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My husband kinda doesn't share financial info. Any others out there? - Page 3

post #41 of 65
10/8/10 at 12:13pm
It is very concerning that you feel your marriage would descend into chaos merely from expecting to be treated like an equal financial partner. A man who respected you as an equal would not be so threatened by that.

It seems that you have to tiptoe to keep him happy, and that's disturbing too.

Let's just say that the law DOES assume that you are entitled to half of his assets; it assumes (upon divorce, for example) that you are each entitled to half. So why doesn't he? More importantly: Why don't you think you're worth being treated equally? He is being very controlling. And you are putting up with it, out of fear that somehow not doing so will create "chaos". Those are issues much bigger than the financial issue.

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post #42 of 65
10/8/10 at 12:30pm
Oh - and I meant to say that I have a recently divorced friend whose husband was very financially controlling (which was symptomatic of how he was about everything, really), and somehow when they bought their house, she didn't make sure her name was on the title. BAD IDEA.

Because yes, when it was sold during the divorce, she was entitled to half of the proceeds - but since his name was on the title, he made the decision whom to sell it to - who turned out to be the first bidder. He purposely sold it low so that there wouldn't be much profit from it - yes, he was willing to sell himself short as well simply to be that controlling with her, because he knew how she depended on that money. Controlling men like this get very angry when the women get sick of the control, and even if they view themselves as doting dads, they'll sell their kids short too. This particular man is a soccer coach and spends time with his kids, but because of his spite, his ex and all 3 kids are crammed into a tiny apartment. He really showed her, didn't he. And while they were going through divorce proceedings but still living under the same roof, he withheld grocery money (to "punish" her for filing for divorce). He didn't care how that affected the kids. She had to get an emergency hearing with court to force him to give grocery money to her before the divorce was finalized.

And here's the moral of the story: This type of behavior is very common, even with "great" dads. Don't think it can't happen to you. Demand equality within your relationship or be prepared to tiptoe forever. And just because he grew up seeing that dynamic, do you want YOUR kids to grow up seeing that dynamic?
post #43 of 65
10/8/10 at 1:15pm
Frankly, the combination of the inequity of power that's just an intrinsic part of this arrangement, AND that you say your husband is touchy about it and you fear "chaos" if you put your foot down, is a big red flag for me. The "peace" you keep by buckling under may be a false one. If it's not this, inevitably it will be something else.
post #44 of 65
10/9/10 at 5:23am
Thread Starter 

Update

Dear Mamas,

Thank you all for your candid advice and strong concern. You have all inspired me to take a more proactive approach about my role in my marriage and my finances. I am so glad I posted here -- I thought it was a finance problem but I really think it is a way we conduct our marriage problem. You've inspired me to improve the way things are done around my neck of the woods.

I decided to approach my husband in a logical, measured way about all of this. I actually just now wrote him an e-mail about how concerned I am that we are not more transparent with finances. I included lots of kind remarks in that e-mail, because there are many aspects of our life where my husband is very egalitarian. I told him that I want to be an equal partner in our relationship and especially in our finances, and that I think it could be fun/unifying for us to watch the balance in our savings account together etc. I also told him how essential it is for us to make sure both names are on all accounts and listed as next of kin, and login info is shared, in emergency situations. In fact, I listed some other unrelated issues in this e-mail too. So we will see how he responds.

The good news is, I also mentioned the topic to him on the phone last week, and I now have login info for our accounts and my husband talked to me about the balance of our savings account. My name is not added to that account YET, but we talked about our finance goals together and decided it would be a good idea to add each others names to credit cards
to both get the benefits of each other's good credit (we carry no debt and pay on time).

My husband also expressed his surprise that he didn't know I felt this way, and insisted that he was never trying to hoard money and that he views all money as our money.

So. There is still progress to be made. But I feel like things are moving into a better direction.

To clarify to you all, we have only been married for a couple years and we got married VERY YOUNG while still in college. We got pregnant shortly after getting married, while still in school, and basically were broke because neither of us had careers (we had part time on campus jobs). DH is just now starting his second year of his real job, and I never worked because I went straight from college to DS. DH paid off all of my $15,000+ in student loans after he started getting a paycheck.
post #45 of 65
10/9/10 at 6:37am
I just saw this update and did a little "yay" in my head. Change in a better direction is always a good thing. And yes, watching your finances turn around before your eyes when it's a mutual goal is really awesome. Hubby and I loved watching our accounts go up and up and up - part of why he was able to up and quit his job (long story), and us being a family of 6, aren't freaking out much. It's a nice feeling.


