adopting/infertility

[missme]

Hi all,

This is sort of random, but I'm looking for feedback from anyone who has experience.

I'm a single mama-to-be, and I'm going to start the IVF process soon. I'm wondering, though, if I should start the adoption process now, since it takes so long for international adoption. I'd still like to adopt after (if) I conceive, but I guess it's a question of resources: Can I parent two young children alone? Can I go through two difficult processes at once? What if I was pregnant when I got my referral? How would I travel? Would I be over-extending myself too much financially and jeopardizing my future ability to support myself and my potential kids?

It just makes me so sad to think that I might spend a year trying IVF, and then wait another 2 years for the adoption process to unfurl. 3 years till I have a kid? I've already been trying for so long and waiting to be ready to try before that. My heart is tempted by local older child adoption too, but I think it's probably too challenging for me at this time.

Any thoughts?

[Smithie]

I'd say that there's no harm in STARTING the adoption process, with the resolve to delay or abandon it if you do conceive and find your resources strained. I'd also say that domestic adoption may be a better bet since international travel would not be involved.

Of course, I'd ALSO say that if you are heterosexual, sperm is widely available on the hoof, at bars and clubs across this great nation, and that conceiving in that manner is easier than conceiving via in vitro or a turkey vaster. So clearly there is no limit to the outrageous things that I will say.

[JoyFilled]

I second that second part.

But on another hand my neighbour is 38 and just started fostering 2 sisters - ages 8 and 14 and is loving it. She has challenges but they have really worked through a lot of things in the last year.

[SundayCrepes]

Umm...if you would find domestic older child challenging (I'm not sure what age you mean) I wonder how international adopting would be? Those kids can have some hard issues AND you're bringing them into a totally different culture and climate.

I assume you've already tried unsuccessfully to get pregnant with IUIs?

[marsupial-mom]

I wouldn't recommend that anyone do both at the same time. They're very different emotional roller coasters that could interfere with each other. And this is terribly sad: I've already heard two identical stories of women fostering newborns with intent to adopt and then suddenly the women got pregnant and decided not to continue on the adoption plan, essentially "returning" those children that they fostered.

[missme]

Smithie - I've tried it the free sperm way too, but it hasn't worked either, and it has lots of risks, so I can't responsibly do it while pursuing ART. But good idea!

Joy-filled - that's great to hear! Thanks for the story.

SundayCrepes - I know that parenting is going to be challenging no matter what. If I go with international adoption, it will because I wish to parent a very young child at some point in my life, and I am more likely to have a young child placed with me in an international adoption that in a local adoption.

marsupial-mom - I think you may be right about the two processes being too emotionally difficult and different to pusue simultaneously. But I would consider any child placed with me to be my child. In the long run, in doesn't matter to me where my children come from, but I'm trying to conceive because I can't deny that in addition to my desire to parent, I also have a desire to grow and birth a baby.

Thanks all of you! This is exactly the kind of feedback I was hoping for!

[Smithie]

Sorry the free sperm didn't work out. But yes, it DOES have lots of risk, and at least your current options will not carry those particular risks.

To drift a bit...

"I've already heard two identical stories of women fostering newborns with intent to adopt and then suddenly the women got pregnant and decided not to continue on the adoption plan, essentially "returning" those children that they fostered."

SERIOUSLY? I do not doubt your word, but that's about the craziest thing I've ever heard - unless the "adoption plan" was still theoretical caseworker pretty-talk, which could have been the case for one or both of those women. I don't think I'd put myself through the "TPR or reunification?" roller coaster from hell while I was pg, so I might decide to stop being a foster parent at that point. That's not "returning" a child. That's realizing that your family situation has changed and fostering is not something you can do well in this season of your life. Part of being a foster parent, especially to a newborn, is having the strength to support reunification. I don't know but that pg hormones might strip that capacity right away.

I recently has some IRL dealings with a reunified one-year-old, who was back with her foster mom (her only mom, as she'd been reunified with biodad and had never even met biomom) for a week as a respite situation. So perhaps I am unduly cynical about infant foster-to-adopt at this moment. That child was placed at birth and spent nearly a year in the placement, with NO meaningful progress towards adoption DESPITE the successful TPR on biomom. She was then handed over to biodad, his new girlfriend, and a one-bedroom apartment housing biodad's four children by three different women. She has stopped vocalizing entirely and her motor skills have backslid. I don't think it's wrong to feel unable to face that kind of outcome when pregnant. It's damn near the killing the tough-as-nails fortysomething foster mom, and she apparently has a strong marriage and a strong faith community and several adoring biokids for support.

