or Connect
Mothering › Mothering Forums › Pregnancy and Birth › Birth and Beyond › C-section Birth › Humanized Caesarean Birth: How do we help the 5-15% who will need a c-section?
New Posts  All Forums:Forum Nav:

Humanized Caesarean Birth: How do we help the 5-15% who will need a c-section? - Page 2

post #21 of 111
Quote:
Originally Posted by mmaramba View Post
We're talking about basic respect for laboring mothers as human beings with brains and options.
This.
post #22 of 111
I think it would help some births if surgeons didn't ban doulas from attending c-sections.
post #23 of 111
great thread
post #24 of 111
Quote:
Originally Posted by lovebeingamomma View Post
I think it would help some births if surgeons didn't ban doulas from attending c-sections.
It's often not the surgeon, it's the anesthesiologist. They don't want too many people in the OR.
post #25 of 111
The case I'm thinking of, they didn't allow anyone to be with her. That just seemed wrong.
post #26 of 111
The only times I have heard of no one accompanying the mom into the delivery room is when general anesthesia is used. Otherwise, the normal is 1 person is allowed to accompany her during delivery. Was there a reason given to the mom you are thinking of that she wasn't permitted to have support with her?
post #27 of 111
Um wow, this thread makes it sound like the woman who has a csection is doomed. Sure it can be dissapointing but dehumanized? Really? (Yeah I could tell from the OP you haven't had a c/s!!)

Personally my c/s done w/ the utmost respect and care as far as I could tell. My Dr's and MW did not dehumanize the experience for me or my babe in the least. No need to feel pity for us! I really pity those who feel they need to waste their energy onjudging someone else's experience!

Quite frankly this board all by it's lonesome made me feel like crap though about it all quite personally. Something I could have done without. All another part of the mommy wars though IMHO and who is doing what the "right" way..sigh.

I really truly am disgusted by threads like this.

Furthermore, I find the title of this thread really offensive and ridiculous. How about a halt on the judgement and pity that us c/s moms feel from those within the natural birth community? Support will go a lot farther in helping the poor c/s moms!

If you're REALLY worried about it why not trying to do something worthwhile like addressing malpractice insurance & hospital policies, etc. Stop victimizing the MOTHERS! It's not helpful!
post #28 of 111
Quote:
Originally Posted by TCMoulton View Post
Honestly, I personally feel that the most important thing that people can do is stop judging c/s moms and trust that when they say that their c/s was necessary that it in fact was & don't feel that you need to tell her what she could have done different that would have made her c/s unnecessary. I have read too many threads here where a new mom posts about her birth & as soon as a c/s is mentioned members here come out of the woodwork here to critique what she did wrong. Unless she asks for advice on what could be changed don't assume she wants it.
ditto. and I'd go a step further and add that judging not just whether the section was necessary, but how having a section makes a woman less of a mother needs to stop. Why do women do this to one another?

As for the procedure, having had a crash section with GA I would have appreciated someone sitting with me soon after the surgery and giving me a run down of wth happened. My first birth experience is just a big, black hole.

For recovery, I really felt the staff at the baby friendly hospital, and the on que ball helped my recovery tremendously. The on que ball let me do with very few painkillers.
post #29 of 111
I also wanted to add, I felt abandoned by my natural birthing community after my section. My midwife didn't want anything to do with me post section, and when I walked in for my pp checkup, she seemed not to remember that I had even had a section. (asked how my vagina was healing?). She did not speak to my husband or I after the section, until the next day.
post #30 of 111
What a great thread. I have had 5 c-sections. My first was absolutely unnecessary. I am thankful of the outcome, my son is alive and well but because of the mistakes that were made I always had to have a c-section. All of my births were by different providers. The wiser I got, the better the outcome each time until my 5th was as perfect as a c-section birth as you could ever ask for.

