WWYD if this were your child? Is further evaluation necessary?

[gbailey]

I'll try and make this short. I wouldn't call us friends but strong acquaintances who are on the friendship route. Her near three year old has hydrocephalus and had successful surgery before she turned 1. Docs were able to drain the fluid from her brain and she didn't need a shunt. Her DD has had about 10-12 ear infections between the ages of 1 and 2, sticks her fingers in her ears or covers her ears and screams when she is over stimulated or hears loud noises, is "severly" speech delayed and been in speech therapy for over a year. She isn't making eye contact with anyone, and isn't able to follow directions. The daycare provider insisted the mom take her to ENT doc because the screaming and covering the ears was becoming "disruptive" to the other children. The mom waits nearly a month to make the appointment because she thinks the screaming and crying is just a bad habit. The speech therapist told her she doesn't believe the child is autistic but at a recent doctor visit (she goes to a place where the doctors rotate) the doc who saw her child asked how come the autism diagnosis wasn't in the chart. She was offended but didn't ask him why he assumed her child was on the spectrum. Anyway, the ENT doctor told her the daughter has wax build up and gave her an RX. She doesn't mention the fingers in the ear but says she wants to know if her daughter is sensitive to sounds. The state is providing her with the speech therapy for free.They've told her they want her daughter to start special education classes but have not given her a diagnosis. She doesn't think anything is wrong with her child except she's "stubborn" and "lazy". She's more upset about not being able to potty train because her DD isn't able to verbalize that she needs to go and concerned about her not "embarassing" the parents at Sesame Street Live.

Is there anyway to gently suggest the mother get an opinion apart from the State? My DH says this is a clear cut case of me needing to mind my own business. From my experience with the child and what the mom says, her DD could use some further interventions.

[Learning_Mum]

It sounds to me that something is going on with this little girl, and if it were my child I would be doing something to find out what.

However, from your post, it sounds like the Mother has her head firmly in the sand and I don't think you saying anything is going to help. It's more likely going to upset the Mother. I think, esp. considering you are only acquaintances I would leave it be. If it were a good friend I might suggest gently saying something.

Hopefully the Mother will start the Sp Ed classes, and that will be the beginning of the journey into getting help for her daughter.

[Linda on the move]

Originally Posted by gbailey

Is there anyway to gently suggest the mother get an opinion apart from the State? My DH says this is a clear cut case of me needing to mind my own business. From my experience with the child and what the mom says, her DD could use some further interventions.

Both you and your DH are right. Her DD has red flags waving wildly, but you really should mind your own business unless asked.

"WWYD if this were YOUR child?" and "WWYD if this were your FRIEND'S child?" are very different questions.

You aren't the mom, and the mom is hearing this from another other places as is. Be a friend. Listen.

The child is getting speech therapy and it sounds like will start sp. ed. soon. It's actually very hard to give solid dx's at such a young age, so unless it is needed for intervention, I'm not sure what good it would do anyway. She's getting help and she's on the path to more help.

She'll eventually have a full eval (Kindergarten age if not sooner). Oddly, the older she is when it happens, the more accurate it will be. Trust the process.

It's VERY hard to be the parent of a sn kid. Living in denial is understandable to me.

[pauletoy]

I agree with your dh.

[Adaline'sMama]

I agree with your DH, only because you yourself cant even call this person a friend. If this was a close friend, it would be different. However, it sounds to me like your "road to friendship" maybe long and hard since she already has some opinions you disagree with ( I assume you disagree with someone calling a child under the age of three "lazy")

[ErinYay]

Sadly, I agree with PPs that your husband is right.

At V's 9-month-WBV, I brought up autism, as there's a family history, and I just wanted it on the radar.

Our ped was pleasantly surprised, and told me that it's very, very hard for them. They notice things at 1 and 2 years, but really can't say outright "We need an eval for this kid," as parents lose their minds and get so offended. They end up often waiting until the child is 3 or 4, when the parents say, "You know, I noticed something going on..." and they can jump in and say, "Now that you mention it, I've also noticed some things..." It's such a hard line to walk: get the kid help early vs alienating parents and have them just stop bringing their kid in.

