Unschooled, unscreened, undiagnosed

[habuchaparty]

Hello,
We're new on this forum. We live in Wisconsin. My partner and I are homeschooling our 6-year-old twins, who were adopted at birth from Chicago and are healing from a lot of birth and adoption trauma. In fact, our whole family is focusing most of our energy on our collective healing journey. We are working with the Post Institute and Beyond Consequences (Heather Forbes).

We had planned to homeschool/unschool even before adopting. Now, in our adoption healing community (I guess you would call it), we encounter many families who have pulled their children out of school because of emotional issues and are now finding more peace, healing and effective learning through unschooling. Most of these kids had major educational and social challenges and have been diagnosed with ADHD, PTSD, learning disabilities, etc. Our kids don't really fit this mold, because they have not been further traumatized by dysfunctional school situations.

Then there's our local homeschooling community. Here, most of the kids are precocious, gifted, working beyond where they would be if they were in school. Our kids don't fit this pattern, either, although it doesn't really get in their way socially.

We have been reluctant to have our children tested (well, we did try once, but our son imploded emotionally, and our daughter refused to enter the lady's office), or to have them psychologically diagnosed. They have not been in any kind of school or class situation because of extreme separation anxiety. My dad really wishes we would get them screened by the school district so we can take advantage of "special education" resources. My guess is that they would be labeled learning-disabled in some way.

Our son and daughter are not easy kids to homeschool. Because of their fears, they don't think they want to try anything new, are extremely distrustful and defiant if they think I'm getting academic, and are very resistant to experiences in the natural world (until they actually get out there, then they have fun). They can learn in circumstances that are fun and low-pressure with LOTS of humor, and they can learn to do just about anything with their bodies. So I try to give them as many experiences as possible that fit these two criteria, to build their confidence

Here's my question: Is anyone else out there homeschooling kids who might be diagnosed with a learning disability but who have not been tested, diagnosed, or in school? Or is anyone homeschooling kids with emotional challenges that require creative solutions? If so, I'd love to hear about your experiences, concerns, ideas and resources.

I'm going to post this in the homeschooling forum, as well.

Peace,
Lia

[queenjane]

I'm glad you posted.

I am in the process of adopting my eight yr old foster daughter, placed with me in June. At that time i thought i would homeschool her as soon as i was able to (when adoption petitions are filed, in my state, which unfortunately hasnt happened yet)...my older son was mostly radically unschooled and i'm a firm believer in that lifestyle.

After spending a few months living w/ my daughter...i dont think i can do it. I'm not sure homeschooling even with an unschooling bent is good for our relationship. She seems to really thrive on the social aspect of school (even though she sometimes has conflict with other students) and doesnt seem to mind the academic part (even though she is disruptive in the classroom and sometimes seems clueless as to what she is supposed to be doing) and i dont think i can provide the same level of contact with children that she craves.

One thing that hold me back, too, is that with my son...he was (well still is...but he's in a regular high school now, his choice, long story) a super bright, inquisitive, open minded kid with a real love of learning, not "book learning" but, like, he'd sit down and watch some documentary on whatever subject, he and i could talk for hours about all sorts of things whether history, politics, religion...even if we'd talk about Pokemon or Everquest or game design we could still have these amazing conversations, making all sorts of connections to the world beyond those subjects. I knew that no matter what he would "be okay", and learn whatever he needed to know when he needed to know it.

I cant really count on all that with my daughter. I suspect she has some learning disabilities, possibly even some damage related to prenatal exposure stuff (though i have no "proof" of this.) Mostly, she wants to talk about justin bieber and the disney channel, and its hard for me to get excited about those interests the same way i did about my son's interest in sword/sorcery, videogames, game design, art, etc. She is very concrete, so we are reading Harry Potter but such a difference than with my son. Hard to explain, but there it is.