OP - despite my mini rant above, I really do think that domestic infant adoption is something that you should look into, even though you are not the stereotypical married rich lady who one sees adopting on TV shows. Your state may have a decent foster-to-adopt program, or you may find a private agency that is not as expensive as you are thinking it will be. And if you were working with an agency as opposed to fostering, there wouldn't be an actual child getting "returned" if you found yourself overwhelmed - you'd just be out some money and time.

[WifeMomChiro]

Have you ever considered embryo adoption? If you go through with IVF with an adopted embryo and it doesn't work, then you'll already be approved for adoption.

[KCMichigan]

Ditto, the embryo adoption.

International may take years, BUT most of the children are at least a year old...some older, many have special needs besides the standard new culture/languague/etc. Many countries have restrictions on age, married status, financial situation, etc. and a few allow single parents, but only for older or special needs adoptions. It varies VERY widely by county and region.


Domestic may take awhile , but infant adoption is available.

Foster to adopt has its own risks ( child/children not available for adoption), but financially it would be the least risk.


We have researched all the above, and when our situation improves (larger housing) we hope to do fost-to-adopt. We would like to do domestic or international...but we do not have the funds for either (or want to risk the time).


I would do some research and call some agencies, some have access to grants and/or resources that may be available as well. They will also be more familiar with your areas foster programs and/or the status of the domestic adoption situations.

[christophersmom]

We did IVF once, got pregnant with twins and then miscarried. We started the foster care process and the second IVF process around the same time. I know/knew I wanted 3-4 kids and we had decided if both work out great, we hoped at least one would work out. We did IVF and miscarried again and meanwhile got approved for foster care about nine months after my IVF cycle. We got our placement around 10 months after my miscarriage from my IVF cycle. I am so happy we pursued both at the same time. Meanwhile we have never prevented either. A pregnancy would NEVER have disrupted our adoption of DD though. And now I still want to adopt again.
If you think that you can handle both concurrently (I knew I could) I would pursue a domestic adoption and pregnancy at same time. I am so happy I didn't delay until I knew results of IVF before pursuing adoption.
BUT, like I said I could/waould want to handle both at same time. Once we had M in our house we never would have looked back and made a different decision.
I always had said I wanted to have bio and adopted kids though (2 of each, ha, if life was so perfect). DH was on board with bio and adopted, maybe just not the same quantity, he is happy with our current number of 2 kids.

[marsupial-mom]

Smithie, yes, seriously. One of the women outright told me, "we were going to adopt her but then I got pregnant."

The little girl was 3 months old when this foster mom got her and she is now nearly 2 and still in foster care with no adoption option yet.

[missme]

Smithie - I think I will look into domestic private adoption. I know I can't foster-to-adopt, because I'm pretty sure I couldn't handle the possibility of having to relinquish a child. I think domestic private adoption is comparable in cost to international adoption where I live, but from what I understand, there are very few infants available. Worth looking into, though.

WifeMOmChiro + KCMichigan - I don't think it will be necessary to do embryo adoption, as there's no indication that I won't be able to produce my own embryos. But I would def. consider it after doing research - I'm not sure it's available here.

christophersmom - thanks so much for your story. I think I could handle doing a homestudy at the same time as IVF, and I think it might help me to cope with the cycle(s) to know that if IVF desn't result in a baby for me, I have begun the next process to becoming a parent. And like you, I would be very willing to have children both by adoption and birth.

marsupial-mom - that's such a tragic story. It really breaks my heart as someone who has worked hard to have the means to be a mother but is struggling to make it happen.

[heatherdeg]

We've been where you are except we were about to engage in surrogacy vs. IVF for ME to carry a child (since my bioson's pg nearly killed both of us).

Originally Posted by missme

If I go with international adoption, it will because I wish to parent a very young child at some point in my life, and I am more likely to have a young child placed with me in an international adoption that in a local adoption.

This isn't true. And it's not true whether you go through the state/public system or the private system; although privately you have a MUCH better chance at parenting a young child.

Originally Posted by marsupial-mom

Smithie, yes, seriously. One of the women outright told me, "we were going to adopt her but then I got pregnant."

I don't doubt this story for a minute. This is very typical of people who don't really WANT to adopt--they're doing it and "settling". Given any other option, they wouldn't adopt. I wish there was a better way to weed those people out, but you see enough of them. And they often go through the foster care system because they don't have the money to go private. That's been a huge change as the real estate market has tanked and people don't have their home equity to tap for money to pay for private or int'l adoption.

