

  Anna

 

post #287 of 343

 

 

Quote:
...Although I recognize every mother's need for a break, I don't want to WANT one so badly.  It makes me very sad.

 

Please release yourself from this guilt. I don't belong in the Adoptive forum so pardon my intrusion. I know there are many aspects to this that must be out of my realm of experience but coming from someone who hasn't had a real break in 7 years, I want one and I don't feel bad about it. It's not healthy to go and go and go with no reprieve, especially when you have had to be so intensely focused on the situation at hand. It doesn't benefit our families either when we let ourselves get to the burn out point. I often wish the MDC community was less widespread, so that we could provide each other with more tangible support. 

 

You are obviously doing an amazing job. I think she will be ok while you take just even a little time for yourself to recharge.   

hug2.gif

  

post #288 of 343

YOU. ARE. AN. INCREDIBLE. MOM.  I have kept up with this thread, but have held back from posting because I wasn't sure what I could offer that you haven't already thought of and tried.  But I have gotten so frustrated today reading some of the "supportive" posts from people who think that your DD is just like their child (who likes to snack) and that this is all about what food you offer her and when. 

 

I'm a psychologist and DH is a pediatrician, and it certainly doesn't take those degrees to sense that something is defintely going on that is beyond the scope of typical toddler food issues.  A few thoughts (and forgive me if you've covered some of this earlier in your journey- I haven't read the beginning of the thread since- well- the beginning...)

 

1.  I totally agree with a pp that reflux needs to be ruled out.  my DD1 has had severe reflux almost since birth, but she was a happy barfer and we either didn't treat it or undertreated it for years.  She is now 5.5 years old, and still on huge doses of meds and has recenlty been biopsied to look for allergies.  Anyway, my point is that until she was 4 years old, she was at the 99.9th percentile for height (DH and I are at the 5th) and about 75th-90th for weight.  Clearly not a child who had trouble growing.  my DD2 also had bad reflux as an infant (she managed to outgrow it) and one of our biggest clues that it was being undertreated is that she wanted bottles every 2-3 hours of the day and night long after others her age were spreading out at least a few of the bottles per day... and had suddenly gone up a lot in the weight/height ratio (getting chubbier faster).  Please find a doc who will look at this issue more closely.... just to rule it out.

 

2. I think there was something up-thread about genetic testing for Praeder Willi Syndrome?  I have worked with several kids who have this (and I have a cousin whose 7 year old daughter has it) and the eating issues are very much like what you have described.  If your DD has been tested and doesn't have it, perhaps some of the support groups on line or other websites would have some ideas for how to deal with food issues.  Of course, they way that this is usually handled in kids with PWS is diametrically opposed to what you are now doing (which is how food issues that are felt to be psychologically/trauma induced are usually handled).  So I'm not sure when/if the PWS approach would even be relevant to you, but at least you may find a way to be in touch with other moms who know of the struggles and pain you go through every day and how awful it is to have a loved one care ONLY about eating.

 

3.  Again, not sure if  this is relevant... but with the growth issues (height) has your daughter been tested for growth hormone levels?  I'm not sure exactly what I'm getting at here, but my DH is/was growth hormone deficient (completely- he basically made NONE) and has taken replacement all his life.  My point is that his issue was found to be related to a congenitally deformed pituitary gland... and one issue is that the hypothalamus (which regulates things like hunger/thirst/feeling satiated) can be impacted by the hormones that are put out (or not in my DH's case) by the pituitary. This has been a struggle for him for his life- he just THINKS about food way more than others...a bout when/how/how much he can get, etc.  It is not something he wants to be doing, and efforts to modify his diet/eating  have been most successful for him (he is now of almost average weight, but has been obese at many times) when they are very structured but allow for huge amounts of actual food.  (for example, he now is a vegetarian and doesn't eat cheese or simple carbs.  but he will eat salad, veggies, fruit, lentils, etc in huge, unlimited quantities and has lost a ton of weight).  So is there any possibiity of a structural or endocrine reason that her hypothalamus could be dysreguated?  (versus a genetic reason, like PWS) If there was, would there be a different treatment approach (meds, behavioral etc) that would be used? I guess just the questions I'd be asking of my doctors.

