Science/maths orientated curriculum for 3rd grader?

[Fillyjonk]

Is there such a thing?

I'm seeing curricula that are basically very arts or language based and teach science and so on through that.

But nothing the other way.

I'm looking for something with both a scientific orientation and a highly factual approach. For example, in history, it would be good to learn about the history of machines, inventions, general human ingenuity, etc. Art-maybe a bit more of a focus on technical drawing skills or botanical illustration. Woodworking and gardening rather than arty stuff. And so forth. One that will appeal to my boy. And, I suspect, a lot of other mechanically minded kids.

I'm sure I can cobble together stuff, I'm just wondering if such a thing is out there already. This is our first year of homeschooling and likely to be the hardest and I'd just like an easy, tried and tested, option really.

I also want something very secular, which rules out Real Science 4 kids.

Any thoughts?

[kgianforti]

This may interest you on a history note:

http://www.bfbooks.com/s.nl/sc.18/category.858/.f

My big girl is very math/science oriented and I just use various curricula. We are using Sonlight Science (which is very easy to use secularly, all of the Bible notes are in the Instructor's Guide and the books used are secular). And we use Singapore Math, which is a very mental, conceptual approach to math.

http://www.sonlight.com/science.html

https://www.singaporemath.com/Homeschool_s/60.htm

[Lisa1970]

Real Science 4 Kids is definitely secular.

You will have to piece meal this together. I used Singapore Math and have a variety of things for science. We are going to do Latin too. I started Latin with my older children and gave up. It just did not seem purposeful. It was not hard to do, but it just seemed a little like a waste of time. Then we hit 7th grade science and most terms were in Latin and I regretted that we gave it up. So I will definitely be doing Latin with the younger kids.

[moominmamma]

We don't use boxed curriculum, but I did want to recommend Joy Hakim's "Story of Science" series. It's a history series concerning science and scientific discovery, with lots of math mixed in, especially number theory and such in the first book. It's lushly illustrated and gives political and cultural context as well as some biographical story-telling. If you are looking to cobble together your own curriculum, it would be a very good jumping off point. Some of it might be a little over a third-grader's head, but I have certainly used it with my kids at that age.

Miranda

[tammyw]

That beautiful feet link for science looks GREAT!

Regarding Joy Hakim's Joy of Science - it says it's for older grades/ages. Would you agree with that assessment?

[moominmamma]

Originally Posted by tammyw

Regarding Joy Hakim's Joy of Science - it says it's for older grades/ages. Would you agree with that assessment?

I enjoyed it as an adult, so I think it'd be great for older grades/ages. However, I've found it works just fine for younger kids too, if they're really interested in science, particularly in the theory and history end of it -- for example, if they're always asking questions like "how did scientists figure out how big the earth is?" and "why does an hour have sixty minutes?" or "who invented rockets?" and so on. If they're not reading fluently at a ~6th grade level they'd need to have it as a read-aloud, cozied up, looking at all the pictures as a parent read and pointed. Actually, it's quite nice as a read-aloud even if you've got a fluent reader.

I've never put much stock in grade levels, if interest level is high.

Miranda

[ChristaN]

Real Science 4 Kids may not be blatantly religious, but the author is a proponent of intelligent design and tends to focus on that approach over evolution.

You might want to take a look at Pandia Press' Science Odyssey materials: http://www.pandiapress.com/. They also have history curriculum.

While I wouldn't call this a curriculum per se, Nebel's Elementary Education is science based and has a lot of good lesson plan and teaching approach ideas as well.

[tammyw]

Thanks so much Miranda! I will definitely look into purchasing these, like I am her history set!

[Fillyjonk]

Ah, looks like I'm going to have to put stuff together, ok. Was just really hoping there was something out there that magically linked everything together for us. Ok I am going to have to put the work in!

I think I may not have explained fully last night (it was LATE here!), what I am really after is something that doesn't treat science as an independent entity but rather explores all its strands and so on to their logical conclusion.

Really liked the look of the Nebel stuff, in fact have just ordered the foundations of scientific understanding book off Amazon.

