Almost 5: "I don't love you."

[CellarDoor]

Granted, I was NOT having a good pre-bedtime mommy moment and my dd was rightfully angry with me for yelling at her and generally being impatient and surly. But to say "I never want to see you again" and "I love my friends more" and "I don't love you and I don't care" really, really hurt.

I told her how much it hurt my feelings and asked her why she said that. She was honest: she doesn't like how angry I get when we have to go somewhere on time (much like getting to bed efficiently...I have issues!)

I'm thinking: total failure + poster child for Gordon Neufeld's work on peer attachment.

Please: any help/support/ideas would be GREATLY appreciated so that I don't cry myself to sleep!

[Chamomile Girl]

Oh mama! Kids know how much they mean to us and that is why the "I don't love you" is such a powerful weapon to them (I mean can you imagine saying that to a parent who you thought to be indifferent to you? What if they agreed with you!). She knows its going to hurt you and that is why she uses it. But it really doesn't mean she doesn't love you, but that she doesn't like the way you are treating he (as she told you herself). She would only be able to say it if she were totally secure in your love for her.

A good response would be "I will allways love YOU though" or some other similar unconditional love affermation. Followed up with "I know you are very frustrated right now...so am I."

[lach]

Here's a fun fact for you: you might THINK that you're a person, but really you're just a giant button... and kids learn pretty early just how to push you.

The "I don't love you" is classic button pushing behavior AND classic testing behavior. And, in cases like this, classic diversionary behavior too! I agree with the PP that the best response is just a simple "But I will always love you" and then carry on with what you're doing. I mean, not the yelling specifically... I don't actually recommend that! But the appropriate displeasure for whatever it is that she is doing.

Don't take it personally. I promise that she still loves you a lot. It's that love that makes her feel safe enough to say things that she knows are mean and knows aren't true.

[GuildJenn]

She's just learning the various weapons in her arsenal, and that's a big one. She's also testing out her negative feelings on you.

I agree with PPs - just treat it calmly. It has nothing to do with your attachment or lack thereof, love or lack thereof. Stop reading Gordon Neufield if it is going to make you that upset!

P.S. he was looking at studies of dysfunctional situations for kids under one in bad bad quality care and then he extrapolated that to life. Sometimes I think that man has done more damage than good.

[mamazee]

I really feel like when kids say this, what they mean is "I'm not feeling loving toward you at this moment." The concept of unconditional love is really complex. It takes kids time to understand that our love, and theirs, continues even during negative feelings. I'd just mirror back the unconditional love you feel for her so she can see how it works.

[ctdoula]

My son started saying "I hate you" last year... same exact age. It came out of nowhere. When he would be angry/upset/frustrated/freaking out he'd add that into the mix. It's a test of power. They know those are powerful words and they want to test limits, etc. We would just tell him that those are unkind words, or that we loved him very much and we're sorry he feels that way, etc. He hasn't said it in months. Phase over... yours will be too & she does love you very much.

[mom2happy]

Originally Posted by mamazee

I really feel like when kids say this, what they mean is "I'm not feeling loving toward you at this moment." The concept of unconditional love is really complex. It takes kids time to understand that our love, and theirs, continues even during negative feelings. I'd just mirror back the unconditional love you feel for her so she can see how it works.

Of course she doesnt mean it.
Im still trying to get my 7 year old DD to stop saying these kinds of things in the heat of the moment.
I know its hard to take, but it just means that she was really really mad at you. It's so hard to be a kid, sigh, its so hard to be mom!

[cjam]

I get this sometimes from DD4. It doesn't bother me, I realize that she doesn't have the language, awareness and self-control to say how she really feels. I usually respond with "Well, I love you.". When she calms down, I help her to find the correct words for her feelings - "I'm angry with you.", "I don't want to be interrupted." etc.

[lach]

Originally Posted by mom2happy

Of course she doesnt mean it.
Im still trying to get my 7 year old DD to stop saying these kinds of things in the heat of the moment.
I know its hard to take, but it just means that she was really really mad at you. It's so hard to be a kid, sigh, its so hard to be mom!

A friend told me that when she was a kid, her mom would write the mean things she said (along the "I hate you!" line) on a post it, and put it on the refrigerator. All very calmly... just doing it very matter of factly. And up it stayed, without comment, until my friend apologized. My friend said it was soooo effective, because whenever she said something mean to her mom she KNEW she didn't mean it, and having it up there was really painful. She said she'd always apologize very quickly, and it was a pretty effective lesson about not saying things that you don't mean.

I always thought that was a really original way to deal with it. LOL, my parents would just send me to my room to "think" and I think being put in isolation after that sort of cry for attention (because I do think that "I hate you!" usually means "I really want you to tell me that you still love me, even though I know you're annoyed with me") just added to whatever issue was going on.

Just thought I'd put that out there, as an idea for dealing with this sort of lashing out.

