Grocery Technicalities

[quantumleap]

We use a debit card for groceries, because we get points towards free groceries by using it at our local store (usually about 50$ twice a year). We DO have a set amount budgeted for groceries every month, and every month I go over! Bah! The enveloppe system doesn't really work for us with groceries (works quite well for personal allowances, gas, etc, etc though). I find myself using my Harper bribe and child tax allowance to supplement groceries every month, and that's money that is *supposed* to be going towards debt repayment!
I'm clearly missing something here. Is it just a matter of being more conscious of things? Any easy systems? I like easy. A lot.

[Teenytoona]

How do you grocery shop? Do you make a list - checking local flyers? Or just go in and buy what seems nice to you? With that information, it will be easier to help with how the money gets spent and how to fix that.

[AZgirl2207]

We use a CC for all our purchases for 'rewards'--(this works for us because we pay it off every month!) I write my monthly grocery spending on a white board in the kitchen, right next to grocery list and ad pages. Then I make my list according to how much is left. This system works for us because we aren't on such a tight budget that going over by $25 means not paying the phone bill.

[texmati]

why doesn't the envelope thing work? Is it just the free points?

[quantumleap]

I make loose meal plans for about 4-5 days at a time. I say we'll have a,b,c and d, but don't dictate on what night we'll have each. I typically look in the fridge and see what needs to be used up, and then see if we already have other necessary ingredients in the pantry. Anything we still need goes on the grocery list. Other things go on there as we run out - cheese, eggs, milk, butter, etc. I do try to buy multiples of certain staples when they go on sale, but sometimes that means that I spend 15$ on tomato sauce. That will last us a good while, but it's about 12$ more than I would normally spend in a month on tomato sauce, so where do I pull that 12$ from?! See, I'm in need of tutoring!
The list will also be a bit flexible - like, "fruit for dd" means I get whatever is the cheapest when I get there! We don't get flyers (no idea why!), but I suppose I *could* look them up online.
The enveloppe system just doesn't seem to work. I don't know exactly why. I would forget to bring the enveloppe. I would be so overwhelmed by the little amount left in it that I would decide to forgo certain ingredients, only to find that I really can't manage to cobble together chili without beans. I would feel loaded at the beginning of the month and not space out the bigger purchases and then we'd be in the middle of the month with full bottles of olive oil and laundry soap and 2$ to get through the rest of the month. Or, I'd be in line and realize that I was short 5$ in my enveloppe, so I'd just use the debit card... It's a litany of excuses! In any case, the debit card really *is* easier for us, so I'd like to find a way to make it work.

The white board idea is a good one. I might be able to incorporate that a bit better into my current system.

Thanks for any help!

[Siennaflower]

It helps to send in the debt payments as soon as the money is in your hand, then you don't have it to draw from for spending extra on groceries. You just use what is in the grocery envelope.

ETA it sounds like a price book might help you figure out exactly how much you need per pay period for groceries. That way you could figure in your meal plan and how much extra you have for stockpiling that trip.

[quantumleap]

Originally Posted by AZgirl2207

We use a CC for all our purchases for 'rewards'--(this works for us because we pay it off every month!) I write my monthly grocery spending on a white board in the kitchen, right next to grocery list and ad pages. Then I make my list according to how much is left. This system works for us because we aren't on such a tight budget that going over by $25 means not paying the phone bill.

We're sort of in the same situation. It's not that we don't have 25$ to go over with, it's just that going over by 25$ means 25$ less going towards paying off our debt! It's a little too easy, in the short term, to relax about the 25$, because the debt is such a vague thing in my mind as I wrangle kid, belly, cart and groceries through the store!

[yeahwhat]

If you're over budget every month, maybe the grocery budget you've set for yourself isn't realistic. Think about what you're buying--are you splurging on things you shouldn't? If you are, then you know how to cut back and get back on budget. If you're not, then revisit the amount of money you've allotted.

[its_betty]

We do use an envelope for grocery money, but sometimes we spend on a credit card or debit card instead. So when we get home, we take that much cash out of the grocery envelope and move it to a "put this in the bank" envelope.

We do our grocery money by week, not month, so it's easier to see how much money could be spent for stocking up vs eating that week.

[zebra15]

Originally Posted by selkat

I make loose meal plans for about 4-5 days at a time. I say we'll have a,b,c and d, but don't dictate on what night we'll have each. I typically look in the fridge and see what needs to be used up, and then see if we already have other necessary ingredients in the pantry. Anything we still need goes on the grocery list. Other things go on there as we run out - cheese, eggs, milk, butter, etc. I do try to buy multiples of certain staples when they go on sale, but sometimes that means that I spend 15$ on tomato sauce. That will last us a good while, but it's about 12$ more than I would normally spend in a month on tomato sauce, so where do I pull that 12$ from?! See, I'm in need of tutoring!
The list will also be a bit flexible - like, "fruit for dd" means I get whatever is the cheapest when I get there! We don't get flyers (no idea why!), but I suppose I *could* look them up online.The enveloppe system just doesn't seem to work. I don't know exactly why. I would forget to bring the enveloppe. I would be so overwhelmed by the little amount left in it that I would decide to forgo certain ingredients, only to find that I really can't manage to cobble together chili without beans. I would feel loaded at the beginning of the month and not space out the bigger purchases and then we'd be in the middle of the month with full bottles of olive oil and laundry soap and 2$ to get through the rest of the month. Or, I'd be in line and realize that I was short 5$ in my enveloppe, so I'd just use the debit card... It's a litany of excuses! In any case, the debit card really *is* easier for us, so I'd like to find a way to make it work.
The white board idea is a good one. I might be able to incorporate that a bit better into my current system.