Moominmamma, Story of Science looks great! We are big fans of Joy Hakim already, we have her American history series playing in the car atm. Am going to investigate further, but sounds like what we want.

Pandia Press stuff-I quite liked this, actually. My real issue with it is that it doesn't make connections to other subjects, it treats science as a standalone thing. I also wanted something with everything there and in one place-the Pandia books rely on supplementing with lots of books, and we are not in America so we'd have to ship them, or I'd have to spend hours trawling the charity shops and our bookshelves for equivalent books. If nothing else leaps forward, that's what we'll use though.

Real Science 4 Kids-yes,my concern was the author's background - not so much what was in there as what was not, iykwim.

But liking Nebel's and Hakim's books atm, further research tonight, thanks all.

[Lisa1970]

Most people who write any books in the US have Christian backgrounds, even if they do not put them in the books. I only have RS4Kids Chemistry and Physics (multiple levels) and have seen nothing of intelligent design. I am unsure if you only want books from people that you have confirmed to be atheists. But that can be very difficult to find as most writers do not advertise their religious beliefs, unless it is a specific part of the program. Maybe the biology has stuff in it, I have never used it. But I know the Chemistry and Physics do not.

You may wish to consider Singapore Science. You will not want any public school texbooks as they are generally approved of and guidelined in Texas. There has been a big thing in the news about it this past year. The people most heavily involved in the creation of the textbooks in the USA are Christians. You can google that and see it. (google texas textbook debate and you will get tons of hits). I cannot guarantee that Singapore Science was not written by any Christians, but it might be worth looking at. Good luck and hope that helps. I looked it up and Singapore is mostly Buddhist. So if Buddhism does not bother you, then Singapore books will be worth a try.

Good luck and I hope I have helped!

[moominmamma]

Originally Posted by Lisa1970

.I only have RS4Kids Chemistry and Physics (multiple levels) and have seen nothing of intelligent design.

Biology is of course where Intelligent Design would show up. We own Biology I and there is no mention of ID. However evolution is of course not mentioned either. The curriculum is very light, so it's not really a conspicuous absence. However, if the author ever expands the curriculum to Level II or beyond I think the absence of any mention of the reasons for, say, genetic diversity, or extinction, or the filling of ecological niches by species, would be more of a drawback.

Miranda

[Lisa1970]

RS4Kids only covers certain subjects. They would not cover everything you would want to learn for all years of school. But they are presented in a pleasing way and really get to the point. My older children were in honors 8th grade science (public school-Texas), yet, when we did Chemistry level 2 over the summer, most of it was new to them. Now they will be in preAP Chemistry this year, I will have to let you know how it goes. We use their physics too, but last I checked, it only has prelevel and level 1 for that.

I have been considering the Singapore Science myself, it gets great reviews. But my children love science and eat it up so we won't give up the RS4Kids. We have tons of DK and Usborne books too as well as books of experiments. I have ordered some kits online. We are learning about "Go Green" now so we are doing composting stuff and such. It is stuff my older children already knows about, but he is loving the whole experiment thing and making official experiment reports.

[Lisa1970]

Originally Posted by moominmamma

Biology is of course where Intelligent Design would show up. We own Biology I and there is no mention of ID. However evolution is of course not mentioned either. The curriculum is very light, so it's not really a conspicuous absence. However, if the author ever expands the curriculum to Level II or beyond I think the absence of any mention of the reasons for, say, genetic diversity, or extinction, or the filling of ecological niches by species, would be more of a drawback.

Miranda

I am wondering about something...the genetic thing....my children did a Christian curriculum at the end of last year due to being in a private school. I have no issue with them learning creationism. But I was a bit surprised to see them not coving protein synthesis, cell division, or genetics. I was quite disappointed in fact over that. Was it just that curriculum, or is that a creationist thing?

[eclipse]

We've just started with the Story of Science, and I was going to recommend it too. If you used that, along with other books about the time periods discussed, it could be a really full curriculum for a 3rd grader. We're using it with my 9 yo (almost 10 - 5th grade), but my 7 yo dd enjoys listening in, too. We're not using it for history (ds is working through Hakim's Story of US for that), but if you wanted to tie it in to ancient history (the first book, anyway), it would work quite well as your spine. You would probably have to add separate math, but there is a lot of math tied into the book - probably above the level of an 8 year old, but it never hurts to see math in action even if you can't quite do it yourself yet. The teacher's manual has lots of math/history/LA tie-ins to choose from.