Originally Posted by marsupial-mom

The little girl was 3 months old when this foster mom got her and she is now nearly 2 and still in foster care with no adoption option yet.

While I don't question the original story is true, I wonder how long it's been since the adoption was disrupted and they've looked for another family. Children under 2yo are the most sought-after for adoptions, so they're not usually available long. Her chances are better than most for being adopted--no matter what her race or issues--just because of her age. Especially if the adoption was disrupted due to pregnancy and nothing related to the child that the family couldn't handle.

Originally Posted by missme

I think I will look into domestic private adoption. I know I can't foster-to-adopt, because I'm pretty sure I couldn't handle the possibility of having to relinquish a child. I think domestic private adoption is comparable in cost to international adoption where I live, but from what I understand, there are very few infants available. Worth looking into, though.

When we looked, private domestic was pretty equal in cost to international and this was just within the last 2-3 years. We lived in NJ at the time. The wait was seriously not much different, either. And really, we heard fewer tales of developmental issues through domestic private adoptions than with the int'l adoptions. Not that it doesn't have it's risks: parents decide last minute to keep their child on occasion. I just had good friends go through that heartbreak. You don't hear about it often, but it happens.

Originally Posted by missme

thanks so much for your story. I think I could handle doing a homestudy at the same time as IVF

I think it's POSSIBLE, but I also know that IVF can be a heavily hormonal process and some people (maybe not you--definitely not me) have a hard time with the homestudy process and how much digging into your privacy they do. So just a head's up.

[missme]

"This isn't true. And it's not true whether you go through the state/public system or the private system; although privately you have a MUCH better chance at parenting a young child."

I think that if I do international adoption there's a good chance I can have a 1-2yr old placed with me, possibly younger in some countries. If I do local public adoption, there's little chance of an infant from what I understand. Local private is definitely the only way that I would have an infant placed with me, but I think the chances are so slim - so few babies are placed for adoption - and the wait time can be very, very long as adoptive parents have to be selected by the birth mother.

"I don't doubt this story for a minute. This is very typical of people who don't really WANT to adopt--they're doing it and "settling". Given any other option, they wouldn't adopt. I wish there was a better way to weed those people out, but you see enough of them. And they often go through the foster care system because they don't have the money to go private. That's been a huge change as the real estate market has tanked and people don't have their home equity to tap for money to pay for private or int'l adoption. "

That's so sad. I WANT to adopt. I also want to give birth. Either way, my heart doesn't care how my children come to me. It's one of the things that I'm sure of in a very hard and uncertain journey.

Thanks, Heatherdeg.







QUOTE]

[mamadebug]

Originally Posted by missme

[I]

I think that if I do international adoption there's a good chance I can have a 1-2yr old placed with me, possibly younger in some countries. If I do local public adoption, there's little chance of an infant from what I understand. Local private is definitely the only way that I would have an infant placed with me, but I think the chances are so slim - so few babies are placed for adoption - and the wait time can be very, very long as adoptive parents have to be selected by the birth mother.








QUOTE]

We really spent a lot of time researching different adoption options, and right now, there are very few options for adopting a child younger than 1 year internationally. There used to be some easier options - Guatemala (now closed) and Korea (still open, but a much different process now than it was even a couple of years ago) are the main ones that come to mind - for adopting a younger baby internationally. I haven't kept current on this as we decided to pursue domestic adoption, but unless you decide to work independently to do an adoption (I have heard of some African countries allowing this) I don't really think there are many options for doing an international adoption of a baby younger than 1 to 2 years.


If it is important to you to adopt an infant, domestic private adoption may be the way to go. More newborns are placed for adoption than you make think -maybe not locally to you, but you don't have to work with an agency that is local to you. There are agencies that work with people through out the country. We started our adoption process in the SF bay area, where I know there is at least one agency and at least one very reputable facilitator who work with single parents. I know of single parents who have successfully adopted through both and while their wait time was a little longer than that of two parent homes, it still worked for them in a reasonable time frame.

Keep researching and asking questions! It can be so hard to sort through all of this and figure out what will work for you!

[KCMichigan]

Originally Posted by mamadebug

We really spent a lot of time researching different adoption options, and right now, there are very few options for adopting a child younger than 1 year internationally. There used to be some easier options - Guatemala (now closed) and Korea (still open, but a much different process now than it was even a couple of years ago) are the main ones that come to mind - for adopting a younger baby internationally. I haven't kept current on this as we decided to pursue domestic adoption, but unless you decide to work independently to do an adoption (I have heard of some African countries allowing this) I don't really think there are many options for doing an international adoption of a baby younger than 1 to 2 years.


