help...what can I say to this???

[Cutie Patootie]

My "best" friend just sent me this...

I never realized that UTI's were a major problem. I am sure that many
>people and not willing to discuss this condition...with everyone. I would like to thank her
>for allowing me to share her experiences with everyone. I am sure that
>many
>of you will learn from her experience. - Patti
>_________________________________________________ _________________
>
>Dear Doctor McCullough:
>
>This is difficult to write but here goes.
>
>I had numerous bout of cystitis in my younger years. About the second day
>on our honeymoon I had a horrible dose that lasted for the whole
>month....we
>motored to CA, up the coast, and back home across Canada.....it was a
>miserable trip trying to find bathrooms every 10 minutes (it seemed) only
>to
>not really have to go, the discomfort....well, just the symptoms of a UTI.
>Lots of medication over the next 10 or more years because it kept
>recurring.
>
>Somehow, we discovered that I became infected from my husband. He was not
>circumcised and unless he was very meticulous in cleaning before
>intercourse, I developed another bout of cystitis. Ever since that
>discovery, I haven't had any more bouts. Years later when some neighbour
>woman happened to mention having trouble with cystitis I got up the courage
>to tell her about our situation. She later reported that she was OK after
>her husband did the same thing.
>
> If our situation could help someone else I'd be happy, even if
>embarrassed reporting it.
>
>Thanks again for all you do to get word out about so many things....it IS
>appreciated.

What can I say to my friend besides the foreskin was put there by God, and is intended to stay there.

Any advice?

[captain optimism]

I am editing this to say, see below.

[cottonwood]

Is she pro-circ?

Some women are no doubt more sensitive than others, and maybe that degree of cleanliness makes a big difference for them. Similarly, I have trouble if my husband neglects to wash his hands before we have sex. But I'm not suggesting he remedy that by cutting off his hands!

[cottonwood]

"An uncircumcized man has to wash."

Why? I never wash my vulva and vagina out, and as far as I know my husband's not getting infections from my lack of "cleanliness." Not that it's not possible, I suppose, I'm just saying that I don't see how it's just something that intact men must do, regardless of the circumstances.

[mattemma04]

//

[lise brit]

All right, here we go again.


I am not sure if you know this, but the study that is often cited when talking about UTI's is statistically invalid. The reason was that the control group and the reference group included different populations. One group (intact) was premature infants. The other (circ'ed) was full term babies. The fact that that there were more UTI's in the intact group was due to the babies being premature, not becasue they were intact.

Also, I have had several intact and one circ'ed partner and never had a problem with UTIs. It has nothing to do with being intact or circ'ed. In fact, Denmark who is a nation of intact males (less than 1% is circ'ed) has a lower rate of UTIs than the US.

Of course we should all wash and brush our teeth. And yes, it is considered good hygiene to wash your genitals for everyone, intact or circ'ed. But it has nothing to do woth the issue in question.

Hope this helps

Lise

[momto3boys]

My friend has had chronic bouts of cystitis. Her bf is circ'd.

I have had this. DH circ'd.

SIL had to take anti-biotics after sex because of this. DH is circ'd

It's bacteria. Not a foreskin.

[Sarah]

Hmmm... Am this question actually CITES that she was on her honeymoon? That in itself seems like a fishy "plant" IMHO... because there is actually a wives tale disorder called (drumroll)

"Honeymoon cystitis"... only during the era of sex before marriage people have forgotten to connect the incident with marriage.

I never heard of it before except one friend told me an unusual opposite story, she said that she ALWAYS got honeymoon sickness whenever she had a new sex partner EXCEPT for the one time she had a lover who was intact.

Anyway- here is a link: http://honeymoons.about.com/cs/femal...a/cystitis.htm


love Sarah

[polka123]

Honeymoon cystitis also came from GIO alot during your honeymoon.
I am the princess of chronic cystitis- 20 yrs
- have had long term BF's of cut/uncut-
infact, I got less infection w/uncut men who did no particular cleaning ritual.
ypu friend needs her urine cultured to see if SHE hasany underlying infections, then there's IVP's to see if there's something structurally wrong with her urinary tract, etc.

[Frankly Speaking]

Yup! It sounds fishy to me too. Sorry, but washing will not eliminate bacteria. Certainly, it will reduce it to some degree but it will still be there and in a very short time, it will reproduce rapidly to fill in any areas where it is absent. His washing had little if anything to do with her cystitis except the possibility that he gave her the initial infection. That would have nothing to do with a foreskin. It would have happened either way.