The thing that was the number 1 was all my providers treated me as a human being with a brain in her head that only wanted the best for her baby even if that differentiated with what their personal beliefs were. I think this is so key. They honored every detail of our birth plan. They listen to me. This late in the ball game I know what works for me and what does not work for me.
post #31 of 111
Quote:
Originally Posted by rainbowmoon View Post
Um wow, this thread makes it sound like the woman who has a csection is doomed. Sure it can be dissapointing but dehumanized? Really? (Yeah I could tell from the OP you haven't had a c/s!!)

Personally my c/s done w/ the utmost respect and care as far as I could tell. My Dr's and MW did not dehumanize the experience for me or my babe in the least. No need to feel pity for us! I really pity those who feel they need to waste their energy onjudging someone else's experience!

Quite frankly this board all by it's lonesome made me feel like crap though about it all quite personally. Something I could have done without. All another part of the mommy wars though IMHO and who is doing what the "right" way..sigh.

I really truly am disgusted by threads like this.

Furthermore, I find the title of this thread really offensive and ridiculous. How about a halt on the judgement and pity that us c/s moms feel from those within the natural birth community? Support will go a lot farther in helping the poor c/s moms!

If you're REALLY worried about it why not trying to do something worthwhile like addressing malpractice insurance & hospital policies, etc. Stop victimizing the MOTHERS! It's not helpful!
Ok, I think this is a bit unfair to the OP. While I guess I'm not qualified to speak because I haven't had a c-section either, my interpretation of what she was saying is that in many instances that we hear about on this board and in other places, mamas are not treated well during and after c-sections. Not ALL the time, but enough that for many women it makes what is often a challenging situation worse. I know that personally (and I realized this very clearly while reading this thread), I am very fearful of having a c-section in large part because I am afraid of not being treated with respect because of the stories I have heard of, for example, docs making inappropriate remarks as if the woman is not in the room or awake, inappropriate music playing in the OR, doctors and nurses minimizing the experience or the woman's feelings about it, not being offered enough help with breastfeeding in the hospital, being separated from baby for hours unnecessarily, and on and on.

I do understand that there is a perception of abandonment of c/s moms by the NCB community and I think that there are definitely individuals out there whose words and actions have created that perception, and that needs to be worked on. But I think the OP's intentions here were pure.
post #32 of 111
Sometimes it's just hard to hear moms who have not had a C/S discussing how to help us have a better experience, especially since many of here are very ok with how our C/S turned out and are not at all traumatized by the experience.
post #33 of 111
My (emergency) c-section was a pretty good experience as these things go. I mean, it was surgery, I was pretty scared, the oxygen mask smelled awful, but the people taking care of me were respectful and communicative, and the surgery was the only way to make sure that DD and I both survived. We did what we had to do, we were well taken care of, we are all fine. This is good.

I find a lot of the suggestions for "family-centered" or "more natural" c-sections rather horrifying. Pushing the baby out with my hands? Good god in heavens no. My husband nearly passed out when I was given an epidural with my first baby. When I mentioned the possibility that we could look at my abdomen while it was cut open, he almost threw up. We did not want a natural c-section, we wanted extra sterile draping if it was available. And since, by the time my daughter was born, I was thoroughly traumatized by the sight of blood, I wanted her washed off first. So one of the things I think we need to keep in mind is that different people are going to want different things.

I agree that the armchair quarterbacking needs to stop.

One of the other things that needs to stop is the assumption that only a small proportion of those c-sections were necessary. Those WHO c-section guidelines have been quietly dropped - they aren't perfectly sure that 5-15% is an appropriate rate.
post #34 of 111
Quote:
Originally Posted by rainbowmoon View Post
Furthermore, I find the title of this thread really offensive and ridiculous. How about a halt on the judgement and pity that us c/s moms feel from those within the natural birth community? Support will go a lot farther in helping the poor c/s moms!

If you're REALLY worried about it why not trying to do something worthwhile like addressing malpractice insurance & hospital policies, etc. Stop victimizing the MOTHERS! It's not helpful!
Exactly!!!!
post #35 of 111
"How do we help the 5-15% who will need a c-section?"