(And I hope my story or stories didn't scare you to much, just don't want anybody else ending up in similar situations - it isn't fun.)
post #46 of 65
10/9/10 at 7:11am
Quote:
Originally Posted by youngspiritmom View Post
Dear Mamas,

Thank you all for your candid advice and strong concern. You have all inspired me to take a more proactive approach about my role in my marriage and my finances. I am so glad I posted here -- I thought it was a finance problem but I really think it is a way we conduct our marriage problem. You've inspired me to improve the way things are done around my neck of the woods.

I decided to approach my husband in a logical, measured way about all of this. I actually just now wrote him an e-mail about how concerned I am that we are not more transparent with finances. I included lots of kind remarks in that e-mail, because there are many aspects of our life where my husband is very egalitarian. I told him that I want to be an equal partner in our relationship and especially in our finances, and that I think it could be fun/unifying for us to watch the balance in our savings account together etc. I also told him how essential it is for us to make sure both names are on all accounts and listed as next of kin, and login info is shared, in emergency situations. In fact, I listed some other unrelated issues in this e-mail too. So we will see how he responds.

The good news is, I also mentioned the topic to him on the phone last week, and I now have login info for our accounts and my husband talked to me about the balance of our savings account. My name is not added to that account YET, but we talked about our finance goals together and decided it would be a good idea to add each others names to credit cards
to both get the benefits of each other's good credit (we carry no debt and pay on time).

My husband also expressed his surprise that he didn't know I felt this way, and insisted that he was never trying to hoard money and that he views all money as our money.

So. There is still progress to be made. But I feel like things are moving into a better direction.

To clarify to you all, we have only been married for a couple years and we got married VERY YOUNG while still in college. We got pregnant shortly after getting married, while still in school, and basically were broke because neither of us had careers (we had part time on campus jobs). DH is just now starting his second year of his real job, and I never worked because I went straight from college to DS. DH paid off all of my $15,000+ in student loans after he started getting a paycheck.
that is a great update... keep talking with him and getting it all settled, you will sleep better at night
post #47 of 65
10/9/10 at 7:27am
Nice!!
post #48 of 65
10/9/10 at 8:48am
That's a great update and I think it will be good for both of you - and in case of a tragedy, which hopefully will never, ever occur. Go you and him!
post #49 of 65
10/9/10 at 10:22am
Great update!

I would love to hear how this keeps evolving for you. I hope that you do find empowerment and equality in this area. This is so important, and I'm so glad you're addressing it proactively.

Yay for you!
post #50 of 65
10/9/10 at 11:38am
Very nice! Very smart to set up things equally before bad habits set in for the long term. It's fine to have separate accounts for some things, just not for one person to control all the money. It looks like you're on the right road!
post #51 of 65
10/9/10 at 12:43pm
Oh, I'm so glad to hear that you were able to communicate with him and that he seems to be receptive. I'm proud of you for taking action!
post #52 of 65
10/10/10 at 1:30pm
Great news.
post #53 of 65
10/10/10 at 2:05pm
post #54 of 65
10/10/10 at 2:52pm
what a great update! I just wanted to commend you-- DH and I have been married for almost four years, and we are still trying to figure stuff like this out (housework, finances etc!)
post #55 of 65
10/10/10 at 9:31pm
Quote:
Originally Posted by youngspiritmom View Post
Dear Mamas,

Thank you all for your candid advice and strong concern. You have all inspired me to take a more proactive approach about my role in my marriage and my finances. I am so glad I posted here -- I thought it was a finance problem but I really think it is a way we conduct our marriage problem. You've inspired me to improve the way things are done around my neck of the woods.

I decided to approach my husband in a logical, measured way about all of this. I actually just now wrote him an e-mail about how concerned I am that we are not more transparent with finances. I included lots of kind remarks in that e-mail, because there are many aspects of our life where my husband is very egalitarian. I told him that I want to be an equal partner in our relationship and especially in our finances, and that I think it could be fun/unifying for us to watch the balance in our savings account together etc. I also told him how essential it is for us to make sure both names are on all accounts and listed as next of kin, and login info is shared, in emergency situations. In fact, I listed some other unrelated issues in this e-mail too. So we will see how he responds.

