Does breastmilk give immunity if mother is not immune

[ltlmrs]

So, DH and I were discussing vaccines and it struck me how we as a society have become so dependent on the formula/vaccine cycle. Because we don't nurse our children, we feel that we need vaccines to keep them safe.

But then the thought came to me of what exactly happens that makes the child protected when they nurse. Is it the mother's antibodies or is it more like the way coconut oil boosts immunity?

The reason I ask is because as most everyone on this forum knows, the greatest danger from childhood diseases is during infancy, when the babe should be getting breastfed exclusively. But, what if the mother had been vaccinated all her life and never had those childhood diseases to begin with?

[2boyzmama]

My understanding is that illness-specific antibodies will not be passed on unless the mother has them to pass. But breastmilk is also full of immunoglobulins that will boost baby's immune system even in the absence of specific antibodies. So it won't be as good as if the mother was immune, but it is still helpful to baby.

That is my understanding at least.

[NaturalBirthGoddes]

Originally Posted by 2boyzmama

My understanding is that illness-specific antibodies will not be passed on unless the mother has them to pass. But breastmilk is also full of immunoglobulins that will boost baby's immune system even in the absence of specific antibodies. So it won't be as good as if the mother was immune, but it is still helpful to baby.

That is my understanding at least.

Yes, this. This is my understanding, as well. Breastmilk passes "limited immunity" meaning that if there is an outbreak, the mom would pass on her antibodies to the baby, but that would not count as life-long or long-term immunity. The child would need to be exposed and have their own bodies create antibodies to get full immunity.

[shanniesue2]

I was sort of thinking about this in terms of CP this morning....

since we don't have a girl right now... it's not something we're currently worried about... and our plan with DS is to hope that he catches it naturally (but not purposefully exposing him) and then check his titres when he's older and vax then if he hasn't developed immunity.

However, if he were a girl (or if we ever have a girl), I would probably be a little more willing to purposeful exposure since I know that getting that natural immunity is so good as far as passing antibodies on through breastmilk. But idk if I would actually be able to bring myself to knowingly expose a child to illness....

I guess this is sort of OT, but kind of related and something I was thinking about just this morning.

[EdnaMarie]

No, it does not.

No antibodies in mom, no antibodies in milk. Low titres in mom, lower titres in milk.

A mom up-to-date on shots will have much more immunity passing through her milk than a mom who has been neither vaccinated, nor sick with the illness.

Every mom will have different immune reactions to illnesses and vaccines so it's impossible, short of an across-the-board titre test, for any mom to know how much protection her child is getting.

E.g. Some people get a light case of chicken pox and are in fact still susceptible into adulthood but don't know it. Their babies will also be susceptible *even though mom had CP*. Some people don't "take" vaccines. I mean they get the shot but their immune system just goes, "Ho hum, kill 'em off, keep a couple antibodies in the file, nothing special." Baby will not be very immune if at all.

Also, more vitamins and stronger immune response does not necessarily mean a safer child. What is often the most dangerous is in fact the immune response: the phlegm. That's not viruses, that's the stuff meant to get the viruses, and yet that is what can suffocate a child. Or the red spots. That's the immune response. So even insofar as breastmilk has more vitamins to boost immune response, it's not going to protect a baby from, say, pertussis, unless there are antibodies in it.

Because we don't nurse our children, we feel that we need vaccines to keep them safe.

Actually, even in countries where nursing to 6 months or one year is the norm and even as high as 90 - 99%, vaccination programs are generally very popular, because breastmilk only provides SOME protection... *even when mom is fully immune*.

Natural selection works by selecting out the weak, namely, susceptible to disease. It also works by luck--sometimes, the immunity just doesn't work for whatever reason, or for seemingly no reason.

Vaccines improve the odds for the individual, in terms of surviving a particular disease.