If it is important to you to adopt an infant, domestic private adoption may be the way to go. More newborns are placed for adoption than you make think -maybe not locally to you, but you don't have to work with an agency that is local to you. There are agencies that work with people through out the country. We started our adoption process in the SF bay area, where I know there is at least one agency and at least one very reputable facilitator who work with single parents. I know of single parents who have successfully adopted through both and while their wait time was a little longer than that of two parent homes, it still worked for them in a reasonable time frame.

Keep researching and asking questions! It can be so hard to sort through all of this and figure out what will work for you!

I agree with this. We have researched adoption extensively. There are very very few countries that do younger than a year, most children are 'at least' 18-20 months old- a large majority are at least 2. (think that they were placed for international adoption at a year then even if you get a referral quickly for that child the actual adoption process is 6-14+ months).

The only 'younger' adoptions I have seen recently have been from African countries and special needs and none were under 10 months. Many countries (think european countries) do not even put special needs children available until after they are a year old- very few non-special needs children are available that are under age 3 internationally-- unless you wait (China does adopt out infants, but the 'regular' program is over a 5 yr wait- Special Needs wait is less, but again- most are not infant/toddlers.)

You will also be limited if you area single parent to some countries.

If you are open to special needs, I suggest this site to explore.Reeses Rainbow. They have a lot of information for special needs children from many countries. They work with Canadian, American, and I know of at least a few European families. They also can help you search the countries that are open to Canada/ single moms/ older parents/large families/type of special need/age/childs home country. Soem children have financial grants as well.They have very young toddlers up to older children with varying special needs (some mild, some severe) that range from Downs Syndrome, dwarfism, FAS, cleft palate, club feet/ortho issues, and more.

Domestically, the wait can be long....but infants are placed. I would try to do private if you want to do adoption and heavily 'let people know' that you are looking to adopt. My SIL adopted her children through word of mouth---a friend knew someone who was considerinf placing the child after it was born and looking for a family...it was a private adoption once they meet with the birthmom and very fast. The longest part was 'finding' a birthmom, and they got lucky and found her within a few months of looking.

If you are looking to carry a child/ get pregnant, I would get more aggressive with your Drs and expand your options and/or consider more testing to find out the best options for you.


Good Luck!

[marsupial-mom]

Personally, all the research I've done suggests it's far easier to adopt an infant or young child domestically. There are a lot of myths about adoption. One seems to be an idealized version of international adoption.

All adoption routes involve some uncertainty and risk. Whatever route someone chooses, they need to be flexible.

We chose foster-to-adopt for many reasons and while the uncertainty can be a little unsettling it's really not a big deal. Life is full of gains and losses. If we don't get to adopt our foster baby, we will grieve that loss but we'll know we did a great thing for him by giving him so much love and support. It truly truly truly is better to have loved and lost than never to have loved at all.

[missme]

mamadebug - thanks for your response. I think Kazakhtan is my best international option, but they may be implementing the Hague convention, which will make it more difficult. Hard to find current information! As to local private adoption, I live in Ontario, Canada, and while I know that adoption is regulated by the province, I'm having trouble finding out if I can adopt from another province. Maybe not a big concern, though, as Ontario is the most populous province.

KCMichigan - ditto the above! And also: word of mouth is a good idea. And I am 2ww on my final IUI and moving on to IVF next, as it's still the most efficient route to parenthood at this time (until it doesn't work!). I've had a laparotomy, etc. Nothing is wrong, I just haven't gotten pregnant.

marsupial-mom -- it seems to be less expensive and less difficult to adopt domestically for sure. I really think, though, that are very few babies placed for apotion in Canada. Health care is free, social support services are adequate (as in one can survive on social assistance, if you consider that adequate), abortion is legal, free, and easily accessible, the social climate is liberal. There are few reasons for anyone to carry a child to term unless they want to, and few reasons to place a child for adoption. I may be wrong, though - there are no good statistics! Frustrating!

[queenjane]

What about an international adoption from the US? I'm not at all sure the finer details but i remember a few years ago it was very popular for Canadians to adopt African-American infants privately, the cost was the same (or likely cheaper) than an overseas international adoption and i believe at that time AA infant adoption wasnt as "popular" as it is now. I know that i often see situations posted by agencies and facilitators on email lists i'm on, for expectant moms of AA babies. Obviously there would be extra steps due to having two different countries but i'm sure its done. And if you'd be doing an international adoption anyway.....

[missme]

queenjane - The Hague convention was implemented in 2008, so now it's much more complex and difficult for canadians to adopt from the US. Still possible, but difficult.