Get the rates down TO 5-15% so when someone hears "I had a c-section" the images of poor advice, over aggressive interventions, or, dare I say it, selfishness, do not play a part.

That was just my first thought when reading the title before I clicked on the thread. I think true support would be much easier if there were no unnecessary/completely preventable sections. On the part of those not directly involved (extended family, friends, "outsiders"), and on the part of the caregivers...meaning, if they weren't doing sections out the behind because so many were unnecessary, there would be more time to truly make it a positive experience for mum and baby.


Disclaimer: Yes, I said selfishness. NO I do not mean that all or even most women who have sections do it for selfish reasons, nor do I mean that all or most OBs do it for selfish reasons. BUT it is a factor that comes up on occasion ("too Posh to push" anyone? it's not the biggest reason by ANY means, but sometimes it IS a reason sometimes). I will admit, even if I turn heads in admitting this, that selfishness is sometimes on my list of assumptions when I hear someone has had a section. It's way, way down low, but it's there. I do not outwardly assume anything, but knowing the stats, I do automatically imagine many scenarios (most commonly, snowball interventions and impatient provider coupled with uninformed mum) because, fact is, half or more of cesareans aren't necessary and those are some of the reasons why.

Geez...I hope that made sense...and I really hope I don't get flamed...I shouldn't be allowed to post here when I'm THIS tired and pregnancy-brained.
post #36 of 111
Quote:
Originally Posted by texmati View Post
I also wanted to add, I felt abandoned by my natural birthing community after my section. My midwife didn't want anything to do with me post section, and when I walked in for my pp checkup, she seemed not to remember that I had even had a section. (asked how my vagina was healing?). She did not speak to my husband or I after the section, until the next day.
Heartbreaking. I've never had a section and I hope I never do and I am obviously a huge NCB advocate, but I feel a tremendous amount of love and respect for those who tried for a natural birth and ended up with a section. Those are the ones that often remind me that there ARE necessary sections that happen...and for a mum who wanted and prepared for and tried for the exact opposite outcome, it breaks my heart. If I were a midwife or doula or CBE, I can't imagine essentially "walking away" from my client at a time like that. That is a time when I would want to be with her even MORE, to remind her that she is still an amazing mother, and did an amazing job, and that she should be proud of herself.
post #37 of 111
Quote:
Originally Posted by smeep View Post
"How do we help the 5-15% who will need a c-section?"

Get the rates down TO 5-15% so when someone hears "I had a c-section" the images of poor advice, over aggressive interventions, or, dare I say it, selfishness, do not play a part.

That was just my first thought when reading the title before I clicked on the thread. I think true support would be much easier if there were no unnecessary/completely preventable sections. On the part of those not directly involved (extended family, friends, "outsiders"), and on the part of the caregivers...meaning, if they weren't doing sections out the behind because so many were unnecessary, there would be more time to truly make it a positive experience for mum and baby.


Disclaimer: Yes, I said selfishness. NO I do not mean that all or even most women who have sections do it for selfish reasons, nor do I mean that all or most OBs do it for selfish reasons. BUT it is a factor that comes up on occasion ("too Posh to push" anyone? it's not the biggest reason by ANY means, but sometimes it IS a reason sometimes). I will admit, even if I turn heads in admitting this, that selfishness is sometimes on my list of assumptions when I hear someone has had a section. It's way, way down low, but it's there. I do not outwardly assume anything, but knowing the stats, I do automatically imagine many scenarios (most commonly, snowball interventions and impatient provider coupled with uninformed mum) because, fact is, half or more of cesareans aren't necessary and those are some of the reasons why.

