"Teachable Moment" or undermining someone else's parenting?

[InMediasRes]

I'm not sure what's right in this situation. My neighbor kids are always outside playing with us. I have written about them before, we have two next door who are 7 and 10 and three at the end of the street who are 5, 7, and 9. My DS is 3.5 and loves to chase them around and join in their games, and they are great with him and adore my 18mo DD.

I get the impression that the girls sort of look up to me, and they are always asking me questions about various things. I have briefly met their moms. I know the girls on the end of the street come from a very conservative family, and they also apparently teach a lot of very strict gender rules. The mom has told the girls that they can only be outside if I'm there (ie, she thinks I'm supervising them?!) but has made no effort to get to know me.

The girls make comments sometimes that really get my ire up. I know they are not coming from them, but from home. On the one hand, I don't want to step on the other mom's toes, she is allowed to teach her children whatever she likes. On the other hand, I can't let those messages get to my kids, and I don't really like that they are being taught them either.

Here are some examples:

M (9): Miss Leah, why did you cut your hair?
Me: Because it's easier to take care of and I like how it looks. Since I have little babies, they were always pulling it.
M: I like it. You look like yourself (melts my heart, that one! )
Me: Aw, thanks!
M: My mom says that short hair is bad for little girls.

I sort of stumbled through a "in our family, girls are allowed to choose how to wear their hair" and "I think little girls can look very nice with short hair", but I felt really uncomfy about the whole thing. We also had a conversation about how boys can have long hair, but they were all in agreement that long hair is "bad for boys and looks awful".

The youngest one is 5 and VERY rigid about this. She doesn't even want DS to play with them because he is a boy. She is always telling him that pink is only for girls, that he can't play with their toys because they are "girl toys" (really, animals are girl toys?) etc. etc. I have called her on it a few times, saying "If you don't want to share your toys, that's okay. But those toys are just as good for boys as they are for girls. Just say that you don't feel like sharing if that's how you feel."

Another of the girls has told me that girls aren't very good at sports.

We have also had a few "teachable moments" about breastfeeding. None of the girls seemed to know what it was when I first did it in front of them. I didn't feel at all awkward about explaining it to them, but now M (9) is giving me the impression that she has talked to her mom about it and mom is saying that I should only be doing it in private. She doesn't even want me to call it "nursing", but to say the baby is "drinking" instead. I told her I didn't see the difference. And it's my own front porch, for goodness sake. I'm being discreet and not drawing attention to myself.

Where is the line between correcting what I think can be very damaging messages and stepping on another parent's toes? I haven't made any remarks to the effect of the other parents being "wrong" or "bad" or anything, just saying how I feel about what they say. Sometimes I offer examples of boys or girls that do what they say boys and girls don't do. I adore them all and my kids love to play with them, so I don't want to just stop playing with them.

[mamazee]

I don't think you should intentionally try to teach them anything their parents would object to, but I don't think you should stop wearing your hair however you want it or stop nursing your baby on your own porch for goodness sake, and it's reasonable to answer how you have IMO. I don't see anything you've said here as specifically wrong. I have said to kids when our families disagreed with things that "different families have different rules" and "different families believe different things" and that might be a helpful phrase as well.

[Areia]

I think you're fine. It's not like you're trying to sway them into thinking a certain way. You're just doing your own thing, in your own house, and respectfully answering their questions/having normal conversations without lying to them. It sounds like the mom doesn't mind too much as she hasn't stopped them from visiting you.

[lotusdebi]

Start out with saying, "I believe" or "We believe" when disagreeing with something they've learned from their parents. That way, they learn that not everyone believes the same things, but you're not telling them what they should think.

You can also be more firm about what kinds of things are permitted in your yard and around your children. For example, you can say that you don't want them telling your DS that something is "just for girls" because you believe he should be able to play with anything. And, if they don't want to share their toys, then maybe it's better if they play separately from your children for a while.

[mamadelbosque]

Yeah another vote for keep doing what your doing - if their mom doesn't like it, she can tell them to stay at their house. Its not like your going over and sitting on *their* porch and preaching!!!

[2xy]

Originally Posted by lotusdebi

Start out with saying, "I believe" or "We believe" when disagreeing with something they've learned from their parents. That way, they learn that not everyone believes the same things, but you're not telling them what they should think.

You can also be more firm about what kinds of things are permitted in your yard and around your children. For example, you can say that you don't want them telling your DS that something is "just for girls" because you believe he should be able to play with anything.

All of this.

Also, if their parents are annoyed about what their children are learning from the neighbors, then how about they come outside with their kids once in awhile, hmm? The way I see it, you can't pawn your kids off on the neighborhood and then complain about the things your kids see and learn.

[goodygumdrops]

I would follow the "we believe" thing and I wouldn't worry about what you say. Maybe some of it will wear off for the better. I the neighbors don't like it than they shouldn't let them be unsupervised in the neighborhood.

[Norasmomma]

Yeah I'd just say that different families have different beliefs, BUT I would have said girls can be good at anything they want when it comes to the sports thing. That crap would have irked me

[earthmama369]

I will answer questions that kids ask me honestly. I won't push "teaching moments" on them, but if they ask, they're expressing curiosity and I'm not going to try to guess what their parents would say in response. I'll answer as me.

