3.5yo pooping pants everyday...need serious insight/help

[Oliver'sMom]

I posted about this a couple of weeks ago in "the childhood years" and didn't get much of a response, so I thought I'd try here since we have made zero progress.

Since ds2 was born ds1 has been consistently pooping in his pants. For the past 6 weeks ds1 has pooped in his pants everyday...often 2-3 times per day.

We did EC with ds1 and before the baby came he hadn't pooped anywhere but the toilet since he was 6 months old (besides times when he was sick or teething).

I know that this is attention seeking behavior. It's not easy having a new baby brother! I just don't know how to help him get past this.

He's responsible for cleaning himself up at this point. I was getting way too frustrated when I had to do it. He draws himself a bath, soaks in the tub and washes himself with soap. He then puts his dirty clothes in the washing machine. There are times when he doesn't even tell me he had an accident. I'll just hear the bath water running and know what happened.

When he poops his pants in public, we go straight home so he can clean himself up. Today we were at the much anticipated pumpkin patch and were all excited to pick out our pumpkins and go for a hay ride. We made sure ds1 went potty before we left. We asked him if he had to poop. He said he didn't, and peed in the potty. Right when we get to the pumpkin patch, he pooped his pants We had to go straight home and weren't able to get our pumpkins.

At this point his 3 month old brother is pooping in the potty more than he is.

DH thinks we should put him in diapers. I don't think that will help anything and I know ds1 would be really ashamed to wear a diaper. Plus, he goes to preschool twice a week and you must be toilet trained to attend. He's had a couple of accidents at school, but his teachers didn't notice and he didn't tell anyone. He just cleaned himself up when he got home

Do I just ride this out and hope it will pass on its own? We have a check up with the doctor scheduled for the 22nd of Nov. Should I bring this up to the doc then or schedule an earlier visit? Ds1 is not sick in any physical way that I can tell. He's just completely regressed in the pooping department.

[BetsyNY]

Gosh, he's so little...the fact that he's cleaning himself up because you were "too frustrated" makes me very sad for some reason. As far as being ashamed to wear diapers, trust me, he's already ashamed.

When he poops his pants in public, we go straight home so he can clean himself up.

This is punishment, no? Since you know he does this, wouldn't it just be easier to bring a change of clothes with you, so as not to exacerbate his shame?

It doesn't sound like you're doing a lot to reassure him that this is a phase and it will pass. Have you tried talking with him about it, in a loving way?

[Minxie]

Regression is perfectly natural at that age as their body grows and develops, especially when you add a new sibling to the mix. It also makes me sad that he is cleaning himself up and being punished for it at a time when he really needs some extra love and attention from you all but may not be able to verbalize that.

I definitely wouldn't put him back in diapers and I would discuss this with the school. Sitting around in his poop because he can't clean himself is just horribly sad to me. The school should be able to provide him with a place to clean himself and you can send along some flushable wet wipes or a washcloth and plastic bags.

I WOULD give him lots of extra empathetic love and attention. I would also put him on a regular poop schedule and take him to the toilet just as you would to potty-train him for peeing. Let him sit there with a book for a while and relax.

Lastly, I would talk to him and reassure him that this will pass. Nobody goes to college pooping their pants. Take off some of the pressure and see what happens.

[Minxie]

Oops!

[BellinghamCrunchie]

I felt sad for the little guy, too, when I read the post. I don't think he is aware until after the fact that it is happening. He's probably just as confused and bewildered as you are.

I don't know what the solution is, but I think its okay in this case to respond lovingly and with compassion. I know you're probably worried that will "reinforce" the behavior... but it really doesn't seem like its under his volitional control all that much, anyway.

[Oliver'sMom]

wow, I feel horrible now my poor guy

I thought that having him clean himself would help the situation. When I would clean him up before he would cry and ask to do it himself. He probably saw my frustration I guess man, I totally suck

We've been going home whenever he has an accident just because the mess is so much I honestly don't know how to clean him up properly without a bath or shower. I really don't think flushable wipes or a washcloth would be sufficient. I'll totally give it a try though.

Thanks for the replies. I knew I wasn't dealing with this the right way. I just didn't know what to do I'll love him through it.

[GandEmama]

I can see where others are coming from, but at the same time I don't think it's mean that you asked him to clean up after himself. I don't see that as a punishment but rather as a natural consequence to his pooping. How is asking him to clean up punishment? I can see it being punishment if it was done with a mean tone or something, but matter of factly asking a child to address their mess seems to also be quite respectful toward the child.