[Mom2M]

Originally Posted by lach

A friend told me that when she was a kid, her mom would write the mean things she said (along the "I hate you!" line) on a post it, and put it on the refrigerator. All very calmly... just doing it very matter of factly. And up it stayed, without comment, until my friend apologized. My friend said it was soooo effective, because whenever she said something mean to her mom she KNEW she didn't mean it, and having it up there was really painful. She said she'd always apologize very quickly, and it was a pretty effective lesson about not saying things that you don't mean.

I always thought that was a really original way to deal with it. LOL, my parents would just send me to my room to "think" and I think being put in isolation after that sort of cry for attention (because I do think that "I hate you!" usually means "I really want you to tell me that you still love me, even though I know you're annoyed with me") just added to whatever issue was going on.

Just thought I'd put that out there, as an idea for dealing with this sort of lashing out.

That is really an interesting idea. I was thinking also that it might be good to make it "things we say that we don't mean" for both the parent and child.
I know sometimes I am in hurry up and get this done mommy mode and will say stuff that I really don't like after I think about it.

It's hard to learn how to be thoughtful and considerate of others' feelings even when you are angry and I know I'm still not perfect at it.

OP, I am so sorry!
I have 2 older boys and the first time I heard something like that I cried my eyes out. Even now, if they lash out and say something horrid, I know for a fact that it is just in the heat of the moment and it still breaks my heart.
I've talked with them about it and they always say they are sorry and they don't mean it, etc...

I do not want to hear it from my 5 year old DD...so far I haven't but you never know.

[LynnS6]

It's the age. 4-5 year olds are learning the power of words. And they're not very subtle about wielding that power. IMO, while they're angry, they don't really grasp the full hurt that words can have on you. It's sort of like a 2 year old who hits. They hit because they're mad, but they don't link your hurt with their actions all the time. 5 year olds say mean things because they are mad.

I'll readily admit that my kids don't do this very much, and I don't think that it's anything that we do specifically that's avoided this. I just think it's my kids' personalities.

Things that I do that I think help are to rephrase things for my kids to help them, "wow, you sound really mad. Are you furious?" Giving them appropriate vocabulary does help in the long run. The other thing I do is try to describe my feelings when I'm feeling cranky or upset. Last night our daughter was ditzing around while practicing the piano, and I was getting upset. After I caught myself being short with her once or twice, I said "Hon, I'm really tired and cranky tonight. I don't have a lot of patience. I need you to focus please."

At the same time, the only other suggestion I have is to not give the words that much power. It's hard, I know, but they're words, and your child is trying them on for size. If you don't get too ruffled, they'll drop it. That doesn't mean you shouldn't call them on it, but a simple "Hey, that's mean." or "That's rude, please try again" works.

[ElliesMomma]

my suggestion would be to just entirely change this scenario. don't dwell on it, just move on from it.

starting tomorrow, tell her, out of the blue, that you ALWAYS LOVE HER. tell her you love her when she cooperates, and you love her when she doesn't cooperate. you love her when she gets to bed on time, and when she doesn't. you love her even when she says she doesn't love you.

and just leave it at that.

[MeepyCat]

I wouldn't take it so much to heart, mama. This evening, my son (3.5) informed me that I wasn't his friend anymore three times in five minutes, because I insisted that he stop pressing the soap into pretend apple juice, that he rinse himself off, and that he get out of the bathtub. He went on to tell me that he loves me ("even when you're difficult" - a direct quote from his dad), and to decide that he can't be The Flash, because he still wants cuddles at bedtime.

It's the age they are: they have limited vocabulary for expressing their feelings, they know how to push our buttons, and when they're tired, they're just giant live wires.

I don't know Gordon Neufield's work, but I would not interpret a four year-old's verbal tantrum as having any meaning about her real emotions. I also wouldn't interpret it as a sign that you've failed as a parent. She has some steam to blow off, you happen to be handy, and she feels safe with you.

One of the things that kids are sometimes looking for when they say these things is reassurance - they know the situation is unpleasant, and they need us to demonstrate that we're sticking around no matter what, so they're as horrid as they know how to see what happens. If you keep calm and don't rise to the drama, they'll eventually get over it and come back to you. If you walk away from the situation, they're likely to chase you and cling.

Stay when you can stay calm, walk out when you can't, know that it is actually not about you.

[whozeyermamma]

All really good responses - just know that it's totally normal.

When DD (now 7) started saying "I hate you," or "I love Daddy more," (when I'd tell her no about something) I'd say calmly "You don't have to love me right now - I understand you're angry about X." Or I've also said, "You don't have to like me, I'm your mother."

I think when they say "I don't love you," part of it is them is scared by their anger and is worrying "Do you love me?" So I agree with the PP who said that it is especially important to remind them in those moments of their anger, that we love them no matter what.

Good luck - and try not to feel so bad, although it still sucks. The other day DD said "I just like Daddy more." Now I know this was because I had said no to candy but ...

[CellarDoor]

Thanks so much for putting this in perspective. I guess I thought my dd would never say that stuff to me, so it took me by surprise.

Onward and upwards!