I'm all for diversity and freedom of belief, but I also believe in "my house, my rules." Meaning that when kids are playing at my house, boys and girls are allowed to do the same things, no one gets teased for liking a certain color or playing with a certain toy, I would breastfeed (when I was still breastfeeding) like usual, etc.

[WifeMomChiro]

Originally Posted by earthmama369

I will answer questions that kids ask me honestly. I won't push "teaching moments" on them, but if they ask, they're expressing curiosity and I'm not going to try to guess what their parents would say in response. I'll answer as me.

I'm all for diversity and freedom of belief, but I also believe in "my house, my rules." Meaning that when kids are playing at my house, boys and girls are allowed to do the same things, no one gets teased for liking a certain color or playing with a certain toy, I would breastfeed (when I was still breastfeeding) like usual, etc.

I agree with this. My own niece had never seen a child being breastfed until my dd was born (and her brother is just slightly older than my dd). She was very curious and I explained it to her. "My dd drinks milk from my breast, and your brother drinks formula from a bottle." I don't impose judgment about it, but kids need to see that there are different options and views in the world.

[Lisa1970]

It is not a teachable moment. I would just say "that is interesting" and let it go. Which is more important? To teach her that short hair is ok, or to let her respect her parents and their rules? See the point on that?

I know it can be frustrating when someone has a different point of view, especially when it comes off as sexist or otherwise, but that child needs to be able to respect her parents more than have short hair. Sort of like, "pick your battles." If you start telling her her parents are wrong, which is what you would be doing, then you will make her miserable at home as she starts to fight and argue with her parents. Most likely, she simply will not be allowed to be around you for it. Or, if she does not tell her parents what you said, then she will internalize it, which is not good either.

But the breastfeeding is a teachable moment. If the mom does not want her girls to know about that, she should hide them in a closet. As far as omitting your son goes, I would not allow that kind of treatment of your son. Your daughters will know that they cannot exclude their little brother. So, if your daughters are forced to chose, they will exclude the little girls. Who, by the way, seem awfully out spoken for little girls being raised to be so conservative.

OK..so much of what you listed really are teachable moments. But I would let the hair thing and other comments like that go.

[LynnS6]

Another vote for: I think you're handling it beautifully.

And I wanted to add that 5 year olds are in a very 'black and white' kind of stage developmentally. So while I find it a bit sad that she appears to be hearing some very strict gender role stuff from home, remember that it's also filtered through her 5 year old mind. In a few years, she might be better able to process the idea that different families have different ways of doing things. And hey, just by modeling a different approach, those kids are learning from you!

[Tjej]

I think you have answered them well and you aren't doing any undermining.

You might be surprised that the parents are not like that at all, though. I know my 2yo and 4yo both have some pretty strong ideas about "girl" and "boy" things, which I have never encouraged and which I discourage whenever they bring them up. I know one relative that says stuff like that around them and I am guessing that is where they pick it up.

Sometimes 5yos just say things. And older kids too. When I was little I apparently told the teacher that I didn't have sheets on my bed. (What was true was that I didn't have a topsheet because I chose not to, I did have a fitted sheet and a blanket). Sometimes things are really easy to misinterpret out of the mouthes of young people.

So anyway, I think you're doing great and I also wouldn't be too sure about what any other parents are like until you've actually spent some time with them.

Tjej

[LROM]

Another vote for "Keep answering honestly and as yourself!"

Seriously, if these kids are out and about that much, if their parents are really that concerned about what they're talking about/hearing, they should be out and about more themselves with their kids. I'm not saying the parents are doing a bad job because they're not out (unless the kids are out inappropriately somehow), but there is no way that you should have to monitor what you say or stay quiet when kids who are playing with your kids express things that you disagree with.

It's fine to say the "In my family we believe..." or "In our family it's absolutely ok for boys to play with any toys they want" or to even engage them in conversations about "Why would animals be a girl toy?". But I can't imagine not answering their questions honestly.

If their parents don't like the conversations you're having, they can restrict their kids time with your family or they can talk to you directly.

And that is definitely practicing what I preach - if my kids were ever hanging out with another family and came home saying they'd heard/learned something I didn't agree with, I'd never be upset with the other family for being themselves and talking honestly around my kid - I'd just explain to my kid what I thought about it and explain age-appropriately why they can't hang out there as much/at all (depending on what was said and how seriously inappropriate I thought it was - most things I probably wouldn't even restrict their time because most things probably wouldn't be that deep).

[limabean]

Stating your honest opinion when asked doesn't come close to undermining anyone's parenting. You're a whole separate person from their mother, and they're old enough to realize that different people have different opinions. If their mom doesn't want them exposed to your opinions, she can keep them away from your porch.

[phathui5]

And I wanted to add that 5 year olds are in a very 'black and white' kind of stage developmentally. So while I find it a bit sad that she appears to be hearing some very strict gender role stuff from home, remember that it's also filtered through her 5 year old mind.

I have to agree with this. My 7yo dd says the same sort of things about hair and it's not something that I have pushed at all.