I think it's a good idea to help him and to assure him and to bring extra clothes when you are out so that you don't have to rush home, but on the whole I don't think it's horrible to ask him to clean up after himself. It seems to me it could be a positive thing if done with a supporting tone.

Hugs to you. It sounds like a hard situation.

[T-man's Mama]

Originally Posted by Oliver'sMom

wow, I feel horrible now my poor guy

I thought that having him clean himself would help the situation. When I would clean him up before he would cry and ask to do it himself. He probably saw my frustration I guess man, I totally suck

We've been going home whenever he has an accident just because the mess is so much I honestly don't know how to clean him up properly without a bath or shower. I really don't think flushable wipes or a washcloth would be sufficient. I'll totally give it a try though.

Thanks for the replies. I knew I wasn't dealing with this the right way. I just didn't know what to do I'll love him through it.

Aw mama, love yourself thru it too. I can't imagine how frustrating and/or bewildering that must be, after three years of EC, only to now be stuck in a rut of changing soiled underpants every day (for many weeks!). I feel sorry for you both, as it seems he is as confused as you. Hope this resolves itself soon, and that you can continue to maintain your loving, nonjudgmental attitude until then! Best of luck.

[Pumpkin_Pie]

I am right in the thick of this myself with my DS who is 3.5. I don't have a new baby, so our situation is a bit different, but I tried nearly everything with him. He has been potty trained almost completely since February of this year with a few very minor setbacks. I had him clean himself up, we missed fun events because he had pooped in his pants and I didn't have extra clothes and wipes to clean him up, I tried switching out of his coveted princess and dog undies and into plain white ones so the beloved ones wouldn't get stained and nothing seemed to help. Finally after much frustration, I put him into pull-ups. I said that we could go pick out some fun new underwear if he could keep his pull-ups clean and dry for a while and he agreed. I was so scared to "shame" him by putting him in pull-ups (diapers), but really it has seemed to relieve the pressure. I literally just put him in them full time yesterday and he has had his first 24 hours without an accident in weeks. He checked about pooping every time he peed on the potty, and he never complained once about wearing his pull-up. He was even dry last night overnight.

I say do whatever you need to do to relieve the pressure off him. It definitely helped over here.

[JudiAU]

If you'd son can easily and completely take care of his cleanup needs then I don't think that, In and of itself is a punishment. It could be, if the accident is met with disgust or disdain. But it doesn't have to be. Being able to care for personal needs is a grate type of Independence. And I don't think going home when an u expected accident happens is a punishment per se either. Poop I. Underpants can be very hard to clean.

But I do think that it sounds unintentional. And that your son is under stress and needs your gentle response. It is hard to get a sibling. I really think I would persist with the underpants. Pullups or diapers are likely,y to prolong the issue.

I really suggest having some dai,y potty time with stories, wake up, around lunch, and before bath. Maybe it could be you ready stories or telling them. Happy and relaxing with so e fouled time if he needs it. I know "daily potty ti e" is not how he was trained and is t ec but it might give you all a little relief.

[Oliver'sMom]

Thanks everyone!

ds1 is fiercely independent...always has been. I never would force him to clean himself up. He honestly wants to do it himself and I thought it would help him feel like he had some control. He does a really good job with it....usually.

Dh and I had a nice long chat with ds1 about this this morning. We told him that we understand what he's going through and that we're here for him to help in any way he needs. We packed up a big bag of extra clothes to keep in the car along with wipes so we won't be left unprepared in the future. I also got him some special hand soap and flushable wipes last night to use at home...goes along with the independence thing (he hates to have someone wipe him and always wants to do it himself). He was thrilled about the soap and wipes and actually pooped in the toilet and wiped himself and washed his hands this morning all by himself! This is the first time in 6 weeks!!

We'll see how the rest of the day goes.

Thanks again!

[BellinghamCrunchie]

Originally Posted by Oliver'sMom

Thanks everyone!

ds1 is fiercely independent...always has been. I never would force him to clean himself up. He honestly wants to do it himself and I thought it would help him feel like he had some control. He does a really good job with it....usually.

Dh and I had a nice long chat with ds1 about this this morning. We told him that we understand what he's going through and that we're here for him to help in any way he needs. We packed up a big bag of extra clothes to keep in the car along with wipes so we won't be left unprepared in the future. I also got him some special hand soap and flushable wipes last night to use at home...goes along with the independence thing (he hates to have someone wipe him and always wants to do it himself). He was thrilled about the soap and wipes and actually pooped in the toilet and wiped himself and washed his hands this morning all by himself! This is the first time in 6 weeks!!

We'll see how the rest of the day goes.