Likewise, once the bacteria is on her vulva and in her vagina, no amount of washing on his part will reduce the bacteria on her parts and it is far more likely for her to reinfect him than the reverse.

This whole story sounds like one of the many old wives tales I've heard about this issue propagated by people who want to promote circumcision to expectant mothers.

Edited to add: There was a woman that was telling me about her experiences with her husband who was intact. She had recurring bouts of yeast infections and her doctor told her that it was her husband who was causing them and that he should be circumcised. She told me that he was circumcised for her. She seemed that she was going to stop there so I asked her if that was the cure. She said "No, I kept having them and the doctor finally said it was my fat legs keeping air from getting down there." I then asked her "Did you lose any weight?" and she replied "No, I just deal with it." So, her husband was willing to have surgery for her but she couldn't back away from the table for herself. UGH!




Frank

[Teresa]

Ooooh, Frank--I could just scream when I read that kind of stuff!

BTW--I don't know, but to me, it would seem that a yeast infection and this 'cystitis' are two different things?

As for hygiene--I've always been told that genital hygiene for males and females is the same--the 'outside' can get washed with soap, but the 'inside' (i.e. labia, vulva, etc. and inside the foreskin) should only be rinsed with clear water to avoid both irritation and disturbing the natural balance of healthy bacteria.

Of course, if one's system is unbalanced to begin with. . .

[menudo]

Pure BS but to the average ignorant American it "must be true". So why did I get all my UTI's pre sexual activity? Wait, I got one after the fact but we were using CONDOMS-so does that count? OF course, that was a major UTI and the intern at the hospital said I must have AIDS. YEs, he actually said this to me.

A few months later the same hospital told me I had no reason to be depresed if I don't drink, use drugs, and wasn't getting beat down by my man... I guess if I came back high and a request to circumcise my man I would've gotten respect!

[elelvee]

Originally posted by Frankly Speaking
Edited to add: There was a woman that was telling me about her experiences with her husband who was intact. She had recurring bouts of yeast infections and her doctor told her that it was her husband who was causing them and that he should be circumcised. She told me that he was circumcised for her. She seemed that she was going to stop there so I asked her if that was the cure. She said "No, I kept having them and the doctor finally said it was my fat legs....

So the Doc(k) suggests surgery first and then simple remedies. Anybody quoting this as an example/or proof that circumcision doesn't help? no....

[cottonwood]

"She had recurring bouts of yeast infections and her doctor told her that it was her husband who was causing them and that he should be circumcised. She told me that he was circumcised for her. She seemed that she was going to stop there so I asked her if that was the cure. She said "No, I kept having them and the doctor finally said it was my fat legs keeping air from getting down there." I then asked her "Did you lose any weight?" and she replied "No, I just deal with it." So, her husband was willing to have surgery for her but she couldn't back away from the table for herself."

If the doctor was wrong about the circ, why believe him about the fat legs? He was an idiot all around. I suppose if she were skinny he would have thought to mention diet, loose cotton clothing, and fully drying after bathing? :

[Frankly Speaking]

Originally posted by Teresa
BTW--I don't know, but to me, it would seem that a yeast infection and this 'cystitis' are two different things?

Well, yes but in the context of this discussion, they are the same in that they can both be passed back and forth between sexual partners. It does absolutely no good to treat one partner and not treat the other. The untreated partner will still be infected and will re-infect the treated partner. Both partners must be treated regardless of whether it is a bacterial infection or a fungal infection.




Frank

[ldsapmom]

Such ignorance! My mom actually sent me on my honeymoon with a bottle of Macrobid because she herself has a chronic history of UTIs (and she has had more than one partner and circ and uncirc'd; for her it did not really make a difference which led her to believe it was more of a problem in her body). She even called it 'honeymoon cystitis.'

Crazy!

[mosschops]

for goodness sake!

I know that i keep harping on about this - but if this kind of rubbish was true then just about every woman in the UK would be wandering around with a UTI the whole time.

I have never in my life even SEEN a circ'd penis... and I've seen a few! I have also never in my life ever had a UTI, except for once when I was 10! (caused by running around all day in the fields in summer and not drinking enough).

Honestly...

[~Megan~]

Why is it so hard to have to pull back and rinse? Is that tiny inconvience worth cutting it off?
I really don't like to brush my teeth so I'm going to pull each of my baby's out so they don't have to go through the *hell* of brushing

[Xenogenesis]

Was the woman douching when she thought her dh wasn't clean?

[Sustainer]

My partner is intact, and he doesn't have to go through any kind of "cleansing ritual" before we have sex, and he has never infected me with anything.