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Low letter grades in 1st grade?!  

post #1 of 80
10/29/10 at 8:47pm
Thread Starter 
Nevermind, I'm fine with it... let's move on.
post #2 of 80
10/29/10 at 8:57pm
I think letter grades in first grade are unreasonable in general, but if they do exist, I don't think they should be artificially inflated -- if he earned a C a C should be reported.
post #3 of 80
10/29/10 at 9:04pm
Thread Starter 
Quote:
Originally Posted by chickabiddy View Post
I think letter grades in first grade are unreasonable in general, but if they do exist, I don't think they should be artificially inflated -- if he earned a C a C should be reported.
I agree with you if it was say, spelling or math where it can easily be graded for right or wrong but handwriting seems like a gray area, especially with a first grader who is left handed and comparatively to the other children in his class doesn't seem to be any messier but perhaps is having some trouble using the correct formation of each letter which is typical with left handed people.
post #4 of 80
10/29/10 at 9:41pm
A C is average and if his handwriting is average, and needs support that the teacher and you have a hard time giving him, and if he forgets punctuation and capitals a lot like the average first grader, then a C is what the grade should be. A's and B's should be saved for work that is truly above or very above average and it doesn't sound like your son is there in handwriting that is legible but not neat and missing the conventions he is expected to include.

I think that it may help him more if you tell him you are happy with the grade because you know he did his best and move on rather than dwell and show any signs of being upset. I am appalled at the thought of honor roll for a kindergarten child. They don't even start grades until fourth grade in my dd's school district (a policy her charter school is also following) and they don't announce them and make a competition that makes other children feel badly about their work.
post #5 of 80
10/30/10 at 12:03am
Quote:
Originally Posted by One_Girl View Post
A C is average and if his handwriting is average, and needs support that the teacher and you have a hard time giving him, and if he forgets punctuation and capitals a lot like the average first grader, then a C is what the grade should be. A's and B's should be saved for work that is truly above or very above average and it doesn't sound like your son is there in handwriting that is legible but not neat and missing the conventions he is expected to include.

I think that it may help him more if you tell him you are happy with the grade because you know he did his best and move on rather than dwell and show any signs of being upset. I am appalled at the thought of honor roll for a kindergarten child. They don't even start grades until fourth grade in my dd's school district (a policy her charter school is also following) and they don't announce them and make a competition that makes other children feel badly about their work.

I agree with the above post.

Our K-2nd do NI (needs improvement) GL (grade level) AG (above grade level). With space for notations and explanations. Starting in 3rd they get number and letter grades.

They also use Guided Reading and certain letter level books are at different grade levels. The 'level' is noted on the report card.

I DO think that if they are grading and a C is a C---average. Being a lefty will make it harder, but not impossible for you DC. I would also ask to look at the rebus they use for 'grading' handwriting. I am sure they have a scale that is point based and certain number of points leads to the grades.


That is how I have seen most written language graded in order to prevent subjectivity. We also had two teachers use the same rebus on kids writing in order to make sure it is accurate.

Ask. See what the criteria is. Talk to your son---if he is motivated ( as he should be) to improve he will know what he needs to do to get an A or B. Make sure you recognize if he is practicing and working hard. As and Bs should not always be easy.

I don think K-2 should be 'graded' , but if it is there is little you can do about it since it is most likely a district policy.
post #6 of 80
10/30/10 at 12:45am
It may be unreasonable to give a 1st grader letter grades, but if they do then a "C" is not unreasonable. As a pp said, I would find out the grading criteria and see if your ds is motivated to improve to that criteria.

My school does both types of grading in 1st grade; an overall letter grade in 4 subjects and the (exceeds grade level, sufficient, needs improvement...).
post #7 of 80
10/30/10 at 12:56am
What on earth is "average" handwriting? And why on earth would anyone need to have better than average handwriting? If a kid is legible--good enough. If a kid writes like the angels themselves were guiding the pen-- encourage them to create art with their writing and write a nice note in their report card about how pretty they write.