 

Anyway, sorry for being so long winded.  I am SO impressed by you and how you've handled this.  I guess I'm wondering if there are any other specialties that may have something they can add to this puzzle... genetics, endocrine (or another doc if you've seen one), any structural imaging, etc.  The awful thing is that your DD may be dealing with the obvious causes for her eating issues (previous deprivation, etc) but that may be overlaying the medical/genetic/physical. 

 

Wishing you strength.  I hope and wish that there was a way for you to get some sort of support and respite care. 

post #289 of 343
Quote:
Originally Posted by MoonWillow View Post

 

 

 

Please release yourself from this guilt. I don't belong in the Adoptive forum so pardon my intrusion. I know there are many aspects to this that must be out of my realm of experience but coming from someone who hasn't had a real break in 7 years, I want one and I don't feel bad about it. It's not healthy to go and go and go with no reprieve, especially when you have had to be so intensely focused on the situation at hand. It doesn't benefit our families either when we let ourselves get to the burn out point. I often wish the MDC community was less widespread, so that we could provide each other with more tangible support. 

 

You are obviously doing an amazing job. I think she will be ok while you take just even a little time for yourself to recharge.   

hug2.gif

  

This is so true. I am a new sahm, and feeling the same feelings of guilt-- at around 5 every day, I don't even want to *look* at my kids anymore, much less care for them, and it also makes me very sad. I think you are working so hard, Anna!

 

You might consider looking at finding your tribe to see if there are some like-minded mom's that you can reach out to.
 

 

post #290 of 343

Dear OP, the title of this thread is about you, not your daughter. She's too young to be food-obsessed in any other way than seeking sustenance. Please let her eat her little heart out. Even if her BMI gets above whatever stats you know, even if you feel her tummy sticks out, even if you feel she's chubbier than your own (culturally defined) standards would consider ideal. For whatever reason, she needs the comfort of knowing there is always more food than she would be able to eat in her life at the moment. She doesn't look overweight now, and even if she needs to be overweight for a while, that's not the end. My DD was born too thin, due to an amniotic fluid problem, and she slowly turned overweight until at the age of 9 she slimmed down (which took a conscious decision and some effort on her side). 

 

Your dd should be able to develop into who she is, not into an image you have of what a girl/woman should be. Feed her what she wants. How can you teach her about her own decisive power over her body if you decide how much she eats? You can give her appropriate choices and offer healthy foods, but please let her decide how much. So what if she's chubby for a while? She''ll likely slim down, and if not, not. Maybe she knows the feeling of an empty stomach to an extent that (almost) no Western woman will ever know. Maybe food is her emotional peacegiver. Maybe she just really really likes flavors. 

 

As a parent, the greatest gift you can give her is to become the person she's supposed to be. Even if that's not the person you envisioned her to be before she was your child. 

post #291 of 343

I tend to agree that you need to relax and try not to worry so much about your daughter becoming fat. I don't think you can learn to regulate your food intake if you don't get practice and that practice needs to be with free access to both fatty foods and low fat foods. It seems like the worst that can happen is she will overeat and feel sick or even vomit but eventually she'll learn when to stop eating. If she doesn't get the chance to learn this now I think it will be harder to learn as an adult. I think that's the same reason why they say not to force your child to finish everything on his plate. Children need to learn how to listen to their own bodies and since she is only two she has plenty of time to learn this if given the chance now.

 

This reminds me of a case I learned about in college where parents had a baby who craved salt and just wanted to eat salt all day long. They took the baby to a pediatrician who said to just stop feeding the baby salt and the parents listened. It turned out the baby had a problem with his adrenal glands and if I remember correctly he died when he stopped having unlimited access to salt. That's an extreme example but I think you need to give your daughter as many choices as you can and let your daughter show you what she is craving (protein, calcium, fat?) since it's possible she is eating constantly because she is not getting all of her nutritional needs met.

