Adoption related-Still food obsessed - Page 17

[prettypixels]

So make and peel eggs by the dozen.  Put out a few peeled and see if she wants them.  You are so worried and fretting about every morsel in her mouth, and since you've been restricting her food for so long, you KNOW she is picking up on all that tension that you have about it.  She might overeat for a while.  SO WHAT?   She might get a tummy ache.  She might even throw up.  It's not the end of the world.  You've been giving her more food for four whole days.  That's not long enough to draw any conclusions.   Prep the food in the morning so that you don't have to do prep work all day long, and when she asks for more have stuff ready to grab for her.  Cheese sticks and peeled hard boiled eggs should only take you a second to grab.  I'd drop the rice thins altogether, what is the purpose?  Put nut butter on apple slices if you want to.  

 

It's been four days.  It has not been long enough for you to say that she will literally NEVER STOP.  

 

And what if she does get fat?  As long as she is healthy and happy who the heck cares what her body type is?  

[AirMiami]

Anna, would you be able to go to a food bank? I know Angel Food Ministries is a cheap food source too. Please don't listen to the people who obviously haven't really read the entire thread. You are awesome.

EDIT: It's been four days since she started watching her gluten more closely again, not four days since she's been letting her eat as much as she wants. 

[lauren]

Originally Posted by AirMiami 

Anna, would you be able to go to a food bank? I know Angel Food Ministries is a cheap food source too. Please don't listen to the people who obviously haven't really read the entire thread. You are awesome.

EDIT: It's been four days since she started watching her gluten more closely again, not four days since she's been letting her eat as much as she wants. 

Day 5 was on 4/27/11, so this must be day 21; a significant difference.
 

[lauren]

I wish I could send you some eggs. My 5 hens have been laying like crazy with the spring!

[TTCH785]

No, she had gluten/milk on 4/23 or so (can't remember the day exactly, but I think it was the day before Easter.    She hasn't had any gluten since then.  It was only the 2 meatballs.  When I said day 4, I meant 4 days of letting her eat as much as she wanted.   That's why I can't understand the return of the extreme abdominal distension.  It has been a while since the gluten/dairy, and I thought taking those out of her diet is what caused her distension to start going away.  

Anna

[lookatreestar]

Originally Posted by LAWoman 

I think this is right on. It sounds like during the week you are home alone with her, but is your husband/partner around on weekends? Could he take over the bulk of her feeding and care on the days he's home so at least so you can get a break?

Also,  you did respond to my question abuot depression and I think it's great that you recognize that you are struggling with that. I really strongly encourage you to do everything possible to get yourself well, up to an including medication and counseling if needed. I think the lens that you are viewing your daughter and her issues through is distorted by the depression and your own food issues and it's clouding your ability to see her for who she really is and to see her issues for what they really are. I don't doubt that she has this issue and that anyone would be struggling at this point,  I just think that your own issues are making it particularly hard for you to cope with it. You are trying very hard and it is very obvious that you want the situation to improve. I think that is to be commended. But I think you need help to adjust to the huge changes in your life if you are going to adequately help your daughter cope with her struggles. I would also not underestimate a young child's ability to sense your stress and distress around the food issue. If she is already struggling with feeling secure and attached that is only going to make it worse.

And I know you have mentioned some of the help you've sought for your daughter scattered throughout the thread, but it might be helpful to put in one post what types of doctors and therapists you've seen. Then someone might have a suggestion for you. Have you seen a developmental pediatrician for example? Has she been seen by any adoption clinics?

I wish you and your daughter the best.
 

i too can feel the stress and emotion in your posts. i know i picked up a lot of bad food habits from my mom. seeing her going without eating all day and talking down about everything she cooked were some of the big ones. i really have to force myself out of that mentality since having my own kids- i really don't want them to have issues with food. i wish one or two of us was close enough to you to give you a break 

[treeoflife3]

I know you put out food for her to graze on but I was reading back on one of your posts and you commented on how every time she would come back asking for more food because she ran out, it would feel like a failure, you didn't give her enough.  I wonder if maybe it is the same for her?  if maybe she needs some time where she doesn't even need to keep going back to you asking for more food?  I don't know how possible it would even be for you so ignore me if you've done this or it just simply isn't something you can do but I wonder how she would react if in the morning immediately after breakfast, you put out EVERYTHING she normally eats in a day before she even has a chance to ask, the dozen+ eggs, pints of berries, all the hummus the ENTIRE box of cereal in a big bowl.. ALL of it and see how she reacts to having such a giant spread?  I wonder if maybe her fear of running out of food would be resolved if she literally DOESN'T run out of food and only has to stop eating it all because its time for a regular meal so she has to go back to all the snack food later.