A "C" in handwriting is meaningless. It's even less helpful than other grades.

Oh, hang on, I do know one way that a letter grade could have actual meaning. It could be in reference to what quantity of various handwriting assignments were completed. But even then, it'd be better addressed in a parent-teacher conference than in a report card.
post #8 of 80
10/30/10 at 8:06am
Thread Starter 
Quote:
Originally Posted by sapphire_chan View Post
What on earth is "average" handwriting? And why on earth would anyone need to have better than average handwriting? If a kid is legible--good enough. If a kid writes like the angels themselves were guiding the pen-- encourage them to create art with their writing and write a nice note in their report card about how pretty they write.

A "C" in handwriting is meaningless. It's even less helpful than other grades.

Oh, hang on, I do know one way that a letter grade could have actual meaning. It could be in reference to what quantity of various handwriting assignments were completed. But even then, it'd be better addressed in a parent-teacher conference than in a report card.
Yeah, that's pretty much exactly how I feel. I DO understand the above and he IS average so I guess a C is right. But It just seems like grading on handwriting seems a little ridiculous to me... my husband has absolute chicken scratch. Had they graded him in school for handwriting, he undoubtedly would have failed. My son's handwriting is already neater then his fathers... so it's hard for me to imagine giving a C to a 7 year old. Then again, I think my problem might be with the whole letter grades in general. It just seems like giving an "average" at that age might discourage them. At this age, they all want to be GREAT and don't quite understand when they get a low letter grade when they are trying... and he is. He's just got a few things stacked against him when it comes to handwriting.
post #9 of 80
10/30/10 at 9:03am
[QUOTE=sapphire_chan;15999275]What on earth is "average" handwriting? And why on earth would anyone need to have better than average handwriting? If a kid is legible--good enough. If a kid writes like the angels themselves were guiding the pen-- encourage them to create art with their writing and write a nice note in their report card about how pretty they write.

A "C" in handwriting is meaningless. It's even less helpful than other grades.[QUOTE]

I would imagine that "average" in this context is average expectations for a first grader - basic letter formation, correct use of capital vs lower case letters, spacing, use of some punctuation (periods yes, commas not expected). There is nothing wrong with letting a parent know that a child needs additional work in a particular area. Why else have a report card if a teacher can only say that everybody is doing well in every subject area? THAT would be meaningless. DD's handwriting has improved immensely in these first two months of first grade. She is also a lefty. But the teacher has given her tips on how much space to leave between words, how to better form her letters - things that were not corrected in kindy but are worked on more in first grade.

Regarding the issue of letter grades, my first instinct is to say that is ridiculous at that age (not sure what we get at DD's school), but do the letters really mean that much different than some of the other types of grading in lower grades ("needs improvement", "satisfactory" etc.)? It is a 5-point scale, whereby there are below-average, average and above-average ranges.