 

Good luck and I hope that you find a doctor who can help you get this situation under control.

post #292 of 343

Simonee and Macy, please read the entire thread and focus on adoption related concerns. The OP is not benefitting from posts such as yours.

post #293 of 343

I think Simonee and Macy have read the whole thread.  Maybe others should make sure they are, in fact, reading the whole thread also.  The OP can benefit from more than just "You're doing everything 100% correct!".

 

post #294 of 343


I am going to second this.  I have a son who had reflux so bad he wasn't gaining weight, but was maintaining.  If you read up on reflux, you will see that weight goes one of two ways with them.  They either become failure to thrive (ie don't gain adequate weight) or they gain and gain and gain.  My best friend's son is a few months younger than mine.  Both of us have reflux kids.  Mine failed to thrive, hers became overweight and constantly ate.

 

I am also going to recommend the taking a break.  I love my Ds3, but man, I do need a break.  Sleepless nights, 2 hospital admissions, even more sleepless nights, hardly ever being able to put him down.  I really takes it toll on a person.

 

BTW - if you are worried about swallowing gum, maybe look at getting like a chewing necklace or chewy sticks.  They are often used in speech therapy and feeding therapy.  She can chew on it and chew on it and not have to worry about swallowing it by accident.  And it will increase syliva production.

 

Quote:
Originally Posted by MoonWillow View Post

 

 

 

Please release yourself from this guilt. I don't belong in the Adoptive forum so pardon my intrusion. I know there are many aspects to this that must be out of my realm of experience but coming from someone who hasn't had a real break in 7 years, I want one and I don't feel bad about it. It's not healthy to go and go and go with no reprieve, especially when you have had to be so intensely focused on the situation at hand. It doesn't benefit our families either when we let ourselves get to the burn out point. I often wish the MDC community was less widespread, so that we could provide each other with more tangible support. 

 

post #295 of 343
Quote:
Originally Posted by lauren View Post

Simonee and Macy, please read the entire thread and focus on adoption related concerns. The OP is not benefitting from posts such as yours.



Particularly Simonee's points:


"For whatever reason, she needs the comfort of knowing there is always more food than she would be able to eat in her life at the moment. "

 

 "Maybe she knows the feeling of an empty stomach to an extent that (almost) no Western woman will ever know. Maybe food is her emotional peacegiver"

 

do relate to the adoption related concerns.  

 

I find it odd that you seem to think yourself in a position to decide what is helpful the OP.  
 

 

Now, to actually be helpful to the OP - have you tried offering her a snack tray, like Dr Sears suggests?
 

I have worked with a number of toddlers and have always found it helpful to offer them a variety of options.  

 

It is VERY common to have attachments to food that are about comfort and security, these attachments are not necessarily pathological, in fact, they are often beneficial.  Children who have been adopted often have a significant need for attachment and comfort.  Knowing there is enough food available to her may be very important for her.

 

She might also be sensory seeking with her mouth, and chewing and eating is one way to do that.    Another way might be to try something appropriate to chew on: http://www.amazon.com/CHEWY-TUBES-MULTIPLE-TEXTURES-SENSORY/dp/B002127E7M  (This is just a suggestion, I'm not endorsing this product.)

 

Many kids are oral sensory seeking - it's often linked to autism, but not necessarily.  She might just find it comforting to have something in her mouth to chew, hence the nonstop eating.

 

So, Dr. Sears has this list of suggestions: http://www.askdrsears.com/html/3/t030800.asp  for feeding toddlers.  While it's aimed at "picky toddlers" Dr. Sears offers some insight into toddler nutrition here, and some great tips, relevant to all toddlers.

 

The key thing to remember with toddlers is that they need to make every bite count, so offering nutrient dense food that will take longer to digest, and avoiding empty calories and watching carbohydrate intake is the way to go.

 

Also, toddlers need to get about 30-40% of their calories from fat.  Cholesterol is super important, they need it to develop their brains.  

