2nd baby: how to NOT nurse to sleep?

[Nova0929]

Our second baby is due in March, and I don't want to make the same mistake with Babee as I did with our first son: that is, the only way DS knows how to go to sleep at night is by nursing to sleep. This means that at 2 years old daddy can't put him to sleep, my parents can't put him to sleep, and of course a babysitter can't put him to sleep ..... I am LONGING for a break! We're figuring out now how to get him to sleep without nursing b/c my milk supply is diminishing and the milk tastes bitter to him now that I'm pregnant, so this is something we're dealing with now.

BUT my question is: I'd love to offer Babee the ability to be able to go to sleep with Daddy or someone else, but I haven't a clue how to do it! It was just so natural for me to nurse DS to sleep. Dr. Sears recommends nursing in a chair, then somewhat waking baby up en route to bed so that she's slightly awake when touching the mattress and learns to associate mattress with going to sleep, not nursing. We tried that somewhat, but it seemed soo much easier just to lie down together and nurse to sleep .... Naptime is the same scenario.

How do I change this up with our second baby? Daddy needs to do his fair share, too! And I need to be able to have some breaks. And by 2 yo we want to be able to go out to a play or something together!

Thank you for your advice!
xo a

[pregnant@40]

Ha! I'm wondering the same thing. My second is due early Feb. Our 5yo still cannot go to sleep w/out one parent present in his room (even though we stopped nursing at 1yo), since we co-slept the first several years. He really just moved into his own bed & room this past year.

My plan is to nurse, but just as the baby is falling asleep, transfer him into his baby swing beside my bed. I plan to be consistent, so that he associates sleep w/ his own bed AND so that he doesn't use me as a human pacifier in order to get him to sleep. The bedside swing/bassinet I have already purchased is the Fisher-Price Newborn Rock 'N Play Sleeper (highly rated on all the blogs). I've read that consistency is key. I'll keep him swaddled while I nurse.

[Nova0929]

Do the blogs you are reading say anything about the product creating "flat head" or neck problems from sleeping in the Rock n Play Sleeper? Also, do the blogs say anything about a possible difficulty in transitioning from the sleeper to the bed when old enough?

I think you have a great idea here - I like it. Our 2 year old son is now in his own room though we did co-sleep for the first two years. We absolutely loved it, but at the same time I see that he is not able to sleep without me present (hopefully he'll learn to get to sleep with daddy eventually). I don't think that's a very good gift for the child or for us. However, we l-o-v-e co-sleeping! So figuring out how to get our second child to sleep without having to nurse or lie down next to us will be excellent.

[elanorh]

The No Cry Sleep Solution has good advice for helping establish a good sleep pattern that allows a good transition from nurse-to-sleep if you want to do that. I think it's very compatible with AP so you might want to check the book out and think about it.

Each babe is different. Dd1 was a very light sleeper but dd2 has been a much more sound sleeper (and needs more sleep than her sister does, at the same ages). I don't think I did anything that different (other than dd2 not having reflux ) .... Although I DID "shush" SJ while she was drifting to sleep/asleep and I really believe that teaching her to associate that shushing sound with going to sleep or being asleep has helped (especially when carrying her up to bed after she crashes or etc.).

I think, whether you nurse to sleep or not, it seems pretty common among my friends (AP and otherwise) that kiddos need a parent to lay down with them for a little while at bedtime and snuggle, until they're around 4-8 years of age (depending on the kid). Dd1 needed this 'til she was about 4 .... And then gradually, she didn't. Dd2 still needs it, but I think she's outgrowing it faster (probably because she can share beds with dd1 so she's still snuggling with someone while she's sleeping).

[pregnant@40]

Originally Posted by Nova0929

Do the blogs you are reading say anything about the product creating "flat head" or neck problems from sleeping in the Rock n Play Sleeper? Also, do the blogs say anything about a possible difficulty in transitioning from the sleeper to the bed when old enough?

One parent reported "flat head" from the sleeper on Amazon.com, none of the others experienced this. However, I purchased a Kiddopotamus Snuzzler Complete Head and Body Support to use w/ the sleeper (though the sleeper does have it's own support, I wanted to add to it). Parents also complain of "flat head" from cribs, due to the "back to sleep" campaign & SIDs issue. Their solution is to do tummy time & other positions while the baby is awake.

As for transitioning, I also bought a pack n' play w/ a newborn bassinet attached, and plan to use this for naps during the day. The other sleeper will only be used at night, or if I need to place him somewhere while cooking or using the bathroom. My hope is that he will get used to the pack n' play so that eventually I can transition him there full-time for the first two years. After the first two years, we'll move him to a floor mattress until he's old enough to have a real twin bed (around age 4).

