So happy to have intact boys

[dziwozony]

Luckily for my two little boys, my first encounter with the circumcision debate was from a NOCIRC man at a midwifery conference handing me a pamphlet (I was about 20 years old at the time). I had never spent a moment's time thinking of the issue & my brief encounter at their info table (they also had a video playing) quickly clarified that I would never do that to my own children.

Yet, it's never been a big issue for me. I always knew that of course I'd never circumcise my boys, but I just tuned out the others who did. But recently, for the first time, I find myself getting really upset over it!

My oldest is a bit over 3yo & my youngest is 20mo. Maybe having two amazingly little boys is what has me suddenly feeling fiercely protective. I had homebirths with both of them, so was never even in the hospital environment. Plus, I'm in NZ where circumcision has become rare, thank goodness (I am a US citizen but NZ resident).

Not only do I have my very own intact boys to personalize the debate, but I also just finished doing a bit of reading on the function of the foreskin & it's really quite incredible. That may sound like I'm overstating it, but I was really amazed reading about the way it moves, the lubricating function of it during sex, & the way it protects the urinary tract & keeps the skin of the penis soft. It's not just a flap of skin!

I have a hard time really understanding the "debate" of it. I know a lot of people post on here about problems, but for anyone reading this that might be on the fence, I am just posting to say that I am so glad my boys never went under the knife! I have absolutely no regrets & I hope for the sake of future boys that informed mothers protect their own sons in the same way.

[PuppyFluffer]

I am so glad that you understand the issue and have protected your boys from the harm of circumcision. It is profound thing to understand when you really know what you have saved them from. I was always opposed to circumcision, from the first time i learned what it was. I knew instinctively that it was wrong.
The American culture is so steeped in the practice that is can be very hard to let go of the idea that circumcised is normal. I am dealing with this personally for the first time with a couple that I know. They are fully informed. They read and watched all the content of the information packed I purchased for them from the group Saving Penises. I believe they are truly educated and yet they are planning on carrying forth with circumcision. Why? Do they truly want to hurt their baby? I don't think so - yet they plan to. The fear of having him be different outweighs the knowledge they have. They know that the circumcision rate is down to about 33% in America yet they are still worried about him being different. The parents cannot mentally and emotionally disconnect from what they know as normal (circumcision) to embrace what they know is right (leaving the child intact). It's some deep conditioning. Brainwashing comes to my mind when I consider the immovability of some people on this topic. It makes my heart hurt because I believe that those parents will one day let their wall down and understand the knowledge they were given, and the regret of an irreversible decision will come down on them. No one should need to feel that sort of pain and regret and no child should ever feel incomplete and violated in such a personal and private manner.

dziwozony, do you think the factual reality circumcision is dawning on you because you are outside of the American conditioning? You are in a culture that sees the whole male body as normal.

[PlainandTall]

Because you said you were at a midwifery conference- can I assume that you are a professional in the childbirth field? I wanted to comment on something you said about the "lubricating function" in regards to sex- and want you to consider this when/if you are in a position to counsel someone who is on the fence about circumcision.

This is something that is frequently misunderstood- as is clear by the fact that you didn't think about it as an adult, you didn't know about it as an adult, you even have intact sons and it didn't really dawn on you till you just saw it spelled out in writing.

When you talk to someone about this- remember that they may have no idea how the anatomy is- and worse yet- they may have a very strong pre-set idea that is fictional- so you not only have to explain the reality- but UN-DO their false idea.

One of the hurdles for a lot of people afraid of foreskin is hygiene- and the fact that they think that circumcision makes a penis dry and thus- more hygienic. If you try to sell genital integrity based on some idea of "lubricating function" and someone was to imagine some sort of gooey wet situation existing at the end of a penis like inside a vagina- well- you might actually turn them even more toward circumcision.

The foreskin keeps the glans from drying out- but it's not wet in there like inside a vagina... the functional purpose is not to create or produce lubrication- it's simply to reduce the DEMAND on the female lubrication system (with the contribution of a few drops from the exact same source as circumcised males have) So it's not that foreskin makes things wetter- it's that immobilizing the penis skin system squanders what wetness there is... where there once was a rolling buffer- now moisture must bear the burden of all that friction.

[dziwozony]

Puppyfluffer- "do you think the factual reality circumcision is dawning on you because you are outside of the American conditioning? You are in a culture that sees the whole male body as normal".............NZ is funny because as a country they used to have really high circumcision rates, then it dropped dramatically. So many adult kiwi males are circumcised...my boy's dad is, and if I wanted to do it to our boys, he would have gone along with it! I find that shocking. I kind of get the impression a lot of them are like that..it was done to them & they aren't aware of being traumatized, so what's the harm? But since it's out of fashion, it's not usually an issue up for discussion. I have yet to see a baby boy here who has been circumcised, so that does change what is normal. That definitely makes it seem even weirder that Americans are still practicing it so passionately.

PlainandTall- I am obsessively interested in pregnancy & childbirth, but am not currently a professional in the field! Though I am seriously considering getting into childbirth education (and am working with some grassroots projects towards community education).

Thanks for your description of the foreskin during intercourse..I can see how my mention of lubrication could create an image of gooey wetness, which might make people think unhygenic. I didn't think that the foreskin actually produced any kind of liquid, by lubrication I just meant that the rolling skin was condusive to the in & out motion, rather than causing direct friction- thinking the woman is to blame for not being wet enough! I watched a video of how the foreskin moves over the erect penis (nothing pornographic!) and I seriously sat there in amazement for a moment thinking "wow, *that's* the way it's supposed to work!" It just makes a lot of sense!

[LightToast]

I'm another mom who has two intact boys and I am so happy they have all their body parts! I am so, SO glad to know that I have preserved the normal function of their genitalia.

We live in the US. I don't know what the statistics are here. But I think circumcision is still pretty common. Instinctively I felt that it was wrong and then found information after-the-fact to support my beliefs. My husband is circumcised and my older son has asked about the difference. We told him that it is something people did before they realized it was completely unnecessary.

[dmpmercury]

I am incredibly thankful every day that I found out beforehand what circumcision entailed and didn't get it done to my ds. I am so thankful to the parents who got the information out there. It is the one thing I see as very black and white. I try my hardest to do the best for my kids and this is one thing I am so greatful I did for my son.

I think the reason it may have decreased in New Zealand and not here is that medical organizations took a strong stand against it and it stopped being covered. I think once it becomes the new norm the attitudes will change. I think insurance companiescovering is why it persists here. The states with the lowest rates are the ones where medicaid coverage stopped. If the AAP reccomends it hear agan it will be bad and the myths will persist and we will only be exposed to circumcision as being normal. If they get there way and have medicaid coverage for the states that lost it rates would go back up dramatically. I seriously want to do anything I can to get what other countries achieved and have it become a thing of the past.