 

Toddlers are growing, it takes a lot of energy in the form of calories to do that, and it may well be that given her adoption and prenatal nutrition that your daughter is lacking in key vitamins or minerals, so it's especially important for her to be allowed to follow her body's signals in sorting out what she needs.

 

It's really not uncommon, in fact, I would say it's typical, for toddlers to eat way more than one might think, given their size.  They are growing and developing, and it takes a lot of calories to do that.  Toddlers also can't go very long between meals, and eating 5-6 mini meals plus snacks tends to be how they are best fed, in my experience.


I hope you are able to find some peace with this and find a way to meet your daughter's needs and promote her healthy development and growth.  

post #296 of 343

Can you share what food your child eats in a typical day?  I've been focusing on my diet, and I realized it was too carb heavy, which was causing me to obsessively eat carby things. Since I'm bad at this with myself,  I try to push proteins and fat with my son so hopefully he'll have a balanced relationship with food (he's 22 months).  My son eats a ton of food; according to daycare, most toddlers and kids eat a ton and their portions can sometimes rival adult portions.

 

My son was really low on percentiles as an infant, but has become pretty average...I think 50% height and 30% weight.  His typical menu on a daycare day is:

Breakfast - 6 oz fage yogurt, strawberries, 1-3 silver dollar cottage cheese pancakes

No morning snack at daycare - at home, cut up fruit or cheese and crackers

Lunch - 1/4 or 1/8 of a cut up chicken breast (depends on size), 1/8 cup brown rice, a few clusters of broccoli

Snack - a couple of olives, some crackers, edamame, peanut butter/hummus/cheese/avocado to go with crackers

Predinner snack-cut up apple or dried fruit

Dinner-ham (2 servings), mashed potatoes (2 servings last night), gravy, carrots, peas, offered a roll but he didn't care for it.

 

While he doesn't eat every last bit of offered food, he eats most of it, which is astounding to me.  He's got a round belly, but that's normal for toddlers.  He's going to spurt in the next couple of years, and the chub rolls and belly will be gone as he goes from toddler to preschooler.

 

 

post #297 of 343
Quote:
Originally Posted by simonee View Post

Dear OP, the title of this thread is about you, not your daughter. She's too young to be food-obsessed in any other way than seeking sustenance. Please let her eat her little heart out. Even if her BMI gets above whatever stats you know, even if you feel her tummy sticks out, even if you feel she's chubbier than your own (culturally defined) standards would consider ideal. For whatever reason, she needs the comfort of knowing there is always more food than she would be able to eat in her life at the moment. She doesn't look overweight now, and even if she needs to be overweight for a while, that's not the end. My DD was born too thin, due to an amniotic fluid problem, and she slowly turned overweight until at the age of 9 she slimmed down (which took a conscious decision and some effort on her side). 

 

Your dd should be able to develop into who she is, not into an image you have of what a girl/woman should be. Feed her what she wants. How can you teach her about her own decisive power over her body if you decide how much she eats? You can give her appropriate choices and offer healthy foods, but please let her decide how much. So what if she's chubby for a while? She''ll likely slim down, and if not, not. Maybe she knows the feeling of an empty stomach to an extent that (almost) no Western woman will ever know. Maybe food is her emotional peacegiver. Maybe she just really really likes flavors. 

 

As a parent, the greatest gift you can give her is to become the person she's supposed to be. Even if that's not the person you envisioned her to be before she was your child. 



That is really not constructive.  She is not even close to being too little to be food obsessed.  As a social worker having worked several years in adoption, I have seen child after child who has been deprived of food react by becoming absolutely obsessed with food.  And to suggest that this is about OP and not her daughter is unfair and cruel.  Of course this is going to have an impact on OP.  She is parenting her daughter day in and day out and struggling with immense challenges.

 

Also, for this child to be allowed to eat nonstop is not going to address the *actual* problem.  There is something creating a need for nonstop eating.  Food being her emotional peacegiver isn't okay.  Allowing this child to eat nonstop is not going to be a gift that allows her to become the person she is supposed to be.  It will prevent her from being who she's supposed to be.  Its an easy way out and isn't a solution. Not to mention, my understanding is that she was continuing to gain weight even without over eating at one point. 