With ASD early intervention (action, not necessarily the program Early Intervention) is SO important, and it is really very sad that so many parents seem to take any developmental not-average-ness so personally, or as a reflection of their parenting/genes.

[Linda on the move]

Originally Posted by Adaline'sMama

I agree with your DH, only because you yourself cant even call this person a friend. If this was a close friend, it would be different.

I disagree. There's really no body that you are so close to that you should look in the eye and say, "I know your child is in speech therapy and getting ready to start special education preschool, but frankly, I don't think it's enough. I think your kid has autism and needs to be labeled as such."

It really doesn't matter how pretty you dress it, that's what you would be saying.

I have a daughter on the spectrum, and you need to tread VERY lightly with other parents and their children's developmental issues. If you cannot relate to the heartbreak of having a child who needs a label, then just count yourself blessed and remember to be kind.

Being kind is really a lot more important than being right.

[EviesMom]

Originally Posted by Linda on the move

Being kind is really a lot more important than being right.

[elmh23]

Originally Posted by Linda on the move

Both you and your DH are right. Her DD has red flags waving wildly, but you really should mind your own business unless asked.

Yup!

She's in denial but that's where most SN moms are at the beginning. My son has mild issues (speech delay, GI problems of some sort, sensory stuff) and it's been a long 3 years of me coming around to these things, then convincing dh, then doubting, then finally making the needed calls.

[starlein26]

Originally Posted by Linda on the move

If you cannot relate to the heartbreak of having a child who needs a label, then just count yourself blessed and remember to be kind.

Originally Posted by elmh23

Yup!

She's in denial but that's where most SN moms are at the beginning.

I see moms now, with children that clearly have delays/problems, who are in denial and BECAUSE I've been there...I stay out of it. They will realize in their own way and at the time their heart is fully prepared to handle it. It's a deeply painful experience. And nothing you say will change her path until she is ready to change that path.

[Adaline'sMama]

Originally Posted by Linda on the move

I disagree. There's really no body that you are so close to that you should look in the eye and say, "I know your child is in speech therapy and getting ready to start special education preschool, but frankly, I don't think it's enough. I think your kid has autism and needs to be labeled as such."
.

That is absolutely true. If anyone said something like that to any mom/dad I would think it to be rude and totally inappropriate. I was under the impression that she was trying to find a way to "gently" suggest a second opinion. After the mother had stated that there was "nothing wrong" with her kid. The kid was just "stubborn" and "lazy". If my friend called her kid stubborn and lazy and I thought the kid had some other issues, I would point it out by saying something like, "Well, if it was me I would want a second opinion, because I wouldnt want to find out if anything was wrong as soon as possible. I dont want this kicking me in the a** 2 or 3 years from now"

[Linda on the move]

Originally Posted by Adaline'sMama

"Well, if it was me I would want a second opinion, because I wouldnt want to find out if anything was wrong as soon as possible. I dont want this kicking me in the a** 2 or 3 years from now"

I suspect that no matter what the mom or what any one else does, this will be kicking the parents in the a** 2 or 3 years from now, and a decade from now. Your statement implies that if only the parents do just the right things, this will be OK in a couple of years. That's just not true.

The child is getting ready to start special needs preschool, which will have teachers trained in all this and can walk the parents through the next steps.

[sapphire_chan]

With the history you've given, I don't see autism. Yeah, it might be there, but everything you've described could come from an SPD or food sensitivity or probably a dozen other things.

What is sad, and what I would try to figure out a way to gently talk to this mama about, is that her dd is suffering and mom's blaming her behavior all on her being "stubborn" and "lazy". If it's the kid's nature (and the kid's fault ) then that shuts down working on explanations and solutions.

From what you've said, I'd probably approach it, next time she vents to you about potty learning etc, as "there is no way your kid is autistic, but I also don't think it's her fault she's having these difficulties. The weirdest things can mess up behavior. I hope your doctor is smart enough to look into all possibilities and not try to foist you off with some pathetic explanation."