So these are my plans, but with babies, the best laid plans are sure to go awry!

[pregnant@40]

Originally Posted by elanorh

I think, whether you nurse to sleep or not, it seems pretty commhttps://ehome.medtronic.com/dana-na/auth/url_3/welcome.cgion among my friends (AP and otherwise) that kiddos need a parent to lay down with them for a little while at bedtime and snuggle, until they're around 4-8 years of age (depending on the kid).

Definitely agree with that. However, I've noticed that my friends who are on their second or third children no longer co-sleep, and have found that magic formula that allows their young kids to sleep alone & in their own rooms. This is true even for babies. It seems to be a matter of association, where the child becomes accustomed to falling asleep like that. Some kids don't even want to have others in their room or bed when falling asleep! It's all learned behavior.

Sleep is very important to me this second time around, and I know my kiddos don't need a snoring & restless grown-up next to them throughout the night.

[katelove]

I am only on baby number one but I don't feed her to sleep everytime. Mainly because she won't let me but anyway. What we do is, I feed her and, if she doesn't fall asleep, DH takes her and rocks/walks/bounces her to sleep. We have done this since she was born and she will go to sleep equally easily for either of us. She does go through stages where she will feed to sleep almost everytime and we've just gone with that. It doesn't seem to affect her ability to fall asleep with DH when she is in a not-feeding-to-sleep cycle. If I wanted to encourage her to feed without falling asleep then I'd feed her sitting in a chair as she doesn't seem to fall asleep at the breast when I'm sitting.

I'm sure [baby] personality has helped us out a lot with this and I'm sure it also helped that DH was able to have 6 weeks off when she was born so she is used to us both. But, it is *great* that she will sleep for both of us and we will definitely be trying the same routine when we have number two.

Oh, and we bed share and have since she was born.

[BetsyS]

My first nursed to sleep for every nap and bedtime until he weaned (at 18 months old; I was 20 weeks pregnant, and I think my supply was almost gone).

My second NEVER nursed to sleep. He was all about laying down slightly sleepy, and he'd fall asleep on his own. He had a musical toy that he liked.

He is my worst sleeper. Didn't sleep through the night until 21 months old, and now (at 27 months) frequently wakes in the night and needs reassurance to go back to sleep.

Now, with my third (who is 4 months old), I'm trying to get him used to sleeping lots of different ways. So far, he'll rock to sleep, sometimes just fall asleep being laid down when he's sleepy (if the stars align; I do try it frequently, then if he fusses, I get him back up and try something different),and sometimes, yes, he nurses to sleep.

From my perspective, being able to nurse to sleep is VERY handy tool to have in your tricks. For a baby that is over-stimulated or has stayed up to long or is out and about, it's really nice to be able to nurse them and have them fall asleep. Much nicer than #2 who would just cry and cry if he didn't have his bed to lay down in and fall asleep (which means we spent a lot of time at home for a while there; he took 2 naps until 21 months old; that's a lot of time for the family to be tied to home and one little baby's bed, you know?). Just something else to consider.

[tabrizia]

DS nursed to sleep, but would let others put him to sleep if I wasn't there, which didn't happen until he was around 15 months. He had no issues transitioning to going to sleep with others when I stopped nursing him to sleep because I was pregnant with DD, and slowly transitioned to not needing to nurse to sleep for naps either, which I still nursed him for even after DD was born. He is and has always been a very deep sleeper.

DD on the other hand almost never nurses/nursed to sleep. Even as an infant she tended to pop off the breast before falling asleep. It really hasn't made much of a difference. She will also go to sleep for others, but she is actually harder to get to sleep then her brother who did nurse to sleep, even for others. Though I think that it is mostly personality. She is a far lighter sleeper then DS and will wake up if someone breathes or moves to close to her.

I have no clue if newbie will nurse to sleep or not, but I am hoping she/he does, because honestly it was almost easier for me to have DS nurse to sleep then have DD not. I've found that with both of mine though we don't really have many issues with others putting them to bed, so if we did have issues that would probably be a different story. Each child is different though so while one might like nursing to sleep, the next one might not all on their own.

[Nicole730]

I think it's a child preference, some babies will fall asleep easily on their own and some will not. My first nursed to sleep all the time. My second, prefers not to most times (which I still think of as a mircale!). It's nothing I did or didn't do.