Thanks again!

That sounds so wonderful!

[Minxie]

That sounds awesome! Is it possible that he felt he wasn't getting clean enough unless he was at home? Maybe the wipes will help him at school and out in public, also. Best of luck to you all!

[kcparker]

Originally Posted by Oliver'sMom

wow, I feel horrible now my poor guy

I thought that having him clean himself would help the situation. When I would clean him up before he would cry and ask to do it himself. He probably saw my frustration I guess man, I totally suck

We've been going home whenever he has an accident just because the mess is so much I honestly don't know how to clean him up properly without a bath or shower. I really don't think flushable wipes or a washcloth would be sufficient. I'll totally give it a try though.

Thanks for the replies. I knew I wasn't dealing with this the right way. I just didn't know what to do I'll love him through it.

I am going to give you some tea and sympathy here because my EC'ed from birth son STILL pees his pants at least once most days if an adult does not remind him to go potty hourly and/or physically guide him to a potty if he's engaged in play. You do not suck. You spent years helping him with staying clean and dry by ECing him, and that is a huge amount of work.

I think that it's appropriate for 3 1/2 year olds to have some hand in cleaning up their own messes, potty or otherwise. My son is expected to help clean if he spills water on the floor or dumps out a huge bag of blocks, and pottying isn't any different - he has to put the wet undies in the laundry and help dress himself again.

There is no one right way - if he TOLD you he wanted to clean himself up, do you insist on doing it yourself anyway? No. I think the only rule of thumb should be to avoid getting angry with him, and maybe increase the amount of suggestions to potty that you make...

[Oliver'sMom]

I really think this was an independence thing. He wanted complete control over his pottying, and was holding it until it was too late because he didn't want anyone in the bathroom helping him.

He's had one minor accident since my last post, but it was nothing compared to before. He was fully eliminating himself in his pants before, but this time he only went a very little amount then did the rest in the toilet.

He seems way more relaxed and confident since I showed him the bag of clothes in the car and talked to him about how it's ok to have accidents etc... It's really crazy how something so simple as that could make such a huge difference. Why didn't I do this earlier???

I think it's a really good idea to have the flushable wipes with when we go out as well. I'll have to buy some more and put them in his bag. He really seems to love those.

[LynnS6]

Originally Posted by Oliver'sMom

I really think this was an independence thing. He wanted complete control over his pottying, and was holding it until it was too late because he didn't want anyone in the bathroom helping him.

He's had one minor accident since my last post, but it was nothing compared to before. He was fully eliminating himself in his pants before, but this time he only went a very little amount then did the rest in the toilet.

He seems way more relaxed and confident since I showed him the bag of clothes in the car and talked to him about how it's ok to have accidents etc... It's really crazy how something so simple as that could make such a huge difference. Why didn't I do this earlier???

I think it's a really good idea to have the flushable wipes with when we go out as well. I'll have to buy some more and put them in his bag. He really seems to love those.

Sometimes it does help to have an outside perspective. It sounds to me like your son is both fiercely independent and perhaps a perfectionist. Those are going to be great qualities when he's an adult, but it's hard when you're 3!

What I would take from this is that my child needs explicit permission to 'fail', and the tools to help make things better. You'd given him all the tools already (no way would my 3 1/2 year old son EVER been able to clean himself up!).

We spend a lot of time telling stories about things we did wrong (especially as kids). It also really helps my kids to hear stories about things that make us nervous and even the bad dreams we have sometimes. When we make mistakes, we point it out.

[Oliver'sMom]

Originally Posted by LynnS6

Sometimes it does help to have an outside perspective. It sounds to me like your son is both fiercely independent and perhaps a perfectionist. Those are going to be great qualities when he's an adult, but it's hard when you're 3!

What I would take from this is that my child needs explicit permission to 'fail', and the tools to help make things better. You'd given him all the tools already (no way would my 3 1/2 year old son EVER been able to clean himself up!).

We spend a lot of time telling stories about things we did wrong (especially as kids). It also really helps my kids to hear stories about things that make us nervous and even the bad dreams we have sometimes. When we make mistakes, we point it out.

Yes, you're right on! He's an absolute perfectionist. He often doesn't do things until he knows he can do them perfectly.

He loves to wake up at the crack of dawn, make himself toast with butter and jam, then feed and water the dog (Just another tidbit to show how he loves his independence).

Thanks for the idea of talking about things dh and I did as kids....I really think that would be helpful for ds1. I often call him my little old man in a boy suit because he really is just that. He has extremely high expectations of himself and those around him. He's very tender hearted as well. I love him to bits