I know that this wouldnt be an issue with unschooling really...but when i assist her with her homework, its very very frustrating for me. Its not that she doesnt want to do it (though sometimes thats the case and will result in a half hour long tantrum) its that she doesnt get it at all. And i'm not a teacher...so it baffles me when i ask her to do what i think is a REALLY easy problem and she is giving me nonsense answers. I just feel like it may be too much to have the entire weight of her educational life resting on my shoulders. She is in a really great school with teachers who want to help, which is good. And, i mean...i hate school. Really...i'm so anti authority, that the very idea of school....i dont like it. And yet i feel very supported by her teachers, and frankly...our day with my younger two goes much more smoothly when she is gone for eight hours.

So....i dont know. Someone else i know online mentioned the Forbes training and how great it is....i'll need to look into it. I do know there is ALOT of negative stuff out there about Bryan Post so it gives me pause.

[Smithie]

We are working towards a foster/adopt placement in a state where foster parents are allowed to homeschool with the consent of their case worker.

I don't plan to accept any placement where homeschooling is not allowed, but I'm not 100 percent sure that we'll be choosing to homeschool immediately. Remedial services through the school are one thing that might make us delay, as is a desire for our son to build/maintain relationships with people of his own ethnicity, if that should happen to differ from ours. We also don't want him to be overwhelmed with huge changes all at once, any more that he has to be.

Ultimately, though, classical homeschooling is our lifestyle choice, and I'm not going to have our adopted son going through 12 years of a school system that we consider not good enough for our biokids! Even if homeschooling was never a good fit for him on account of innate personality or early childhood deprivation, we would find a way for him to attend a school that was teaching a classical curriculum.

OP, as a homeschooler who has been down the road of getting a SN child tested by the public school system in the hope of receiving useful services - for us, it was not worth it. For other parents I know, it was totally worth it and the transition to public schooling with services really, really helped their child make progress. I think it's worth at least talking to your school district and seeing what their process is.

[SundayCrepes]

Our daughter was adopted at birth. At about a year I picked up a speech delay and she has been getting speech therapy since. It turns out that speech delays are common in her biological family. So is the need for special education.

I frequent the learning at home and unschooling boards here. On one of them there was a discussion about how kids with reading disabilities need more help and that unschooling (or was it just homeschooling) was not enough. I decided to do some research. I learned that a speech delay COULD be a sign of a reading disability. I also learned about the neurological conditions of people with dyslexia and that if children get intervention at a young enough age you can actually restructure their brains so that they grow up with normal brains instead of dyslexic brains.

I learned a lot from "Overcoming dyslexia" http://www.amazon.com/Overcoming-Dys...8297210&sr=8-1 until I was offended by the author stating parents should not be the primary teachers, that job should be left to the professionals.

I also read "Reading Disabilities: Beating the Odds" http://www.amazon.com/Reading-Disabi...8297252&sr=1-1 I didn't think it had much more to say on reading than overcoming dyslexia did, though it had some good points.

I had the good fortune to meet with a mom who homeschools some of her kids but has one son in school. He has severe dyslexia and some other issues. She doesn't feel she could homeschool him so he goes to a school (that she does not like.) The school really failed him so she had him tested privately. It cost $2,000. He is now receiving assistance from a reading disability person (I don't know the title) for $6,000 a year. This woman has helped her son learn to read. The school did not do that.

I called this intervention person and asked what I should do about my 2 year old. I don't know that she'll have any learning disabilities. I wanted to know when we would test and if there was anything we could do now.

She said to watch our daughter. If she seems to not be learning the same stuff that other kids the same age are learning we should contact a specialist. She also suggested we NOT have her tested. Rather, we simply get her intervention and use the money we would have done on testing to pay for one on one intervention. The interventionist will evaluate her needs and respond accordingly. Having a diagnosis will not really effect what interventions are done. (I didn't think to ask if we would qualify for more services through the school or elsewhere if we had her tested, but given her recommendation, I think it's the best choice for us to make.)

When our daughter is 3 she will no longer qualify for early intervention and speech therapy (if she still needs it) will be transferred to the school district. I asked her what she thought about that. She is not a big fan of the school district so advised we continue with therapy privately (since our insurance pays most of the costs, this is what we will do.) She also did not think much of the assessments done by the schools.