I would focus more on how to get your son the help he needs if you think he needs different instruction to improve his work. Yes, left-hand writing is a challenge, but it does not have to be a barrier to learning how to write well. At the end of the day, it may be an area where he is destined to be a chicken-scratcher no matter how hard he tries, or maybe he will eventually have beautiful writing with different instruction. Either way, my focus would be on supporting my child to do the best that they can within their own limits of their abilities. And use the grades as a guide to understand areas where there is potential room for improvement.
post #10 of 80
10/30/10 at 9:45am
Thread Starter 
[QUOTE=amma_mama;15999627]
Quote:
Originally Posted by sapphire_chan View Post
I would focus more on how to get your son the help he needs if you think he needs different instruction to improve his work. Yes, left-hand writing is a challenge, but it does not have to be a barrier to learning how to write well. At the end of the day, it may be an area where he is destined to be a chicken-scratcher no matter how hard he tries, or maybe he will eventually have beautiful writing with different instruction. Either way, my focus would be on supporting my child to do the best that they can within their own limits of their abilities. And use the grades as a guide to understand areas where there is potential room for improvement.
I guess this is where my problem is... if some people are just destined to write messy, is it really fair to grade that with actual letter grades? I mean I understand some people can just NOT be good at math/reading/etc but you can study/tutor/etc on those things and eventually DO better even if you still aren't great in the subject. If someone is destined to be a messy writer, is it fair to judge them against someone who will someday be an incredibly neat writer? My husband is a chicken scratch writer, I am incredibly neat and am constantly complimented on my handwriting. Would it have been fair when we were kids and learning to write to compare the two? I don't think so... even when he slows down, takes his time and really pays attention, he doesn't write as nicely as I do. It's just not in the cards for him and I think it would be incredibly unfair to compare the two.... so to say my son is "average" compared to other children just doesn't seem unnecessary. I think if we can grade Art a pass/fail then we should be able to grade handwriting on a pass/fail system as well. Either you can read it and he writes legibly or you can't make it out and it's illegible. I think that system would make more sense. Perhaps having a different grade all together for punctuation and grammar. I don't know, it just seems a little ridiculous to me.
post #11 of 80
10/30/10 at 10:02am
I understand where you are coming from. But I just think grades at that age are really more for the parents to understand where their kid is and, for me, the more information, the better. They are not grades to get into college, after all - they surely will not affect his record. I am not sure how less information for you would help you with your son. Maybe he is not, in fact, destined to be a chicken-scratcher and just needs more patient instruction on how to round out his letters, which automatically makes it more legible to others?

If you think that it is not important for him to work on this and/or expect that he will improve at his own pace, then leave it be. But the teacher has a standard form she must fill out to assess each of her students and take it for what it is, helpful or not. Again, my focus would be on getting your son the support he may need in this area, as you alluded to his left-handedness and lack of adequate instruction by the right-handed people in his life being culprits. Focus on this rather than the grade. This can potentially be fixed with the right inputs/people. If there is still no improvement or he just needs the benefit of time and greater maturity, then go with the flow.

On the other hand, if it is an area that does not concern you, the parent, at this point, then just move on and focus on other things. There were some areas on DD's report card in Kindy that I though, who really cares at this point? And I did not make an extra effort to "help" her in that area (I think that it was, in fact, regarding her writing!). So I took it as an evaluation of where she is at and did what I thought appropriate with the information at the time. This year, if she is receives an average or below average score, I may use the information differently.
post #12 of 80
10/30/10 at 10:13am
But the OP has seen her kid's writing and would know if he were wRItiN9 liKetHis
post #13 of 80
10/30/10 at 10:26am
Yes, but some parents may not know whether it is age appropriate or something to work on at this point. A teacher assesses the student, not the parent.

As for types of grades, I would be more bothered by a pass/fail system, rather than a "needs improvement" or below average score.

As for the idea of an honors roll in Kindy, let alone elementary school, that, I think, is really inappropriate.
post #14 of 80
10/30/10 at 11:05am
Quote:
Originally Posted by amma_mama View Post
As for the idea of an honors roll on Lindy, let alone elementary school, that, I think, is really inappropriate.
: I missed that. That is horrible.
post #15 of 80
10/30/10 at 12:41pm
I think you should take your concerns to the people who make the district grading requirements in your school. Teachers are usually told what areas to grade in and then they do it. It sounds like your son has a teacher who grades according to what kids actually earn because that is what teachers are supposed to do when they grade unless a child has an IEP. You may or may not be able to get something changed in that area. I would be livid about the honor roll stuff and I would definitely complain to the principal about it. That kind of pressure inducing system in the primary grades is just wrong. You are seeing it from the viewpoint of a child who isn't used to not getting all A's, but there are probably many kids who already believe they are a failure because they have never been able to get recognition for trying their best, the grade is all that matters.
post #16 of 80
10/30/10 at 1:08pm
I don't like letter grades at all BUT if they are going to be there, they should be fair. Encourage him to work on his puncuation and capitalization, and each week notice when he gets those things correct and praise his EFFORT. Use it as a tool to encourage him to strive to do his best and work hard.
post #17 of 80
10/30/10 at 1:24pm
Quote:
Originally Posted by sapphire_chan View Post
What on earth is "average" handwriting? And why on earth would anyone need to have better than average handwriting? If a kid is legible--good enough. If a kid writes like the angels themselves were guiding the pen-- encourage them to create art with their writing and write a nice note in their report card about how pretty they write.
Actually the rebus the are taught in for handwriting was looking for grade appropriate:

1. punctuation
2. Capitalization
3. spacing
4. size/consistency of letter formation( individual styles are allowed and accepted)
5. legibility



Handwriting may seem meaningless, but at Grade school it is looked at as a combination of basic Grammar and legibility. A child that writes in mixed capitals and lower case and/or unevenly spaced letters is MUCH harder to understand in writtten format. Legible writing leads to a smoother flow of written language later....it can be chicken scratch as an adult, BUT very few adults use poor spacing/ improper capitals, etc. Which is part of grade level handwriting (at least in our area). Legibility can also impact grades later if a teacher can not read a response.

I can assure you not all the students that got A/B in handwriting had 'angelic' handwriting at all! BUT it was neat, legible, and used proper capitals and punctation.

I also would stress that you know he is working hard. Acknowledge that- that is more important than anything else. A C is ok, even for little kids. They do need to know that they have stretgths and weaknesses---as do their peers. It is is imperative as adults that we allow them to see that and be accepting of other kids and be able to recognize what they themselves need to improve ( and to work toward!)and what they excel at! Not everyone is good at everything and that is OK --- K and up kids already know this, just not all of them can verbalize it.

Honor Roll in K is upsetting to me too....
post #18 of 80
10/30/10 at 4:10pm
Quote:
Originally Posted by sapphire_chan View Post
But the OP has seen her kid's writing and would know if he were wRItiN9 liKetHis
But writing like that in the first grade is PERFECTLY NORMAL. As are letter reversals (dd still writes her 5s backwards half the time), and interesting spellings. Dd, for example, is an excellent reader, but spelling things like 'break' is somewhat of a mystery to her. We get 'braek' or 'barek' and occasionally 'break'.

I think that letter grades before about 7th grade are pretty much meaningless. Really, they are for the parents. But as I tell my students (college age), C is passing. C is an acceptable grade. Not everyone can be good at everything. Or, as the Despair.com says: not everyone gets to be an astronaut when they grow up.

I much prefer our schools' system: Developing, Meets or Exceeds Benchmark, PLUS grades for effort: Needs Improvement, Satisfactory, Outstanding. So, ds got "Developing" for handwriting in 1st grade (considering he had a pretty major fine motor delay in K, that was to be expected), BUT he also got "Satisfactory" for effort. He wasn't there yet, but he was clearly working on it. What more can you ask?
post #19 of 80
10/30/10 at 4:33pm
Letter grades in first grade: I had never heard of this. I don't think it's necessary.

Giving Cs: Well, someone has to be average! What's wrong with average? You can't be great at everything. Grades tell you how well you are doing, not that you are doing well.

Honor Roll: Unnecessary at that level, and not helpful.

Grading handwriting: Like grading P.E. or math or art. Some people just aren't that good at it and have to try twice as hard to get half the reward. Life sucks at times. Oh, well. It's necessary. Sorry your son isn't great at it, but hey, average is good for a leftie!
post #20 of 80
10/30/10 at 4:53pm
Quote:
Originally Posted by sapphire_chan View Post
What on earth is "average" handwriting? And why on earth would anyone need to have better than average handwriting?
Yes, this! What on earth?? That is like grading someone's art work. I understand the whole fair is fair thing, but handwriting? For a first grader?? That is why I think grades are unnecessary and harmful, especially at this age. Some kids might feel motivated to improve, but many will not. Many will just feel that they are not "good" at handwriting, and it is just not necessary at this age, IMO. Sorry you are going through this. I would advocate for no letter grades in the elementary school.
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