[moominmamma]

Originally Posted by Lisa1970

I am wondering about something...the genetic thing....my children did a Christian curriculum at the end of last year due to being in a private school. I have no issue with them learning creationism. But I was a bit surprised to see them not coving protein synthesis, cell division, or genetics. I was quite disappointed in fact over that. Was it just that curriculum, or is that a creationist thing?

I expect that was just the curriculum. As far as I know, proponents of creationism don't disbelieve in cell division or protein synthesis. Or genetics, for that matter. But then again I have no experience with creationism.

Miranda

[Fillyjonk]

[QUOTE=Lisa1970;15782347]Most people who write any books in the US have Christian backgrounds, even if they do not put them in the books.

My goodness-really? This is absolutely not the case in the UK. I'm kind of boggling a bit at that. I'm realising that quite a lot of US homeschoolers are also creationists (I suspect that if you are American, that is like saying "British people like to queue").

I follow US politics and know that religion is BIG over there, like religious faith seems to be a prerequisite for any public office, but hadn't quite appreciated how prevalent it is in the HE community. Sorry about that.

In practical terms I honestly don't care whether the people who write the books are atheists, I just want books that are respectful of a functionally atheist point of view.

OK going to look at RS4K seriously, and Singapore Science!

Thanks again all

ATM am thinking of Nebel + Story of Science. I doubt we are going to follow a rigid curriculum anyway, unless that is what seems to work, and I'd quite like a second book to dip in and out of.

[Fillyjonk]

Originally Posted by Lisa1970

Real Science 4 Kids is definitely secular.

You will have to piece meal this together. I used Singapore Math and have a variety of things for science. We are going to do Latin too. I started Latin with my older children and gave up. It just did not seem purposeful. It was not hard to do, but it just seemed a little like a waste of time. Then we hit 7th grade science and most terms were in Latin and I regretted that we gave it up. So I will definitely be doing Latin with the younger kids.

oh btw latin, what did you use?

i love latin and I'd quite like to introduce my kids to it.

i came from an (ancient) languages background to studying science (maths/physics) as an adult-I can't tell you how much easier I found remembering scientific terms because of my working knowlege of greek and latin.

[Lisa1970]

Originally Posted by Fillyjonk

oh btw latin, what did you use?

i love latin and I'd quite like to introduce my kids to it.

i came from an (ancient) languages background to studying science (maths/physics) as an adult-I can't tell you how much easier I found remembering scientific terms because of my working knowlege of greek and latin.

I used Prima Latina last time, but am not of that religion. It has prayers in it. But it really is not a preachy thing, and you can skip them if you want. It is just memorizing certain popular Catholic prayers in Latin. But, I have the Minimus textbook, not the teachers guide. I believe that is put out by Cambridge Press. The teacher's guide is expensive, but I love Cambridge Latin which is for the older kids. If you are in the UK, have you looked at Galore Park? I heard others really like their materials, but I have not gotten to see them in person, just the samples online.

[Fillyjonk]

Originally Posted by Lisa1970

I used Prima Latina last time, but am not of that religion. It has prayers in it. But it really is not a preachy thing, and you can skip them if you want. It is just memorizing certain popular Catholic prayers in Latin. But, I have the Minimus textbook, not the teachers guide. I believe that is put out by Cambridge Press. The teacher's guide is expensive, but I love Cambridge Latin which is for the older kids. If you are in the UK, have you looked at Galore Park? I heard others really like their materials, but I have not gotten to see them in person, just the samples online.

No but I've looked at minimus, and I think that looks really good for small kids (and as a bonus, we are near to Bristol Uni which, iirc, distributes it)

I started Latin with the Cambridge Latin Course. Caecillus est pater. Metella in horto sedet. Etc.

Will take a look at Galore Park, never heard of it!