I asked her if there is anything we can do at this age that will help. Fortunately we are doing most of what she recommended:

Read A LOT.
Do sound games "Silly Sam the snake did somersaults after Saturday's siesta."
Do rhyming.
Do alliterations (she recommended Rafi songs for this. I am buying books on alliterations and tongue twisters.)
Make sure they do well in gross motor activities since that will enable them to do fine motor activities.
Make sure they do will with fine motor activities since that will enable them to write.
Make it fun and don't force anything.
She recommended the book "Road to the Code" http://www.amazon.com/Road-Code-Phon...8298329&sr=1-1

She recommended the international dyslexia conference which is happening this week 125 miles from my house. I just can't afford it. You can learn more at www.interdys.org

She said any of the products at www.linguisystems.com would be good. Especially the "sounds abound program" http://www.linguisystems.com/itemdetail.php?id=10068

This woman was one of the co-developers of the Woodcock-Johnson assessment tool which, I've been told by a friend who teaches special ed, is THE assessment tool.

I've also been doing an ages and stages questionnaire http://pages.uoregon.edu/asqstudy/ on her monthly, which is how I discovered the speech delay. The last few times I did this she came out normal. The woman said to keep doing this so we have a sense of how she's doing.

Our plan for our daughter is to do all the normal stuff we do (which is heavy on language) and watch her (which will include the asq.) If we think she is having difficulties we will seek out private intervention to augment what we do at home. I am grateful she will not be labeled as "special ed" as I think this can be really damaging to a child's self-esteem and their natural desire to learn. If we need to seek intervention, I will learn from the interventionist what I can do to facilitate my daughter's learning and we will do this in an unschooly way. I will make sure that whoever we hire will be someone that is supportive of our homeschooling choice and that we will learn to work as partners for my daughter's best interest.

[heatherdeg]

I'm homeschooling my bioson whose issues are similar to the OP in terms of resisting learning (with a vengence) and other behavioral issues. He has some attachment problems resulting from developmental issues that kept him from knowing we were even in the room until he was nearly 2yo. It's less common to hear about attachment problems outside of the adoptive community (in fact, as a fp and now ap, I was only able to find help for my son by having been part of that community). And really, the only place I saw reference to this was in the book "Beyond Consequences"--ONE paragraph, but enough to let me know I wasn't insane. But he does have ADHD and fine motor issues (despite being raised in a loving, attentive home--these are not always the result of environmental dysfunction)

I will say that there are many educational pedagogies that believe that academics under the age of 7 or 8yo is not age appropriate... so I'm not pushing it at the moment.

The other thing is, many states offer up SpEd services to homeschooled kids but WI doesn't explicitly grant it. That means you MAY get help through the district, but you may not. However, if you get a diagnosis, you may qualify for home instruction and therefore SpEd services. Of course, this is assuming you think you want/need this.

I'm personally not going to worry about academics for my 6-1/2yo (would be first grade) until next year. He will learn way more comprehensively when he's able to take it in willingly. Right now, we're focusing on his social/emotional needs and building that foundation. His foundation may take longer to build.

As for the other local homeschooled kids, kids who are ahead/gifted are special needs kids, too. Too much of this country doesn't realize this, but they are. They're just not a protected class. So it's not surprising that you find them in and amongst homeschoolers. That being said, you really need the social interaction and environment (unless you can find it elsewhere--church groups or other groups) and since your kids aren't inhibited socially by this--SCORE!! To be honest, your own kids might be working well ahead of where they would be in public school, too.

It's just my own .02, but at their age and given their struggles, I'm not sure I'd worry yet about academics and just try to ease them into learning through stories (see Charlotte Mason's living books which might sneak learning up on them through stories) and take it from there if you're really worried about it.

I'd also ask your attachment therapists what they recommend to other clients in similar shoes. Surely they've been in this position before...?

[Diane B]

Our adopted daughter has experienced challenges with grief/loss, trauma, and mild attachment issues, and honestly, she functioned best at daycare and school and worst at home. Since it was her relationship with us that was most charged for her, I really felt that being away from us part of the time gave her a chance to thrive and be herself without the extra emotional drama and issues. It also gave us a break, which we sorely needed.