Thanks for any help!

I highlighted a couple things that stand out. Easier isn't always financially sound. It takes 5 minutes to look at the grocery ads online and make a list - about the same time as looking at the paper ads you dont get. This prepares you for shopping, you know whats on sale, what you need and how to adjust your cooking for the week.

You forget to bring the envelope? Do you forget your wallet, your credit card, your drivers license? I guess IMO if I want to buy something I remember the money...

You are inline and realize youare $5 short in your envelope system, what happens when your debit card account is $5 short or you don't have available credit and your entire transaction gets declined? Your 'excuse' doesn't hold water.

You need a budget, you need to look at the sales, you need to meal plan and yes stockpiling does cost a bit and that effects the budget.

If you are serious about making a plan and staying with it you will find a way to make it happen.

[smallmama]

One thing I've found useful is that my grocery store started having those little handheld scanner things available, so I scan things as they go in my basket and keep track of exactly how much I'm spending. Once I'm at my limit, I just stop. If there's something high priority that I still need to get, something else has to go back on the shelf.

[GuildJenn]

I think you can attack this a few ways.

One is to really examine your meal planning.

It may be that you're planning meals that are out of your budget. This is where flyers really, really help, because you can plan your meals around whatever big items are on sale/loss leaders that week.

For example, if you eat pork and pork is on sale, you eat a couple of meals that are pork-based that week. The next week it will be something else. Or if you're vegetarian and there's an eggplant sale, that's ratatouille week. It's totally worth finding the flyers online.

Also make sure you have a certain ratio of 'cheap' meals each week (check out this forum for some great recipes and sites). One way we stretch our budget is that we usually have a hearty soup (leftovers, bits of this and that) at least once a week.

The second is to do a pantry challenge at the end of the month anytime you're almost out of budget.

So if you've gone over budget, you're stuck with what's in the house + milk (and bread if you don't make it yourself) for a week. This involves a certain amount of creativity if you don't have a full pantry.

The third is to examine the ingredients you're using and see where you can reduce.

If you're using canned beans, generally dried are cheaper (soak overnight, cook in slow cooker if you have one). If you're having a lot of pasta-based dishes, sometimes switching to rice is cheaper. Going meatless a few meals a week helps. Eating seasonally helps. Frozen veggies are cheaper and generally just as wholesome as fresh conventional, since they are usually frozen close to when they are picked.

And finally what I do for sales is I have a 'sale allowance' of about $10-15 each week. This is separate from the budget we need to eat (you may not be able to do this until you address the core budget) and is for stockpiling. What has happened with us is that after a few months of doing that I suddenly was going under budget (because of my stockpile) so then I could reduce the overall budget.

GL!

[PoetryLover]

Originally Posted by GuildJenn

And finally what I do for sales is I have a 'sale allowance' of about $10-15 each week. This is separate from the budget we need to eat (you may not be able to do this until you address the core budget) and is for stockpiling. What has happened with us is that after a few months of doing that I suddenly was going under budget (because of my stockpile) so then I could reduce the overall budget.

GL!

Thanks! I have been wondering how to develop a stockpile when I never seem to have any budgeted money left over! Very helpful!

[BetsyS]

I went to cash, because it was just too easy to go over with the debit card.

Think about it. If you get $100 back in rewards per year, but you're going over $25-$50/month, that doesn't make much sense, does it? Those rewards are fun, but not if they don't help you get to your financial goals.

I also stop spending when I get to the end of the cash. I budget on an every 2 week system, so worst case scenario, I spend it all, then have to wait 13 days. It's high motivation to leave enough money for milk so that I'm not raiding my spare change. LOL. (and I totally could put it on the debit card, and sometimes I do, but I really, really like the satisfaction of staying on budget and knowing that my money gets to go to what we've deemed our priorities)

I have a pretty well stocked pantry, though, so if I can't buy something, I can substitute something lse from our pantry. For instance, if I spend all my money the first week, and I can't buy produce the second week, we can eat frozen veggies and canned fruits, you know? If I forget the beans for chili, then I can make Spanish rice with meat with the other ingredients, cause I have rice in the pantry. Stuff like that.

I'll tell you. After several months of staying on budget, it's very, very satisfying, and it makes me proud of myself in a geeky way.

[Callimom]

Can you set up a separate account just for groceries which is attached to your debit card and just move whatever your budgetted amount is over every week or every other week.