I have no idea how feasible that would even be or if it could even help but the emotion you put through in that post talking about how it felt like a failure, not giving her enough because she'd keep coming back for more and more struck me.  I don't know how fast she eats so for all I know, doing that just means she ends up doubling her intake because she finishes it all before lunch but it popped into my head.

I can't even begin to imagine what it would be like to deal with something like this and I can tell how much you love her and how much you are trying to do everything in your power to help her reach a point where she can have a happy and fulfilling life.  I think you are amazing for clearly putting your all into this, and for so long.

[macy]

In the 4 days that you allowed her to eat as much as she wanted during the day did she eat so much that she threw up? If so, did she empty her stomach or just throw up a little? Personally, I would let her eat until she made herself sick if that's what she wanted to do so she could learn what hungry, full and too full feels like through experience. I only say that because my baby overate breastmilk until she vomited all the time as a newborn and her doctor said it was ok since it was just a few times a week, not after each meal. She grew out of it and now knows to stop eating when she is full. I know it's a different situation but I think if it's ok for a baby to vomit a few times a week it's probably ok for a 2 year old to vomit occasionally too.

However, since your daughter is two and nutrition in the early years is so important I would be hesitant to make too many guesses like this about what is the best course of action, particularly since you can't get a do-over if you mess up somehow. There must be someone you can contact with experience who can answer specific questions like: is there such a thing as eating too much or will she just throw up if she eats too much, how often would she need to throw up for it to be something you should worry about, how many weeks or months should you expect it to take before she gradually learns to self-regulate? I assume it would take several months of gradual learning before she really knows when to stop and that any extra weight gain during that time would work itself out later when is older and more active, but I think there must be someone out there who actually knows the answers and isn't guessing. If you would like to find an expert like this but don't know where to look and don't have the time to look into it right now (it sounds like you are already overwhelmed as it is), perhaps I or others in this thread could help look for you. Just a suggestion.

I do worry that if you give her free access to food and then take it away you could reinforce her thinking that she should eat as much as she can while she has the chance, rather than learning food will always be there and to just eat when she is hungry.

[Irishmommy]

A social worker told me once that however long the trauma was before adoption, is how long it takes to "recover" after. And this being a food issue, your dd is 28 months right? Less the 4 days you've been giving her everything? I don't want to scare you, but it could, conceivably take a year or more for her to normalize her behaviour. Or longer if not given the chance.

[ssh]

First, I think your doing a great job and I can't imagine how stressful this would be. Do you have a back yard? Have you tried spending the day mostly outside, watering plants, digging in the dirt, blowing bubbles and stuff? What about growing some tomatoes or other fruit in a pot? My DD had 2 tomato plants last year. She planted them, watered and picked them and they were her's to eat too. Maybe having her own plants might make food seem less scarce for your DD. It's spring now, maybe being outside could be more distracting now. If you're still offering gluten free Cheerios, maybe having her own box where she can reach it could help. It's hard to do that with most of the foods she's eating. I also sliced eggs for my DD when she was your DD's age.

[texmati]

nm

Edited by texmati - 5/14/11 at 7:48am

[texmati]

nm

[APToddlerMama]

Originally Posted by prettypixels 

So make and peel eggs by the dozen.  Put out a few peeled and see if she wants them.  You are so worried and fretting about every morsel in her mouth, and since you've been restricting her food for so long, you KNOW she is picking up on all that tension that you have about it.  She might overeat for a while.  SO WHAT?   She might get a tummy ache.  She might even throw up.  It's not the end of the world.  You've been giving her more food for four whole days.  That's not long enough to draw any conclusions.   Prep the food in the morning so that you don't have to do prep work all day long, and when she asks for more have stuff ready to grab for her.  Cheese sticks and peeled hard boiled eggs should only take you a second to grab.  I'd drop the rice thins altogether, what is the purpose?  Put nut butter on apple slices if you want to.  