[Jenica]

I'm on my first but she doesn't need to nurse to sleep. I normally nurse her in the morning before we get out of bed and this sets her up on a trend of nursing after naps instead of before. It works out that she's usually not hungry yet by the time she's ready for her first nap so we naturally developed other ways of getting her to sleep. For the first 3 mos we swaddled, sang to her, and rocked/bounced her. At around 3.5 mos we stopped swaddling and started giving her a lovey while we rocked and sang to her and by 4 mos we could just put her down with her lovey, give her her paci, turn on her mobile, and she would go to sleep most of the time. I do nurse her back to sleep during the night. She starts off the night in her crib and then wakes up when we go to bed and I nurse her back to sleep in bed with us and then she wakes to nurse through the night. I'd like to think her being so good at going to sleep is because of my awesome mothering skills but more likely she's just a good baby and the next will be a royal terror

[P.J.]

I need to reread The No-Cry books. I do know the methods there require quite some work and consistency, but I guess nearly everything in parenting does now doesn't it?

Anyway I have the same problem and it's becoming a real issue as DH, SIL and MIL all take care of DS sometimes. Most of the time when I'm not here he ends up screaming himself to sleep (in their arms while they desperately try to help him feel better ). It really sucks and I consequently do not go out of the house alone very often, unless for very short periods when he's awake.

[RaeDyCo]

Both my boys will let DH put them to sleep for naps or nighttime, even DS2 who is nursing. I think it is totally natural for a baby to nurse to sleep but some babes just won't do that. I have a massive oversupply so it was much harder for the boys to comfort nurse to sleep as they would just keep getting letdown after letdown

What we would do often is have me nurse, then when DS was drowsy, give him to DH and DH would rock / bounce him to sleep. Some nights I would do the bouncing, others it would be DH. DH does it WAY better than me and could put DS1 to sleep so much faster than I could. DS2 is way easier to put to sleep so both of us can bounce him to sleep.

[SuzieQ3417]

Originally Posted by P.J.

I need to reread The No-Cry books. I do know the methods there require quite some work and consistency, but I guess nearly everything in parenting does now doesn't it?

I agree with needing some consistency. I found it helpful to read about infant (or even adult) sleep cycles and sleep associations. Then you need to decide which associations you are comfortable with. For us, I did not want to have to nurse or have to be holding my babe EVERY time he needed to fall asleep. I didn't mind having to lay down next to him or patting/touching him in order for him to fall asleep, so long as it would also work when my husband (and by default hopefully grandparents and others) tried. Once you decide what you're comfortable with, you can use whatever measures you want to get your babe sleepy, but aim for only using the associations you're comfortable with for getting him from sleepy to asleep. Keep in mind you can pretty much do anything the first couple of months (including nursing to sleep) and it shouldn't impact their longterm associations (I think I read between 3-6 months is when they start forming the connections? I could be wrong).

So for us, I would nurse him until he was full and/or sleepy (eyes closed and relaxed, but still arousable), then I would delatch and set him in the bassinet/cosleeper next to our bed. This would often result in him waking up a bit, so I would pat, say "shh", and reswaddle him if necessary until he settled. Sometimes my husband would also help. There were certainly times I would deviate from this method, as it is SO convenient to side-lie nurse in bed while you snooze.

I will say that before we tried this we were either having to vigorously bounce him or I was nursing him into a milk-coma, and then we would tiptoe to the cosleeper to set him down and pray that he didn't wake up. Of course after an hour he would wake up and cry because he was wondering where the bouncing and/or boob was that helped him fall asleep. This resulted in a frustrated baby and frustrated parents. He seems happier (and by extension so are we!) now that he has a more consistent sleep routine.

I agree with other posters, that it will also depend on the personality of your baby. It's hard to say whether the above "method" worked for us because it's a good method, or because it fit our son's personality. Since he's our first, I have nothing to compare to.

[Nova0929]

This is all soo helpful, thank you! I'm definitely getting the point that "sleep is a learned behavior," but also that sleep depends on each child's personality. Really looking forward to seeing how we figure all this out!

[beebalmmama]

Originally Posted by Nicole730

I think it's a child preference, some babies will fall asleep easily on their own and some will not. My first nursed to sleep all the time. My second, prefers not to most times (which I still think of as a mircale!). It's nothing I did or didn't do.

That's my feeling and experience too. I TRIED to get ds 1 to fall asleep other than nursing and in other places besides my bed. I only became a real supporter of cosleeping because without it we were NOT sleeping. He had to nurse to sleep for the first 18 months until we night weaned.

I think the only thing I changed with ds 2 was to pass him off to his dad in the evening. But this was mainly because for the first 8-10 weeks ds 2 had a crying period in the evening and I couldn't take more than 20 minutes or so without a break. Ds 2 actually rarely/almost never nurses to sleep. He'd pop off right before and then I'd rock him down. Ds 2 also will sleep for naps in a pack n play, which I could never get my first ds to do.