The good news is, I also mentioned the topic to him on the phone last week, and I now have login info for our accounts and my husband talked to me about the balance of our savings account. My name is not added to that account YET, but we talked about our finance goals together and decided it would be a good idea to add each others names to credit cards
to both get the benefits of each other's good credit (we carry no debt and pay on time).

My husband also expressed his surprise that he didn't know I felt this way, and insisted that he was never trying to hoard money and that he views all money as our money.

So. There is still progress to be made. But I feel like things are moving into a better direction.

To clarify to you all, we have only been married for a couple years and we got married VERY YOUNG while still in college. We got pregnant shortly after getting married, while still in school, and basically were broke because neither of us had careers (we had part time on campus jobs). DH is just now starting his second year of his real job, and I never worked because I went straight from college to DS. DH paid off all of my $15,000+ in student loans after he started getting a paycheck.
I'm so glad to hear this! When I read your original post, I was struck by the way you said that you trust him 100% because what that told me is that the other aspects of you marriage are GOOD! And in this update you mentioned that he was surprised to know how you felt. I think sometimes we make issues that are actually smaller into bigger issues because we forget that our spouse can't read our minds. (I forget that ALL the time!!) And I am SO glad that you guys are beginning to work this out.

I did want to share a little about my financial situation because it is very similar to yours. My husband is a much better saver than I am and runs our financial life. (It's the reason our lights haven't been turned off!) On top of that, when we have a difference of opinion in how money should be spent, I generally defer to him, because he has more experience than me. (if it was something I felt strongly about I suppose I would argue harder, but well, I also trust my hubby 100% and he hasn't steered me wrong yet, and that had earned him some cred.) The big difference is that *I* make all the money in my household. I just feel no need to manage it. I could. I could easily hold it over his head and act like his boss instead of his wife and partner. But that's not how we work. However, my hubby knows that I ask now and again how much money we have, and he will give me a run-down of the account totals. That's all I ask--that's all I even feel inclined to ask.

I don't think it's necessary to know all the ins and outs of the finances *if you don't want to.* However, I am a joint account holder and if I thought hard enough I could probably remember the log-in info for our bank website. It's not my role, it's his, and I let him fill it. But when I do ask (and I ask maybe every couple of months) he will sit down right away and tell me. That's all I need. And maybe that's all you need. And If he's already generous with your *you* money (and it sounds like he is) then it probably really is just a matter of letting him know what you want and assuring him that you don't want to "take over." My husband gets a lot of confidence out of managing our money well and I am more than happy to let him take that burden. I don't want it!

Good luck, but it sounds like you are on the right path!
post #56 of 65
10/10/10 at 9:47pm
Glad to read you are being proactive about this! I have to admit up until 5 or 6 years ago this would've been my dream scenario... I dread having to deal with finances, ugh! But since my dh was in major debt and I had a savings account when we got married and he had more than once overdrawn on his bank account the financial responsibility for our family naturally fell into my lap. However, in the past few years or so I have heard so many marriages dissolving due to just this exact situation and the really sad part is that I honestly feel many of those separations could've been avoided if there had been transparency to begin with. It sounds to me like this is the sort of situation you might've been headed for... it really is heartbreaking because these men just want to take care of their families and feel it is their duty to provide and for their wives to have no worries and feel they have everything taken care of for them. The trouble is, that while it certainly is easier just to be able to make all the financial decisions without having to consult anyone else, avoiding all those tiny little disagreements along the way, once you get too far apart there is just no ever coming back together.
post #57 of 65
10/11/10 at 1:57pm
Thread Starter 

Another update

Thank you all for your support and concern! Honestly! Once again mdc community has really made me feel like I have a community of women who are rooting for me.

So, after I sent DH the e-mail, on Sunday morning I made our family pancakes, eggs, etc. and we had a nice time eating at the table together. My DS went off to play when he was done and I asked my husband, "So, did you get my e-mail?"

(A tangent here - When I first wrote the e-mail it was really kind of demanding and angry, I think I needed to get some feelings out, almost like journaling but then I edited it to sound very positive, and supporting and not too long, just focusing on the biggest issues. I think it turned out nicely)

He said yes and told me that it is never his intention to do something deceitful or unequal with finances. I told him it upset me that my name was not on the title of the car, and he told me he didn't even realize he was supposed to add my name too. He said we can add it right away. I also told him that if we ever purchase a condo/home (we want to do that but are renters right now) that my name needs to be on that too. He agreed to that and told me that if I really want us to be partners then he has some things that he thinks I could do more equally also. It was such a great convo and we both were able to talk about issues that we hadn't been bringing up.