 

It's been four days.  It has not been long enough for you to say that she will literally NEVER STOP.  

 

And what if she does get fat?  As long as she is healthy and happy who the heck cares what her body type is?  

There is so much terrible and harsh advice on this thread that I hesitate to even respond to any of it, but this I just have to...  Fretting about "every morsel in her mouth"?  She isn't fretting about every morsel in her mouth.  Did you *hear* what she ate?  8 eggs would make me sick and that was the tip of the iceberg.  If you want to get your point across, try wording it in a way that isn't so harsh and doesn't exaggerate what is going on.  8 eggs isn't a morsel.  And so if this little girl gets nice and fat, she's also going to be happy and healthy, but who cares about her body type?  This kid isn't happy no matter how much she eats, and she isn't healthy either.  *Something* much bigger than food is going on.  If it was that simple as getting fat and happy, this child would have been happy a long time ago.  There are actually some good thoughts and ideas in many posts that just so happen to get mixed in with a lot of judging, lack of empathy, and cruelty, so the message goes unheard. 

A lot of people posting on this thread really need to ease up.  The lack of empathy is appalling.  I hope nobody else is ever put in the unfortunate situation that OP is in, because then we might all just understand just how difficult it is to parent a child with these sorts of challenges 24 hours a day 7 days a week. I know I would be deeply depressed in this situation.  I question how many of us wouldn't be.  Not to mention, nobody here even knows if letting this child eat two dozen eggs, 50 hotdogs, 20 pbj sandwiches, 10 bowls of icecream, 4 bags of chips, and whatever else for a YEAR would solve anything.  If you have actually been in this position of having had a child who has eaten like this, who has been adopted, who you have "cured", go ahead and write a completely condescending, thoughtless, and cruel post to OP telling her how she's doing things wrong, its all because of OPs own body issue/food issues, that she isn't feeding her DD the right foods, etc.  If you haven't been in that position though, you should probably consider having a little kindness and empathy.  After all, nobody has solved OPs problem over the internet yet.

OP, I am really truly sorry for all that you are going through.  I am also sorry that you have had to endure such appalling responses on this thread. The fact that you keep coming back to this thread searching for a solution despite all the negativity really shows that your heart is in the right place and just how hard you are willing to fight for your daughter.  I think you addressed this before saying that there wasn't a medical cause, but I don't recall reading specifically if your DD has been tested for Prader-Willi.  Ignore the suggestion if you've mentioned it before and I'm sorry to duplicate suggestions if you've addressed that.

Also, it sounds like you need a break.  It sounds like your other kids need a break.  It is okay to look at putting your DD in preschool or getting some childcare.  Two things could happen...You could find out that by some miracle, she is distracted enough by other kids at the preschool that she isn't so focused on food (unlikely), or school could have the exact same issues as you which might take some of the "blame" off you that others are trying to place on you.  Also it might be helpful in searching for an answer to know this isn't a behavior that goes on solely in your home.  For you to have a few hours a day or week in which you didn't have to focus on these food issues and/or the whining/lack of play when DD wasn't eating might allow you to recharge enough to have more time to devote also to figuring out what is going on.  You might have some time to clear your head.  We can't give our kids what we don't have to give, and it sounds like (and rightfully so), you are getting to the point where you're running on empty.  It is okay to ask for help.  You are going through extraordinarily difficult challenges with your DD. 

Having worked in adoption, I will agree with others who say 4 days of total food access probably aren't going to be enough.  But then again, I can understand where you are coming from, because it hasn't really been four days either.  She has had fairly unlimited access to food for a long time.  Just a thought though.  Also, if I were you, I would look at taking myself off the hook for providing super healthy foods for a while too and would opt for convenience.  Even if you just go for that for a month, it might take some pressure off of you to be constantly cutting, washing, preparing food.  You can buy hardboiled eggs that are peeled already.  One other thought...if you don't want to do childcare, you could also see about hiring someone to come in and do some food prep for you a couple hours/week.  I just think you need something to lighten your load.  Anyone would start to break in your shoes.  Too much is being expected from you. 

