Jonsing for a PhD....am I crazy?

[lunarlady]

So i have a great job teaching middle school, but I really want to go back and get a PhD. Yes, a degree would move me up the salary scale, but only enough to pay off the degree. So there is no financial reason to pursue it, since it wouldn't really pay for itself for at least 10 years.

I have two young kids at home, both still nursing, so it is not that I have time on my hands.

I just really miss being in school. I miss learning, and the structured study that comes with pursuing a degree. I already have a masters, so PhD is the next level unless I go for another masters in a different field of study. I'm curious, and want to know more about my field of study.

So student mama's...am I crazy? Is full time work, a PhD program, and parenting too much for a sane woman to take on? Give me your honest opinion. Should I go all out and shoot for the doctorate, or scale it back to a second masters? Or scale back more and do a second endorsement on my teaching license?

[Just Kate]

What about an Ed.S? The coursework would be "higher" than a master's yet not as intensive as a Ph.D. program...

[DariusMom]

well . . .. it would be a lot.

I think much would depend on what sort of PhD program you'd be entering, and what the expectations of the program are (is it geared to professionals already working? or is it full of young bright stars in their mid 20s?, etc.?)

My PhD program was also full of mid 20s bright stars (many of whom became great friends actually!) so the "culture" was very much work, conferences, publish, publish, publish, 100% academia.

My DS was 9 months old when I started working on my PhD and it was very hard to balance being the AP mommy I wanted to be with the expectations I had of myself + the ones placed on me by the department.

I, thankfully, had a great stipend and fellowship so all I had to do was work on my PhD.And it was still really really exhausting. I almost had a nervous breakdown and my marriage almost failed. Now. . there was lots of other stuff going on, too, so I can't put all that on the PhD! *But* ... . if you're a perfectionist like I am, in all aspects of my life, it's particularly hard to feel like you're acing being a mom and a student and, in your case, your already intense work as a teacher.

I realize I'm sounding discouraging and I'm sorry. I'm glad I got my PhD. It was very important to me personally and I, like you, loved the atmosphere of learning and inquiry. Plus, my goal was to go on in academia and, so far, it's more or less working (fellowship then post-doc . . .. let's see what I get for next academic year. fingers crossed . . . ). In your case though, because you've got *two* very young kids plus a full-time job (compared to my one kid and the funding to only work on my PhD, which was hard enough), I'd really at least wait until your kids are older (maybe when they're in school?).

In the meantime, could you take a few classes -- ones that might even contribute to your degree -- to keep yourself mentally stimulated and at least on the periphery of an academic environment?

[mambera]

Originally Posted by lunarlady

I just really miss being in school. I miss learning, and the structured study that comes with pursuing a degree. I already have a masters, so PhD is the next level unless I go for another masters in a different field of study. I'm curious, and want to know more about my field of study.

I would absolutely not get a PhD for fun. I have a PhD and I am currently facilitating a support group for women in PhD programs. None of them look like they are having fun, and FTR I didn't either. They are all Stressed Out, just like I was.

I would not call a PhD 'structured study' - you have to provide all your own structure - nor is it similar to UG or Master's level work, where you take a lot of classes and have relatively short-term goals.

I did notice that among the relatively small number of people I know who enjoyed their PhDs, all came in with an extremely clear idea of their research focus. I would say that a really good reason to get a PhD (other than because you have your heart set on being a professor) is if you have a burning idea for a large academic project and you want the intellectual time and space to achieve it. If that's the case, I'd say go nuts. But I would wait until your children are older for sure.

[lunarlady]

Thanks for the feedback. I'm investigating some online or mixed setting (mostly online with a few in person sessions) programs that will lead me to a second masters, or another endorsement. I think I will put the PhD on hold until the kids are a little older, simce it sounds like yes, that might be over doing it! Thanks for talking me down.

[*bejeweled*]

Hi, I just received my Ph.D. and it took me 10 years to get it.  10 years and so many tears.  It was sooooooo hard.  But it was worth it, because it was my dream. 

I think it would be really difficult to do it with two young kids AND working full time.  I could see it if you maybe weren't working.  But I think a Ph.D. program might be too much with two young nurslings and a full time job.  Totally doable when your kids are older though. 
 

Originally Posted by lunarlady 

So i have a great job teaching middle school, but I really want to go back and get a PhD. Yes, a degree would move me up the salary scale, but only enough to pay off the degree. So there is no financial reason to pursue it, since it wouldn't really pay for itself for at least 10 years.

I have two young kids at home, both still nursing, so it is not that I have time on my hands.

I just really miss being in school. I miss learning, and the structured study that comes with pursuing a degree. I already have a masters, so PhD is the next level unless I go for another masters in a different field of study. I'm curious, and want to know more about my field of study.