He confirmed that I am listed as next of kin on all accounts, and him on mine, and has all login info listed somewhere and will put it somewhere where I can access it in case of an emergency.

Now.....the savings account.

So. My husband is uncomfortable with adding my name to the savings account (I am listed as a beneficiary) and giving me authority to make transactions. Apparently this is because when we first got married, he owed me $1,000 for something and when we were fighting , in anger I took it out of our joint savings account without telling him first. He felt that this was not a joint decision, and it affected his ability to trust me. I didn't realize that that instance years ago was still in his mind now.

What he DID say is that since we use Quicken (an online program) to do our budget, he will give me the Quicken info so that I can be more active in helping with the budget. The Savings account is linked to Quicken (Quicken draws info from the account online), so I will be able to see the balance and all transactions in and out of the account anytime I want. So I can see everything but not do anything without consulting him. He can make transactions from the account (he pays all bills and expenses) before asking me, but I will see all of them on Quicken. He also said I can ask him anytime what the balance is and he will tell me.

So. It's not perfect but things are definitely improving, and I hope that with time my husband will be able to trust me to the extent that he will add me to the savings account too. Maybe when I start working and have an income he can add me to it and then we can both make deposits to it.

And yes, he liked the idea that watching our finances grow together can be a great unifying factor in our marriage.

Thanks for keeping up with this thread, for your advice, for reading my long posts, and for helping me to be more assertive in my marriage. Forever grateful.
post #58 of 65
10/11/10 at 3:04pm
I'm glad that things are working out. Our personal finances are set up as such that we both have to work together to keep them budgeted. I keep the checkbook balanced and make sure the bills are paid, we have a weekly "budget" meeting where we reconcile what we spent with what was projected and discuss any upcoming expenditures.
post #59 of 65
10/11/10 at 3:08pm
Now thats a sticky situation as transparency is needed when it comes to finances in a relationship. Especially if a couple shares the same account. If both couples have a seperate account then they are obligated to their privacy. However if both couples share the same account then by all means much openess is needed.
post #60 of 65
10/12/10 at 12:47pm
Quote:
Originally Posted by youngspiritmom View Post

Now.....the savings account.

So. My husband is uncomfortable with adding my name to the savings account (I am listed as a beneficiary) and giving me authority to make transactions. Apparently this is because when we first got married, he owed me $1,000 for something and when we were fighting , in anger I took it out of our joint savings account without telling him first. He felt that this was not a joint decision, and it affected his ability to trust me. I didn't realize that that instance years ago was still in his mind now.

What he DID say is that since we use Quicken (an online program) to do our budget, he will give me the Quicken info so that I can be more active in helping with the budget. The Savings account is linked to Quicken (Quicken draws info from the account online), so I will be able to see the balance and all transactions in and out of the account anytime I want. So I can see everything but not do anything without consulting him. He can make transactions from the account (he pays all bills and expenses) before asking me, but I will see all of them on Quicken. He also said I can ask him anytime what the balance is and he will tell me.

So. It's not perfect but things are definitely improving, and I hope that with time my husband will be able to trust me to the extent that he will add me to the savings account too. Maybe when I start working and have an income he can add me to it and then we can both make deposits to it.
I understand where your husband is coming from. My husband did this to our savings account. With my 35th birthday party money five years ago. (that may seem like something small to many, but, I really wanted a celebration. And since my husband doesn't work and isn't big on celebrations, the only way to get it was to throw it myself. Yes, we'd discussed it and he was in agreement. Something came up, he didn't discuss it with me and wiped out the savings.) I just stopped contributing to the account as a result. Problem is, I make all the money. Reading your post and the responses to it, coupled with the counseling we've been going through for the past 3 months or so, has really helped me to see how my actions are a barrier to our growth as a couple. This is something that your husband is just going to have to decide to move past. He might not get over it, but, the reality is that your children will deprived of that money for a period of time should something happen to him (and my kids deprived similarly of the money I have in accounts on which my husband is not a joint holder) should something happen to me. This is not the move or choice of someone who is truly trying to move towards oneness. And yes, you (or, in my case, my husband) may do it again and your husband (and I) would be very hurt. We can earn more money. We can't replace the sense of oneness, encouragement, love and trust our partners will feel if we choose to do the right thing with these accounts. The benefits far outweigh the costs, as I am now beginning to see it. I can't otherwise earn those benefits without deciding to be financially vulnerable again.
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