[minkajane]

I see a lot of parents blaming developmental issues on personality traits in the child and I don't even know how to respond to it. My niece just started walking at 18 months, which is well within the normal range, considering she was born at 35 weeks. But for months beforehand, my grandmother would say things like, "Oh, she can walk, she's just lazy." She was dead serious. Kids WANT to learn things like walking. Why would you project things like laziness simply because a kid doesn't learn things on YOUR timetable?

Sorry, little side rant there. I just don't know how to respond to that attitude. "Oh, s/he's just lazy, stubborn, a brat, etc."

[gbailey]

Originally Posted by Linda on the move

I disagree. There's really no body that you are so close to that you should look in the eye and say, "I know your child is in speech therapy and getting ready to start special education preschool, but frankly, I don't think it's enough. I think your kid has autism and needs to be labeled as such."

It really doesn't matter how pretty you dress it, that's what you would be saying.

I have a daughter on the spectrum, and you need to tread VERY lightly with other parents and their children's developmental issues. If you cannot relate to the heartbreak of having a child who needs a label, then just count yourself blessed and remember to be kind.

Being kind is really a lot more important than being right.

I agree and thanks to everyone who responded. I know you guys are right about minding my own business.

Minkajane, I agree with you about projecting those kinds of things on children. I especially hate when adults tell children they are being mean when they don't want to show affection or unwilling to be engaged with certain people.

[starlein26]

Originally Posted by sapphire_chan

What is sad, and what I would try to figure out a way to gently talk to this mama about, is that her dd is suffering and mom's blaming her behavior all on her being "stubborn" and "lazy".

It's not sad...it's just denial. It comes in all forms.

[gbailey]

Originally Posted by starlein26

It's not sad...it's just denial. It comes in all forms.

I think the denial is sad though if a child is in pain or suffering and doesn't have to. A lot of kids with hydrocephalus are extremely sensitive to hearing and when she sticks her fingers in her ear and screams she may be in pain. My DH's cousin has it and for years the sound of certain noises would cause her extreme pain. It always mean it was time for the fluid to be drained.

[Linda on the move]

Originally Posted by gbailey

Anyway, the ENT doctor told her the daughter has wax build up and gave her an RX. She doesn't mention the fingers in the ear but says she wants to know if her daughter is sensitive to sounds.

Originally Posted by gbailey

I think the denial is sad though if a child is in pain or suffering and doesn't have to. A lot of kids with hydrocephalus are extremely sensitive to hearing and when she sticks her fingers in her ear and screams she may be in pain.

The mom took the child to an ENT and has made arrangements for speech therapy and special preschool. The mom has also had her baby operated on.

While I think it is possible that the mom could be more proactive about multiple opinions and requesting a complete evaluation, I feel tremendous compassion for this mother.

They've already been through a lot, and I suspect that they have a lot more to go through.

I'm sure that people have looked at my DD and felt that they could do a better job. It is really icky to be in the receiving end of that feeling. Unless you've had a sn child, you really don't have a clue. I'm sure it looks easier from the outside than it is on the inside.

[gbailey]

Originally Posted by Linda on the move

The mom took the child to an ENT and has made arrangements for speech therapy and special preschool. The mom has also had her baby operated on.

While I think it is possible that the mom could be more proactive about multiple opinions and requesting a complete evaluation, I feel tremendous compassion for this mother.

They've already been through a lot, and I suspect that they have a lot more to go through.

I'm sure that people have looked at my DD and felt that they could do a better job. It is really icky to be in the receiving end of that feeling. Unless you've had a sn child, you really don't have a clue. I'm sure it looks easier from the outside than it is on the inside.

Great points Linda and honestly, I do have a lot of of compassion for the mom and when she wants to share with me what's going on with her DD I listen. While I do think she could be more proactive about a lot of things like taking her to ENT a year earlier, I don't think I've made her feel like she needs to be doing a better job. While I think I would do things differently in her situation, you are right, it probably does look easier from the outside than it is on the inside.