Geez...I hope that made sense...and I really hope I don't get flamed...I shouldn't be allowed to post here when I'm THIS tired and pregnancy-brained.
A study just came out this week saying that "too posh to push" is a myth.
post #38 of 111
Quote:
Originally Posted by smeep View Post
Heartbreaking. I've never had a section and I hope I never do and I am obviously a huge NCB advocate, but I feel a tremendous amount of love and respect for those who tried for a natural birth and ended up with a section. Those are the ones that often remind me that there ARE necessary sections that happen...and for a mum who wanted and prepared for and tried for the exact opposite outcome, it breaks my heart. If I were a midwife or doula or CBE, I can't imagine essentially "walking away" from my client at a time like that. That is a time when I would want to be with her even MORE, to remind her that she is still an amazing mother, and did an amazing job, and that she should be proud of herself.
The thing is, most women (at least who I know, and certainly most here on MDC) who ended up with c-sections did want and try for a natural birth. They didn't go into labor hoping for tons of interventions, yk? So, I guess, maybe it should just be assumed that all women who have had c-sections hoped not to. Then maybe that same compassion and understanding can be implied - and no, feeling sorry for us, generally, isn't a helpful form of empathy.

I sometimes wish there was a support thread for women who, while they didn't wish to be included in the c-section statistics, came out of it okay. We all aren't traumatized and left feeling unworthy. Yes, the HCP's and supporting staff at the hospital play a huge role in that outcome, but other people - namely other women - have a big part in the difference with how we deal with the aftermath and any ensuing emotions surrounding how our children were born.
post #39 of 111
Quote:
Originally Posted by lach View Post
A study just came out this week saying that "too posh to push" is a myth.
Not to mention, it's really a subjective thing. If a woman is seriously so afraid of pushing a baby out that she'd rather have major abdominal surgery, is it really "selfish?" Obviously there's something going on there. And, of course, I have to point out that UC is often viewed as a "selfish" decision. So does that make it true?

Quote:
One of the other things that needs to stop is the assumption that only a small proportion of those c-sections were necessary. Those WHO c-section guidelines have been quietly dropped - they aren't perfectly sure that 5-15% is an appropriate rate.
Yes. AFAIK, there was no real basis for the 5-15% number. And again, the idea of "necessary" is subjective. The criteria for "necessary" generally laid out by the NCB community are pretty stringent and unforgiving. Even in cases where mom or baby (or both) were clearly in serious danger, I often see second guessing.

And, while I acknowledge and respect that there are women who have been traumatized by their experience with c/s, many women haven't and aren't interested in being "healed" because they just don't need it.

And Lord, yes, the whole "natural c/s" thing sounds horrifying to me! In theory it sounds fine if mom wants it, but I can't imagine that most women want to see themselves cut open or push their baby out through their incision. My birth plan has options for c/s and the closest I get to "natural c/s" is to have the drape lowered just enough so I can see the baby coming out (but not far enough to see myself sliced open!)
post #40 of 111
Quote:
Originally Posted by CherryBomb View Post
And Lord, yes, the whole "natural c/s" thing sounds horrifying to me! In theory it sounds fine if mom wants it, but I can't imagine that most women want to see themselves cut open or push their baby out through their incision. My birth plan has options for c/s and the closest I get to "natural c/s" is to have the drape lowered just enough so I can see the baby coming out (but not far enough to see myself sliced open!)
I would not have been down with that (seeing it all clearly or helping pull the baby out some how). No, I don't want the drapes lowered to see what I look like cut open and bloody, no, I wouldn't want to feel anything more than the tugging and pressure on my chest I didn't enjoy, as is. It took me a while to look at the pics my mom took of my sections, and even then, I don't really want to see more than my babies heads being pulled out. I'm grateful I have them, and grateful that the anesthesiologist (it really is 'his' OR, so his decision), let my mommy be in there with DH there, too. But no, I don't know about wanting a more natural c-section - to me, that conjures up images of doing it drug-free (ha!) no, thanks!
New Posts  All Forums:Forum Nav:
  Return Home
  Back to Forum: C-section Birth
Mothering › Mothering Forums › Pregnancy and Birth › Birth and Beyond › C-section Birth › Humanized Caesarean Birth: How do we help the 5-15% who will need a c-section?