So student mama's...am I crazy? Is full time work, a PhD program, and parenting too much for a sane woman to take on? Give me your honest opinion. Should I go all out and shoot for the doctorate, or scale it back to a second masters? Or scale back more and do a second endorsement on my teaching license?

Edited by *bejeweled* - 11/10/10 at 6:53pm

[catscharm74]

I say if it's truly a top 5 goal/dream..GO FOR IT!!! It's a personal one of mine- I love a challenge, love academics and it suits my personality to pursue one. My life is structured for learning even though I work full time, with a 4 year old and a husband and 2 dogs/2cats to mind. Simply living and minimalism has helped me achieve my goals and dreams. I wish you the best.

[Realrellim]

Hi, I just received my Ph.D. and it took me 10 years to get it.  10 years and so many tears.  It was sooooooo hard.  But it was worth it, because it was my dream.  I think it would be really difficult to do it with two young kids AND working full time.  I could see it if you maybe weren't working.  But I think a Ph.D. program might be too much with two young nurslings and a full time job.  Totally doable when your kids are older though.

I defended two years ago, just after my oldest turned 4.  It had been a 10-year process, during which I only worked part-time.  Getting a Ph.D. with kids + a job = HARD.

[konayossie]

I defended 4.5 years ago and only spent 5 years working on it, and it was hell. I wasn't married and did not have kids, but I know that personally, I could NOT have handled being a mom to my high- needs son. I absolutely think I would have broken down and probably quit the program.

I agree with PP that the type of program (traditional, very academic v. online, or more professional-oriented) probably does make a big difference. Also, as a PP mentioned, I always counsel my undergrad students that pursuing a PhD is not something you do b/c you just love learning, don't know what to do with your life, or want to "find yourself." It's such an entirely different experience than undergrad education--so extraordinarily more stressful and requiring extreme drive and self-direction (at least for me and most of the PhDs I've talked to about this). I tell my students that you need to "need" that PhD in order to accomplish your career objectives. That's not to say you shouldn't do it--but just be really, really sure you NEED the degree and also maybe consider waiting till your children are at a less needy age (if there is such a thing!).

[~pi]

Originally Posted by konayossie 

I always counsel my undergrad students that pursuing a PhD is not something you do b/c you just love learning, don't know what to do with your life, or want to "find yourself." It's such an entirely different experience than undergrad education--so extraordinarily more stressful and requiring extreme drive and self-direction (at least for me and most of the PhDs I've talked to about this). I tell my students that you need to "need" that PhD in order to accomplish your career objectives. That's not to say you shouldn't do it--but just be really, really sure you NEED the degree and also maybe consider waiting till your children are at a less needy age (if there is such a thing!).

Yeah that.

Finishing the PhD was the hardest thing I've ever done. And I have done some other really hard things. I did it because I love research, I needed it to move on in my research career, and I had invested so much time (and tears, and broken dishes on one memorable night near the end of the dissertation when I had had ENOUGH of my stats runs crashing) that I was going to finish the thing if it killed me. I only have one kid and I have an unbelievably supportive spouse.

This is not meant to dissuade you, only to present a BTDT view. It's amazing, and I love this career path, but a PhD is hard. They don't just hand them out for being brilliant and loving learning. (I asked.) Now that I have done it, I would never personally do a PhD if I didn't intend to pursue a career path requiring one.

Of course you should go for it if you truly want to, but go in with eyes open. You may also want to consider your other options (e.g., those you listed, plus others like learn a new language, add a new teachable, etc.) that are truly structured learning. I would not call a PhD structured learning at all. The coursework, sure, but definitely not the dissertation.

Best of luck whatever you decide to do.

[spedteacher30]

If you want to remain in the K-12 classroom, I wouldn't bother with an education PhD. I would seriously consider pursuing National Board Certification, though. I am currently stalled out in the PhD process, and doubt I will actually finish it. I don't think I want it badly enough to bother...

[meemee]

it seems to me that perhaps you should be teaching college level instead of k-12.

hmmm in my experience i see a whole different picture of Ph D's. most of my friends who got them got them after kids working full time. however what worked in their favour was - that they werent in a rush, they took classes part time and their research was based on their work so they were already doing it. the stressful part was the actual writing and editing the dissertation. and of course the politics.

however yes it was HARD and needed a lot of personal discipline. hard in teh sense of juggling, giving up time. initially ph d's are not intense. so if you were to take classes, whether you do them in ma or ph d - i dont see the difference.

school is EXTREMELY stressful - no matter what you are pursuing. so keep that in mind. if you do enjoy the challenge i would much rather invest in attending in person than online.

have you taken anything online? i did OnE class and realised how much i hated that method. i need the critical thinking and in class interaction.

you can right now start taking one class a semester. twice a week. if childcare is not an issue. by the time crunch time comes in your kids will be older. dd is 8 now. seh wants to be around people where seh is loved, not necessarily around mama all teh time.