You are in my prayers OP.  It might not come tomorrow, but I believe you will find the cause of your DD's obsession with food and a solution. You are getting very close to her becoming verbal enough to provide you with some clues to what is going on.   I have seen so many families who have adopted really struggle for years with similar sorts of issues who have had happy endings.  There is hope. 
 

[lauren]

Just raising Prader Willi Syndrome again, as many of us have, just to make sure this has been ruled out. You would need a referral to a genetic clinic that could do testing to see if she had this. Ruling it out would just provide some more peace of mind if she didn't have it.

http://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pubmedhealth/PMH0002572/Symptoms

Symptoms may include:

• Almond-shaped eyes
• Delayed motor development
• Floppy newborn infant
• Insatiable appetite, food craving
• Irregular areas of skin that look like bands, stripes, or lines
• Narrow bifrontal skull
• Rapid weight gain
• Skeletal (limb) abnormalities
• Slow mental development
• Small for gestational age
• Undescended testicles in the male infant
• Very small hands and feet in comparison to body

[TTCH785]

Yes, she was tested.    It was negative, thank God.

  Anna

[lauren]

That is great. One less thing to worry about.

[TTCH785]

Thank you to all of you who have been helpful and supportive in the past.  I am taking my leave of this community now.

  Anna

[pumpkingirl71]

Originally Posted by APToddlerMama 

A lot of people posting on this thread really need to ease up.  The lack of empathy is appalling.  I hope nobody else is ever put in the unfortunate situation that OP is in, because then we might all just understand just how difficult it is to parent a child with these sorts of challenges 24 hours a day 7 days a week. I know I would be deeply depressed in this situation.  I question how many of us wouldn't be.  

Thanks you!  I think the way that AP parents want to parent and the needs of an adopted child can make a mom crazy.  Then throw in people who are sure they KNOW the answer and you feel crazy and like a bad mom.  I remember it so well when my adopted daughter needed to dominate my attention and my other two suffered.  So many AP moms told me just "give her all of the attention she needs."  Well that isn't practical when you have other kids and honestly, her goal was to make the whole family miserable.

Anna, I have been thinking about you every day.  I hope things are at least a little better.  I was thinking about you this morning as I fed my kids breakfast and my almost seven year old adopted daughter had a tantrum over not getting the best piece of coffee cake.  I had already made her a separate cake because she hates rhubarb.  No amount of extra attention is ever enough for her.  So it got me thinking about your daughter.  It occurred to me that she is fairly picky.  Do I remember that correctly, that she won't eat veggies or chicken?  It seems to me that if she had a deep psychological need to just eat, she would not be so picky.  Have you considered that maybe she doesn't just want to eat, that she LOVES the idea that she asks you for food and you get it for her?  That is the act of you feeding her she is addicted to, not just the food?  Of course, she has a problem with food too.

I ask because my daughter is addicted to dominating my atttention.  But she will purposely have bad behavior so I can't play with her, then she feels like she won.  She is seeking both attention and rejection.  It occured to me that maybe your daughter is asking for food until you just can't take it and you have to say no.

Now that I have laid out that scenario, sadly, if that is problem I don't have an answer.  But honestly, just knowing the problem had made my dd's behaviors more managable and easier to get my brain around.  We do see a therapist who uses Daniel Hughes's theories.
 

[4evermom]

  My understanding is to have an accurate test for celiacs, she will need to be eating gluten before the test.  You can get a false negative if the person has been eating gluten free.  Just wanted to mention that if you are still reading and in case it hadn't been mentioned previously...

[Super~Single~Mama]

Originally Posted by ram3113 

My last update:

    DD is doing well on the Ellyn Satter method.   We had a well check up yesterday and the pediatrician said she is growing well, and her height has increased by 2 inches in the last 4 months.   She is now about 30% percentile for height, which is a good increase.  He recommends testing her for celiac because of the abdominal distension, but he said to go ahead and try milk again.   He is concerned about what he called "significant distension".     He also said he truly believes she may have an undiagnosed parasite, because frequently the tests will come back negative.

   Anna

I'm so glad things are getting better!!!!!  You're doing a great job - and are such an incredible amazing mama!!!!!

I wish you luck, and hope that you find whats causing the distension, but I have NO DOUBT that you will succeed, and your dd will begin to thrive!!