Fortunately, we were able to find therapeutic help, and she's now doing great at home AND at school. You seem very committed to your unschooling path, so I don't know if this is helpful, but I just thought I'd share. I think queenjane's words are well-taken: we have our ideas about how we want to raise our kids, but then they surprise us with what they actually need, and those two things don't always align perfectly.

[SundayCrepes]

Originally Posted by heatherdeg

I will say that there are many educational pedagogies that believe that academics under the age of 7 or 8yo is not age appropriate... so I'm not pushing it at the moment.

I believe this, but the stuff I read about restructuring the dyslexic child's brain really has me left wondering what the best choice is for kids who learn differently. I guess I'd love information from countries who delay academics.

[heatherdeg]

Originally Posted by SundayCrepes

I believe this, but the stuff I read about restructuring the dyslexic child's brain really has me left wondering what the best choice is for kids who learn differently. I guess I'd love information from countries who delay academics.

The most successful is Finland. You might start there.

My son is absolutely NOT a mainstream learner. I'm finding that delaying academics is undoubtedly serving him better. But I agree: it's a case-by-case decision. I just didn't want the OP to think that it was CRITICAL for her kids to be academically challenged right now.

[annethcz]

My adopted DS was almost 5 when he left Ethiopia and joined our family. At the time, we were a homeschooling family. DS had a lot of attachment and trust issues to work through, as well as a new language to learn, to say nothing of academics. I did not push academics for him at all, although I did work with him consistently in a gentle manner. I think this was most definitely to his benefit. DS was able to learn and explore on his level, which would have undoubtedly have been considered delayed by mainstream standards. As DS got older, I did expect more of him academically, and he was able to do more as he adapted to his new world and matured. After a few years in our home, we did enroll our kids in school (it's a very small charter school). By that time he was below average, but not to the point where extra services were recommended. DS is now 10 and still tests below average on standardized tests. But he's leaps and bounds ahead of where he started. And I still believe that keeping him home for the first few years was best for him.

[habuchaparty]

Thank you for your thoughtful reply. It's very helpful.
Lia

[Whistler]

We're a homeschooling (unschooling-ish) family and we're bringing a daughter home from Ethiopia next year who is SN. I really hope to be able to homeschool her too but I'm expecting resistance because I am not "taking advantage of all the resources." I'm thinking I may need to get some schooling and actually become a certified teacher of her disability, but that might not be a bad idea anyway.

We'll have to see when she gets here what her personality is like and what works best for her.

For you and your kiddos, should you have them tested and diagnosed? Well, that depends what you want. It could be helpful if you feel like they are not progressing as they should. But if you are happy with their progress and learning, it kind of doesn't seem necessary, maybe? Or perhaps in the future when they are more mature they could handle the testing process? Just throwing out ideas...

[flightgoddess]

Just lurking in here, but your post caught my eye. Just my 2 cents, having worked in educational settings and toutoring kids.

FOr some kids, being in a different learning environment  may be beneficial. An example, my sister tried to do somethings at home with her preschooler, and wasn't having much luck. Job change, and he had to be enrolled in preschool two days a week. Now he's coming back doing tons of things she had tried to teach him. His type and personality are the kind that he needs another 'authority' to validate things, or see other kids his age doing something and then he's motivated to try something new.

I strongly reccommend getting them screened somehow, you might have to do it slowly, in increments over various visits, or maybe have someone come to your home, instead of an office. Because if they do have a processing disorder or learning disability, the other people are trained to see it and have resources for teaching those kids, or teaching you how to teach those kids. Like dislexia for example, if one of your kids is dislexic there are different methods for teaching them to read and decode, that are very different from the traditional way kids learn to read. They may be better able to define if your children are auditory, sight, tactile, large motor learning styles, etc. If you know that your child needs tactile sensations to learn, then you can get physical objects, like for math for example. To learn a triangle, feel a triangle with their hands, trace the triangle, etc, until they are able to understand the triangle, recognize the triangle from a picture or reproduce from your word Also,  get information and training in those areas that your children need(take some classes at the university?) if you really do want to homeschool.

Maybe Montessori would be an option, their methods are very different from traditional public schools.