 

OP-- You are doing an incredible job!  There are so many layers to sift though that it must feel incredibly daunting.  To not know if this is an issue stemming from trauma/deprivation or if it stems from some sort of medical or genetic issue makes it all the more difficult.  I really have nothing to add other than my son was a baby in the 95th plus percentile for his weight and was super chubby because he was only around 50th for height, and he had reflux.  He had reflux so badly that it gave him sleep apnea because he would hold his breath at night to protect his airways.  This was how we found out he had it actually....listening to him gasp for air in the middle of the night.  Had we not had that scary situation, we probably never would have known the severity.  Maybe something to check out...  Good luck to you.  Be kind and gentle to yourself and don't let anyone on here convince you that you're anything but a fantastic mom doing the everything you can to nurture your daughter and get to the bottom of this issue.  Clearly those who are judging have no understanding of the complexity of adoption issues nor rare medical issues.   


Edited by APToddlerMama - 5/8/11 at 11:51am
post #298 of 343
Quote:
Originally Posted by lauren View Post

Simonee and Macy, please read the entire thread and focus on adoption related concerns. The OP is not benefitting from posts such as yours.



Lauren, I read the whole thread. I even did a rather extensive search for other posts and threads by the OP (and even though I wanted to bring them up, I didn't because I didn't want to be a UAV). To me the food issues seem to be intertwined very closely with the adoption-related concerns. I get the strong impression that food is more important to the OP's daughter than the OP considers ideal, and I tried to tie it to potential issues the girl may have had before (or as?) she was adopted. 

 

I don't know what the OP benefits from (though I would have preferred you phrasing it as "what this precious little girl benefits from"), but as the OP's concerns have been similar for a while (so other suggestions  maybe weren't very beneficial either), I thought it couldn't hurt to offer my own ideas. 

 

Also? I love parentheses more than is good for me ;)

post #299 of 343



 

Quote:
Originally Posted by simonee View Post

I get the strong impression that food is more important to the OP's daughter than the OP considers ideal, and I tried to tie it to potential issues the girl may have had before (or as?) she was adopted. 



Re-typing this as it just disappeared so forgive me if it posts twice.  Simonee--I am not trying to attack you, but here is the problem:  You are suggesting that OP's problem is her own perceptions and ideals about food intake, when that isn't the case.  It implies OP should change rather than that she should continue seeking a solution for her daughter.  This little girl isn't happy.  She isn't emotionally well.  Her belly is distended.  Something is going on.  The problem isn't OPs perceptions, and it comes off as an attack when it is suggested that way.  Also, I don't mean to be rude, but you cannot have a real good understanding of adoption issues if you are suggesting that this little girl isn't eating for any reason other than "seeking sustenence."  That isn't true. 

 

 

Also, here is a PSA for everyone on this thread who wants to post without reading everything.  Read this:  OP is giving her daughter big, healthy, balanced meals and snacks each day that have both protein and fat.  The cheerio substitute is what she uses in between all the regular meals a child would normally eat.  Quit flaming her for offering her DD a "carb heavy, empty calorie" whatever snack in between meals as if she is starving this child.  If you're going to post without reading, at least suggest something like testing for celiac for the 20th time instead of criticizing.

 

post #300 of 343

I've been a foster parent for five years, have worked with at-risk children and families for almost 20 years, and have many foster and foster/adoptive parent friends. This food obsession is VERY common. I've read every one of the OPs posts on the subject and know she is doing her best to help her daughter. She has not stopped trying. She has gone to doctors (those who specialize in adoption-related issues and those who don't.) She has taken the advice of many posters in this, and her other, threads. Comparing this toddler to other toddlers really isn't helpful because they aren't the same. This isn't a little girl who just needs to learn to self-regulate. She likely has very complex psychological wounds that need to be healed.

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