You can sign up to have fliers emailed to you if that is easier.

I agree with the PP about setting up an amount for stockpiling. I do the same and I set aside an increased amount in the summer for canning/freezing. I don't keep a price book but I do have a general sense about when I will be spending larger amounts on stocking up as things go on sale (extra turkeys at thanksgiving, extra baking supplies at Christmas, - that sort of thing) and we eat from the pantry/freezer more during those weeks to make a bit more room in the budget for stocking up.

good luck
Karen

[Teenytoona]

These mommas have great tips, GuildJenn's list is great. Definitely look for flyers online. I do alot of that myself, sometimes we don't get certain ones, other times we do. I know I can find them online, so I rely on that if I need to. I like the price book idea. We've got several stores I go to, one of them is a local health food store that has no flyers and a reputation for being pricey. But when I compare that to other local stores, I find that in many cases, it's cheaper there than at local chain stores. It does take a little investment, and knowing what your usual buys are, but it's worth the effort, as you could save a bit.

I don't always have available funds to buy something when there's a really good sale. Sometimes you just have to miss out, the sale will come around again one day.

[sunnysandiegan]

Lots of great ideas here!

I don't handle the cash envelope system well, either, so I can relate to what you are saying.

I play a game with myself to make it more fun and more satisfying to stay on budget. I calculate our entire budget (all categories) based on real figures from the previous year and average them out over 12 months. Some things don't work that way, like insurance and HOA fees and other such things, so those items get the known figure and past averages are a moot point. It can be eye-opening to see what one actually spends on certain categories. For us, food and household were really crazy categories. We separated out dining to see the differences between food we buy and cook versus food we buy in an experience setting and we separated out household items because that was really the key. Anyway, with those real life numbers in front of us, we consciously chose to lower the monthly average each year. We've had to get creative because along the way, we've discovered healthier eating and some of that is much higher priced. We've offset it by not eating out nearly as much, so the combined food budget has remained on track. It is actually fun, in a geeky way, to compare our spending plan numbers to our actual numbers each month. It is also motivating to keep it up. Some months are higher than the set amount due to birthdays or parties or holidays, so we make sure to go "creative" (aka lower) during the other months in order to keep the average on track.

I spend 15-60 minutes every week on finances, so I know what we have already spent in all categories in any given month up through the last Tuesday. Seeing the numbers in black and white is a visual reminder of our financial goals and motivates me to stay on track.

There is one local discount store where I tend to stock up. I found I was going to that store too often for our goals. Sure, things are cheaper, but buying 10 of something at a really good price is still spending more than what we actually need (2-3 would suffice). I still love this store and the thrill of the treasure hunt (organics are like treasures in this place; they exist, but you have to hunt for them amidst the usual low quality items). So, I set a reminder in my calendar to check their website the last week of each month and then I check our food and household totals up to that point in the month and decide if I am going there the following day. I add in my head as I add things to the cart to keep it under budget. If my DD is with me, I engage her in the math. If she isn't in a cooperative mood, I use my phone calculator to keep track. I literally put the food items and household items in separate areas of the basket and keep track of each total separately. It takes practice, but it works and can be a mental thrill sometimes.

Be kind to yourself and think positively. You can do this!

[luv-my-boys]

have you thought about taking a calculator with you and tally your groceries as you go? sometimes it helps to actually know how much your spending as you go.

[Lucy Alden]

While going over is not ideal, if you do you can always pay part cash and part debit (IE $100 in cash, $15 on debit). I've done that before when I've gone over a few buck. The cashiers never care. Plus, it might give you an idea of how much you tend to go over each week.

I think having a few cheap go to meals also helps the budget. Our main one is brown rice and pinto beans topped with whatever is in the frig (cheese, salsa, sour cream, chopped tomatoes, etc.).

I shop mainly at Costco because it's closest and cheapest. Most things cost around $10 (eggs, milk and veggies are a bit less, coffee, juice, canned items and bulk rice/beans are a bit more). I do a quick grocery cart head count and it's usually pretty close (10 items x $10 = $100).

[quantumleap]

Wow. Thanks for all the replies! I guess I just need to sort myself out and commit to figuring this out. I like the idea of seperate $$ for household and groceries, and then again for sale/stockpiling items.
I know my excuses are flimsy - that's why I said they were poor excuses!

We are vegetarians, eat very little soy, I make a lot from scratch, only buy bread products from the 50% off bin, make all our beans from dried, etc, etc. I feel like I do a decent job of keeping costs down in many areas, but then I do buy most of the dirty dozen organics. I also get one "treat" (organic grapes, or yummy cheese, etc) every time we go to the store, which I could cut out, or at least cut *down*. We eat out about once a month. I'm trying to find a balance between being super frugal and not feeling "deprived".
Mostly, I just need to get the debit card thing under control. A seperate chequing account would likely solve my issue, actually. I don't (can't!) overdraw the debit account, I just find myself using up the other money that is in there, like what is set aside for the chiropractor, or whatever. Thanks to the pp who suggested the second account. I'll look in to if that's possible!